New Information Dissolves Illusions About Vaccines—And They’re All Illusions

Dissolving Illusions is a powerful new book written by Roman Bystrianyk and Suzanne Humphries, MD
Dissolving Illusions is a powerful new book written by Roman Bystrianyk and Suzanne Humphries, MD

Dissolving Illusions is a powerful new book written by Roman Bystrianyk and Suzanne Humphries, MD

There’s a new book out. It’s called Dissolving Illusions: Disease, Vaccines, and the Forgotten History. The biggest illusion is quite simple and is the basis for the entire book and what the book ultimately proves. Before I continue, answer this true-or-false question:

Throughout history, vaccines have been responsible for the increase in life expectancy, and drastically reduced the death toll from infectious diseases.

If you said false, you are correct. Vaccines were not responsible for the increase in life expectancy or the major drop in mortality from infectious diseases.

Another question.

True or false: Clean water, nutrition, hygiene, and sanitation were responsible for the eradication of all of many infectious diseases.

This is true, which Dissolving Illusions clearly shows. This single fact makes the following question easy to answer.

True or false: The vaccine program in this country is based on a false premise.

Absolutely true. Really think about this. Diseases like cholera and typhoid all but vanished before the introduction of any vaccine. Therefore, vaccines could not have been responsible for the eradication of these diseases.

But wait. I was told my whole life that vaccines are absolutely necessary to protect us from awful diseases. How can it not be true?

It’s Basic History 101

In the 1800s and 1900s, many people in the United States lived in poverty and filth. In small, overcrowded, dark houses with rats, roaches, mosquitoes, and other vermin. Streets were filled with sewage and garbage and dead animals—often as much as two to three feet deep in places like New York City. Food and drinking water were diseased.

People were malnourished. They didn’t have clean running water and flush toilets. When they became sick, they ended up in hospitals that were also dirty and unsanitary, lacking in basic hygiene such as handwashing and instrument sterilization and isolating the sick.

Many worked long hours in dirty, unsafe conditions, without fresh air, exercise, and rest. Even children labored to the point of illness and sometimes death. Epidemics were rampant, with millions dying from diseases like typhoid fever, cholera, dysentery, diphtheria, pertussis, scarlet fever, measles, yellow fever, tuberculosis, puerperal fever, and smallpox. Mortality was high, and life expectancy was low.

This is the forgotten history. This is what was responsible for the spread of disease. This is the truth.

Then came the Sanitation Revolution. Everything changed. Sewage and waste was properly disposed of. Clean drinking water was mandated. Food was inspected and handled properly so it was no longer contaminated. Milk was pasteurized. Labor laws were passed to protect workers. Basic hygiene was implemented. In many countries, life became cleaner, safer, and better.

Another piece of the forgotten history is the lost remedies. Vitamins, cinnamon, garlic, echinacea, jicama, fresh juice, apple cider vinegar, cod liver oil, silver, and other natural supplements were used to treat infectious diseases. And guess what? They worked very well.

The result? By 1940, deaths from measles, scarlet fever, pertussis, and diphtheria were practically a thing of the past. Deaths from scarlet fever—a bigger killer—were almost unheard of by the early 1900s, even before antibiotics were used to treat it. Tuberculosis, pneumonia, flu … same thing. When they surfaced, they were much milder. Mortality was rare. That’s a fact.

And this is important. This happened during a time when there was an almost zero vaccination rate.

disease-graph

How Can Such a Fundamental Truth be Forgotten (Or Ignored)?

As far back as the 1700s, although vaccines were being pushed, numerous medical journals questioned their safety and effectiveness. They cited the statistics. The mortality rates. The fact that they could be contaminated and often led to more disease than they prevented.

As Dissolving Illusions explores, questioning vaccines was not without consequences. Doctors who spoke out were ignored and sometimes threatened. Parents who refused to obey vaccination laws were prosecuted, fined, and even imprisoned. Eventually, there were protests. And eventually, the laws began to change.

“Unfortunately, the flawed belief that vaccines and other medical advances were responsible for this amazing decline has dictated how infectious diseases are treated today. Instead of an emphasis on hygiene, nutrition, and appropriate vitamin supplementation, immune system support, and natural remedies, the emphasis is always on costly antibiotics, vaccinations, and other medical procedures.” (pp. 220–221)

Here’s another fact. People who have healthy immune systems—because of basic necessities like sanitation, hygiene, clean water, and nutrition—are able to fight diseases. Vaccines do not cause immunity to disease and, in fact, harm the immune system. What makes you immune to a disease? The disease.

Fear is a powerful motivator. The thought of a child coming down with a “dreaded disease” is scary. Consider the story of polio that the book covers at length. The pictures of children in iron lungs—that frightening reminder of the crippling effects of the disease.

But what is missing, what we aren’t told, is that people who were crippled and paralyzed often suffered from something else, such as DDT or arsenic poisoning or even syphilis. We also aren’t told that polio was never eradicated with a vaccine.

The irony is that the very existence of a vaccine makes the fear greater. If there is a vaccine to prevent the disease, the disease must be pretty scary.

And those who promote vaccines cover all the bases.

“When vaccine programs don’t live up to their promises, the blame is always placed on the unvaccinated, or a new angle is drawn to the tune of ‘five vaccines per child may not be enough.’ By sleight of hand—changing the diagnosis of old-time polio to AFP [acute flaccid paralysis]—any ongoing paralysis will be covered while the dimes continue to roll in.” (p. 289)

Conclusion

Even if you believe vaccines are safe, Dissolving Illusions should make it crystal clear that they are not necessary. If they are not necessary, why do our children receive more than four dozen by the time they go to school?

There are only so many possible explanations. I suppose some doctors still believe in them. After all, they’ve been indoctrinated since they first set foot in medical school. Big Pharma is a powerful—not to mention rich—force. And I guess it’s possible that the FDA, CDC, and other agencies believe the “studies” they see quoted. After all, the statistics are skewed to say whatever the authors want them to say. It’s also possible that some doctors don’t believe in vaccines and don’t vaccinate their own children but keep quiet.

How many times have you heard your doctor say, “Vaccines prevent horrible diseases and sometimes death?” I know that, until my grandson Jake regressed into autism from rabies vaccines, I believed wholeheartedly in vaccines. I believed everything I read about all those horrible, deadly diseases and dutifully took my daughters for their vaccines when they were little. I couldn’t wait to get my flu shot every fall. I accepted it all without question. I never had a reason to question it. Until my family suffered the indescribable agony of watching Jake disappear into a black hole.

Don’t let your child developing autism or suffering any injury after a vaccine be your reason to question the safety of the vaccine program. Do it now. Read Dissolving Illusions. If you don’t do anything else, look at the graphs. (You can see these on the web site, www.dissolvingillusions.com.) Consider the history. The science. Not someone’s opinion, but the facts. This book is the result of 20 years of research. It presents the truth.

Remember this: There is no evidence to support the theory that vaccines are necessary, and “safety” studies are absent or flawed. Doctors have pushed vaccines since the 1700s, but they have yet to study vaccinated versus unvaccinated children. If they are so sure their vaccines are effective and necessary and safe, why haven’t they done this study to put parents’ minds to rest? The answer is simple. They don’t need to do the study. They already know the truth. They don’t want us to know it.

Draw your own conclusions. And be willing to accept the fact that what you’ve been told all your life and believed without question just might not be true. Your child’s health and life depends on it. He depends on you to make informed, healthy, safe decisions. He can’t do it himself.

Do your child a favor. Read Dissolving Illusions.

Get the Book Now:

 

Reference

Suzanne Humphries, MD, and Roman Bystrianyk. Dissolving Illusions: Disease, Vaccines, and the Forgotten History. Create Space Independent Publishing Platform, July 27, 2013.

 

  • Viking

    Another great book to my shelf, whenever people try to confront me.

  • davidhill

    Big Pharma’s ‘roots’ are shrouded in sheer crimes against humanity – http://foolscrow.wordpress.com/2010/07/27/return-to-nuremberg-big-pharma-must-answer-for-crimes-against-humanity/

    Therefore and as they have never changed their spots, invariably they will use and manipulate as much as they can to just increase the bottom-line year on year, not bothering about the damage that they inflict on the world’s people. Indeed they are seen as just pawns in the whole accumulation of vast wealth and merely the means to an end.

    Dr David Hill

    World Innovation Foundation

  • http://www.desireerover.nl Desiree Rover

    Till the cows come home we can talk and protest, bring evidence and write books about the damage that vaccines are inflicting upon millions and millions of people, yet nothing is ever changing. Lying through their teeth the ‘authorities will keep denying every causal link between vaccines and SIDS, autism, cancer and every illness in internal medicine. The explanation is to be found in this document:
    http://birthofanewearth.blogspot.nl/2012/02/secret-covenant-of-illuminati.html

  • Lissa

    Our country is run by a bunch of unintelligent, greedy, ignorant humans. This is why we are subjected to the moronic and insensible rules of government today.

  • Geoff

    Hello, I have no doubt the above is essentially true and that the problem goes
    well beyond big pharma. A root cause analysis may reveal an extremely
    poor
    education system and selection process could be a contributor to any
    insanity practised by doctors and patience. Some people are failed by the educational
    authorities and others selected to become important people. Thus thru a
    process of blindly accepting knowledge to pass exams that can lead to
    significant reward a select group of people are given the professional
    status. Apply a profitable pack mentality and it becomes immaterial that
    what was taught contained errors. As a result, armed with limited
    accountability, the professional standard seems to be at a similar level
    to the sanitary conditions that people were forced to live with in
    ignorance during the 1700′s. How easily humans forget and how well
    educated we are?

  • Barb

    Bravo for another book that uncovers the truth about vaccines and dismantles the long held false beliefs with verifiable facts.

    I’m grateful to Dr. Suzanne Humphries MD for her well written 2012 publication on curing whooping cough with vitamin C; from what I’ve discovered (from researcher, doctor and vet written publications) it’s highly effective for kennel cough, distemper, arthritis, polio/encephalitis, measles, bladder problems and a long list of conditions when given in high doses – with absolutely no fear of toxicity or overdose!

    It’s always refreshing and empowering when a medical professional is more interested in truth than blindly following or upsetting the herd, “Good-bye Germ Theory” by Dr. William E. Trebing is another good read. His book also reviews the actual (vs. taught) history and in addition arms the individual with the legal foundation (and forms) to exercise the right to decline vaccines.

