1893

2-Month Old Infant Suffered Apnea and Died Following 8 Vaccines

Another family is mourning the loss of their two-month old baby following routine vaccinations. Cash Dewayne Thomas was having apnea episodes following the vitamin K injection and hepatitis B vaccine given to him at birth. When his mother sought help from numerous doctors, they ignored her concerns and would not put Cash on a breathing monitor.

At his two-month well-baby checkup, Cash’s pediatrician assured his mother the vaccines were safe and signed off for the nurse to vaccinate Cash with eight more vaccine doses, even though Cash’s breathing problems had not been addressed. He died 16 days later, which is one of the critical days infants pass away or suffer breathing issues after vaccination. [1,2]

After burying their son, Cash’s parents, Whitney Hill and Jesse Dewayne Thomas, regretted that they listened to the doctor over their own instincts. They entrusted the doctors with their infant son and know the vaccines led to his breathing problems and ultimately his death.

Cash’s mother and father want to send a strong message to parents who support vaccines and hope their son’s story will help save others from suffering a loss like they have.

Cash Couldn’t Escape Doctors Eager to Inject Him

Cash Dewayne Thomas survived the onslaught of unsafe vaccines his mother was told she needed to get during her second trimester, when she was injected with the Tdap and flu vaccines. [3,4]

At forty weeks gestation, Whitney went into labor at Research Medical Center in Kansas City, Missouri. She tested positive for Group B strep and was given two doses of the antibiotic penicillin. Soon after, Cash was born unresponsive, weighing nine pounds and two ounces and had to be resuscitated immediately.

After he was resuscitated, Cash was deemed in good enough health and then injected with the vitamin K shot and hepatitis B vaccine on April 19, 2013, the day he was born. The two combined shots contain approximately 350 mcg of aluminum and both are linked to breathing problems, among other things. [5]

By the time Cash was three weeks old, his mother noticed him having gasping episodes while sleeping in his bassinet. When he awoke, he let out a snorting sound as he would catch his breath, then he would go back to bed.

When Cash was five weeks old, his apnea episodes started occurring more frequently, about once every hour. Cash’s mother had to blow into her son’s mouth and nose to get him breathing again. On May 26, 2013, Whitney rushed her son to the emergency room at Children’s Mercy Hospitals and Clinics in Kansas City, Missouri, begging for help.

Whitney knew something was very wrong, but the doctor would not listen to her and wrote Cash’s breathing problems off as reflux and gave her a prescription for Zantac and told her to follow up with his pediatrician. She felt helpless and was frustrated they would not hook up Cash to a breathing monitor.

Cash was still being breastfed. He was breastfed for several weeks and then switched to formula. He had no congestion, no runny nose, and no swollen eyes, none of the things you would associate with a food allergy. Believing the doctors knew best, his mother gave Cash the prescription Zantac. This did not help him.

Cash’s apnea spells continued while she waited for him to be seen by his pediatrician. Whitney found out the pediatrician was required to submit a referral to Children’s Mercy for them to test Cash at their Sleep Disorder Clinic.

On June 7, 2013, the pediatrician sent the referral for them to do apnea testing on Cash. An appointment was made for him be seen by a nurse practitioner at the sleep clinic the following Monday. By this time, Whitney had to breathe in her son’s nose and mouth more than once when he stopped breathing.

After getting home from that appointment, Whitney received a phone call about an hour later and was told Monday’s appointment was canceled. She was told Cash couldn’t be seen by a nurse practitioner because he was too young and that only a Doctor of Medicine (MD) could see him, which didn’t make sense.

Whitney was told they would put Cash on a waiting list to be scheduled, not for Cash to be seen, but to be scheduled to be seen. She was so shocked and upset at this. None of the doctors were doing anything to help Cash.

Weeks went by and Cash was still not scheduled to be seen; then his two-month checkup approached. His mother took all three of her children in to receive the vaccines on time, but she didn’t know vaccines were linked to apnea and breathing problems.

At his two-month well-baby checkup, the doctor neglectfully recommended Cash receive the routine vaccines. The doctor assured Whitney the vaccines were safe and signed off for the nurse to vaccinate Cash with eight more vaccine doses, even though Cash’s breathing problems had not been addressed. Cash’s mother entrusted the doctor with her son’s life and signed the paper, giving consent to vaccinate.

On June 19, 2013, when Cash weighed almost fifteen pounds, the nurse administered the diphtheria, tetanus, pertussis, hepatitis B, polio, Hib, pneumococcal and rotavirus vaccines, via three needle injections and one oral dose, for a total of eight vaccine doses.

After Cash received those two-month vaccinations, he was cranky and was given Tylenol, which was recommended by the doctor. Cash’s breathing issues worsened. Days passed and the apnea spells continued.

Cash’s mother felt helpless and didn’t know what to do while waiting for Cash to be scheduled for an appointment. She would prop up Cash on his Boppy pillow and on one occurrence, she witnessed Cash holding his face and not breathing for fifteen seconds.

Whitney was so scared because when Cash would sleep, he was gasping for air more often and his apnea episodes worsened following the two-month vaccines, but none of the doctors would help him.

Baby Cash Was Laughing and Playing; 5 Hours Later He Died

On July 4, 2013, after an eventful firework celebration on Independence Day, Cash was laughing and playing on his Boppy pillow. He went to sleep around 11:30 PM, in a natural, elevated position, cradled in his mother’s arm, on his back. He had a bassinet he often slept in but sleeping next to mom was more preferred this night.

On July 5, 2013, around 5:08 AM, five hours after they fell asleep, his mother woke up thinking it was odd Cash hadn’t awakened yet, because he would normally wake up sooner, to feed. Cash was still in the same position he fell asleep in. He was on his back and completely face up. His mother needed to get up and when she moved her arm out from under him, Cash rolled off her arm and onto his face. He didn’t try to move.

Whitney knew something was wrong. She picked him up and yelled his name. Cash was still warm, but his lips were cold. She yelled for his dad Jesse to call 911. It took the ambulance eight minutes to get to them and they only lived two blocks away. The ambulance showed up and emergency responders took Cash and tried to revive him.

All attempts to resuscitate Cash were unsuccessful and he was pronounced dead at Children’s Mercy Hospital, at 5:51 AM. He was only two and a half months old. When Cash died, emergency responders noted Cash had a significant amount of blood in the back of his throat and that no foul play was suspected.



Cash’s Parents Were Treated Like Criminals

Cash’s parents were immediately separated and taken to the hospital in two separate vehicles. His mom had to ride alone in a detective’s car. When she entered the emergency room at Children’s Mercy, she was taken into a room followed by ten strangers who were there to explain to her that her son was dead. Whitney said, “I don’t want to hear it! I brought my son to you for help because he would stop breathing. You wouldn’t help him.”



Cash’s dad Jesse arrived in a second detective’s vehicle 30 minutes later. In the hospital, when Cash’s parents were finally allowed to be together, they felt they were being held hostage, while they were counseled with a chaplain present.

Whitney and Jesse were not allowed to leave that hospital room until the results came back from a skeletal survey done on their son, proving their innocence that Cash didn’t die because of foul play. It is unthinkable that parents are treated like this after losing their baby. They felt they were being treated as criminals.



Cash’s Mother Was Asked to Donate His Organs and Tissue

Once Cash’s parents were allowed to leave the hospital, less than two hours later, Children’s Mercy phoned Whitney, to ask if she would give permission for them to donate Cash’s useable organs and tissue. Whitney couldn’t handle this and was so upset and told them not to touch her baby.

She was emotionally unable to re-enter her home for over a week.



Vaccines Were Not Mentioned on Cash’s Autopsy Report

Cash’s immediate cause of death on his autopsy report was labeled “probable asphyxiation,” due to co-sleeping with an adult, leaving his mother feeling guilty she was responsible. It was ruled accidental.

Cash had a significant amount of blood in the back of his throat and many of his organs were congested. His body was starved of oxygen. There were no signs of suffocation when Cash died, he was on his back and no object was obstructing his airways.

Cash had no blood vessels that burst in his eyes, he had no petechiae in his eyes, no swelling of his face, no bruising on his face, no blood pooling in his face and his face was not discolored, which are things a person would show signs of if they truly suffocated.

Major findings during Cash’s autopsy, from the office of the Jackson County Medical Examiner in Kansas City, Missouri, were:

“I. Probable asphyxia. 


A. History of being found unresponsive, after co-sleeping with adult. 


B. Thymus and lung petechiae. 


C. Severe congestion of internal organs.”






Autopsy Record

Based on these findings, Cash’s immune system was overstimulated. These findings on Cash’s autopsy report are typical of someone who suffered a severe reaction, associated with an immune system or asthma related inflammatory response. Petechiae found in the thymus and lungs represents Cash’s capillaries were bleeding, where blood was able to leak into the skin. Vaccines can affect the thymus. [6,7]

Co-sleeping wouldn’t lead to this type of reaction, but a vaccine reaction could and the coroner completely ignored this. In viewing the vaccine package inserts to the vaccines given to Cash, one can read that sepsis, apnea, breath-holding, SIDS, allergic reaction, etc. are listed as associated risks to these vaccines.

Vaccine Associated Risks

Cash’s mother was not informed by the pediatrician that all of the vaccines Cash received are associated with breathing problems and apnea as possible adverse reactions, which is stated on each of the vaccine package inserts to the vaccines given to Cash. [8,9,10,11,12,13]

Had Whitney known this information, she wouldn’t have allowed him to be vaccinated further. Vaccinating a child with vaccines linked to apnea is negligent, but doctors get away with this because they aren’t held liable when the vaccines harm.

Cash’s’ death is plausibly an iatrogenic death, due to a medical intervention that involved vaccination. This should not be ignored and Whitney, along with an endless number of other parents, wants her child’s death certificate changed to acknowledge vaccines as the most plausible contributing factor in the death of their child.



Proof Cash’s Pediatrician Vaccinated Him Before He Was Tested for Apnea

This is the medical record proving the doctor signed off on the vaccines while Cash still had unresolved apnea spells. This was not mentioned on Cash’s autopsy report.

Cash vaccinated while had apnea

The Coroner Also Failed to Mention Cash Slept in a Bassinet

On Cash’s autopsy report, the coroner noted Cash had a history of being found unresponsive, after co-sleeping with an adult. The coroner failed to mention that Cash slept in a bassinet as well, and his breathing episodes also occurred in his bassinet, not just when co-sleeping, as stated on the emergency room document from the 5-26-13 visit, shown in the image below.

ER doc bassinet

Take a look at the ingredients in these vaccines, from the CDC’s website. These are the ingredients in the eight vaccine doses Cash received before he passed away. It is appalling and is not understood why Cash’s medical examiner wasn’t required to note these vaccines on his autopsy report. [14]

Baby Cash's Vaccine Record

The coroner didn’t mention that Cash’s mom sought help for her son’s apnea episodes and no help was provided except for a prescription for reflux. The coroner noted that Cash had a history of being found unresponsive, after co-sleeping with an adult, while ignoring these other facts about his case, and Whitney wants the ruling on her son’s death certificate to be changed. She is only one of many parents who are put through this vaccine-related death coverup.

Redheads May Be More Susceptible to Vaccine Injuries

Cash’s grandmother, Gaela Fisher, is a former Labor & Delivery Nurse (LPN) and she is currently working as a Certified Labor Doula. Gaela is concerned about her other grandchildren, some of whom are redheads like Cash was. She is concerned there isn’t enough research to understand if redheaded children are more susceptible to vaccine injuries due to a genetic defect they carry in their MC1R gene.

Redheads have a variant of the human MC1R gene. The MC1R gene plays a role in the brain’s central functions. This gene variant affects melanin production and leads to the individual being more or less likely to feel pain while under anesthesia. Many doctors are aware that redheads may require a different dose of anesthesia because of their pain tolerance or intolerance.

Vaccines have a long history of being linked to causing brain damage; thus, redheaded individuals may be at an increased risk of suffering a severe vaccine reaction. More studies need to be done to understand vaccine risk susceptibility in redheads. [15,16,17]

Gaela shares,

“Years ago, when my clients wanted more information about vaccines, seventy-five percent of them are VBAC clients, I started doing more research to get informed. My sister and I are both nurses and we supported vaccines when we were young, but the more we’ve learned about them, the more we embrace natural medicines and the body’s immune system.



My daughter still trusted the vaccines and thought they were safe, like I once did. I did what I could to help her learn about vaccines but had to step back and let her make her own decisions.



I was always so thankful that in our big family we had never lost a baby, or had one who was sick. I have 20 grandchildren and 3 great grandchildren. Losing one is just horrible. It is so ironic that I’ve spent years telling parents about the dangers of vaccines and then my own grandson dies from them.



Cash was such a beautiful baby. The last time I held him while he was still alive, he was just really starting to giggle and coo. Isn’t it amazing how someone can only be in your life for 10 weeks, yet forever change your heart?



Looking at his records and everything that happened, it’s like the hospital, the doctor and the vaccine company all let my daughter and grandchild down. How could someone not do something when you have a baby that stops breathing? Whitney kept telling them something was wrong and they just blew her off! Doctors should always listen to the mama’s intuition! It’s almost always right! My grandson didn’t have to die. He shouldn’t have died!



The very last time I held Cash was to dress his little body and rock him before I placed him in his casket. My daughter could not do it. I wanted him to have loving hands on him before he was buried.