    The current trajectory of government/medical bodies makes it clear that if we do not exercise this most fundamental right for our family/animals the choice to do so will disappear.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Vaccines have an essential role in eliminating disease. The fact that better living conditions, clean water, etc has had a greater role is irrelevant. If it was possible it would be OK to say “if you don’t like vaccines don’t use them” and just let the ignorant conspiracy theorists get the diseases, but there are two problems with this. First it’s often ignorant parents stopping their innocent children from being vaccinated who then suffer as a result; and second, herd immunity requires a high proportion of the population to be protected for greatest effect. So misleading books like this are dangerous to us all, unfortunately.

  • Clausen

    “Herd Immunity” is an admission vaccines don’t work. But morons like you still use your propaganda. Your circular logic is laughable if it wasn’t so maliciously misleading. The ignorant are the people who refuse to look and the opposing view point. People like you are scum, because you couldn’t possibly believe your lies, or you are willfully ignorant!!!!

  • mary

    When you see your child regress into autism after receiving certain vaccines, you will not be so anxious to subject your other children to vaccines. If people believe that vaccines prevent diseases, and their kids are vaccinated, why do they worry about the kids who have not been vaccinated? I have yet to figure that out.

  • Dionne Wilson

    Re: herd immunity – whenever there has been an outbreak of a particular “childhood” disease, it is always in populations that are at least 97% vaccinated. The healthiest children I’ve ever seen are unvaccinated. Do the research instead of listening to government propaganda. There is a HUGE financial incentive for hospitals and private doctors to push vaccines which makes the motivation all wrong and the outcomes ignored. THINK FOR YOURSELVES, PEOPLE!!

  • Free People

    “Herd Immunity”???..you are either a dumb sheeple or a big pharma troll.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Yikes! This doesn’t seem the place to have a sensible, facts-based discussion! :)

  • educatingforpeace

    I am always elevated when I read the comments below these articles. It encourages me that so many people are aware and educated about this and are speaking out. Now we must grow our numbers…truth to power. Hopefully these trolls like OJB will fade away.

  • Free People

    ‘Herd Immunity’…’ignorant conspiracy theorists’…’ignorant parents’….is that right…….
    Well, if you weren’t so ignorant yourself, you would know the truth. Here’s a little helper..The History of Deadly Vaccines: (a little edumacation for you)
    http://articlesofhealth.blogspot.com/2008/02/death-by-vaccine.html

  • Free People

    ‘Herd Immunity’…’ignorant conspiracy theorists’…’ignorant parents’….is that right…sound ‘sensible, facts-based to you’?….
    Well, if you weren’t so ignorant yourself, you would know the truth. Here’s a little helper..The History of Deadly Vaccines: (a little edumacation for you)
    http://articlesofhealth.blogspot.com/2008/02/death-by-vaccine.html

  • Michael

    People like OJB, your cause is lost , you’re a dying breed. You won’t stop this steamroller.

  • Argus

    As you already found out, OJB, facts and truth are in short supply around here. And the first, biggest lie is the name of the website.
    Occasionally, an actual fact does creep in. But only if it can be isolated from other facts so that its meaning can be subverted.

  • alwayslearning

    OJB – I am no accustomed to name calling and using projection as a tool to make a point. I instead read and listen to as many different sources as possible – then make an informed decision.

    Just so you know Herd Immunity is indeed a misnomer and re: ‘The fact that better living conditions, clean water, etc has had a greater role is irrelevant’

    Did you not know that vaccines will not prevent your child from catching these diseases ?

    What it will do is reduce your child’s ability to fight many other even more deadly diseases – appearing by the day – and if your child suffers from malnutrition (I mean living of FastFood, Supermarket foods etc instead of whole organic foods), uncleanliness and ignorance when it comes to keeping clean and not spreading disease to others then any and all diseases and sickness will continue to flourish, whether a vaccine is available or not.

    Really for humanities sake I would suggest everyone including yourself to delve a little deeper into the facts rather than one source (in this cases a conglomerate of paid off medical and governmental bodies)

    If you have any facts that you may feel relevant please supply them here – I will look forward to reading / seeing them.

    Love Light and Happiness to everyone here.

  • Roxanne

    You said that vaccines had an essential role in eliminating disease?
    Hmm… Like the smallpox disasters when smallpox mortality actually increased
    with mandatory vaccination and the worst outbreaks occurred where almost
    100% vaccine compliance occurred such as in the Philippines in the
    1910′s. Meanwhile Scarlet Fever which in some regions had a
    higher mortality rate than smallpox plummeted in victims despite the
    fact that NO VACCINE WAS EVER ADMINISTERED FOR SCARLET FEVER
    (this was also well before the advent of vaccination) If the smallpox vaccine
    hadn’t been created and caused such mass devastation – including death and paralysis – the case could well be made that smallpox mortality would have plummeted vastly sooner much like Scarlet Fever instead of being prolonged
    due to mandated vaccines.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    The scientific evidence shows vaccines work and we know exactly why. They prime the body’s defences against the real threat later in life. What is so threatening to you people about this simple and effective medical procedure?

  • Roxanne

    A comment that is purely emotional in blind defense of vaccines and presents no “facts” nor “truth”.

  • Roxanne

    “Since the passing of the Compulsory Vaccination Act in (Britain) 1853 we have had no less than three distinct epidemics. In 1857-9. We had more than 14,000 deaths from small pox. In the 1863-5 epidemic the deaths increased to 20,000 and in the 1871-2 they totaled up to 44,800.” Walter Hadwen MD, MRCS LRCP, LSA

    “In the Cologne epidemic of 1870, 173 vaccinated persons were attacked before the first unvaccinated one. In Liegnite in 1871, the first unvaccinated to suffer was 225th on the list.” William T. Collins MD, MRCS 1883

    “How is it that smallpox is five times as likely to be fatal in the vaccinated as in the unvaccinated? How is it that in some of our most highly vaccinated towns, smallpox is rife whilst in some of our most poorly vaccinated towns such as Leicester, it is almost unknown? How is it that something like 80% of the cases admitted into the Metropolitan Board Smallpox Hospital have been vaccinated, whilst only 20% have not been vaccinated.” Dr. L. Parry, British Medical Journal, 1/21/28

  • Roxanne

    For those who haven’t yet seen it, a powerful MUST READ are the historical records, articles etc. by Dr. Eleanor McBean – ‘The Poisoned Needle’ … No longer available but
    google the title at http://www.whale.to to access the whole book online

  • redhead67

    I would love to share this, but there is one huge error. Pasteurizing milk harms our immunity. If cows are raised humanely with fresh grass, exercise, and sunshine, you get quality milk that it’s a part of good nutrition. I drink it all the time!

  • Quicksilver

    True Roxanne but the dairies of the past were truly a health hazard. Now they are a different kind of hazard but it is not as much as an infectious disease hazard. The other problem of the past that pasteurization would not have helped was the DDT in cow’s milk.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Both my children were fully vaccinated and one is now 20, the other 16. Neither have autism and neither had any serious infectious diseases. Almost everyone I know was also vaccinated and none are autistic. The idea that autism and vaccination are connected has been shown to be false. The reason I care about non-vaccinated children is that I don’t want to see parents harming their children through ignorance. Also there are some cases where people want to be immunised but can’t be. In that case herd immunity is all they have.

  • crystal

    Agreed OJB is a troll. Also am happy to view all the educated souls who reject the fear mongering and propaganda. I intent all trolls to be exposed by the light of truth. Amen.

  • Barbara

    If you want to know what vaccines are for, just ask Bill GATES. he makes no bones about it, Population Control.Disease and death.

  • Roxanne

    Sorry, OJB this comment scarcely makes your point. Everyone who smokes doesn’t get cancer. Everyone who drinks heavily doesn’t
    get liver disease and on and on…. That is hardly a case re. no link
    between vaccines and autism. Amongst many points that make
    the case for vaccines being linked to autism you seem to be unaware of historical observations and records (example to follow) and the fact that in non-vaccinated populations autism is negligible or non-existent.
    Re. your children, I hope they lead happy healthy lives. However,
    vaccine damage can take many years to show up such as with
    cancer and auto-immune disease. You seem – in fairness like
    the majority of the population – completely unaware of the scope
    of damage vaccines can cause (VIDS) Vaccine Induced Diseases.
    These include: allergies, arthritis, ear infections, asthma, diabetes, learning disabilities, behavioral problems, tonsillitis, hearing and visual damage (such as optic neuritis), cancer, SIDS, learning disabilities, MS and other auto-immune conditions etc. *** I’m not implying that vaccines are by any means exclusively responsible for the above, but rather that they could be the cause or a major contributing factor.
    I used to be avidly pro-vaccine but looking back that was based on robotic indoctrination and not on skeptical independent
    investigation. In fact, it took three separate events to knock some
    sense in me and to begin questioning the vaccine holy cow.
    This included the ugly realization that the very thing I had previously
    endorsed -vaccination- was, in fact, the CAUSE of my ill health.
    I only wish I had awakened to the vaccine propaganda machine
    years earlier…..
    -

  • Roxanne

    “Vaccination programs were instituted in the late 1930s… In the 1940s a new mental syndrome which Dr. Leo Kanner called autism ,was noted. It appeared in the wake of the U.S. pertussis vaccine schemes. When vaccination programs were expanded after the war, the number of autistic children increased greatly… (When) the U.S. occupied Japan and forcibly vaccinated the children: their first case of autism was diagnosed in 1945. In England the shot was subject to large scale promotion in the late fifties: a society for autistic children was founded in 1962. In the U.S. at first the malady was noticed in higher income families. This was before the free or forced pertussis vaccine programmes; only the better-off parents could afford the ‘latest medical advance’ later…parents from across the socio-economic spectrum gained equal access… Thus, autistic children were now being discovered within every kind of family and in dreadfully greater numbers than ever before imagined.”

    Harris Coulter PhD, Medical Historian

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    There are some potential side effects of vaccines but they are considered to be worth the risk for the protection achieved. There is very little contrary opinion on this amongst medical experts. Either the anti-vaccination crowd, like you, are wrong or for some bizarre reason almost the entire medical and scientific community are deliberately allowing many people to suffer unnecessarily. I think most sensible people know the most likely explanation.

  • Roxanne

    Lots of points I want to raise in reply here but it’s very late so I’ll be in touch in the next day or two…

  • Paul Fassa

    Pharma shills are common on vaccination truth sites or articles. So anyone who persists with non-factual opinions to promote vaccinations is a troll who will tire you out while trying to convince otherwise. Why would a person so convinced of vaccinations’ efficacy and safety come to a site like this to begin with? To troll, distract, confuse, and frustrate. Ignore or delete their comments.

  • VaccineRisks

    Am reading the book now. It’s excellent, I can’t put it down.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Erwin-Alber/548856074 Erwin Alber

    Some people are just so profoundly brain-washed that their imagination doesn’t go as far as letting them even conceive of the notion that they along with millions of others including the members of virtually the entire medical establishment and governments have been duped into believing that the systematic poisoning of babies and children has something to do with disease prevention.

    They have been told the lie that “vaccines are safe and effective” so often that they become most indignant towards or ridicule anyone who dares to tell them otherwise, completely oblivious of the veritable vaccine holocaust taking place in our midst and all around us.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Erwin-Alber/548856074 Erwin Alber

    I’m looking forward to reading the book!

    This doesn’t sound quite right to me:

    “As far back as the 1700s, although vaccines were being pushed, numerous
    medical journals questioned their safety and effectiveness. They cited
    the statistics. The mortality rates. The fact that they could be
    contaminated and often led to more disease than they prevented.”

    I think this should probably say:

    “As far back as the 1800s, although vaccines were pushed…” as Jenner launched his disgusting concoction in 1796.

    Prior to Jenner’s cowpox vaccine against smallpox there was a similar and similarly detrimental procedure involving the use of smallpox material, but this was called variolation.

  • gspurlock

    Another good book to read is “Confessions of a Medical Heretic”. I forget the author’s name, but I happily read it before I had children and they got no vaccines until required by law to attend school.

    Another important factor that doctors never mention is that the human brain is still in gestation until age 4. I’m not necessarily convinced that vaccines cause autism, though from research, it looks like it is a contributing factor. Vaccinations before age 4 would appear to be a bad idea.

    I would like to see some research on what low-fat diets do to children. The brain, as noted is in gestation until age 4, and is comprised almost exclusively of cholesterol. From my experience offending parents of autistic children while running for a political office, I noticed that these parents are almost all “super parents”, and very conventional. Autism has also been identified as almost exclusively occurring among the affluent. How many of those parents were on low-fat diets prior to conception, during gestation and kept their infant on a low-fat formula/2% milk?

    It really seems like the dramatic increase of autism parallels the rise of the low-fat / no-fat diet. It would be great if someone would research this.

  • Cordelia

    I agree redhead67. I really want to share this, but didn’t due to the huge error in pasteurized milk. The rest is spot on. so glad to see so many people waking up to this biological warfare.

  • Cordelia

    It’s always the same parroted comments by the pro-vaccinators….(that are emotional) and spout off that the science is behind vaccinations, but fail to show any proof at all nor will one do any research or open their minds to facts, just ignorance defending itself, along with defending the perpetrators of Big Pharma…they get self-righteous
    about protecting their children (actually what is irresponsible is buying into the
    vaccination BS without question) they talk
    about gratitude for not having polio and small pox etc. (to which I
    counter…most of these big diseases were on their way out when the
    vaccination was invented and this was due mainly to increased
    sanitation)…as this book is revealing. it’s always the same parroted comments/agruments/ignorance. How can people like OJB continue to believe his own lies?

  • Cordelia

    Exactly Roxanne. Just b/c one doesn’t have an immediate illness from vaccinations, doesn’t mean they do not cause illness and bad health as a result. Many people with chronic fatigue, IBS, and other illnesses which mainstream doesn’t have a clue how to treat are a result of oxidative damage done by the toxic world, which includes the dangerous crap that is in vaccinations, like heavy metals. People who methylation challenges and gene mutations within this pathway (MTHFR Mutation for one) have trouble producing glutathione, which detoxifies the toxins present in the vaccinations. most all austics have this gene mutation and trouble in the methylation pathway.

    vaccinations harm the natural flora in the gut and can cause leaky gut, which brings on auto immune diseases. Children are showing up with skin issues, constipation etc. and are just giving drugs instead of looking at the WHY. it is the short-sighted (and intentional) nature of current and dangerous medical practices. if you look into the money trails, you will see everyone has their hand in the coo$ie jar…doctors, media (nancy synderman), big pharma (of course), CDC, FDA.

  • Cordelia

    Wow. that is so accurate. (I clicked on the link). most people won’t, so I have cut and pasted this: “An illusion… it will be so large, so vast, it will escape their
    perception. Those who will see it will be thought of as insane. We’ll
    create separate fronts to prevent them from seeing the connection
    between us. We will behave as if we are not connected to keep the
    illusion alive. Our goal will be accomplished one drop at a time so as
    to never bring suspicion upon ourselves. This will also prevent them
    from seeing the changes as the occur. We will always stand above the
    relative field of their experience, for we know the secrets of the
    Absolute. We will work together always, and remain bound by blood and
    secrecy. Death will come to he who speaks. We will keep their
    lifespans short and their minds weak, while pretending to do the
    opposite. We will use our knowledge of science and technology in subtle
    ways, so they will never see what is happening. We
    will use soft metals, aging accelerators, and sedatives in food and
    water. Also in the air. They will be blanketed by poisons everywhere
    they turn. The soft metals will cause them to lose their minds. We
    will promise to find a cure for our many fronts, yet we will feed them
    more poison. The poisons will be absorbed through their skin and mouths.
    They will destroy their minds and reproductive systems. From all of
    this, their children will be born dead, and we will conceal this
    information. The poisons will be hidden in everything that surrounds
    them… in what they drink, eat, breath, and wear. We must be ingenious
    in dispensing the poisons for they can see far. We will teach them
    that poisons are good, with fun images and musical tones. Those they
    look up to will help. We will enlist them to push our poisons. They
    will see our products being used in film and grow accustomed to them and
    will never know their true effect. WHEN THEY GIVE BIRTH, WE WILL INJECT POISONS INTO THE BLOOD OF THEIR CHILDREN AND CONVINCE THEM IT’S FOR THEIR HEALTH.
    We will start early-on, when their minds are young, and we’ll target
    their children with what children love most… sweet things. When their
    teeth decay, we will fill them with metals that will steal their mind
    and kill their future. When their ability to learn has been affected,
    we will create medicine that will make them sicker and cause other
    diseases for which we will create yet more medicine… They will grow
    depressed, slow, obese and when come to us for help, we will give them
    more poison.”

  • Roxanne

    That book was written by Dr. Robert Mendelsohn (now deceased)… Re.
    autism and vaccines the links are overwhelming but no time to elaborate
    today. Just wanted to send the name along.
    “…immunization against relatively harmless childhood diseases may be responsible for the dramatic increase in autoimmune diseases…such as cancer, leukemia, rheumatoid arthritis, M.S. Lou Gehrig’s disease (ALS), lupus erythematosus and Gullian-Barre.”

    Robert S. Mendelsohn MD, Professor of Pediatrics, University of Illinios, ‘The Medical Time Bomb of Immunization Against Disease’

  • Quicksilver

    Yes it should be 1800s.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    I am quoting the scientific facts and it has nothing to do with emotion. You are the one supporting pseudo-scientific nonsense, not me. I can refer you to material at respected sources such as PubMed, the CDC, etc, but would you take any notice? Alternatively there is a very good fact-based article at QuackWatch which is aimed more at the non-specialist level. Would you look at any of this material?

  • Christine P. S.

    Re. PubMed, I suggest you read the following research which
    concluded: …”Nations that require more vaccines doses tend to have higher mortality rates”

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170075/?tool=pubmed

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Yes, that particular piece of “research” is often quoted by the anti-vaccination community. It has been dismissed as deeply flawed by most real science commentators. Do you need a link which shows it’s numerous problems? But let’s just say it is accurate (it isn’t). That is one study amongst thousands which support vaccination. Why believe one and reject all the rest?

  • Argus

    “. . . they along with millions of others including the members of virtually the entire medical establishment and governments have been duped . . .”

    And only those who have become enlightened by limiting their education to websites like this one – and choosing to dismiss all scientific research as biased – know the truth.

    Right. . .

  • Christine P. S.

    I don’t need your pharmaceutical vested “studies”. Over the many decades I’ve dealt with the young, I’ve all too frequently witnessed firsthand the serious damage that vaccines cause; the subsequent denial and dismissal no matter how obvious the connection by the medical
    system; and the significantly better health of the small minority who choose not to vaccinate. Trying to communicate with someone like you who cannot see the looming disaster that is the deteriorating health of todays’ babies and children (who receive more vaccines than ever) is a utter waste of time. Good bye.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    How do you know these studies are influenced by the pharmaceutical industry? I haven’t even told you what they are. This clearly shows that you are not interested in the facts. You have made up your mind what you want to believe and that is what you will believe no matter what the facts are. That’s OK, you can believe crap if you want to, but unfortunately your ignorance affects other people. That is the problem.

  • http://www.desireerover.nl Desiree Rover

    1936 – Pertussis vaccine introduced in the United States. Autism begins to appear in children shortly thereafter.

    1953 – The Swedish conduct a study on the Pertussis vaccine. Anna L. Annell, a Swedish researcher, writes a major work on Pertussis which indicates that ‘pertussis vaccine may be associated with the most varying kinds of cerebral complications which may be cortical, subcortical or peripheral.’

    1970 – A study by Pittman reveals Pertussis vaccine can induce hypoglycemia due to increased production of insulin. (Ref: DPT shots). Study is corroborated in 1978 by Hannick and Cohen and by Hennessen and Quast in West Germany. Result: Pertussis and DPT vaccines can cause diabetes.

    From: http://articlesofhealth.blogspot.nl/2008/02/death-by-vaccine.htm

    And so on, and so on. Ad nauseam…

    Conclusion: THEY KNOW DAMN WELL how to create a generation of sick, stupid and sterile zombies…

    OUR children — if we do not wake up in time!