We miss Cash so much. I have a strong faith, it doesn’t take the pain away but it gives me hope. Our family believes we will see our loved ones again. I’m not sure how people go through this with no faith. I believe Cash is with us and I believe we will be with him in Heaven. I just sure wish we could be with him here.



I hope that through Cash, the word will spread that our vaccines are not safe for our babies. I believe his life had a purpose. I just pray that other babies will be saved because of what the vaccines did to him. I don’t want his little life to mean nothing.



I pray that this article will influence other parents and grandparents to get educated about vaccine injury. We want his story to be out there. I pass his story to everyone who will listen. If one baby lives because he died, his life will have meant something great!”

Whitney Filed a Vaccine Injury Claim for Her Son’s Death

Whitney was turned down by three vaccine injury attorneys before a fourth attorney helped her file a claim with the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (NVICP). She was able to file just before the two year deadline.

The most Whitney would be awarded for a death benefit is $250,000. Most parents never receive a penny and those that do often have their case settled for less. Nearly two-thirds of the claims get denied and it can take years for a final decision, while parents struggle to pay for their child’s funeral or other medical expenses.

With donations VacTruth has received, we have donated $400 to Whitney’s vaccine injury case, to help her get Cash’s claim filed in time. This is the price that has to be paid first, to file a vaccine injury claim. It is important to understand the financial responsibility one has after vaccines have taken the life of your loved one; this is the sad recourse set in place in the United States. [18]

Another $2400 is due soon, to cover the expert witness retainer fee for Cash’s case. Since medical examiners omit the vaccines had anything to do with a child’s passing, parents often face the extra hurdle of hiring an expert witness, to help prove their child plausibly died from an injury related to the vaccines administered.

Through further donations received, VacTruth wants to help cover this retainer fee so Cash’s case can move forward. If you would like to help by sending a donation, Whitney, Jesse, Gaela and the VacTruth team sincerely appreciate your help and kind support, in honor of Cash. We want his death to be acknowledged.

Cash’s Mother Speaks Out for the First Time Since Losing Her Son

Leaving you with words from Cash’s mother, Whitney Hill shares,



“Cash was the best baby. He was so easygoing and playful. I was so happy to have him and felt so blessed. I called him my little buddy. He was my third child. 



Parents like me once valued what my child’s doctor had to say and I believed them when they told me vaccines were safe, but I don’t anymore. Because I listened to the doctors, I had to watch my son get buried. Your kids shouldn’t be seen being buried.



The day before I attended my own son’s funeral, I saw him at the funeral home. When the door opened, I fell to my knees and cried. I could do nothing for him now. As I was kneeling there and looking at him, I sang him lullabies. I told him how much I loved him and to sleep with the angels.



I had supported vaccinations and fully trusted the doctor when she said it was ok to give Cash the two month vaccines. I was reassured Cash would be fine and there was no need to worry. 



After Cash died, I wasn’t able to talk about him or what happened. I was so frustrated because the doctors ignored my concerns and then the autopsy blamed me for co-sleeping, which is not why he died. My mom did a lot of searching for information. It was when she told me you can’t sue a doctor for vaccine injuries because there is a vaccine court put in place to protect vaccine manufacturers and doctors from liability.



This made me question and started making me realize the truth. It made me question if vaccines are so great, why did the government have to set up a vaccine court to protect the doctors and manufacturers from liability? 



For me, filing a claim with the NVICP is not about the money because no amount of money will bring my baby back and all I want is to have my baby back with me. If I do get awarded, I will use that money to help create Cash’s Law. This law will require doctors to spend a certain amount of time with patients and listen to them more. They will also need to fully explain the risks involved with the vaccinations, because this is not being done. 



If I was told either of these vaccines could kill my baby, Cash would still be here, because I would have said no to them. 

I want my son’s death certificate changed. I did not harm my son by co-sleeping with him. I do not want that on his death certificate because that is not what killed him.



I want people to know these vaccines are killing our babies and hurting adults too. We fully believe 100% that the vaccines caused Cash’s health problems and caused him to stop breathing in his sleep. After the shots, he had more breathing episodes. It makes me so frustrated because the doctors wouldn’t listen to me.



My child’s life didn’t have to end, his death was preventable. It’s not fair those pushing for more vaccines probably don’t vaccinate their own children and they are healthier because they wouldn’t dare let their own child be injected with what’s in these shots. Their children will grow up and go off to college, drive fancy cars and have a trust fund at the expense of my baby and many others.



I am not the person I once was. I am not the same. There is a whole piece of me missing. I would give anything for all 3 of my children to be driving me crazy right now. Cherish every moment with your children and don’t take things for granted.



To my baby, I love you, Cash. Your family loves you so much and we miss you. I would give anything to have you here with me again. Sleep with the angels little buddy. Mommy loves you.”



Conclusion

After watching their son get buried, Cash’s parents were thrown into a world they didn’t know much about. They were now another set of grieving parents who senselessly lost their child due to medical practices recommended under a doctor’s care.

Vaccines are being ignored when compiling infant mortality data. In 2013, Cash Dewayne Thomas was one of 23,440 babies who died in the United States before reaching their first birthday, according to the latest infant mortality data published in 2016. [19] About 11,300 newborns die within their first day of life, many soon after receiving their first hepatitis B vaccine dose in the hospital. [20]

If medical examiners are completely omitting an infant’s vaccination history on their autopsy report, then vaccines will not fairly contribute to infant mortality data. One must question why the vaccines are being ruled out so quickly as a cause of death, when so many babies are dying following the shots.

We send our love to Cash and are heartbroken for his loss. We must remember him and all that he has taught us.

Cash Dewayne Thomas infant

Cash Dewayne Thomas from Kansas City, Missouri
 April 19, 2013 – July 5, 2013


He received 8 vaccine doses at 2 months old and died 16 days later.

 

References:

  1. http://www.consumerhealth.org/articles/display…
  2. http://sanevax.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/CRITICAL-DAYS-1.pdf
  3. https://vactruth.com/2012/11/23/flu-shot-spikes-fetal-death/
  4. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22727350
  5. https://www.scribd.com/doc/33874512/Merck-Vitamin-K…
  6. http://www.mayoclinic.org/symptoms/petechiae…
  7. http://www.acupuncturetoday.com/archives2003/dec/12hawkins.html
  8. https://www.gsksource.com/pharma/content/dam/GlaxoSmithKline…PDF
  9. https://www.vaccineshoppe.com/image…pdf
  10. https://www.gsksource.com/pharma/content/dam/GlaxoSmithKline…PDF
  11. http://labeling.pfizer.com/showlabeling.aspx?id=501
  12. https://www.gsksource.com/pharma/content/dam/GlaxoSmithKline…PDF
  13. http://www.immunize.org/packageinserts/
  14. http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads…pdf
  15. https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/gene/MC1R
  16. http://sciencenordic.com/redheads-feel-different-kind-pain
  17. http://healthland.time.com/2010/12/10/why-surgeons-dread-red-heads/
  18. http://www.hrsa.gov/vaccinecompensation/howtofile/index.html
  19. http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_02.pdf#page=95
  20. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-has-highest-first-day-infant-mortality…
Augustina Ursino
 

Augustina Ursino has spent many years researching vaccine ingredients and vaccine reactions. Once she became aware of so many children and adults dying after vaccinations and that most people that survived them are living with vaccine injuries, this impelled her to write these stories. She earned a BS in Marine Biology, focusing on conservation biology and realized it didn’t make sense to inject life forms with the ingredients used in vaccines, under the guise of keeping us healthy. Augustina now writes for VacTruth and continues to help families negatively affected from vaccines.

  • Planet Autism

    Just heartbreaking. This is a corrupt and evil world when authority can cover-up knowing harm without batting an eyelid and it’s deliberate because they know and carry on regardless.

  • Erwin Alber

    Vaccines and medical ignorance are always a harmful and sometimes a deadly combination when parental ignorance is added to the mix. .

  • Tarah Locke
  • Danielle Carruthers

    It always amazes me how gullible some people can be. Sure, it is a tragedy that this little bub lost his life and that these parents lost their son, however there is NO proof that links this death to his vaccinations. The first injections were given within his first day of life and AFTER he had already suffered a respiratory arrest. How can one say that he suffered apnoea’s post vaccines, when he was BORN apnoeic. Thinking LOGICALLY, how can you directly put the blame on the vaccinations? Research and statistics have shown NO correlation between birth vaccines and baby deaths. I understand these parents would want answers, but blaming vaccinations is clutching at straws. This anti vac mentality is putting more and more susceptible children at risk. They recommend not getting vaccines because they will kill your children- what about the innocent children, who cannot be/ are yet to be vaccinated and who rely on herd immunity, who lose their lives every day, due to contracting PREVENTABLE diseases, because some ignorant people refuse to vaccinate their kids. People are so quick to blame vaccines/Doctors for childhood deaths, but I wonder if these people feel any remorse when a child dies from contracting a preventable disease from them, who was relying on the people around him to keep him safe,

  • nubwaxer

    crackpot conspiracy nonsense. i was maybe 5 when i got vaccinated for polio. scientists worked 17 develop the vaccine supported by donations from millions of average americans. polio was banished forever in america while the fight continues in pakistan to end polio forever.
    anti-government forces and right wing extremist media has tried to undermine trust in government and science from the anti-flouride crusade to climate change denial today.

  • Danielle Carruthers

    ALWAYS harmful? Are you forgetting how many lives doctors save and how many lives vaccines have saved- or at least how many have prevented serious illnesses and long term side effects of these illnesses?

  • CumExApostolatus

    I couldn’t read the article. It’s just too much to bear.

    These parents should CIVILLY SUE EACH AND EVERY PERSON WHO WAS INVOLVED EITHER AT THE DOCTOR’S OFFICE, THE HOSPITAL(S), THE CLINICS , OR WHEREVER.

    The parents may not win, but just the fact that these thoughtless, mindless, agents of the state, would have to respond individually, in court, to a civil lawsuit might make them think twice before behaving in a similar manner in the future. If we can’t go after pharma, then we need to go after their agents. And that is exactly what doctors, nurses, hospital administrators, etc. are…they are corporate and state agents.

  • CumExApostolatus

    The no correlation garbage is given to you by pharma run/paid for ‘studies’. Who is gullible?

    There are lies, there are damned lies, and then there are statistics. Someone of some notoriety said that years ago. Someone who had skin in the game. Look it up.

  • CumExApostolatus

    Stay home and wax your nub. That’s all your good for, that and regurgitating state sponsored propaganda.

  • CumExApostolatus

    Vaccination is not immunization.
    However, indoor plumbing and hygiene has and does save lives.

  • guest

    conspiracy = troll.

  • CumExApostolatus
  • dobekind

    How stupid are you people letting your children be vaccinated? At 80, I don’t recall having been given more than 2 vaccinations, in the 11 years I was brought up in India between the ages 2 to 15 in a British army boarding school. I recall coming down with, mumps, whooping cough, measles and malaria, I also recall kids bragging and showing me they could spit up blood, I now know they had tuberculosis and no I didn’t come down with it.
    My children are now over 50 and have had no sickness in their lives, not because I had them vaccinated I would say it is because I kept them FREE of all the shit the doctors pump kids and adults alike, I don’t wish to have the flue needle which pisses my doctor off every year. Poor bloke, he keeps trying and you should have seen his face when I told him I ate 21+ eggs a week. When I was
    a teen, I ate up to 15 every morning for breakfast.
    Try to remember your children look to you to do the right thing and Dr Wallach in “Dead doctors don’t Lie” tells us that Doctors kill over 800000 Americans each year and they are the leading cause of
    all deaths in America.

  • guest

    PREVENTABLE diseases
    There are NO vaccine preventable diseases. Vaccine were designed to “give” the person the virus of bacteria in hopes that the person will develop anti-bodies to the illness. If they did become infected the idea is the person would have a mild case of say measles. Here are a few images parents sent in of their children when they were terrorized by the MSM/CDC to have their children vaccinated after the Disney False Flag:

    VACCINE INDUCED MEASLES:
    An Unexpected Side Effect of My Daughter’s Measles Vaccine
    http://www.kveller(dot)com/an-unexpected-side-effect-of-my-daughters-measles-vaccine/
    -My Sons’ Vaccine-Related Measles
    http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork(dot)com/my-sons-vaccine-related-measles/
    -Genotype Testing Showed Baltimore Baby’s Symptoms Were A Reaction To The MMR, Health Officials Relieved (this is a stock photo but the child was infected by the shot)
    http://www.inquisitr(dot)com/1801210/genotype-baltimore-mmr/
    -https://www.facebook(dot)com/photo.php?fbid=10205874067907027&set=p.10205874067907027&type=1&theater
    -Story of one little girl:
    vaccinescanharm(dot)com/story-of-one-little-girl.

    Your rant is laughable about a child dying from a vaccine preventable disease when over the last 5 years outbreaks or whooping cough, chicken pox and measles have been traced back to the vaccine strains. Even the Disney measles outbreak was traced back to Measles Genotype B3-a vaccine strain that has been in the US since 2005. 86% of the people who were infected at Disney were fully vaccinated. Why did those 86% become infected if the vaccine worked? Studies have revealed that the vaccines are causing outbreaks of these illness, not the unvaccinated.