  • Roxanne

    Back online…. OJB it’s not about the entire medical etc. community deliberately allowing people to suffer. The vast majority of medical etc. professionals are decent, caring people. It’s about a deeply entrenched system of power, politics and profit that is rotten to the core and controls and taints academia through regulatory and “official” bodies from the CDC through the AAP etc. It’s about a system that is so
    deeply invested in an outdated, fundamentally flawed, narrow reductionist paradigm that the majority once imprinted with such dogmas can’t even see how deeply indoctrinated they are; step out of the box and independently challenge and question the mantras
    they’ve been robotically fed, especially when there livelihood relies on them adhering to the vaccine ideology. They simply parrot the same old lines, “vaccines are safe and effective” and “the benefits outweigh the risks” without
    a shred of skeptical inquiry.
    Consider – How many in medical “officialdom” etc.
    - know about the GSK Hexa Infanrex scandal in which
    the internal confidential report in THEIR words admits
    to over 800 adverse reaction many serious including
    all body systems, death and yes, “autism.”
    - know about the extent of VAERS reports and realize
    that this woefully lax voluntary system represents potentially as low as 1-2% of potential vaccine reactions – many very
    serious.
    - know about virologists stepping forward from a key
    vaccine producer with reports of fraudulent tampering with data for over a decade re. a specific vaccine.
    - know that vaccines are routinely not tested for carcinogenic
    nor mutagenic potential, impacts on infertility etc. Read
    the monographs.
    - know that vaccine trials are woefully inadequate and not
    designed to look for long-term damage such as auto-immune problems.
    - know that vaccines are routinely tested against NON-inert
    placebos thereby skewing results. Talk about junk science
    - know that animal studies comparing vaccinated vs non-vaccinated populations reveal disturbing results from behavioral problems to auto-immune damage in the
    vaccinated groups.
    -can list a small fraction of vaccine ingredients – their categories and consequences; far too many still pathetically
    compare ingestion of a substance with injection of a substance! NOT THE SAME
    - know anything significant or at all about vaccine synergistic toxicity, demyelination and the blood brain barrier impacts in infants. (Most doctors just draw a blank face and repeat the same old mantras to trust the “experts.”)
    - grasp the implications of bypassing the frontier of the
    immune system via direct injection which has massive
    implications particularly in regards to the development
    of auto-immune disease.
    - cling to a narrow understanding of antibodies and don’t fully grasp that real immunity is vastly more complex and
    that moreover, you can still be susceptible to a disease
    with high antibodies, and conversely not susceptible with
    low antibodies.
    - realize the FULL extent of the revolving door where there
    are clear conflicts of interest between influential “experts”
    and regulatory etc. bodies. (If you think the CDC etc. are
    neutral and objective re. vaccines, I have some land I’d like
    to sell you)
    - realize how doctors etc. who do openly raise serious criticisms, research etc. re. vaccines are professionally penalized or smeared.
    - realize that the historical stats they were fed in medical
    school were inaccurate (starting from just before the
    vaccine was introduced and ignoring the plummeting
    decline in infectious disease mortality well, well before
    vaccines.
    - realize they’ve been fed scare tactics re. the rate of
    complications with childhood illnesses with grossly
    inflated exaggerations. Meanwhile, vaccination at best
    offers inferior “temporal immunity” and is shifting the age of
    these illnesses when indeed they could be much more
    problematic.
    - realize that definitions have been changed to serve
    commercial interest and manipulate stats… again junk
    science…
    I could go on and on but when you have a system that
    is so broken and one-sided, no one has to deliberately
    intend suffering – institutionalized blindness takes on a
    power of its own.
    As I mentioned in an earlier entry, I used to be avidly
    pro-vaccine. Sadly, it’s often not until something happens
    to you so black and white that you have to confront years
    of brainwashing that you begin to investigate for yourself -
    so when you talk about “anti-vaccinators” bear in mind
    that the majority started off pro-vaccine and had to wake
    up the hard way. (In my case – three serious wake up
    calls had to happen before I forced to connect the obvious dots!)
    -

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    When examining the scientific evidence for any phenomenon you need to be careful not to attach too much importance to individual studies. I can show you many studies showing no link between vaccines and autism and many showing no lasting effects around hypoglycemia. Considering the vast majority of the science shows vaccines are worthwhile (they have some risks but the protection they offer makes these acceptable) why would you believe the occasional study which supports the anti-vaccine perspective?

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    So you are offering the conspiracy theory which medical professionals are too ignorant to notice, huh? But the anti-vaccination community must be much smarter because they can see the truth? Sound a little bit paranoid, don’t you think? Tell me, given that every report by a respected body (such as the CDC) is seen as part of the conspiracy, how would you know if you are wrong?

  • http://www.desireerover.nl Desiree Rover

    Do I really need to deign with an answer this mainstream academic parrotry? My 20 years of research say I don’t.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    So what qualifications do you have making this research credible? Which university or other research organisation do you work for? What papers have you published in peer-reviewed journals? Please give some references so I can check them out.

  • Argus

    Nothing new here at all in this self-published screed. Be sure to update us in a month about how the sales are going at $24.00 a pop.

    These tired old ideas have been trotted out many times before. The problem is that they are based on either outright lies or on incomplete and deceptively presented information.

    For example, a classic bait and switch is the “mortality” graph shown above. Like the magician practicing misdirection on his audience, it is designed to mislead by making you think that these diseases ‘disappeared’ just because fewer people were dying from them. But the true measure of the human toll is morbidity. This tells a completely different story, as illustrated here:

    http://www.behance.net/gallery/Vaccine-Infographic/2878481

    Please don’t bother responding just to call me a troll or a pharma shill. Instead, if you disagree, explain why, using facts and information. To do otherwise is just an admission that you can’t.

  • http://vactruth.com Jeffry John Aufderheide

    Yes, but, you will not divulge job title or industry you work in, will you?

  • http://www.desireerover.nl Desiree Rover

    Independent research, love.
    BTW, who is paying you?

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    So by “independent research” you really mean “just your opinion”. Unfortunately opinions can’t really be trusted, especially against the overwhelming majority of real science, which includes mechanisms to minimise bias, etc.

    Who is paying me? I’m an IT specialist at the University of Otago, New Zealand. I also do private computer consulting. I have no links with “big pharma”. In fact, in many ways I distrust big business. But I do have a high level of trust in the scientific process, even though I freely admit it isn’t perfect.

  • Roxanne

    How pathetic, you did not counter by showing your knowledge (more like lack of) re. demyelination or the like but trotted out the hackney, misused C word to avoid all the other points raised:
    It’s not a theory but a fact that the CDC etc. are infested
    with conflicts of interest.
    (It’s the fox guarding the chicken
    coop from the bottom down) To be sure, I know professionals who are all too aware that the system
    is corrupt but who just go about their daily practice so
    as not to incur professional problems.
    It’s not a theory but a fact that professionals who are
    openly critical of vaccines have been targeted.
    And when I confronted our own regional “officials” on
    the Hexa Infanrix revelations, they just had blank stares.
    This high paid “experts” are decent people but they only
    know what they’re told. I remind you that the confidential
    report leaked through a watchdog group lists the earlier
    mentioned in their own words – not mine! I bet you
    knew nothing of this either.
    “The combined profits for the ten drug companies in the Fortune 500 ($35.9 billion) were more than the profits for all the other 490 businesses put together ($33.7 billion) in 2002…Now, primarily a marketing machine to sell drugs of dubious benefit, this industry uses its weight and power to co-opt every institution that might stand in its way, including the US Congress, the FDA, academia, medical centers and the medical profession itself.”

    Dr. Marcia Angell, former Editor, The New England Journal of Medicine (another “conspiracy theorist”, I suppose!)

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Let’s have a look at the dictionary: “conspiracy (noun): a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful.” Sounds like what you’re claiming to me!
    Can I ask again: if all evidence against your ideas is seen as part of the conspiracy how would you know if you are wrong?

  • Roxanne

    The mortality rate is FAR more important because the bottom line is that humans will never outwit microbes and to think that we can vaccinate all
    infectious disease into oblivion is sheer folly with the potential to backfire.
    Inferior temporal artificially induced “immunity” potentially shifts the age when children can handle chicken pox etc. and acquire lifelong immunity to an age such as the teens or adulthood when complications could indeed be more grave.
    A healthy immune system that hasn’t had its critical frontier defenses bypassed via vaccination, supported by a strong nutritional profile etc. is one’s best defense against complications from any disease – infectious or otherwise. Fundamentally, the current dying model views the germ as king and we the public as helpless sitting ducks awaiting rescue our “vaccine deficiency” because nature didn’t make our immune systems smart enough to know what to do.
    Really, how utterly irrational this model is.

  • Quicksilver

    There is plenty of mortality data in the book. In fact most of the graphs are on mortality. Nobody says the diseases disappeared. YOUR camp says smallpox disappeared though, because of vaccines, and that is also a joke. There is incidence and mortality both of which are addressed using official data. THe same data Offit uses except the authors used the full range of data and not just one little chunk for 30 years or so—YOUR bait tactic Argo. THere are also over 800 references, many of which YOU have never seen.

  • Roxanne

    Dear OJB,
    When power, politics and mega profits are at stake, one doesn’t need a secret plan to do harm, especially when it is
    guided by faith in an outdated scientific paradigm that is
    misguidingly using the wrong measuring stick. Old
    ideas die hard…. God knows there are plenty of examples
    of power, politics and profit trumping regulatory integrity
    OUTSIDE of vaccines. Besides, even JAMA published an article citing the approximately. 200,000 that die annually from unnecessary surgery, drug problems etc… Does this mean that the hospitals and doctors conspired to do these people in…of course not!!
    Additionally, I have news for you: none of the below – a small sampling of points – are “MY ideas”- They speak for themselves…
    “Prior to 1954 any physician who reported paralytic poliomyelitis was doing his patient a service by way of subsidizing the cost of hospitalization… two examinations at least twenty-four hours apart was all that was required… In 1955 the criteria were changed …residual paralysis was determined ten to twenty days after onset of illness and again fifty to seventy days after onset…This change In definition meant that in 1955, we started reporting a new disease… Furthermore, diagnostic procedures have continued to be re-defined. Cocksackie virus infections and aseptic meningitis have been distinguished from poliomyelitis…Thus simply in the change of diagnosis criteria, the number of paralytic cases was pre-deterrmined to decrease.”
    Dr. Bernard Greenberg, Chairman of the Committee on Evaluation & Standards of The American Policy Health Association during 1950s testifying before Congressional Hearings, 1962

    “Members of the CDC’s Vaccine Advisory Committee get money from vaccines manufacturers. Relationships include: sharing a vaccine patent; owning stock in a vaccine company, payments for research getting money to monitor manufacturer’s tests and funding academic departments.”

    UPI (United Press International) Investigates the Vaccine Conflict

    “I have minutes from a CDC Study Groups Meeting on Hepatitis B vaccine held in March, 1997. The minutes of the meeting show that it would take at least a 60 day study to show onset of MS. Clinical studies done by the two manufacturers were four and five days in length, respectively. It should be noted that the afternoon session of this meeting was chaired by Dr. Robert Sharrar of Merck. Can an employee of a pharmaceutical company that manufacture the vaccine be objective to show fault in a product that generates close to billion dollars in sales for his company?”

    Betty Fluck RN, Testimony for U.S. House of Representatives, 5/18/99

    “The vaccine industry gives millions to the American Academy of Pediatrics for conference grants medical education classes, even to help build their headquarters. The totals are kept secret but public documents reveal pieces $342,000 was given by Wyeth maker of the pneumococcal vaccine; $433,000 was contributed to the Academy by Merck the same year the Academy endorsed Merck’s HPV vaccine… Then there’s Paul Offit perhaps the most widely quoted author of vaccine safety. He has gone so far as to say that babies can theoretically tolerate 10,000 vaccines at once… Dr. Offit holds a $1.5 million research chair at Children’s Hospital funded by Merck… The AAP, ‘Every Child by Two’ and Dr. Offit wouldn’t agree to interviews but all told us they’re up front about the money they receive and it doesn’t sway their opinion.”

    CBS, ‘How Independent Are Vaccine Defenders’, 7/25/08

    “Prevnar has not been evaluated for its carcinogenic or mutagenic potential or impaired infertility…Immune response elicited by Prevnar among infants born prematurely have not been studied.”
    Two Statements from Product Monograph for Prevnar Vaccine

    “Animal reproduction studies have not been conducted with Fluzone vaccine. It is also not known whether Fluzone vaccine can cause fetal harm when administered to a pregnant woman or can affect reproduction capacity … Fluzone vaccine has not been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential or for impairment of fertility.”
    Vaccine Package Insert for Sanofi Pasteur’s Fluzone

    I have the table (would not readily copy and paste) showing the trial “placebos” for the HPV vaccine in which the vast majority were given aluminum hydroxide – hardly inert or
    constituting a placebo of scientific integrity.
    I could send you lists of studies implicating vaccines in serious conditions and death. You, likewise, could send material (hopefully not shoddy don’t look don’t find vaccine pseudo-science trials) that would speak to the opposite. Ultimately, the real proof is in the body. Unvaccinated primates are healthier than vaccinated primates; unvaccinated dogs are healthier than unvaccinated dogs;and from all indications and IMHO plain common sense unvaccinated children have significantly less asthma, diabetes, allergies, ear infections, tonsillitis, learning problems, autism etc. than vaccinated
    children. This may not be ascertained by “official studies” since officialdom refuses to conduct transparent studies re. such. However, unofficial parent surveys (most of whom were for vaccines or they wouldn’t have vaccinated to begin with) from Germany etc. indicate such. Moreover, I know many parents who stopped vaccinating their subsequent children after witnessing the blows dealt the vaccinated child. Without exception, they see a significant difference in the superior health of the vaccine-free child. You can dish this all you want. The ultimate proof is in the pudding.
    Common sense dictates the immune system didn’t come
    with a “vaccine deficiency” in need of injection
    of known neurotoxins and carcinogens and multiple live viruses at once… esp. in growing infants in whom
    the blood-brain barrier is violated. This isn’t even how
    real immunity plays out. Do you understand the implications of bypassing the foremost frontier barriers of the immune system via injection?! (not “my idea” either) By this logic, every species would need to be shot up regularly against the endless slew of microbes that we “swim in” everyday.
    What backward logic.
    Now here is my question to you, OJB …. How many girls
    have to suffer strokes within an hour of the HPV vaccine
    for you to connect the dots?? How many babies have
    to have seizures within a day of vaccination for you to
    even consider the vaccine guilty??
    I suspect that someone could drop dead straight after
    vaccination and you still would defend the vaccine to death.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    You seem to think that by throwing sufficient numbers of out of place quotes, suspect studies, faulty logic, and anecdotes at me I will be overwhelmed by your evidence. Unfortunately I don’t have the time to follow up on all of those to see if they have any validity but when I do I find them lacking credibility.

    You are supporting a conspiracy because you are claiming that almost every medical professional is either so corrupt that they don’t care about, or so incompetent that they haven’t noticed, the alleged dangers of vaccines.

    Just think about this for a moment. Medical professionals are generally intelligent and moral people. Do you really believe, in your wildest fantasies, that they are still supporting a regime which you claim is so dangerous and corrupt?

    Regarding your question: if properly conducted clinical trials indicate that vaccines cause more harm than good then I will be happy to admit I’m wrong.

  • Roxanne

    It is you who referred to points I’d previously raised as
    “MY IDEAS’, I was simply CORRECTING you. Instead of focusing on an important point such as product monographs that state in black and white that carcinogenic potential is not studied for, you’re consumed with diverting attention to the “conspiracy card” …. It is clear from your response that you do not grasp what I was trying to get at in my prefacing
    comments particularly about the power of outdated paradigms of which I could elaborate ( the bacterial/viral theory of infectious disease versus the cellular ecological theory of infectious disease – hardly “my idea” going back to the great Dr. Antoine Beauchamp and now re-gaining interest as our understanding of microbes evolves) – but why bother. I prefer to converse with doctors and scientists who are genuinely open to critically investigating vaccines, and aren’t so absurdly defensive of a clearly broken medical SYSTEM. Thankfully, I’ve met many such individuals both here and abroad.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Wait a minute… a you a germ theory denialist as well? I guess one form of quackery is often accompanied by others! It seems to me that you live in an alternative world of fantasy. Can I try just one more time though: how do you explain the fact that the majority of intelligent, well-meaning medical professionals reject your ideas?

  • Roxanne

    Dear OJB,
    There is plenty I could say in reply to your germ theory and
    “quackery” comments but will refrain from doing so. It’s
    clear this exchange has run it’s course, and that both of
    us could find more enjoyable and worthwhile things to do
    with our August than endlessly butt heads over vaccines. Have a good month and the best to you and your family.
    R.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Agreed. Once you get into a mindset of denialism and conspiracy it is hard to escape. Just think about my last question (regarding the attitude of medical professionals) in the future. I think that is the clearest indication that your logic is faulty. Thanks for the discussion.

  • Jim Bob

    How does Argus’ title and industry help further the scientific debate?

  • http://vactruth.com Jeffry John Aufderheide

    Bias?

  • Jennifer Hutchinson

    There are plenty of studies showing a link between vaccines and autism and other disorders/health problems. See: http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2007/06/no-evidence-of-any-link.html

  • http://DCincome.com/blog Matthew Loop

    Real science? lol… Classic ignorance about who funds medical journals and “scientific” studies.

    Even the former editor of the New England Journal of Medicine stated most medical research and clinical studies are fraudulent.

    http://ethicalnag.org/2009/11/09/nejm-editor/

    Modern medicine is hardly scientific. It’s full of prejudice, illogic and susceptible to advertising.

    Doctors are not taught to reason, they are programmed to believe in whatever their medical schools teach them and
    the leading doctors tell them.

    Over the past several decades drug companies, with their enormous wealth, have taken medicine over and now
    control its research, what is taught and the information released to the public.

    The fox guards the hen-house, OJB.

    Science is for sale. You need to go back and do your homework on the history of medicine and the business of disease.

    Modern medicine kills over 700,000 Americans per year. It’s almost the leading cause of death.

  • Jim Bob

    Why haven’t you asked that question of Humphries?
    She is a homeopath (btw homeopathy is the worst of all pseudoscience). For her, discrediting science-based medicine would increase the sales of her magic water cures.
    Moreover, this website exists to discredit vaccines. Wouldn’t that make all its writers biased as well?

  • Argus

    A strange reply that is on a different topic than what I addressed. This is the tactic that Jeffry usually uses.
    What about the information I linked to showing drastic increases in the incidences of targeted diseases after vaccines for them were introduced? Anything to say about that?

  • Argus

    Just making a very cogent observation.
    As for examples – they are numerous. Just see some of my other posts – or OJB’s – where we point out the untruths.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    The problems you describe (influence of corporations, failure to consider alternative views, corruption) are common to all areas of human experience. The scientific process is the best way we have found to minimise these problems. Faulty and fraudulent results don’t last long before better studies expose them.
    The fact that there are poor and biased studies is exactly why you should distrust your own anti-vaccination beliefs because most of the information you base your views on comes precisely from the faulty sources you quote above.
    And in countries where modern medicine is practiced life spans are longest. When western medicine replaced traditional beliefs in China, for example, the average life span increased greatly.

  • Darryl Lynn

    Funny thing is, the scientists from Nazi Germany came to America and were hired by big pharma companies. After they served prison terms for 5-7 years for mass Genocide.. Coincidence, i think not. Some were actually hired as top level executives right out of prison.. Ecoscience comes to mind, they are controlling the population just like said they would do 20-30 years ago.

  • Health Care Professional

    I don’t usually get involved in these discussions but I have to say I found the below comments facinating and I really enjoyed the read.

    To the pro vaccinators – thanks for your views and concerns for the children. I would like to read about specific and non biased evidence to support all your claims below. I would like to be able to make my own choices based on a firm foundation of knowledge of all sides.
    Also, just to let you guys know that I am one of “those” medical professionals that have to administer treatments to the public. I can guarantee you that with all my best intentions and wishes to do the best by my patients, I DO NOT know the extent of the ingredients of the drugs that I dispense. I know the “spiel” that I was taught at University. If I don’t make EXTRA time in my day especially to further my knowledge (the information of which is so difficult to find sometimes), I would have no clue! This goes for all my collegues in the various professional fields that I am in contact with. Often I have found that I know more than a “so called” professional because I have done extensive research.

    To all anti vaccinators – thank you for providing all the links and information in your comments. If it wasn’t for the pro vaccinators, this vluable information may not have been share. I will be spending much time over the coming days and weeks furthering my knowledge.

    To everyone – when you listen to the news and they report that yes indeed the govt has been tracking peoples’ internet activities and logging it, does this not point to the POSSIBILITY that maybe anti vaccinators are not into conspiricy theory, but rather expressing their right to information, truth and their right to free will and choice. Is it not feasible to imagine that the companies with monatary interest do not have the people or the individuals’ best interest at heart.
    This is how I explain it to my patients – It is YOUR choice. It is YOUR responsibility. No one else in this world has YOUR best interest at heart – only YOU. Weigh up the options and the possible resulting outcomes. Then make your decision with to best of your knowledge. BUT understand the FINALITY of certain decisions – this goes both ways, vaccinating and not vaccinating.

    Sorry for the rant : ) it is quite late here. Knowledge is power – so thanks again for ALL the comments as it has increased my knowledge.

  • Roxanne

    It’s refreshing to see someone within the medical system questioning assumed
    paradigms and insular thinking. (Actually, there are many such individuals,
    it’s just that we only hear publicly from those who obediently tow the line)
    I know that for me, I never questioned what I was told about vaccines and simply regurgitated blindly without an ounce of independent scrutiny. Then three separate incidents unfolded which shook my faith to the core and forced me to question years of brainwashing…
    HCP, your comments are insightful and welcome, and I hope you continue
    to explore these issues which have been censored for vastly too long…

  • Phrixus

    Those who come on here and criticize the written work of the authors on this site certainly are here for reasons other than personal. It’s hard to believe that someone, just because they believe they have two children who have not been effected negatively health wise by receiving vaccines, would bother to come here and argue for that purpose. What are the more in depth reasons for your being here? Please let us know so we can have a deeper understanding of what motivates you, because there must be one, or more?