    -Nearly a century after the release of the whooping cough (B. Pertussis) vaccine, mounting evidence suggests that widespread mandated use of the vaccine could potentially be doing more harm than good in the long term—in addition to having been found lacking in the effectiveness department. As reported by The Washington Post:

    “The research suggests that while the vaccine may keep people from getting sick, it doesn’t prevent them from spreading whooping cough — also known as Pertussis — to others.
    ‘It could explain the increase in Pertussis that we’re seeing in the US,’ said one of the researchers, Tod Merkel of the Food and Drug Administration…

    The study, titled: “Acellular Pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate model,” used infant baboons to test the hypothesis that “current acellular pertussis vaccines fail to prevent colonization and transmission” of B. Pertussis. (there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus) http://www.pnas.org/content/111/2/787

    Lead author Tod Merkel did comment to the New York Times that when exposed to B. Pertussis after recently getting vaccinated, you could be an asymptomatic carrier and infect others, saying: “When you’re newly vaccinated, you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population.” According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.

    Most current study:
    Study: Whooping cough resurgence due to vaccinated people not knowing they’re infectious? clinical news.org/2015/06/24/study-whooping-cough-resurgence-due-to-vaccinated-people-not-knowing-theyre-infectious/comment-page-1/. From study/article:
    “a detailed epidemiological model of whooping cough transmission to conclude that acellular vaccines may well have contributed to — even exacerbated — the recent pertussis outbreak by allowing infectedindividuals without symptoms to unknowingly spread pertussis multiple times in their lifetimes. ‘There could be millions of people out there with just a minor cough or no cough spreading this potentially fatal disease without knowing it,’ said Althouse. ‘The public health community should act now to better assess the true burden of Pertussis infection. What’s worse, their model shows that if the disease can be spread through vaccinated, asymptomatic individuals essentially undetected.

    *”The measles vaccine has failed”, he explained two years ago in a prescient paper, “The re-emergence of measles in developed countries.” In that paper, he warned that due to factors that most haven’t noticed, measles has come back to be a serious public health threat. Poland sees the need for a major rethink, after concluding that the current measles vaccine is unlikely to ever live up to the job expected of it: “outbreaks are occurring even in highly developed countries where vaccine access, public health infrastructure, and health literacy are not significant issues. This is unexpected and a worrisome harbinger — measles outbreaks are occurring where they are least expected,” he wrote in his 2012 paper, listing the “surprising numbers of cases occurring in persons who previously received one or even two documented doses of measles-containing vaccine.” During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, “over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine.”
    Paper: The Re-Emergence of Measles in Developed Countries: Time to Develop the Next-Generation Measles Vaccines? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pmc/articles/PMC3905323/
    http://business.financialpost (dot) com/2014/05/01/lawrence-solomon-vaccines-cant-prevent-measles-outbreaks/

    *Arch Intern Med. 1994 Aug 22;154(16):1815-20.
    Failure to reach the goal of measles elimination. Apparent paradox of measles infections in immunized persons. Poland GA1, Jacobson RM.
    Conclusion: The apparent paradox is that as measles immunization rates rise to high levels in a population, measles becomes a disease of immunized persons. Because of the failure rate of the vaccine and the unique transmissibility of the measles virus, the currently available measles vaccine, used in a single-dose strategy, is unlikely to completely eliminate measles. The long-term success of a two-dose strategy to eliminate measles remains to be determined. http://archinte.jamanetwork (dot) com/article.aspx?articleid=619215.
    Dr. Gregory Poland is Professor of Medicine and founder and leader of Mayo Clinic’s Vaccine Research Group. Poland is one of the world’s most admired, most advanced thinkers in the field of vaccinology.

    -Keep in mind the Rubella portion of the vaccine is made from aborted fetal cells which has the DNA from these cells linings still intact so the person is having foreign DNA injected into them and the CDC/pharma states it has no idea what affects it has o the human body.

    Former researchers from Merck have sued the company for fraud in regards to the Mumps portion of the vaccine. They are currently in court (have been for a couple of years) providing evidence that Merck scientist spiked the Mumps portion of the vaccine with animal blood to achieve it’s 95% efficiency rating therefore Merck maintains the hold on the MMR market:
    -Judge: Lawsuit Against Merck’s MMR Vaccine Fraud to Continue-https://healthimpactnews(dot)com/2014/judge-lawsuit-against-mercks-mmr-vaccine-fraud-to-continue/
    -Vaccine Whistleblowers File to Compel Merck to Respond to Federal Lawsuit-https://healthimpactnews(dot)com/2015/vaccine-whistleblowers-file-to-compel-merk-to-respond-to-federal-lawsuit/.
    *Merck accused of stonewalling in mumps vaccine antitrust lawsuit-http://www.reuters(dot)com/article/health-vaccine-idUSL1N0YQ0W820150604.
    -Copy of court documents: http://www.naturalnews(dot)com/gallery/documents/Merck-False-Claims-Act.pdf.

    To be clear—this lawsuit continues as Merck lawyers have been fighting to not reveal scientific data which would support the researchers accusations. No verdict has come about but the judge ruled that the suit can continue forward: http://www.rescuepost(dot)com/files/59-opinion.pdf

    *Chatom Primary Care sues Merck for Sherman Act monopolization, breach of warranty, violation of consumer protection laws: Court document-http://www.naturalnews(dot)com/gallery/documents/Chatom-Lawsuit-Merck-Mumps.pdf.

    *Chicken pox vaccine has high rate of primary vaccine failure – Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal: Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal 11 February 2013.

    -Can provide you provide an Independent double-blind, placebo-controlled study that can prove the safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    – Can provide you provide Independent scientific evidence on ANY study which can confirm the long-term safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    – Can provide you provide Independent scientific evidence which can prove that disease reduction in any part of the world, at any point in history was attributable to inoculation of populations?

    -Can you provide scientific justification as to how injecting a human being with a confirmed neurotoxin is beneficial to human health and prevents disease?

    -Can you provide scientific justification on how bypassing the
    respiratory tract (or mucous membrane) is advantageous and how directly
    injecting viruses into the bloodstream enhances immune functioning and
    prevents future infections?

    – Could you provide scientific justification on how a vaccine would prevent viruses from mutating?

  • Jonathan Graham

    There are NO vaccine preventable diseases.

    Sure there are. Seroconversion correlates strongly with disease resistance.

    Vaccine were designed to “give” the person the virus or bacteria in hopes that the person will develop anti-bodies to the illness.

    …and developing antibodies without having the disease.

    If they did become infected the idea is the person would have a mild case of say measles.

    …and this is what happens – although it is pretty rare. http://www.eurosurveillance.org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=20649

  • Jonathan Graham

    Someone of some notoriety said that years ago. Someone who had skin in the game. Look it up.

    Someone who knew less about statistics than my pinky finger. Look it up.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Vaccination very frequently results in immunization. Hygiene while a great advance is does not contribute to the current low level of incident in vaccine preventable illnesses that much.

  • guest

    There is no such thing as a vaccine preventable disease. If there is provide data that confirms that. Not an epidemiological study but an Independent double blind placebo controlled study that confirms that a vaccine prevents an illness. Independent means no medical industrial industry involvement.

    Antibodies are not necessary for immunity.
    No Antibodies Required For Immunity Against Some Viruses
    http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/242403.php

    MEDICAL DIAGNOSIS: CONFUSION
    http://www.whale.to/vaccine/medical_diagnosis.html

    NOVEMBER 23, 2010. These days, doctors often run antibody tests on patients to see if they have a particular disease.

    What is an antibody test?
    In the simplest terms, it is aimed at detecting a person’s immune system
    responding to the presence of a specific germ.

    A doctor suspects you have disease X, which is caused by virus Y. He takes a
    blood sample, and that sample is examined for the presence of antibodies which are specific to virus Y.

    If you test positive for the presence of those antibodies, he says you have
    disease X.

    However, there is a vaccine that is supposed to protect a person from disease
    X, and this vaccine does what?

    IT PRODUCES ANTIBODIES SPECIFIC TO VIRUS Y.
    In that case, you are said to be immune from virus Y.
    That’s right.

    This is what is called a contradiction.

    In the first instance, when your body naturally produces antibodies to virus
    Y, the doctor tells you you have disease X.

    But if the vaccine produces those same antibodies, you’re said to be immune
    to disease X.

    In purely practical terms, this contradiction is good for business. Medical
    business. On the one hand, they diagnose more cases of a disease. On the other hand, using the same logic to obtain an opposite conclusion, they sell more vaccines.

    Have fun with the contradiction. Chew it over. Maybe you’ll decide we’ve
    humans have evolved to the point where we don’t have to pay any attention to
    logic. Maybe not.

    Vaccination is not immunization
    http://www.24medica.com/content/view/2780/73/

    How Do Vaccines Work? Immune Mechanisms and Consequences
    http://icpa4kids(dot)org/Wellness-Articles/how-do-vaccines-work-immune-mechanisms-and-consequences/All-Pages.html

    In 1995, Golding and Scott,2 published the need for strategies to make vaccines that would generate the “required” Th cell to the corresponding microorganism. Since that time, attempts to produce vaccines that would generate a “natural”- type response have failed. So, we are left with vaccines that generate “protective” responses as a second choice. How does this work? In vaccine-induced Th2 responses, called humoral responses, the body
    produces large quantities of specific antibodies that block the virus
    from entering cells. This response is why a vaccinated child doesn’t get
    a full blown infection and why the child won’t spread as many viruses
    into the environment. However, antibodies cannot get into cells to
    eliminate viruses once the viruses are in the cells or cannot kill
    infected cells themselves. Therefore, the body has no choice other than
    to internalize the virus and be chronically infected when the body is
    forced into a Th2 antibody response. The body is essentially constipated
    with viruses that it cannot expel!

    Golding S., Scott DE., Vaccine Strategy: Targeting Helper T Cell
    Responses. Ann. NY Acad. Sci. 754:126-137, May 31, 1995
    Golding & Scott continue to be researchers at the FDA.

  • Jonathan Graham

    There is no such thing as a vaccine preventable disease. If there is provide data that confirms that.

    So you don’t believe that seroconversion strongly correlates with disease resistance?

    Antibodies are not necessary for immunity.

    Even if true, this does not make your point.

    http://www.medicalnewstoday.co

    Your link doesn’t say what you think it says. For a very long time immune responses were considered to be roughly split between humoral and cell-mediated. Generally speaking both are activated during infection but there tends to be a dominance depending on the type of intrusion. This simply says that antibodies are not required for some specific infections and that the cell-mediated response is sufficient. This isn’t that surprising that vaccines tend to be pretty Th2 specific and therefore operate with very little cell-mediated response. So the idea that the opposite can sometimes be true is hardly unthinkable.

    I apologize but I tend to stop reading if you’re just going to spew links. I’m not your fact-checker.

  • guest

    Measles is measles mild or otherwise. The health depts of the various states that were home to the Disney outbreak infected stated the cases were mild. The one thing that didn’t make the media is this:

    CDC’s Dr. Ann Schuchat has stated that PATIENT ZERO, who the CDC and the corporate bought media blamed on a unvaccinated person, HAS NEVER BEEN FOUND. Which means they don’t know where the measles began. http://www.cdc (dot) gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtm /mm6406a5.htm?s_cid=mm6406a5_w. They want you to believe it began in the Philippines but that strain of measles Genotype B3 has been in the US since 2005. It just didn’t pop up here. CDC will not tell you that either. Measles virus Genotype B3 has been in the US since 2005: http://wwwnc.cdc (dot) gov/eid/article/12/11/06-0635_article. It has been on the WHOS’ radar for a couple of decades.

    So the vaccine strain caused the outbreak but that never makes the corporate bought MSM. How did the people get infected by a vaccine strain?

    It’s interesting to note how the Measles vaccine is made:
    How ‘Measles Virus’ is isolated for a Vaccine.
    by Janine Roberts
    Monday, 18 August 2008 01:37
    extract from her book “Fear of the Invisible”

    In an online paper entitled ‘Isolation and Identification of Measles Virus in
    Cell Culture,’ the CDC, the central Health Research authority of the USA, lays
    out how isolation of this virus should be done so it can be used, say for a
    vaccine. It instructs, first obtain from the patient a small sample of urine or
    fluid from the nose or mouth.

    Next ‘sacrifice’ a marmoset monkey, take some of its cells, then make these
    cancerous, perhaps by exposing them to radiation, and then give them, on top of this, Epstein-Barr disease! Such extremely sick cells, the CDC informs us, are ‘10,000 times’ more sensitive to the measles virus than are normal human cells.

    Now add to these cells a toxin called trypsin. The CDC tells us to expect some
    cells to fall off the sides of the vessel as if they have been poisoned. They
    have been. Now add nutrients and glucose and leave for two or three days so the cells can somewhat recover.

    Now add to the cells the sample gathered from the patient. After an hour,
    inspect the cells in the culture with a microscope to see if any of the cells
    are becoming distorted, or are floating free as they did when trypsin was added. If they are, the CDC says this is proof that measles virus is present and making the cells ill.

    This statement made me sit back and think. Why should this illness now be caused by a virus? They had poisoned the cells, made them cancerous….. and now the CDC was saying the cells must be ill because they had measles. Where was the logic in this?

    The next stage involves the addition of two antibiotics, Penicillin and
    Streptomycin, to the culture and leaving it alone for a day. Again the cells are
    inspected – and if small holes now appear between cells, it is now presumed that measles virus has caused these. If no sign of such damage, this process is repeated. If after this there are still no signs of damage, then the culture is
    discarded. However, if 50% or more of the cells are now seriously ill and
    distorted, the culture is set aside and kept in the fridge as ‘isolated
    measles virus stock suitable for vaccines!’ All this without actually detecting
    the virus itself!