    Those supporting the work on this site certainly have many reasons for writing what they do and for taking time out of their lives to do such a thing. Have the people on here criticizing over and over again EVERYTHING EVER SAID on this site ever thought to ask, why are you so passionate about this? Perhaps if anyone bothered to look up Desiree Rover and her life story, for instance, you would find she has had a child who was negatively effected by vaccines. (Correct me if I am wrong, but I am quite sure I am remembering correctly) That began her journey into vaccine research, 20 years ago.

  • JRM

    daily vaccine

  • Cookiepress

    I and my husband got a 5 year old, 8 pound toy poodle from the shelter. They gave him one year shots when we got him. Rabies and Bordetella (kennel cough-similar to whooping cough). One year later I took him to the vet for the shots. They gave him 3 year shots. That night he had his first seizure. He foamed at the mouth and his legs went out from under him. His eyes could not focus. Since it was 8 at night the vet was closed and I had to take him to an animal hospital. The vet there gave him a cortisone shot. The seizure lasted an hour. The seizures started at once a month and progressed to 2 x a week. The vet put him on Phenobarbital and he has been on it ever since (6 years). He has been to 3 vets and only one would admit that his brain was overstimulated from the shots. No one could convince me at this point that the vaccines did not do this to him.

    I had 2 kids born in the mid 70s and had all the vaccines given to them that were scheduled. I believed the doctors. I now have 9 grandchildren and only the oldest have been vaccinated. Their parents have done a lot of research and have decided to not have most of the vaccines given to their children. I might also add that they have all been breast fed. When I had my first child in 1975 I was in a ward with 9 other new moms. I was the only one who nursed my baby. One of the women told me it was bad for my baby and I should not do it.

    I had measles, mumps, german measles, whooping cough and chicken pox as a child in the 50s and I am still here to talk about it.

    If I had children today I would be very careful and do all the research I could before I had them vaccinated.

    I believe that people like Jenny McCarthy are doing us a service by making us think and do research to make informed decisions.

  • sed

    It’s rare to find Professional Medical Practitioners who actually put the care in to the patients hands and let them take the responsibility for their actions or non actions. It’s great to see that you are one doctor who actually goes above and beyond to research things further. Most others I have worked with believe the CDC is the all and knowing powerful OZ. More physicians or medical professionals need to research things before informing their patients otherwise.

  • http://www.desireerover.nl Desiree Rover
  • Dan Kegel

    Hi Roxanne!
    I happened to check on that last reference recently; it’s online at http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2454407/
    and is a question in a letter, not an article with data. So I’m afraid it doesn’t effectively support your point.

    About the Cologne epidemic of 1870-1871, I googled around a bit and found actual (if somewhat hard to read, especially if you don’t know german) statistics at
    http://books.google.com/books?id=TDQPAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA155

    It says that in Cologne, the number of districts with death rates in the following ranges among smallpox cases was as follows:

    unvaccinated vaccinated
    under 10% 1 2
    10%-30% 2 8
    30%-50% 0 0
    50%-70% 2 0
    70%-100% 4 0
    not reported 2 1

    To summarize this odd way of reporting statistics: among smallpox cases in Cologne, the death rate was 10%-30% for vaccinated patients and usually higher (in 4 districts, 70% or higher) for unvaccinated patients.

    I’ve checked the statistics from seven smallpox epidemics in four countries, and all seven show that vaccination was effective at reducing the death rate among smallpox cases.
    (See http://kegel.com/smallpox for the data.)

  • quicksilver

    Classic Witch Finders ploy here

    DONT BOTHER TO REPLY

    Exactly how they burned witches at the stake.

    If you objected then watch out as you would be the next WITCH

    Research ANDREW WAKEKEFIELD

    Research ARPAD PUSTZAI

    And thousands of others

    BUT more important this is for ARGUS

    DONT READ THIS

    You might get a prick from:

    CHARLES RICHET and ANAPHYLAXIS

    From UNAVOIDABLY UNSAFE shots at the flaws in your fictitious writing.

  • http://www.BodyCures.com/ Dr. John Foley

    It’s a sad fact that paid trolls are hired to patrol disqus and create disruption. This is especially true with vaccines and GMOs as these topics are extremely important to corporations. Here are a couple of resources. After a while, it’s very easy to pick them out. Best to simply ignore them as they are not getting paid to change their minds.
    http://www.anh-europe.org/news/trolls-agents-and-forum-spies-how-dissent-is-controlled-on-the-internet

    http://holisticremediesnews.com/3859/researchers-release-the-profile-of-a-vaccine-internet-troll/

  • IHateOJBArgusJimBob

    OJB, you are an idiot. I have a mental disability but I have enough sense to know how stupid you are. Which pharmaceutical company’s pole are you smoking on? Why do you smoke pharma-pole? Why are you a liar? Why are you so mean to other people? Since you are so hateful, why not chat with me? I’m hateful to people like you and your butt-dart buddies Argus and JimBob. No one trusts the CDC anymore except for those who have not the power to think for themselves. But seriously, why are you so stupid? Did yo’ momma not feed you from the teet? Too much Thimerisol on the brain? I’m doing what you do to others. I’m not gonna prove anything or give any facts. My job is to focus on you, JimBob, and Argus. I will just sit here on this website and “troll” trolls like y’all. This is gonna be fun. I don’t need scientific facts (you don’t provide any) to prove anything, I am only here to talk crap to you and those other idiots. Do y’all just sit next to eachother and smoke pharma-pole together? I wish we could meet in person so I could kick you in the nuts just for shits-n-giggles. Where you at? Remember I have a disability so please type slowly. Everyone else, please ignore me and realize that this is necessary. Sorry to sound childish but these idiots do so I will too.

  • IHateOJBArgusJimBob

    I know who you are. Stop playing with yourself. I’m watching you.

  • IHateOJBArgusJimBob

    You are very stupid for a government spy.

  • IHateOJBArgusJimBob

    Have a facts-based discussion with me. Why do you smoke pharma-pole? I want scientific facts as to why you, OJB, smoke pharma-pole? Please, I need to know this.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Facts: the vast majority of studies show vaccines are safe; there is no good evidence supporting conspiracy theories concerning autism, etc; the vast majority of doctors and other medical experts recommend using vaccines. What other facts do you need?

  • Duncan Vincent

    This book is A fraudulent deception written by a quack.

  • http://vactruth.com Jeffry John Aufderheide

    But you can’t discuss the merits of the information in the book, can you? How quaint.

  • sabelmouse

    yes, they were already declining in incidence and mortality.

  • sabelmouse

    what a very good comment. it sums it up very well.

  • Mike Stevens

    There are no merits.
    It is based upon the mistaken premise that medical care, sanitation, nutrition and hygiene eliminated childhood infectious diseases, when all it did was impact the mortality rate.

  • Mike Stevens

    Mortality was declining to an extent, unsurprising considering how medical science had developed things like iron lungs and antibiotics.

    Incidence was hardly declining for most of the diseases. One simple proof of this is to quote the antivaccine mantra “We all had these diseases when we were young, and they never did us any harm”, which neatly nails the lie above that no-one had the diseases because they were all in terminal decline anyway.

    Also, see here:
    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v507/n7490_supp/full/507S2a.html

  • Mike Stevens

    Mortality counts, obviously, but the crucial factor is the incidence of disease. If that is zero, and the disease is eliminated or eradicated, then no-one can die from it.

    Let’s look at it from this perspective.
    Cars crash. 30 thousand die each year from MVAs.
    If you had a new system (Google, anyone?) which prevented cars crashing into each other, would you use it?

    Some might argue thusly: “Well, we have airbags, and ABS, they have reduced the fatality rate from accidents. We also are better at rehabilitating people who get brain damage in MVAs. So since “mortality” from accidents is dropping, we don’t need technology to prevent the problem of car crashes in the first place”

    That’s not rational. That’s what you are saying though.

  • BeStrong

    “The appeal to authority is a logical fallacy because authorities are not necessarily correct about judgments related to their field of expertise. Though reliable authorities can be correct in judgments related to their area of expertise more often than laypersons, they can still come to the wrong judgments through error, bias, dishonesty, or falling prey to groupthink. Thus, the appeal to authority is not an argument for establishing facts.”

    (McDonald, Franklin (2008). Informal Logic. London: Cambridge University Press)

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    True. You cannot prove a point through an appeal to authority. You can however support your view by showing that almost every expert accepts the results of credible research. And that is the situation for vaccination.

  • BeStrong

    Your second logical fallacy :
    ” Argumentum ad populum is a fallacious argument that concludes a proposition to be true because many or most people believe it. In other words, the basic idea of the argument is: “If many believe so, it is so.” It is logically fallacious because the mere fact that a belief is widely held is not necessarily a guarantee that the belief is correct.”

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    I am very aware of logical fallacies and this is not an appeal to popularity. The fact is that well-designed studies show vaccines work and the vast majority of experts agree with this. The support of experts isn’t a guarantee of truth but it is a strong indicator. Claiming the experts are wrong with no good evidence is just denialism.

  • sabelmouse

    nothing to be sniffed at. the mortality rate [and rate of any kind of lasting damage ] is the important one.
    not the fact that people spend a week with some unpleasantness.
    any person concerned with the well being of humans, let alone a doctor , should be happy with that.

    claiming that preventing the disease even if it has no drawbacks is more important that removing the drawbacks is either deluded or trying to sell a vaccine.

  • sabelmouse

    mortality was declining because of nutrition, sanitation, medical care [ unless the medical care actually endangers patients as with fever suppressants and measles] sector as you’ve said above.
    so what if the incidence didn’t?
    i dont say that they all were in decline. or that we all had them. a significant portion of us had them and more important; they didn’t sent parents, teachers , doctors into a panic as they would have had they been feared.

  • sabelmouse

    personally i’d rather trust myself than that system, or is it infallible? driving well is the most important element including watching other driver’s behavior.

  • sabelmouse

    the scientific process can be tainted by monetary interests as well as ego.

  • Duncan Vincent

    I did. It is a fraudulent deception, without merit. Unless you enjoy laughing at the nonsense that silly fools dream up. Then its a great book.

  • Duncan Vincent

    There aren’t any studies that show that, in fact there are many studies that disprove it.

  • ciaparker2

    Dr. Humphries’ book is filled with quotes from contemporary sources and fully-referenced charts and tables supporting her points. Most of it is a stunning indictment of industrial society, dependent on cramming hundreds of thousands of factory workers into crowded, filthy slums where they died of contagious disease at horrifying rates. The rest of the book documents how death rates from the big killers of the nineteenth century plunged precipitously in the first decades of the twentieth century BEFORE the vaccines for some of them came into use.
    It is an excellent book and much-needed to counter the lies of the pharma industry and those in their employ intent on denying the deadly truth about vaccines.

  • ciaparker2

    Incidence declined greatly for diphtheria, pertussis, and scarlet fever, the big killers of the nineteenth century. Mortaility fell for all of them too, and measles as well. Measles incidence did not decline before the vaccine, but it had evolved into a common, nearly always harmless disease of childhood. The smallpox vaccine was ineffective and deadly in itself, and vastly increased rates of the disease from the arm to arm vaccination practice that was commonly used, and caused the disease in and killed hundreds of thousands. The disease evolved to become much milder after 1897, and in a few decades became rare and much less deadly than it had been, independent of vaccines (details to be found in Dissolving Illusions).

  • ciaparker2

    That is true, but it Is also true that BP is paying legions of commenters to defend vaccines everywhere possible.

  • BeStrong

    Logical Fallacy #3

    False Analogy:

    This fallacy consists in assuming that because two things are alike in one or more respects, they are necessarily alike in some other respect.

    Comparing one thing to another based on superficial similarities or while ignoring fundamental dissimilarities that matter is a False Analogy.

    (College of the Redwoods)

  • Mike Stevens

    Disinformation and downright falsehoods.
    Incidence did NOT decline for chickenpox, rubella, mumps, measles, pertussis or polio. Diphtheria incidence declined partially. It took vaccines to drive these diseases out of our homes and cities.
    Measles has not become milder; it still kills one in one to five thousand in modern industrialised countries in the 21st century.
    Smallpox vaccine was dangerous, killing maybe one in a thousand. But when smallpox itself killed one in two, most people leaped at the chance to have it. I myself had it 8 years ago.
    You can find details of this from agencies specialising in the diseases, such as WHO, CDC, HPA. ECDC, AAP etc. Go read about it in Nature:
    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v507/n7490_supp/full/507S2a.html

    Or I suppose you can put on a foil hat, relax with a glass of koolaid, and read lies in someone’s book.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Try googling ” Suzanne Humphries quack”.
    Ps vaccinations started in the 1700′s not the 1970′s, just one of the many misrepresentations in this book.

  • Mike Stevens

    Mortality was also declining because of the iron lung.

  • Mike Stevens

    I support sanitation and nutrition, and advances in medical care. Right with you on that, and if they reduce the death rate that’s fine by me.

    But if people never got the infection in the first place, there would be no deaths.

  • ciaparker2

    You are so uninformed. From UK government charts:
    Scarlet fever deaths spiked at 160 per 100,000 in 1862, fell from 70 to 20 between 1880 and 1886, to 5 in 1916, and then it nearly disappeared in both incidence and mortality. (no vaccine since trial vaccines killed so many)
    Pertussis mortality peaked at 80 per 100,000 in 1868, 10 in 1916, then less than one by the time the vaccine started to be used in the ’50s in the UK.
    Measles mortality peaked at 70 per 100,000 in 1840, down to 20 in 1910, five in 1930, close to zero when the vaccine started to be used in 1968.
    In Leicester, England, diphtheria deaths spiked at 150 per 100,000 in 1900. five years AFTER the antitoxin came into general use. Diphtheria caused 3000 deaths per year in the UK in 1866, but rose in mortality to reach 9000 a year in 1900. The antitoxin (often deadly) came into use in 1895, the vaccine in about 1940, by which time the disease cause 2000 deaths a year.
    It is very likely the diseases would have continued their fall into insignificance even without the vaccines, and we would have been spared all that vaccine damage.
    Et ainsi de suite. The diseases evolved to become less deadly, and all but measles less common, BEFORE the vaccines for them came into use.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    All processes and groups (including vaccine denial groups) can be tainted by monetary interests and ego. The question is which group has the most credibility around self-correction and review. Clearly that is science which has these mechanisms built-in.

  • http://www.ojb.co.nz OJB

    Quoting irrelevant logical fallacies isn’t really adding anything useful to the argument. What’s your point?

  • Mike Stevens

    Damn, this is like Groundhog day.
    Read…..My…..Comment.

    INCIDENCE, Cia, NOT MORTALITY!

  • BeStrong

    Late-Nineteenth and Early-Twentieth Century Pediatrics: The Development of a
    Specialty (Cynthia Connolly, PhD, RN, FAAN )

    “Until the mid-nineteenth century, there were no facilities dedicated to the care of sick children in the United States. If they could not be cared for at home,
    children, like their parents, went to municipal almshouses, also known as
    poorhouses. Orphaned or abandoned babies often ended up in infant
    asylums.

    By 1900, the organisms responsible for typhoid, leprosy, malaria, tuberculosis, cholera, diphtheria, and a host of other conditions were identified. An understanding of the bacterial origins of infectious diseases encouraged such advances as the use of surgical gloves and sterilization.

    Until the 1890s when the Children‟s Hospital of Philadelphia developed
    accommodations to isolate potentially infectious children, the institution
    avoided admitting children with contagious diseases as well as infants for
    any reason.

    Over the course of the twentieth century, hospital care for sick
    children of all classes became more commonplace, especially as new
    technologies and advances such as antibiotics made it possible to save the
    lives of more children.

    The incidence of urban poverty exploded as immigrants and native
    born migrants crammed into tenements. Inadequate living conditions led to
    overcrowding, poor sanitation, disease, and increased crime.

    Poor children and those orphaned or abandoned, were highly visible in cities. Children played in the streets, increasingly becoming victims of accidents. Contagious diseases and hunger were rampant. Poor maternal nutrition helped keep infant mortality high. Record keeping was sporadic until the 1920s and ’30s, but what records that do exist indicate that at the dawn of the twentieth century one in every seven babies died.

    A New York City nurse, Lillian Wald, pioneered the new nursing specialty of public health nursing, an important engine of child-saving. In 1893, she and a colleague merged the concepts underlying district nursing and settlement houses by creating the nurse-managed Henry Street Settlement. Wald believed that bringing subsidized nursing care to the poor in their homes—care similar to that which the middle and upper classes could afford for themselves—both heightened the chances for its success.

    Lillian Wald’s activism helped spur the creation of the Children‟s Bureau,
    the first government agency to be dedicated solely to children‟s welfare,
    which was established in 1912. Wald and other public health nurses throughout the nation worked at health departments to implement Children‟s Bureau initiatives such as those aimed at preventing infant mortality. Their efforts established nurses as a critical societal resource for children‟s health.

    A few years later, Congress enacted the first federal legislation for children‟s health and welfare, the 1921 Sheppard-Towner Act. At the height of the 1930s Depression, nurses again sprung into action, providing health care to children through the Child Health Recovery Program and later through the Social Security Act.

  • ciaparker2

    Sabel’s right, illness is actually a good thing (within reason), to keep the immune system up to snuff. People with cancer usually haven’t had a cold in years: if they had, the immune system would have been more alert and killed the cancer cells. I just read last night in a book by Harold Buttram that measles, mumps, rubella, and chickenpox were necessary to train the child’s immune system properly, and nothing else does a comparably good job.

  • ciaparker2

    That’s ridiculous, she goes into great detail about the main diseases and the vaccines for them, the years they were introduced. She talks about the diphtheria, smallpox, and pertussis vaccines in great detail, and all were introduced long before the ’70s.

  • ciaparker2

    Incidence and mortality usually fell in tandem. The exception was measles, which continued to be universal until the vaccine, though its mortality had dropped to close to zero.

  • ciaparker2

    Except that if you never get sick, your immune system never develops an effective Th-1 response, crucial to lifelong health. The task of the baby’s first year is to develop towards appropriate dominance of the Th-1 response, attained by confronting microbial threats. No illness, no mature immune system. The alternative, the Th-2 response, is encouraged by vaccines and is the autoimmune alternative, leading to chronic illness and ill health. Is it healthier to jog or do other aerobic exercise every day, or to lie in bed eating chocolates? You certainly run little risk of spraining an ankle, but your heart needs to exert itself to remain healthy. Same with the immune system.

  • ciaparker2

    Homeopathy is the answer. It has a much better of curing all contagious diseases (when necessary, usually it’s not) than allopathic medicine. It has performed miracles for my family and our pets.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Quack quack quack. she is a quack. So is Roman Brskalphabet. Try doing some research into critiques of their book. Quack.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Except for knives and bullets.

  • BeStrong

    Infant Mortality in the 20th Century, Dramatic but Uneven Progress
    (Myron E. Wegman, School of Public Health, University of Michigan)

    In 1915, deaths of children between one month and the first birthday declined steadily to roughly one third of the total today. Up until World War II, this decline appears more closely related to improvement in the biologic environment, particularly less crowded housing and the quality and quantity of water available to households for drinking, personal hygiene and sewage disposal.

    Deaths from infectious diseases had also diminished strikingly by 1937; yet it was only in that year that use of the sulfonamide drugs became widespread and antibiotics were still several years off. Typhoid fever had almost disappeared and measles deaths had been reduced sharply. It was the rare medical student who had a chance to see a case of diphtheria. Similarly, deaths from pneumonia and influenza, many of which might just as well have been classified as infectious diseases, had also diminished strikingly. Reduction in crowded housing had a substantial effect before the antibiotic era.”

    Typhoid: Improvements in sanitation and the provision of clean drinking water led to the elimination of typhoid fever from developed countries in the beginning of the 20th century. (Yale School of Public Health, Epidemiology of Microbial Diseases).

    Diphtheria in the 1920s in the United States,(140–150 cases per 100,000 population) and 13,000–15,000 deaths were reported each year. In 1921, a total of 206,000 cases and 15,520 deaths were reported. The
    number of cases gradually declined to about 19,000 cases in 1945 (15 per 100,000 population). A more rapid decrease began with the widespread use of toxoid in the late 1940s. (CDC Pink Book)

    Measles: Incidence of Measles in U.S. was approximately 3 to 4 million cases a year, with 400-500 deaths (CDC). In “Historical Comparisons of Morbidity and Mortality for Vaccine-Preventable Diseases in the United States”, American Medical Association, 2007, between the years 1953- 1962, there were 440 deaths from measles, a death rate of between .011% and .015 % of cases. It was considered a common childhood disease.

    Atypical measles occurs only in persons who received inactivated (“killed”) measles vaccine (KMV) and are subsequently exposed to wild-type measles virus. An estimated 600,000 to 900,000 persons received KMV in the United States from 1963 to 1967. KMV sensitizes the recipient to measles virus antigens without providing protection.