    This is the whole process as recommended by the CDC. There is no mention of the need to have a control culture, no mention of any need to isolate the measles virus or even to see it with an electron microscope. The cells are poisoned – and an unseen measles virus is blamed – even thou’ the disease the cells have is totally unlike measles. Where is the logic in this?

    What they call measles virus is in effect the fluid in this poisoned cell
    culture.

    Source document – CDC. Isolation and Identification of Measles Virus in Culture, Revised November 29, 2001.

    MMR Vaccine Contaminated:
    A year after I met with the top government regulatory scientists at the NIH
    Emergency Workshop on SV40 in 1997, they met again in Washington for another workshop on vaccine safety. At this there were representatives of all the major US government health organisations and of the vaccine manufacturers. A third similar meeting would be held a year later in 1999.

    The main issue at the November 1998 meeting was whether or not it would be safe for manufacturers to produce the viruses needed for vaccines from cancer cells. Pharmaceutical companies were at that time seeking government approval for this, on the basis that cancerous cells, as ‘immortal’ and permanent, would be cheaper to use than cells they had to regularly replace by, for example, buying more monkeys.

    These workshops looked at the issue broadly, by comparing the safety of the
    different ways available for making our vaccines. As everyone present was a
    scientist, the discussions were much more open and frank than they are when
    journalists are present.

    They started with the Measles, Mumps and Rubella vaccine (MMR). One of the first speakers on this was from the federal Food and Drugs Agency (FDA) and what she had to report was very disturbing.

    ‘Today I would like to present an update on the reverse transcriptase [RT]
    activity that is present in chicken cell derived vaccines.’ My attention was
    immediately grabbed. I knew that the mumps and measles viruses used for the MMR vaccine are grown in fertilised chicken eggs, as are also the viruses for the Flu and Yellow Fever vaccines. (The rubella virus for MMR is produced
    differently – in artificially grown cells taken originally from an aborted human
    foetus.)

    Dr, Khan was reporting the result of a just concluded two-year investigation
    into the safety of MMR led by the World Health Organisation. She explained that this was initiated in 1996 after the discovery in MMR of RT; an enzyme whose presence they believed could well indicate that retroviruses had contaminated the vaccine. This had greatly alarmed them as some retroviruses are thought to cause cancers – and AIDS.

    WHO had then quietly, without telling the public, without withdrawing the
    vaccine, organised MMR safety studies at various laboratories to see ‘whether this RT activity was associated with a retroviral particle, and even more importantly, whether this retrovirus particle could infect and replicate in
    human cells.’

    What they then discovered confirmed their worse fears. Dr Khan continued: ‘The RT activity is found to be associated with retroviral particles of two distinct avian endogenous retroviral families designated as EAV and ALV.’ Now ALV stands for Avian Leukosis Virus. It is associated with a leukaemia cancer found in wild birds, so definitely was not wanted in the vaccines. EAV was however less dangerous, at least for birds as it is natural for them to have it.

    Khan added that they had also found another possible danger; ‘There was a theoretical possibility that the virus [ALV] could … infect the [human] cell’
    thus integrating its genetic code ‘into the human DNA’ to cause cancer. The
    only reassurance she could give was that her team had watched vaccine cultures for a full ‘48 hours’, and, in that time period, no merger of viral and human DNA had been observed. I thought this much too short a period to guarantee safety. Cancers develop over years.

    Dr Khan then warned; ‘there is a possibility that there could also be
    potential pseudotypes (merging between) … the measles vaccine virus and the retroviral sequences’ – meaning there was a risk that bird viruses might combine with the measles virus in the vaccine to create dangerous new mutant viruses, They had not seen it, but it could happen.

    She acknowledged much longer term safety studies were needed than 48 hours, but said that long-term studies of measles vaccine cultures were very difficult: ‘because the measles vaccine virus itself lyses [kills] the culture in about three to four days.’ This had prevented them from studying the longer-term consequences of this contamination of the MMR vaccine.

    So far, she added, they had only managed to analyse a small part of the
    retrovirus contamination in the vaccines. ‘Our ongoing studies are directed
    towards doing similar analysis’ of other retroviral genetic codes found in the
    vaccine preparations.’ It was suspected that other retroviruses might also be
    present. She also noted that ‘about 20 years ago similar RT activity was
    reported’ in the vaccine. Apparently nothing had been done about it at that time and the public were never told.

    She concluded by explaining what the World Health Organisation (WHO) had decided to do about this chicken leucosis virus (ALV) contamination. It would take the risk of quietly allowing MMR to continue to be contaminated. It would permit vaccine manufacturers to continue to use retrovirus contaminated eggs, because ‘you cannot get ALV free flocks in places where you are making yellow fever vaccine.’

    Dr Andrew Lewis, head of the DNA Virus Laboratory in the Division of Viral
    Products, then warned. ‘All the egg-based vaccines are contaminated,’
    including ‘influenza, yellow fever and smallpox vaccines, as well as the
    vaccine for horses against encephalomyelitis virus’ for ‘these fertilised
    chicken eggs are susceptible to a wide variety of viruses.’

    This was an eye opener for me. Before I started on this investigation, if I
    thought about it, I would have presumed our vaccines were made of selected
    viruses in sterile fluid to which a small amount of preservative chemicals has
    been added. I think this is what most parents presume.

    It was thus a shock to discover from this top-level scientific workshop that the
    viruses in our current vaccines are not in a sterile fluid as I had presumed,
    but in a soup of unknown bits and pieces, a veritable witches’ brew of DNA
    fragments, added chemicals, proteins and, even possibly prions and oncogenes, all of which would easily pass through the filters used to be injected into our children.

    Our vaccines, I thus learnt, are not filtered clean but are suspensions from the
    manufacturers’ ‘incubation tanks’ in which the viruses are produced from
    ‘substrates’ of mashed bird embryo, minced monkey kidneys or cloned human cells. These suspensions are filtered before use but only to remove particles larger than viruses. The point of the vaccine is that it contains viruses, thus these must not be filtered out. This means there remains in the vaccine everything of the same size or smaller, including what the manufacturers call ‘degradation products’ – parts of decayed viruses or cells.

    I also learnt that the only official checks made for contaminants in vaccines
    are for a few known pathogens, thus ignoring a vast host of unknown, unstudied, small particles and chemicals. These eminent doctors reported at these vaccine safety meetings that it is simply impossible to remove these from our common vaccines – and this would of course also apply to vaccines for pets, farm animals and birds.

    I went to the published reports of the MMR manufacturers and found these
    confirmed what the scientists at this workshop had reported. A manufacturer
    stated in 2000 that it made the MMR vaccine with ‘harvested virus fluids.’ It
    stated frankly that their ‘Measles vaccine bulk is an unpurified product whose potency was measured through a biological assay for the active substance rather than through evaluation of integrity of physical form. Degradation products are neither identified nor quantified.’ In other words, it left the latter in the measles vaccine along with all contaminants that lay there quietly, or worked slowly. The pharmaceutical company admitted checking the measles vaccine only for obviously active contaminates. It did not measure how much the vaccine was polluted with genetic code fragments, other viruses, or with parts of bacterial, animal, bird or human cells.
    ……
    The latest information I could find on the retroviral contamination of the MMR
    vaccine was in a 2001 scientific paper from the CDC. This reported that 100 MMR recipients were tested to see if they were contaminated by either of the two types of retroviruses identified by Dr Khan and others. The conclusion was
    dramatic. ‘The finding of RT activity in all measles vaccine lots from
    different manufacturers tested suggests that this occurrence is not sporadic and that vaccine recipients may be universally exposed to these [chicken] retroviral particles.’

    They then concluded: ‘Despite these reassuring data, the presence of avian
    retroviral particles in chick embryo fibroblast-derived vaccines [like MMR]
    raises questions about the suitability of primary chicken cell substrates for
    vaccine production.’ They recommended considering stopping production in
    fertilized eggs, and growing the vaccine viruses instead on ‘RT-negative cells from different species, such as on immortalized [cancerous] or diploid
    [laboratory grown] mammalian cells.’ I was amazed to learn this, for, to the
    best of my knowledge, nothing has been done since this report was made to render MMR safer. The measles vaccine is still produced from contaminated chicken embryos.
    http://www.fda(dot)gov/ohrms/dockets/ac/cber05.html#VaccinesandRelatedBiological

    Dr. Minor, the UK’s top vaccine safety officer, then added: “So even today then you have to bear in mind that a large a mount of vaccine that’s made is made on really quite crude materials, from an adventitious agent point of view.
    It’s not a trivial usage. In fact, when considering what vaccines are actually made on these days, they are quite primitive in some respects.”
    “Fear of the Invisible”

  • CumExApostolatus

    Dr. Sherri Tenpenny, Dr. Suzanne Humphries, “Doctors Against Vaccines” would all disagree. And they aren’t on pharma payroll.

    http://vaccineimpact.com/2015/medical-doctors-opposed-to-forced-vaccinations-should-their-views-be-silenced/

    Testimony of Robert Kennedy Jr. before Vermont House Health Care Committee 2015:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2UJ2oBeya0

  • guest

    I read the link, I know what it says. No apology needed. It’s a know toll tactic to say something to the effects of:

    -spew links
    -wall of information
    -data dump
    -information dump
    etc, etc etc.
    When there is information that cannot be discredited. I don’t post for you. The information is for others who may not have it. You’re just the conduit that makes it available. Thank you.

  • guest

    “Vaccination very frequently results in immunization.”

    Substantiating data please.

  • Jonathan Graham

    The better approach is, in my opinion. Simply to frame an argument, use a short substantiating quote (1-2) sentences and a reference.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Well then, ask them what objective metric they used to measure the level of hygiene.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Philippines but that strain of measles Genotype B3 has been in the US since 2005.

    That’s a known wildtype strain.

    Apologies but when you just spew links, I stop reading. Frame an argument, use tiny portions of a proof text, and a reference.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Do you not believe that seroconversion strongly correlates with disease resistance?

  • guest

    We all do or our thing.

  • guest

    Data please. Otherwise it’s just an opinion.

  • guest

    Combining Childhood Vaccines at One Visit Is Not Safe
    by Neil Z. Miller
    Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons, Volume 21, Number 2, Summer 2016
    http://www.jpands(dot)org/vol21no2/miller.pdf

  • guest
  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    I’m the grandmother. The doctors and all involved are protected from any type of litigation as a result of a vaccine injury. Believe me…we tried!

  • missy wine

    There is NO reason these vaccines should be given to tiny babies starting the day they are born!! Then 8 at one time during their first well child visit at approx age 2 mo. And then 8 more next time and 8 more next time after that. Are you people really so stupid that you think a tiny babies body & immune system can handle that. Vaccines are full of poisons! Let me ask you this have you had your 120 up to date vaccines yet? Cause that’s what’s coming next for you and all the vaccine mongers. Only difference is you are a grown adult and not a baby with a developing immune system. But yet still you will get ill when you get your 120 shots. You just wait and see.

  • donna mills

    I am 65, and I HAVE NEVER FELT THAT VACCINES HAVE EVER played a role in KEEPING ME ALIVE or prevented anything!! During the course of my life, I had mumps, measles, chickenpox and I completely recovered from all of them–And it wasn’t as a result of the vaccines or I wouldn’t have contracted the diseases in the first place would I? This poor little new life was murdered by the medical industry. All that poison in one course for such a tiny baby is murder–Not prevention. I’ll tell you what this is, this the globalist cabal’s EUGENICS program to reduce the world’s population to 500 million!! It’s in the PNaC–Do your research people and don’t let your loved ones be victims. There’s a special place in hell for monsters like Bill and Melinda Gates, Henry Kissinger and Sen. /Dr. Richard Pan, just to name a few. Don’t be a victim!

  • donna mills

    Good response JG! You’ve done your homework.

  • donna mills

    CumExApostolatus your brain is firing on all cylinders!
    I commend you.

  • Danielle Carruthers

    Murdered by the medical industry????? I am utterly amazed that you (or anyone) can say such a thing! Have you lived your entire life without ever visiting a medical professional for treatment? Will you live out the rest of your days without going to see a dr for any medical issues? If the medical industry is so corrupt and murderous, then I can assume you will never approach them for help? So when you are old and your heart, lungs or kidneys are failing, will you still be sticking to your word and refusing any input from a medical professional that might just save your life? They are murderers right? You wouldn’t want help from a murderer…

  • Kiwimommy

    Stupidest argument ever! If I am in a car wreck, I will probably end up in a hospital where the one thing American medicine does well will hopefully do so for me! Otherwise, I will steer clear of the third leading cause of death in America…. Doctors and hospitals.
    American medicine is a joke, except I am not laughing! Abysmal at diagnosis but eager to bring up mental if they can’t figure it out. Most don’t give more than 5 minutes and all they have to offer is chemicals via Vaccines or drugs. If the drug causes problems they don’t ever stop it, they simply start adding more to counter side effects after side effects! Their offices are simply assembly lines for drug dispensing.
    Last doctor I saw said I was one of only 3 patients he had that were NOT on any prescription, and stated he would ALLOW that for now! Allow? I never went back!
    The healthiest I have ever been in my life was when I stopped going to doctors!
    12 of our children are sick, disabled, or dying! I would say they have failed as the watchmen of our health and that of our children! Only an idiot would say “please give me some more of that please”!
    But it is not all or nothing! I don’t have to regularly see a doctor or take their drugs and vaccines to earn a right to emergency care. And if I do get sick despite my healthy lifestyle, I will go to alternative care-givers who actually look at causation and not just bury symptoms with pharmaceutical drugs. Drugs that we already know pharma companies will lie about to make a buck and after murdering tens if thousands, gladly pay the fine as it is always a tiny bite out of the profits the drug made them!