    Subsequent infection with measles virus leads to signs of hypersensitivity polyserositis. The illness is characterized by
    fever, pneumonia, pleural effusions, and edema. Moderate to severe
    local reactions with or without fever may follow revaccination; these reactions are less severe than with infection with wild
    measles virus.(CDC Pink Book).

    Findings not previously described in Atypical Measles included liver enzyme elevations, thrombocytopenia, disseminated intravascular coagulation, possible transmission among siblings, and suspected cardiac involvement. All patients had previously received killed measles vaccine. A substantial number of persons who are older adolescents or young adults may be at risk of developing atypical measles. (Atypical Measles in Adolescents and Young Adults, American College of Physicians, Annals of Internal Medicine, June, 1, 1979).

  • BeStrong

    Medical care, waste management, nutrition, hygiene, clean water, and sewage systems profoundly impacted the mortality rate in the case of infectious disease.

    Death Rates for Common Infectious Diseases in the United States. Mortality rate per 100,000 population.

    Influenza and pneumonia 202.2 in (1900), 103.9 in (1935) and 30.9 in (1970)

    Tuberculosis 194.4 in (1900), 55.1 in (1935) and 2.6 in (1970)

    Gastroenteritis 142.7 in (1900), 14.1 in (1935) and 1.3 in (1970)

    Diphtheria 40.3 in (1900), 3.1 in (1935), and 0.0 in (1970)

    Typhoid fever 31.3 in (1900), 2.7 in (1935), and 0.0 in (1970)

    Measles 13.3 in (1900), 3.1 in (1935), and 0.0 in (1970)

    Dysentery 12.0 in (1900), 1.9 in (1935), 0.0 in (1970)

    Whooping cough 12.0 in (1900), 3.7 in 1935, and 0.0 in (1970)

    Scarlet fever (including streptococcal sore throat)
    9.6 in (1900), 2.1 in (1935), and 0.0 in (1970)

    Meningococcal infections 6.8 in (1900), 2.1 in (1935), and 0.3 in (1970)

    (Introduction to Infectious Diseases Epidemiology, Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Health, Johns Hopkins University, 2007, page 10.)

  • sabelmouse

    except for death by vaccine, or slow, prolonged death by auto immune disease or death of something else that the person’s immune system couldn’t handle because of being vaccinated.

  • sabelmouse

    what, for measles?

  • Duncan Vincent

    The cutting and pasting is strong in this one.

  • BeStrong

    “This one” knows how to research and document multiple academic and medical sources of information.
    What we know about Duncan Vincent is that he knows how to say, “Quack, Quack”.

  • BeStrong

    I sure did some research into critiques on “Dissolving Illusions: Disease, Vaccines and Forgotten History”.

    Thanks for the recommendation, Duncan Vincent !!!

  • Mike Stevens

    Of course not. My post, which you responded to, mentioned 7 diseases, polio being one of them.
    Keep up, will you?

  • Mike Stevens

    Your amateur Google-university opinion is trumped by the data.
    For the facts, see Project Tycho, an analysis of nearly 88 million recorded cases of vaccine preventable infections from 1888 to the present day.
    http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMms1215400

    The striking and persistent reductions in disease incidence rates after vaccine licensure strongly support the conclusion that vaccination programs were a leading cause.

  • Guest

    I love these silly claims by the anti-vaxers. “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.” – Samuel Clemens

  • AzSandrat

    “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.” -Samuel Clemens

  • AzSandrat

    What a bunch of silly lather.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccination#History

    Vaccinations have been around for ~1000 years.

  • AzSandrat

    She fails to mention that the Turks developed a smallpox vaccine almost 1000 years ago, along with other real, verifiable facts. She presents cherry-picked blather to cloud the truth and you, my dear innocent, bought it.

  • AzSandrat

    Aha! That, dear innocent, is exactly what vaccines do. Provide the virus to the bodies immune system in a way that does not cause disease, so that the immune system is trained to fight off those diseases. Yet you somehow think diseases that killed many of the people who contracted them should be allowed to thrive in the modern world. You really should find a therapist to help you with that.

  • Mike Stevens

    I said that these advances impacted the mortality rate. Didn’t you read my comment?

    But what about morbidity and incidence of disease. For the usual vaccine preventable diseases of childhood you really needed vaccines.

    Here is data from 88 million cases of disease in the last 130 years:
    http://www.febrilnotropeni.net/newsfiles/3777NEJMms1215400.pdf

  • Mike Stevens

    Yes, we have heard from you on other forums how you would be delighted to see the return of all these diseases like measles, and say “No big deal” when you had their prevaccine death rates pointed out to you (450-500/yr for measles alone in the US each year)

  • Mike Stevens

    Except death by vaccine is vanishingly rare (prove otherwise if you will) and death from the diseases was still rife prevaccine,

  • Mike Stevens

    Cured you all, did it?

    Pity it can’t cure terminological inexactitudes

  • Mike Stevens

    Superglue on your thumb?

  • Duncan Vincent

    Actually not me. How ever that other Duncan is correct. She is”widely regarded as a QUACK “.
    I said research critiques, not try to confirm what you already believe. That 44 people who were silly enough to buy this book were also too silly to figure out that is silly nonsense is of no consequence. The books target audience liked it, big surprise.

  • ciaparker2

    So? They killed thousands in the nineteenth century, and there were huge riots all over Europe protesting mandatory vaccine laws that were killing so many of them and their children. That would mean that your point would be…?

  • ciaparker2

    Again, so? Variolation gave smallpox to so many and killed so many for other reasons as well that it was given up. So again, your point is…?

  • ciaparker2

    So you get paid per comment, no matter how asinine? Do they do any kind of quality control on you guys?

  • ciaparker2

    And death because immune systems that have not been allowed to hone their skills combatting real diseases never become competent at their job. Vaccines create predominance of humoral, autoimmune immunity dependent on antibodies, which are in themselves immune-suppressant. Nature designed us to have predominance of the cell-mediated Th-1 immune response, which only gets up and running if it has been able to combat childhood diseases.

  • ciaparker2

    Ching! Ten bucks per comment?

  • Duncan Vincent

    $20

  • Duncan Vincent

    I get $10 for your reply too.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Plus $5 for every book someone doesn’t buy.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Woohoo 10 more dollars!!

  • BeStrong

    Sure, it was just a coincidence, Duncan. Surprisingly, the “other Duncan” has your writing style. His “QUACK” is unmistakable.

  • sabelmouse

    vanishingly rare because it’s being denied. as are other vaccine injuries. it’s always something else, it’s always a coincidence, it’s never the vaccine.
    i think i’ve found the solution to the perfect murder!

  • sabelmouse

    it didn’t and you seem to have a bit of an obsession with the iron lung.

  • sabelmouse

    maybe there are different levels. reasonable sounding ones get more than those just used to spam. it would hardly be fair otherwise.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Yes its true, I invented the word quack. I also insist you refer to me as “THE Duncan”, since there can only be one.
    PS you owe me eleventy billion dollars in royalties for quoting me.

  • ciaparker2

    But when they’re tired and in a hurry, slamming out five comments consisting only of Quack! or Dr. Wakefield was a fraud! would still net them a hundred bucks at the pay scale suggested here. Wow, that’s nearly enough to make me change horses and turn my coat!

  • sabelmouse

    such shoddy work sure doesn’t deserve the pay. my daughter thought it sounded intriguing too. work from home, be online. make money. sadly she’s got a conscience, i must have raised her wrong.

  • BeStrong

    You “quacked” seven times before I responded to your post. “Quacking” seems to be your favorite form of communication.
    You also may wish to attempt to critique the book rather than QUACK about the author.

  • Mike Stevens

    Hang on… I am only getting £10 per comment.
    Are you getting Merck shillings or Glaxo?
    Neither of us do as well as Cia though, she gets $25 from Service Corporation International.

  • Duncan Vincent

    I double bill, like all (google) doctors. Plus the yearly stipend from the reptillians.

  • BeStrong

    I just checked your Wikipeda source and this what it said.

    “The earliest documented examples of vaccination are from India and China in the 17th century, where vaccination with powdered scabs from people infected with smallpox was used.”

    You said, “Vaccinations have been around for ~1000 years.”

    You need to check your math, because it can be, at the most, 414 years since the most rudimentary forms of vaccinations began.

    Also, check your Wikipedia source to distinguish the difference between “Vaccination” and “Inoculation”.

    You don’t seem to know as much as you think you do. Try reading the complete reference before you post the link.

  • Mike Stevens

    Damn. I need a new agent.

    Best I can do is a bonus of £50 with every 100th comment on the Illuminati forum.

  • Duncan Vincent

    Illuminati!! Those cheap bastards!! My new overlords, the Reptillians, pay much better. Plus I got a HUGE bonus when they headhunted me. Email me at Duncan_quack@reptillian.org for the details.
    PS Keep this a secret.

  • AzSandrat

    You do know that vaccines were just coming into widespread use, but not required anywhere, around the 1900s, right?

  • AzSandrat

    The true conspiracy theorist answer: “Any evidence which contradicts my belief must be a lie because it contradicts what I believe!” You cannot see because you refuse to open your eyes, child. Keep trying and you may get there.

  • AzSandrat

    True enough. I am here because I don’t want my grandchildren or anyone else put at risk because some a-hole wants to sell a book to a bunch of paranoid nuts. Not so personal, really.

  • AzSandrat

    Bologna. You’re a quack and more reasonably minded people are calling you out for it. No paid disruptors required.

  • AzSandrat

    Clearly, you don’t know as much as you think you do or you would not be advocating the re-emergence of deadly childhood diseases. Only the most vile members of humanity would be in favor of allowing these diseases to run rampant again.

  • BeStrong

    Try reading your source completely before you post a link.

  • BeStrong

    If you google, “the history of vaccines”, you will see that most vaccinations were approved for use after 1935, and they were not well-received by the public. The first pertussis vaccine proved to be ineffective.

  • AzSandrat

    So you admit that the current vaccines are effective?

  • AzSandrat

    In computers, most people struggle to distinguish memory from storage. Truth is, the popular concept wins no matter how much you’d like to blather on about the distinctions between (in this case) an innoculation and a vaccination. The result is remarkably similar. The recipient is granted some protection against the disease.

  • AzSandrat

    You have turned to the quack side… I fear that there is no hope for you.

  • BeStrong

    If that is the most intelligent commentary you can make, it is best that you return to playing with your rubber duckies.

  • AzSandrat

    An intelligent conversation requires both parties be reasonable and intelligent people. So far as I can tell, based upon the ongoing quackery, you are neither. *nom* *nom* *nom*

  • BeStrong

    So sorry that you consider your response “reasonable and intelligent”. You are still quacking, dear.