  • Jonathan Graham

    You just do it in a way that really doesn’t facilitate useful discussion.

  • Danielle Carruthers

    My argument is the stupidest ever???? I have no words to describe your comment! Your comment makes you sound like a paranoid fool. You are lucky enough to live in a country that is able to provide the health care that it does, despite the faults it may have. At least you have the option, unlike millions of others around the world. Your attitude towards doctors is just sad. Despite what you may think, the vast majority of doctors are good people who have taken an oath to help others. I don’t know where your unfounded, paranoid ideas have come from, but I almost feel sorry for people like you- you just have no bloody idea!

  • guest

    Ad you keep posting meaningless comment just to get paid. Got your per deim today? Please don’t bother with the oh I’m a troll, where’s my money or some other such nonsense. You don’t think or like my comments there is a solution. Stop responding to them. However you won’t do that because you need the money. Also, a recent study states that trolls are Machiavellian sadist so you must be one that lacks internal self control which compels you to continue to comment even though you are adding nothing to the discussion-just whining.

  • Jonathan Graham

    See, I’m pointing out that the way you are approaching things is not a (very) useful way to discuss things. It’s reasonable, if perhaps a bit optimistic to expect that a comments sections would exist to discuss the article it’s attached to.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’m asking a pretty reasonable question to determine what kind of data best addresses your gaps in knowledge. For example if I simply posted studies which show a strong relationship between vaccination and seroconversion. Is that compelling?

    Data please. Otherwise it’s just an opinion.

    What everyone says is their opinion however you can’t know if it is merely opinion unless you have data to support the absence of data supporting it.

  • guest

    Despite your assertion about meaningful discussion you can’t control your impulse to reply. Money or Machiavellian sadist. Take your pick.

  • guest

    Point proven.

  • Ron Roy

    I agree with donna mills. I’m 71 and other than having a doctor remove a cyst ( which was just an annoyance and I couldn’t remove it myself because of it’s location) from the back of my head I haven’t been to a doctor in over 40 /50 years and I take NO pharmaceuticals of any kind.

  • Ron Roy
  • Ron Roy

    When there is information that cannot be discredited. I don’t post for
    you. The information is for others who may not have it. You’re just
    the conduit that makes it available. I do the same. Keep up the good work.You know a lot more than I do I find your posts very useful.

  • guest

    Thank you.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I do want to have meaningful discussion. Which is why I asked my reasonable question: “Do you or do you not believe that seroconversion is strongly correlated with disease resistance?”

    Why is this such a problem for you? Why do you feel the need to be abusive?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Then perhaps you’ll change your posting style.

  • Danielle Carruthers

    There are multiple reasons why young babies are immunised. If you aren’t aware of these reasons, then I suggest you do some research and educate yourself. I am not stupid, research and history itself have shown what and when an infant body can tolerate. They would not be given, otherwise. Please research, from a reputable source, the so called “poisons” that are being injected into children. You may learn something. Have you ever seen a newborn baby, too young to be immunised properly, contract whooping cough? Have you seen them struggle to breathe, unable to catch their breath? Held them as their tiny faces turn blue because they aren’t getting enough oxygen?? I have, believe me, it is not nice.
    And for the record, yes, I have had my multiple immunisations. I need them to protect the unwell and immuno-compromised children and adults that I come into contact with every day, and to protect myself from contracting communicable diseases that people bring to me every day, while looking for help because they are unwell

  • Proponent

    Oh, hai Danchi..

    guest: “Measles is measles mild or otherwise. The health depts of the various states that were home to the Disney outbreak infected stated the cases were mild.”

    … spewing nonsense again?

    “2015 US measles cases

    In the CDC’s overview of measles activity so far this year, published today in Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR), it said 159 cases were reported between Jan 4 and Apr 2.”

    Among the 159 outbreak cases, 22 people have been hospitalized for their infections, 5 of them with pneumonia.

  • Proponent

    Geez, Danchi.. now I think I understand why you simply puke up walls of copypasta text.

    Since, once you actually type out your own words.. your grammar is horrendous. It’s difficult to read and/or comprehend what you post.

    … …

    And the shill gambit? Really? That the best you have?

    Of course it is.. and it is dismissed out of fingers/hands by rational people. And the only place where your nonsense resonates is back at your e-home echo chamber of lies; (Lying) Age of Autism.

  • mthead

    “There are multiple reasons why young babies are immunised.”
    Here they are……$. $ and more $.

  • JGC

    “Another family is mourning the loss of their two-month old baby following routine vaccinations.”

    “Following” and “as the result of” are not synonymous–I suggest you google the classic logical fallacy “post hoc ergo propter hoc”.

    “Vaccines can affect the thymus. [6,7]”

    Citation 6 does not provide evidence that vaccines can affect the thymus: in fact, it doesn’t mention vaccination or the thymus even once. Citation 7 (to of all things a non-peer-reviewed promotional website for acupuncture) offers no evidence that vaccines can cause bleeding or petachia formation in the thymus: it instead claims (without offering any supporting evidence, I’ll note) that vaccines can cause “thymus clogging”.

    Re: package inserts:

    Citation 8 states “Apnea following intramuscular vaccination
    has been observed in some infants born prematurely”. Cash was born at 40 weeks
    gestation. Citation 9 documents a acute case of apnea occurring on the day of vaccination
    which might possibly have been associated with the vaccine: Cash’s apnea was
    chronic. Citation again notes apnea
    following intramuscular vaccination in infants born prematurely. It also notes apnea and bronchospasm including asthma-like symptoms
    reported in post marketing surveillance, but notes that a causal association
    with the vaccine can not be established (“Because these events are reported
    voluntarily from a population of unknown size, it is not always possible to
    reliably estimate their frequency or establish a causal relationship to the
    vaccine”)

    I could go on, but the bottom line is this: a child who was born unresponsive at 40 weeks-prior to receiving any vaccination–requiring resuscitation and who exhibited chronic apnea died of asphyxia. The autopsy results present no evidence suggesting that the asphyxia was the result of ‘immune system overstimulation” however you wish to define it. There is no evidence that the vaccines he received in general or those he received 16 days prior to his death in particular were responsible for his apnea or for his death. The idea that such an association exists is founded, apparently, on nothing other than the fact his death occurred at a point in time (a full 16 days later, at that) after he had been vaccinated.

  • JGC

    “There are NO vaccine preventable diseases.”

    Which is why we’re still seeing 4 million cases of, and 10,000 hospitalizations due to, chicken pox in the US every year….

    Oh, wait.

  • guest

    (Source: Table 36 The GlaxoSmithKline Biological Clinical Safety and Pharmacovigilance report to Regulatory Authority)
    “… if one analyzes the data looking at deaths in first 10 days after administration of vaccine and compares it to the deaths in the next 10 days, it is clear that 97% of deaths (65 deaths) in the infants below 1 year, occur in the first 10 days and 3% (2 deaths) occur in the next 10 days. Had the deaths been coincidental SIDS deaths unrelated to vaccination, the numbers of deaths in the two 10 day periods should have been the same. Similarly in children older than 1 year, 87.5% deaths (7deaths) occurred in the first 10 days and 12.5% (1 death) occurred in the next 10 days.”

    Chart at:
    http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/vaccines-proven-cause-sudden-death-children

    The clustering of deaths around the time of vaccination demonstrates a link between the vaccination and the sudden deaths. It indicates this is not by chance, as otherwise the deaths would be spread across the entire 20 days. Rather than showing the total deaths each day,
    GlaxoSmithKline disguised the clustering of deaths around vaccination. They did this by listing the cumulative number of deaths. So by Day 19 after vaccination, GSK’s total was 67 deaths. But there had only been two deaths in those last 10 days and not 67. In contrast 65 deaths
    occurred on the first day of vaccination up to the 10th day following vaccination.

    And here you can see GSK’s Table 36. The way it is prepared disguises the clustering of deaths around the time of vaccination – the total cumulative number of deaths up to 10 days from vaccination is 65. That number over the next 10 days increases by only 2. So in 10 days there were 65 deaths and between day 11 to day 20 after vaccination there were only another two deaths. So only the vaccine can be the cause of this:
    Chart at link and remainder of article at link.

    -Combined hexavalent diphtheria-tetanus-acellular pertussis-hepatitis
    B-inactivated poliovirus-Haemophilus influenzae type B vaccine;
    Infanrix™ hexa: twelve years of experience in Italy.
    http://www.tandfonline(dot)com/doi/full/10.4161/hv.26269

    Combining Childhood Vaccines at One Visit Is Not Safe
    by Neil Z. Miller
    Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons, Volume 21, Number 2, Summer 2016
    http://www.jpands(dot)org/vol21no2/miller.pdf

  • AutismDadd

    Callous Disregard

  • JGC

    “The clustering of deaths around the time of vaccination
    demonstrates a link between the vaccination and the sudden deaths.”

    No, it does not: it only observes that some vaccinations are
    scheduled to be given during a time period where SIDS death are also commonly
    observed to occur: that observation is insufficient to establish a casual association.

    Consider what was observed in Japan when in 1975 their vaccination schedule
    was changed to raise the minimum age of vaccination to two years, in part
    because they observed the same temporal association (clustering) of vaccination
    and SIDS.. Lo and behold! The number of SIDS deaths clustered around the time of vaccinations went to practically zero.

    The number of SIDS deaths occurring in Japan, both in general and prior to 2 years of age, however, did not: the SIDS rate in Japan either increased or stayed the same after the vaccination age was raised. SIDS incidence did not lower, much less disappear. The apparent association was broken not because vaccines were causally associated with SIDS deaths in infants younger than two, but because the greatest risk of SIDS occurs in infants prior to two years of age and vaccines were no longer being coincidentally administered during this time.

  • AutismDadd

    Of course a nurse who has been indoctrinated.

  • AutismDadd

    Big whoop 159 people how many deaths? Let me guess ZERO

  • AutismDadd

    Quit harassing the guy for God sake!!!

  • JGC

    I’m curious I people could help me with something. I keep see people, like the author of this article, warning about the adverse consequences of “overstimulating the immune system, while others simultaneously promote supplements etc. to “boost the immune system”.
    Could someone clarify the difference between the two, and explain how what can reliably and objectively distinguish between an unstimulated, appropriately stimulated and overstimulated immune system, as well as between an unboosted immune system and one that has been boosted?

  • guest

    “If you aren’t aware of these reasons”
    Please provide the reason in chronological order.

    “Have you ever seen a newborn baby, too young to be immunised properly, contract whooping cough?”

    First obstacle is to determine where or how the child became infected. Here is a good place to start:

    Two current studies speak to the above:
    -Study titled: “Acellular Pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate model,” used infant baboons to test the hypothesis that “current acellular pertussis vaccines fail to prevent colonization and transmission” of B. Pertussis. (there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus) http://www.pnas (dot) org/content/111/2/787.

    Lead author Tod Merkel did comment to the New York Times that when exposed to B. Pertussis after recently getting vaccinated, you could be an asymptomatic carrier and infect others, saying: “When you’re newly vaccinated, you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population.” According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.

    -Study: Whooping cough resurgence due to vaccinated people not knowing they’re infectious? clinicalnews(dot)org/2015/06/24/study-whooping-cough-resurgence-due-to-vaccinated-people-not-knowing-theyre-infectious/comment-page-1/. From study/article:
    “a detailed epidemiological model of whooping cough transmission to conclude that acellular vaccines may well have contributed to — even exacerbated — the recent pertussis outbreak by allowing infected individuals without symptoms to unknowingly spread pertussis multiple times in their lifetimes.

    ‘There could be millions of people out there with just a minor cough or no cough spreading this potentially fatal disease without knowing it,’ said Althouse. ‘The public health community should act now to better assess the true burden of pertussis infection.’ What’s worse, their model shows that if the disease can be spread through vaccinated, asymptomatic individuals essentially undetected.

    “from a reputable source, the so called “poisons” that are being injected into children.”
    Lets look at the Measles vaccine for example;
    How ‘Measles Virus’ is isolated for a Vaccine.
    by Janine Roberts
    extract from her book Fear of the Invisible

    In an online paper entitled ‘Isolation and Identification of Measles Virus in
    Cell Culture,’ the CDC, the central Health Research authority of the USA, lays
    out how isolation of this virus should be done so it can be used, say for a
    vaccine. It instructs, first obtain from the patient a small sample of urine or
    fluid from the nose or mouth.

    Next ‘sacrifice’ a marmoset monkey, take some of its cells, then make these
    cancerous, perhaps by exposing them to radiation, and then give them, on top of
    this, Epstein-Barr disease! Such extremely sick cells, the CDC informs us, are
    ‘10,000 times’ more sensitive to the measles virus than are normal human cells.

    Now add to these cells a toxin called trypsin. The CDC tells us to expect some
    cells to fall off the sides of the vessel as if they have been poisoned. They
    have been. Now add nutrients and glucose and leave for two or three days so the cells can somewhat recover.

    Now add to the cells the sample gathered from the patient. After an hour,
    inspect the cells in the culture with a microscope to see if any of the cells
    are becoming distorted, or are floating free as they did when trypsin was added. If they are, the CDC says this is proof that measles virus is present and making the cells ill.

    This statement made me sit back and think. Why should this illness now be caused by a virus? They had poisoned the cells, made them cancerous….. and now the CDC was saying the cells must be ill because they had measles. Where was the logic in this?

    The next stage involves the addition of two antibiotics, Penicillin and
    Streptomycin, to the culture and leaving it alone for a day. Again the cells are
    inspected – and if small holes now appear between cells, it is now presumed that measles virus has caused these. If no sign of such damage, this process is repeated. If after this there are still no signs of damage, then the culture is
    discarded. However, if 50% or more of the cells are now seriously ill and
    distorted, the culture is set aside and kept in the fridge as
    ‘isolated measles virus stock suitable for vaccines!’ All this without actually detecting the virus itself!

    This is the whole process as recommended by the CDC. There is no mention of the need to have a control culture, no mention of any need to isolate the measles virus or even to see it with an electron microscope. The cells are poisoned – and an unseen measles virus is blamed – even thou’ the disease the cells have is totally unlike measles. Where is the logic in this?

    *****What they call measles virus is in effect the fluid in this poisoned cell
    culture.*****

    Source document – CDC. Isolation and Identification of Measles Virus in Culture, Revised November 29, 2001.

    “I have had my multiple immunisations”
    I’m very happy for you. No one is trying to prevent you from getting vaccinated if that is your choice. No one is trying to convince you not to get your children vaccinated if that is your choice. The operative word here is CHOICE. The other word INFORMED CONSENT.

  • guest

    Still got that itch you can’t scratch. Lover.

  • guest

    OOOh baby baby-Maybe one day you get some play huh. Nah don’t think so. Danchi would stroke up, not down.

  • guest

    tisk tisk tisk

  • guest

    In 2005, the UN Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization, UNESCO, addressed this issue, adopting the Universal Declaration on Bioethics and Human Rights on the consensus of 193
    countries. The participating countries hoped this Declaration, like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights before it, would become a set of guiding principles. On the issue of consent, the Declaration states that:

    any preventive…medical intervention is only to be carried out with the prior, free and informed consent of the person concerned, based on adequate information.

    It further notes that the “sole interest of science or society” does not prevail.

    This pronouncement is an extension of the medical oath, attributed to Hippocrates 2500 years ago, that doctors must work for the good of their patients and never do harm. Abbreviated as the “first do
    no harm” principle, this credo embodies the precautionary principle in medicine, clearly placing the interests of individual patients above the interests of the collective or the “herd.”

    This precautionary principle in medicine leads directly to the view that vaccination policies must be recommended, not coerced. The doctor-patient relationship depends first and foremost on trust, and
    coercion undermines it. When the doctor-patient relationship is based on coercion, trust is a casualty, and doctors then serve the state, and by extension the society, above their individual patients. This is a slippery slope, where civilized medicine has too often derailed in the past. “

  • guest

    You can argue the study all you like but others will read it for themselves and decide for themselves. That’s why we post information–for people to read and make up their own mind.

  • guest

    From:

    We have known for decades that getting the childhood diseases naturally results in a permanent immunity to the specific microorganism. Getting the vaccines results in a temporary immunity, meaning that susceptibility is deferred and repeated booster shots will be required for the ENTIRE life of the individual. In the 80s, the specific immune mechanisms involved in vaccine-induced immunity was discerned. In the 90s, the same mechanisms in humans were explored. T cells (thymus cells)are the major cell in the immune system; they direct and control all immune responses as well as immune memory. Subsets of T cells are the T-helper cells (Th). T-helper cells coordinate and direct the safest and most effective immune response. Using Moskowitz’s measles example, we
    know that, when infected with the measles virus naturally via the nasopharyngeal route, the body produces a Th1 response that externalizes the infection and provides permanent immunity.1
    Fever, rash, coughing, sneezing, etc are signs of the body ridding itself of this infection. Bypassing the normal body lines of defense by injecting a vaccine forces the immune system into an emergency-based Th2 response which serves to internalize the infection. You don’t get the disease but are susceptible to the disease later since the Th2 response results in poor immune memory. So, if a natural, viral (measles) infection results in a Th1 response, why don’t we make vaccines that
    could elicit the same response.

    In 1995, Golding and Scott, (FDA scientist) published the need for strategies to make vaccines that would generate the “required” Th cell to the corresponding microorganism. Since that time, attempts to produce vaccines that would generate a “natural”- type response have failed. So, we are left with vaccines that generate “protective” responses as a second choice. How does this work? In
    vaccine-induced Th2 responses, called humoral responses, the body produces large quantities of specific antibodies that block the virus from entering cells. This response is why a vaccinated child doesn’t get a full blown infection and why the child won’t spread as many viruses into the environment. However, antibodies cannot get into cells to eliminate viruses once the viruses are in the cells or cannot kill infected cells themselves. Therefore, the body has no choice other than
    to internalize the virus and be chronically infected when the body is forced into a Th2 antibody response. The body is essentially constipated with viruses that it cannot expel!

    Unvaccinated children who are exposed to measles will generate the immune response that is required to make permanent immunity as well as kick out the virus from the body. The normal, healthy body’s response to viruses is to externalize them. To suppress this natural response can be as
    hazardous to our health as suppressing waste elimination from the bowel or toxin release from the skin. Natural Th1 responses generate cell-mediated responses that serve to both neutralize viruses by producing antibodies and most importantly stimulate the immune cells necessary to kill any cells infected with viruses. The body works to externalize and eliminate viruses when the Th1 response is generated. So we understand now that when a Th2 response is induced, “it drives the infection deeper into the interior and causes us to harbor it chronically.”3 It is commonly held that the presence of antibody to viruses is a sign of a chronic on-going infection not a sign of immunity.4 Our bodies generally need to have Th1 cells to defend against viral, Gram-negative bacterial, and fungal infections, and tuberculosis, as well as to protect against cancer. Th2 response is necessary to protect against Gram-positive bacterial, parasitic infections, as well as to neutralize toxins from microorganisms and the environment. A balance of
    Th1/Th2 cells in the body is defined as immunostasis (or immune balance)and is required for optimum health and wellness. Vaccines promote a failure in immunostasis by making the Th2-type cells dominant.

    http://icpa4kids(dot)org/Wellness-Articles/how-do-vaccines-work-immune-mechanisms-and-consequences/All-Pages.html (resources).

    Top Doctors Reveal Vaccines Turn Our Immune System Against Us: http://www.wakingtimes(dot)com/2016/01/04/attacking-ourselves-top-doctors-reveal-vaccines-turn-our-immune-system-against-us/

    ‘ASIA’ – autoimmune/inflammatory syndrome induced by adjuvants. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih(dot)gov/pubmed/20708902

  • AutismDadd

    They claim we can’t recall when all these killer diseases were rampant, but when we inform them that we were fine with few or no vaccines they start the tinfoil hat nonsense. The majority of people are those with no vaccines or had a few 40 or more years ago. We have not died and were never close. And it wasn’t till the 1980’s the USA created a vaccine injury compensation plan to cover up what vaccines really do to consumers.

  • AutismDadd

    Get ready for the tinfoil hat gambit

  • JGC

    If you’re genuinely interested in people considering the available evidence and deciding for themselves you’d provide a link to the study itself,rather than to Greenmedinfo’s false assertion that a single table in the report offers proof of a casual association between vaccines and SIDS.

  • Billy Briggs

    Suplements is natureal and vacines aint

  • donna mills

    AMA indoctrinated MDs and nurses means anything that’s not drug protocol is prohibited or they lose their license! But, NOW, it’s beginning to look more like the Nazi SS model everyday. In that respect, being older has its advantages. Knowledge is power…If the young people /parents only knew or would listen!

  • JGC

    “First obstacle is to determine where or how the child became infected”
    No, it’s not. It’s not even relevant. The topic being discussed is whether or not pertussis vaccination is safe and effective, and whether giving infants HIB vaccines immediately following birth is contraindicated.
    Try to stay on topic.

    RE: your whole description of culturing and harvesting cells to generate measles vaccines–did you have a point? Unless you have some evidence that the risks associated with receiving the MMR vaccine exceed the risks associated with remaining vulnerable to measles infection, or evidence that trace amounts of trypsin etc. remaining in vaccine formulations as a consequence of having been used in their production are toxic or otherwise harmful at levels of exposure achievable by routine vaccination, your entire argument reduces to nothing other than “Oooh….ingredients! Scary stuff!”

  • JGC

    “Of course a nurse who has been [educated].”
    FTFY

  • donna mills

    get lost troll–loser!

  • AutismDadd

    indoctrinated as in brainwashed

  • donna mills

    The whole thing is, obviously, JG is a despicable big pharma contracted troll. The internet is rife with them on topics such as this. Disinformation is a lucrative business for losers.

  • JGC

    Natural means neither “Superior” nor “desirable”: there’s a reason after all why we don’t drink willow bark tea when we’re dealing with headache or inflammation and reach for aspirin or Tylenol instead.
    That said, human immune response and the generation of protective antibody titers represent entirely natural phenomenon. Vaccination presents the naturally occurring protein epitopes or live attenuated cells in a safe and efficient manner, with added benefits such as allowing for the delivery of a consistent and predetermined dose, lack of contaminants, etc. Certainly relying on vaccination to protect against infectious diseases rather than relying on exposure to the pathogens themselves is no less natural than taking supplementary vitamin C tablets to obtain desired amounts of ascorbic acid rather than gorging on citrus fruit.

  • JGC

    Actually, no, we don’t–certainly no more than does vaccination. Protection from pertussis infection following contracting the actual disease, for example, wanes over time just as does protection provided by vaccination, and measles infection actually compromises the immune system’s ability to respond to other infectious diseases for a period of years afterward.

  • JGC

    Wow–zero to Godwin in 18 words! is that a personal best, donna?

  • JGC

    Yes: we don’t know the identity of patient zero. Did you have a point?
    Surely you don’t believe that after leaving Disneyland in California, patient zero visited an additional 23 different states directly infecting a total of 189 different people, rather than the spread of infection being a result of compromised herd immunity?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Quit stalking and harassing me.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Think of your immune system as an “army”. A huge invader (vaccines) comes to attack the kingdom (body). The immune system is out numbered (overstimulated immune system) and can’t properly fight the invaders. Now, if you built your army (boost immune system) the army would be stronger in the defense of the kingdom (body). I know that’s pretty simplified, but you get the idea, right?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Why all the vitriol. I asked a pretty straightforward question.

  • donna mills

    Oh pleeeze–give me a little more credit than that Danielle! Do I come off to you like some kind of a fool? Well, I’m not. I used to go to a mainstream MD whenever I thought there was the least little thing wrong with me and get jerked around–NO more of that for me! I’ve had my share of accidents, some that required the emergency intervention of an MD, but not for the treatment or “prevention” of any disease–ACCIDENTS, yes; broken (fractured) bones; and, rarely, for anything I can’t handle myself, there are naturopathic MDs who don’t pander to Big Pharma and the drug industry. If you haven’t been to a naturopathic or holistic MD, even integrative MDs are a little better than a conventional one, I encourage you to visit one next time you get sick, since it seems that self-care is not something you do, and you depend on professional healthcare for most or all of your health issues.

  • JGC

    If I am getting your idea, it’s not plausible, as it would be impossible for vaccines received according to the CDC’s recommended childhood vaccination schedule, to somehow “outnumber” or exceed the capacity of the immune system to respond to antigen exposure. A newborn infant is exposed to orders of magnitude more and different antigenic epitope sin the first 15 minutes following delivery than it could possibly see even as a consequence of the most aggressive vaccination schedule imaginable

  • AutismDadd

    Jonathan (Hammy) Graham tells me to stop harassing him, while he is out of control harassing.

  • AutismDadd

    They rigged it in their favor in 1986

  • guest

    Study titled: “Acellular Pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate model,” used infant baboons to test the hypothesis that “current acellular pertussis vaccines fail to prevent colonization and transmission” of B. Pertussis. (there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus) http://www.pnas (dot) org/content/111/2/787.

    Lead author Tod Merkel did comment to the New York Times that when exposed to B. Pertussis after recently getting vaccinated, you could be an asymptomatic carrier and infect others, saying: “When you’re newly vaccinated, you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population.” According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.

    -Study: Whooping cough resurgence due to vaccinated people not knowing they’re infectious? clinicalnews(dot)org/2015/06/24/study-whooping-cough-resurgence-due-to-vaccinated-people-not-knowing-theyre-infectious/comment-page-1/. From study/article:
    “a detailed epidemiological model of whooping cough transmission to conclude that acellular vaccines may well have contributed to — even exacerbated — the recent pertussis outbreak by allowing infected individuals without symptoms to unknowingly spread pertussis multiple times in their lifetimes.

    ‘There could be millions of people out there with just a minor cough or no cough spreading this potentially fatal disease without knowing it,’ said Althouse. ‘The public health community should act now to better assess the true burden of pertussis infection.’ What’s worse, their model shows that if the disease can be spread through vaccinated, asymptomatic individuals essentially undetected.

  • guest

    The acellular pertussis (aP) vaccine (the final element of the DTaP combined vaccine), now in use in the USA, replaced the whole cell pertussis vaccine in the late 1990s, which was followed by an unprecedented resurgence of whooping cough. An experiment with deliberate pertussis infection in primates revealed that the aP vaccine is not capable of preventing colonization and transmission of B. pertussis (see appendix for the scientific study, Item #2). The FDA has issued a warning regarding this crucial finding.[1]

    Furthermore, the 2013 meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors at the CDC revealed additional alarming data that pertussis variants (PRN-negative strains) currently circulating in the USA acquired a selective advantage to infect those who are up-to-date for their DTaP boosters (see appendix for the CDC document, Item #3), meaning that people who are up-to-date are more likely to be infected, and thus contagious, than people who are not vaccinated. Tetyana Obukhanych who holds a PhD in Immunology.
    -Meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors, Office of Infectious Diseases Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Tom Harkins Global Communication Center Atlanta, Georgia December 11-12, 2013. PDF.

    Levi Quackenboss did some research on the Pertussis tosid and here’s what he reported:
    -The pertussis vaccines do not contain pertussis bacteria.
    The Tdap and DTaP vaccines that were phased in during the 1990s don’t confer immunity to pertussis bacteria. The vaccines contain pertussis toxoid. Toxoid is the inactivated version of the nasty exotoxin that the bacteria secrete during an infection thatcauses major damage to the human body. These “acellular” (meaning not
    whole cell) vaccines also contain pertactin, fimbria, and filamentous hemagglutinin– all of the gook that pertussis produces –in a failed attempt to stop pertussis from sticking to itself and posting up in your throat. Pertussis and pertussis toxin are not the same thing—think of it like the difference between grapes and wine. Do you get arrested for driving after eating grapes? No, you don’t. Because although one is made from the other, they’re not the same thing.

    The pertussis toxin is called an AB toxin because the B-unit (B is for binding) binds to your healthy cells while the A-unit enters through the membranes and wreaks havoc. It’s the B-unit that the body can learn to recognize and get some immunity to. The DTaP/Tdap vaccines are for teaching your body to fight when it encounters the B-units.

    But the key fact misrepresented by the media, lawmakers and medical establishment is this: the vaccines can’t fight pertussis until your body is infected and by then it’s too late to stop you from being contagious. There is no toxin to fight off–and no B-unit to recognize– until the infection takes hold anywhere from 4 to 21 days after exposure. DTaP and Tdap may be symptom-reducing vaccines, but they aren’t designed to
    prevent an infection from happening. They are not transmission-reducing
    vaccines. In fact, the pertussis toxin antibodies are of no use until an infection happens.

    Links to studies and reports at:
    https://leviquackenboss(dot)wordpress.com/2016/02/19/you-cant-protect-another-person-from-pertussis/

  • guest

    If you read the article for yourself which you obviously did not you would have seen the link in the article at GreenMed. Also, the abstract has a link to the study which has to be purchased. However, there are some sites that have the study on their blogs but I know how you hate going to anti-vaxx websites so I won’t bother posting it here.

  • jacobvk

    My first immediate question is why would intraparenchymal hemorrhage be listed under “lungs” when it’s a hemorrhage of the prefrontal lobe of the brain?

  • guest

    I agree. Everyone on this site knows who the trolls are.

  • EllyW

    Thank you for posting about the FDA and CDC research re: pertussis vaccines. I just want to point out that the FDA research also tested whole cell pertussis vaccine in baboons, and found that it (like the acellular vaccine) failed to prevent infection with pertussis. The baboons vaccinated with whole cell vaccine cleared their infections in about 3 weeks, and the baboons vaccinated with acellular vaccine cleared their infections in about 6 weeks.

  • EllyW

    I suggest you read retired neurosurgeon Russell Blaylock’s article “The Danger of Excessive Vaccination During Brain Development.”

  • Anthony Murawski

    THE REAL REASON VACCINES ARE DANGEROUS FAR MORE OFTEN THAN REGULATORY AGENCIES ADMIT

    Even if the anti-vaccine people don’t have the right explanation, the vaccine manufacturing industry has been so unfathomably corrupt since the early 1980s that I wouldn’t take any vaccines unless I were forced to do so.

    “Until 1980, the federal government retained rights to all inventions made under government grants or sponsorship.[1] The resulting underutilization of research and a wish to enhance the technological capacity and economic competitiveness of United States’ firms led to legislation allowing certain private entities to retain ownership of inventions made in projects involving government grants.[2] This legislation, the Bayh-Dole Act[3], was designed, among other things, to encourage small businesses (i.e., independently owned and operated, with fewer than 500 employees) and the recipients of nonprofit funding (i.e., recipients of federal funding such as universities, research institutions, nonprofit scientific or educational organizations, hospitals, etc.) to patent the results of government-sponsored research by allowing them to retain title to the inventions if they diligently filed patent applications and promoted commercial development of the inventions.”[4][5]

    Ronald Reagan expanded the Act in a 1983 Memorandum that directed federal agencies to extend the terms and provisions of Bayh-Dole to all government-funded research and development contracts, grants, and cooperative research agreements with private sector entities, permitting large for-profit businesses the right to retain title to their federally funded inventions[6] . Reagan’s 1987 Exec. Order No. 12591 required, among other things, that executive branch agencies promote the commercialization of federally funded inventions in accordance with his 1983 Memorandum.[6][7]

    If a vaccine is invented by a university employee or pharmaceutical company employee in the context of federally-funded research, the university and/or pharmaceutical company is granted full patent rights to the vaccine as long as if it markets the vaccine and shares an undisclosed percentage of its profits from the sales of the vaccine, in the form of royalties, with the federal agency that funded the research that went into inventing the vaccine. In other words, the universities and pharmaceutical companies are handed hundreds of millions of dollars in profits, and the federal agencies funded the research receive a secret percentage of royalties from the sale of the vaccine. The public is not even permitted to know how much money in royalties a government agency receives, because that information is withheld under the pretext of trade secret information.[8][9] This can fairly be characterized as federally‐mandated, multi‐billion dollar, legalized corruption.

    This is why the CDC continues to flagrantly exaggerate the marginal efficacy of flu vaccines and to downplay safety issues, as it profits to an unknown but doubtlessly breathtaking extent from royalties generated by flu vaccine sales (said extent of profit being exempt from disclosure under the Freedom of Information Act as a supposed “trade secret”). I haven’t had a flu vaccination in at least ten years, and don’t plan on having another one, in light of the safety and efficacy data published in several largescale studies in recent years by Cochrane Reviews and the British Medical Journal. For instance, according to a Cochrane Reviews study titled “Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy childfen (Review),”[10] the authors provide the caveat that “[t]his review includes trials funded by industry. An earlier systematic review of 274 influenza vaccine studies published up to 2007 found industry-funded studies were published in more prestigious journal and cited more than other studies independently from methodological quality and size. Studies funded from public sources were significantly less likely to report conclusions favourable to vaccines. The review showed that reliable evidence on influenza vaccines is thin but there is evidence of widespread manipulation of conclusions and spurious notoriety of the studies. The content and conclusions of this review should be interpreted in the light of this finding.” The review also noted that “[o]ne specific brand of monovalent pandemic vaccine is associated with cataplexy and narcolepsy in children….” [10]

    But all this applies to any vaccine manufactured after Reagan’s executive orders of the mid-1980s expanding the scope of the Bayh-Dole Act of 1980. For instance, the CDC unleashed a horrendous vaccine for Lyme disease in the early 1990s that resulted in several documented deaths, and the destruction of health of countless people who were already infected when they were vaccinated. It doesn’t necessarily mean that every vaccine that has been invented since 1980 is ineffective and dangerous; but it does mean that there is a lot of corruption at the NIH and CDC (among other agencies), and an enormously powerful motive for federal agencies to permit dangerous and/or ineffective vaccines to be marketed. It’s no wonder that you can’t sue a vaccine manufacturer directly when damaged by a vaccine or when a family member is killed by a vaccine, but can only apply for limited compensation from a federal, pooled fund.

    1. Whale, “Technologies and Universities,” 4 The Law and Business of Licensing: Licensing in the 1980s G-55 (1983).
    2. Patent & Trademark Law Amendments Act, Pub. L. 96-517 (1980).
    3. 35 USC §§ 200 et seq.
    4. Pulsinelli, Share and Share Alike: Increasing Access to Government-Funded Inventions Under the Bayh-Dole Act 393, 403 (2006).
    5. 4 Eckstrom’s Licensing in For. & Dom. Ops. § 14:9 (2014).
    6. OMB Circular A-124 (Feb. 10, 1982).
    7. Federal Grant Practice § 50:15 (2014 ed.)
    8. 15 USC § 3710a. Cooperative research and development agreements;.
    9. 15 USC § 3710c. Distribution of royalties received by federal agencies.
    10. Jefferson T, Rivetti A, Di Pietrantonj C, Demicheli V, Ferroni E. Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy children (Review). Cochrane Database of Systematic Reviews 2012, Issue 8. Art. No.: CD004879.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Just another example of how the medical examiner made mistakes.

  • jacobvk

    Was it the medical examiner who made a mistake, though? To me it seems more probable that the alleged document in the article whose provenance isn’t in any way established as factual may be made up or modified for print there. I’m thinking whoever posted it probably just didn’t expect too many people to look at it too close. It seems unlikely to be a mistake a medical examiner would actually make.

  • CumExApostolatus

    But, even civilly, individually, as negligent ‘professionals’? There HAS to be a way. It just hasn’t been tried yet. EVEN if it’s thrown out on summary judgment, at least make them answer the charges. I want to use some 4 letter words here, but I won’t.

  • CumExApostolatus

    Ingredients…scary stuff. So drink a few vials —and use a chaser of glyphosate.
    Keep your dirty paws off other people’s children.
    Repeat after me, all day, every day, “I love my police state. I love my police state. I love my police state.”

  • guest

    It seems unlikely to be a mistake a medical examiner would actually make.

    Seriously considering that ME discount vaccines as having any causation in the death of a person. Shaken Baby cases are being overturned and new trials are being given to defendants that were convicted on ME’s medical cause of death SBS. ME’s make mistakes and they outright lie.

    Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts Opens the Legal Door to Retry All Shaken Baby Syndrome Convictions: https://healthimpactnews(dot)com/2016/supreme-judicial-court-of-massachusetts-opens-the-legal-door-to-retry-all-shaken-baby-syndrome-convictions/

  • jacobvk

    And none of that has anything at all to do with vaccines, it also doesn’t support the idea that the mistake in the article in the OP is one a real medical examiner would be likely to make.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    we consulted 3 local attorneys. If something is considered reasonable and customary and the doctor did not act outside what is considered to be “right”, you cannot sue for malpractice. At least, that’s the way it is in MO.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    No, the document you’re seeing is as we received it. I believe that these reports are open to the public and can be obtained through the medical examiner’s office. If you would like to examine it for authenticity, please do so. People look so hard to discredit these stories, because they don’t want to believe them. We are a normal, Midwest family who love our children, try to live our lives in a good way just like, I’m sure, you do. Believe me, we never thought that we would lose one of our babies and certainly never coveted being in the middle of a vaccine controversy. We agreed to have our story published, not because we have an agenda, other than to share what happened to our baby, and hopefully prevent it from happening again.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    I replied to this above. It is the actual autopsy report. You may receive a copy of it from the medical examiner’s office in Jackson County, MO. Please take up your concerns with him…as we have.

  • jacobvk

    I’ve attempted a public record search of the Jackson county, MO website for birth and death certificates for Cash Dewayne Thomas between April and September 2013 and can’t find anything? So failing to find anything filed in that county under that specific name I attempted to search every birth and death certificate filed in that county in that date range and I got 62 results and none of them was Cash Dewayne Thomas?

  • guest

    Indeed it does.

    Analysis of causes that led to rib and skull fractures and intracranial bleeding
    in the case of the premature triplets Parneet, Sukhsaihaj, and Imaan.
    http://medicalveritas(dot)com/manAlbayati9.pdf

  • guest

    Yes: we don’t know the identity of patient zero. Did you have a point?
    Who is it because I’m sure Dr. Ann Schuchat would appreciate knowing. Please post all the documentation to your little story here. I’m very interested.

  • jacobvk

    Again…nothing to do with vaccines, and not suggestive that the type of mistake in the OP medical report would be made by an actual medical examiner.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    I’m not sure why you can’t find it? I’ve never tried to look for it on line. Here is the address and phone number: Address: 950 E 21st St, Kansas City, MO 64108
    Phone:(816) 881-6600

  • Ron Roy

    If only more people ( and I’m doing my best to encourage people to do this) would live by: Harm my child pay the price!

  • Ron Roy

    You mean MISS- educated.

  • guest

    There is no such thing as Herd Immunity.

    Herd immunity doesn’t exist-never has in Vaccine Induced antibodies production. A.W. Hedrich measles observation, was not a study or a research paper and had nothing to do with VACCINES. His observation was in 1933 and the killed measles vaccine (the first measles vaccine) wasn’t developed until 1963. By 1963, the death rate from measles in the United States had already dropped by approximately 98% ( Vital Statistics of the United States 1937, 1938, 1943, 1944, 1949, 1960, 1967, 1976, 1987, 1992; Historical Statistics of the United States— Colonial Times to 1970 Part 1; Health, United States, 2004, US Department of Health and Human Services; Vital Records & Health Data Development Section, Michigan Department of Community Health; US Census Bureau, Statistical Abstract of the United States: 2003; Reported Cases and Deaths from Vaccine Preventable Diseases, United States, 1950–2008.)
    Live measles vaccine was distributed in 1966-7. Just on that basis alone antibody production could not be detected. Herd Immunity has no basis in vaccine-induced antibody production, it is not a scientifically validated concept, it is not an immunologic idea, but rather an EPIDEMIOLOGICAL CONTRUCT and cannot be applied to vaccinated communities because VACCINES were not part of the OBSERVATION. This notion was built on the understanding that children developed immunity to a disease after experiencing it. Nowadays, we are told that vaccines can achieve the same. If we vaccinate the bulk of the herd, we can achieve herd immunity. Vaccinologists (a name they given themselves) adopted the phrase and increased the figure from 68% to 95% with no scientific justification as to why, and then stated that there had to be 95% vaccine coverage to achieve immunity. Essentially, they took Hedrich’s observation and manipulated it to promote vaccination programs. Interestingly, the magic number has gone from 50% to 68% and is now 99-100%—and they have given no scientific justification for this. Vaccination campaigns are aimed at reaching 100% compliance. However outbreaks of childhood illnesses are happening in highly vaccinated communities. Also take this into consideration:
    Today millions of adults exist with having had no vaccines in decades (Baby Boomers) and millions of teenagers who have not had boosters. That is more than half of the country’s population. There have not been ANY EPIDEMICS in the US as a result of more than half of the population being unvaccinated.

    I’m still would like the name of Patient Zero so I may contact the CDC with the information to get a copy of that news briefing.

  • guest

    Indeed it does. The idea that an ME can’t make a mistake is ludicrous-if not delusional.

  • jacobvk

    The idea isn’t that they can’t make a mistaken diagnosis, the idea is that they’re unlikely to make the categorical mistake of including a intraparenchymal hemorrhage under lungs instead of brain.

  • jacobvk

    They won’t give a death certificate or autopsy report to just anyone. In the application for either you need the person’s name, the date of birth and death, your name and your relationship to the person for whom you’re requesting it. The reason for that last thing being, obviously, to screen for random strangers requesting records they have no business requesting.

  • guest

    I think you should follow Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher advice. It’s sound.

  • jacobvk

    Not really sure to what advice you are referring.

  • guest

    This from: Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher
    You may receive a copy of it from the medical examiner’s office in
    Jackson County, MO. Please take up your concerns with him…as we have.

  • guest

    Congress gave the Vaccine makers and all involved in the distribution and administering of vaccine blanket immunity. The only option is to apply to the NVICP and hope for the best. Even that’s stacked in favor of the pharmaceutical industry because there is no discovery process allowed for the complainant. The Supreme Court upheld this law because the republican put it under homeland security. What compelled the congress to do this: Vaccine makers were get their lunch handed to them because of lawsuits for vaccine injuries & deaths. They approached their buddies in congress and told them if they didn’t stop the bleed they would stop producing vaccines in the US. Congress buckled and gave them what they wanted. National Vaccine Compensation Program was implemented (which is a joke) that family can apply to. This is the Supreme Court decesion:

    NVIC Cites “Betrayal” of Consumers by U.S. Supreme Court Decision Giving Total Liability Shield to Big Pharma: http://www.nvic(dot)org/NVIC-Vaccine-News/February-2011/NVIC-Cites–Betrayal–of-Consumers-by-U-S–Supreme.aspx.

    https://www.nvic(dot)org/CMSTemplates/NVIC/pdf/NVIC-amicus-as-filed-090809.pdf.

    The Man Behind The Vaccine Mystery: http://www.cbsnews(dot)com/news/the-man-behind-the-vaccine-mystery/

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Whether they are likely or not, this IS the autopsy report. This is my grandchild! It’s really not my job to dispute the idiocy of the medical examiner, nor should I have to argue over the validity of our baby’s autopsy report for Heaven’s sake. Having been a nurse for over 25 years, I can tell you that medical records often can and do contain errors. Whether the examiner made the mistake in his dictation or the transcriptionist made the mistake, I have no idea. I do know that this question has been asked and answered ad nauseum.

  • jacobvk

    It isn’t exactly advice that I can follow, I’m not a family member.

  • jacobvk

    I guess this just remains an impossible claim to verify.

  • guest

    It appears to be a state by state issue. Many have obtained autopsy reports such as media outlets by using the Freedom of Information Act. It just depends on how much you want the information.

  • guest

    jacobvk is a troll so it doesn’t matter what you say to him–he’ll play the no information, approach or directions are acceptable.

  • guest

    I didn’t read where an autopsy report is restricted to only family members even though the request ask for relationship to decedents. We would really appreciate you following through and sharing what you find with us. Please remember to ask in your request an explanation about “intraparenchymal hemorrhage under lungs instead of brain.”

    Jackson County Missouri
    Medical Examiners Office
    http://www.jacksongov(dot)org/158/Autopsy-Report-Request

    Autopsy Report Request
    Written Request Required

    *A party requesting an autopsy report must send that request
    to our office via mail or fax. Please include the following in any
    request.

    Decedent’s full name
    Decedent’s date of death
    Decedent’s date of birth
    Your name and your relationship to the decedent
    State that you are requesting a copy of the autopsy report
    Include your return address and contact number

    NOTE:
    If a case is pending litigation or is an open criminal investigation,
    the records are not available. In general, it takes a minimum of 6-8
    weeks to complete an autopsy report. In certain cases, additional tests
    may need to be performed which will delay completion of the report for
    several additional weeks.

    ME’s Office
    950 E. 21st Street
    Kansas City, MO 64108

    Medical Examiner
    Fax: 816-881-6641

  • jacobvk

    It appears likely that when interpreting laws for foia requests judges are likely to view autopsy reports as personally identifying exempt information and deny the request. Further Missouri requires residency or evidence of being personally aggrieved for making a FOIA request.

  • jacobvk

    You’re in luck, I had just looked this up directly and it is still in my web search history. Aside from it being explicitly in the autopsy request form from the Jackson County MO autopsy report request form, here is a direct quotation from Missouri Revised Statutes Chapter 195 section 115 subsection 7:

    “7. If an autopsy is performed on a deceased patient and an autopsy report is prepared, such report shall be made available upon request to the personal representative or administrator of the estate of the deceased, the surviving spouse, any surviving child, parent, brother or sister of the deceased.”

  • guest

    Grandmother is on the comment board. Ask for her assistance in obtaining a copy. Please be nice and respectful.

  • guest

    You never know until you try.

  • Jonathan Graham

    That’s why we post information–for people to read and make up their own mind.

    …and you think that’s MORE likely to be correct when you link to something which is strongly biased? or LESS likely.

  • Its not just infant death after vaccines, it is as well falsely accused shaken baby syndrome which vaccines HAVE caused. There is no bigger LIE than that of claimed vaccine safety.

    Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts Calls for a New Trial in Shaken Baby Case
    Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts Opens the Legal Door to Retry All Shaken Baby Syndrome Convictions
    by Christina England
    Health Impact News, June 19, 2016

    Excerpts:

    As the medical profession continues to debate the merits of “Shaken baby syndrome” (SBS), the American judicial system is increasingly determining that the evidence against SBS is strong enough to prevent convictions in a court of law, where the standard is “reasonable doubt.”

    With SBS charges, however, many parents have been charged by District Attorneys with crimes, and entered into the judicial system. As we have reported, a new pediatric sub-specialty, child abuse pediatrics, with the corresponding title of “Child Abuse Specialist,” came out around 2010. There are now over 300 of these doctors serving mostly in children’s hospitals across the country, functioning more like law enforcement officials than actual medical doctors, as their sole purpose is to find “child abuse” based on medical records.

    Should doctors be given this much authority? Are they really trained in forensic evidence and criminal behavior?

    It would seem that the courts are increasingly saying “no,” since so much contradictory medical evidence exists, showing that there are legitimate medical conditions that can be misinterpreted as “child abuse,” and more and more of it is coming to light in the court room.

    An important case was heard last year in the Ninth Circuit Court, which ruled that Dr. Claudia Wang, the medical director of UCLA’s Suspected Child Abuse and Negligence (SCAN) team, does not have immunity from civil lawsuits, may have set an important legal precedent. (Story here.)

    The late Archie Kalokerinos, M.D., once stated:

    I have no doubt that this ‘shaken baby’ business will eventually be recorded as one of the worst pages in the history of paediatrics. And the saddest part of it all concerns the fact that, while important doctors are busy collecting ‘evidence’ for the prosecution, vital issues that can save many lives are being not only ignored but destroyed with intense hostility.
    Sadly, Dr. Kalokerinos died in 2012, however, four years later, courts from around the world have at last begun to recognize that the diagnosis of Shaken baby syndrome is indeed “seriously flawed” and claim that the diagnosis needs to be investigated in more depth.

    One of the latest cases to be re-examined is the case of Oswelt Millien, a young father, who in 2015 was jailed for 4-5 years for causing permanent injuries to his six-month old daughter, Jahanna.

    According to the official court report, Mr. Millien claimed that his daughter had, earlier that evening, accidentally fallen backwards from the couch where she had been sitting and landed on a wooden floor. However, the prosecution’s expert witness, Dr. Alice Newton, disagreed and stated that such injuries could not have been caused by a short fall injury alone. During her evidence she stated:

    The only injury . . . that could possibly be related to a short fall was the skull fracture, but that this was ‘very unlikely,’ because short falls are more likely to result in linear, rather than comminuted, fractures.
    Dr. Newton testified that the skull fracture had required “some type of blow,” such as “slamming the child against something.” She stated that one could not determine when a skull fracture had occurred simply by looking at the CT scan because it would heal in the same way as vertebrae.

    Knowing that he was innocent and believing that Dr. Newton’s evidence was incorrect, the defendant, Mr. Millien, decided to file a motion for a new trial on the grounds of ineffective assistance of counsel. He claimed that his counsel was ineffective because they had failed to either consult or call an expert on the science of Shaken baby syndrome and that in failing to do so they had denied him a substantial ground of defense.

    Mr. Millien is not the first to question the ‘so called’ expertise of Dr. Alice Newton. In fact, her evidence has been questioned in several cases including the cases of Daniel Green, Aisling Brady McCarthy, Justina Pelletier and Geoffrey Wilson.

    Chief Justice Ralph Gants Orders a New Trial

    Millien’s motion was carried and on June 4, 2016, the Boston Herald reported that Chief Justice Ralph Gants from the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts had ordered a new trial.

    The Herald stated:

    The jury is still out on shaken baby syndrome, but the Supreme Judicial Court made one thing clear yesterday — the controversial diagnosis has flaws that any competent attorney should be able to pick apart.

    Read more:
    http://vaccineimpact.com/2016/supreme-judicial-court-of-massachusetts-opens-the-legal-door-to-retry-all-shaken-baby-syndrome-convictions/

    Falsely Accused Shaken Baby Syndrome, (and vaccine caused SIDS)
    http://www.vacfacts.info/falsely-accused-shaken-baby-syndrome.html

    TOP 10 THINGS I’VE TAKEN AWAY FROM 10 YEARS OF VACCINE RESEARCH
    https://heartruth.info/2015/01/29/top-10-things-ive-taken-away-from-10-years-of-vaccine-research/

    And it is not just the MMR vaccine: it is vaccine contamination; it is aluminum adjuvants; it is cytokine immune reactivity after vaccines, and more importantly multiple vaccines and when given in the same day; it is ischemia and ischemic stroke caused by aluminum adjuvants and vaccine induced immune reactivity; it is all of the above and more.

    Oddly for some children that have vaccine injuries, and as well autism, mercury continues to be an issue, and with mercury and other heavy metal toxicity found during biomedical treatment and in the need of detoxification. Where is it coming from, if not the vaccines? We know there are said still trace amounts of mercury in several of the killed/attenuated childhood vaccines. Just how is the FDA checking on and regulating that issue where mercury is used in the manufacturing process, but then said removed other than for trace amounts remaining. How do they assure that Thimerosal has been removed, other than to assume it has been done, and that on the honor of the pharmaceutical companies. We all know what that trust and honor is worth; absolutely nothing.

    Vaccines have historically and always will continue to do, MORE harm than good. There is a better way, and they refuse to look. They have everything to lose, and they will in their denial, continue to refuse to let that happen.

  • LiLi

    Parenchyma is the functional tissue of any organ

  • LiLi

    Parenchyma is not some mysterious part of the brain. Parenchyma is found in ALL ORGANS- renal, cardiac, pulmonary, etc

  • jacobvk

    And yet if you look up intraparenchymal hemorrhage the only thing you find is a brain hemorrhage.

  • LiLi

    No

  • jacobvk

    Nobody said it was, but what I did say is that an intraparenchymal hemorrhage is specifically a brain hemorrhage.

  • LiLi

    No

  • LiLi

    “pulmonary vasculitides: especially small vessel vasculitides: alveolar haemorrhage secondary to extensive parenchymal small-vessel vasculitis is typically more diffuse and initially causes more widespread lobular ground-glass opacification with gravity-dependent density gradients through to air-space consolidation, often with interspersed areas of ground-glass opacity; these include”

  • LiLi

    “Pulmonary hematoma consists of hemorrhage into the alveolar and interstitial spaces. It is usually associated with surrounding intraparenchymal hemorrhage”

  • LiLi

    ” parenchymal renal disease may refer to
    either unilateral (uncommon) or bilateral conditions”

  • LiLi

    ” but it may be that various stem cell populations already exist naturally within the penile parenchyma. “

  • LiLi

    Clinical Profile of 30 Infants With Acute Pulmonary Hemorrhage in Cleveland

    http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/110/3/627

  • LiLi

    Nope

  • LiLi

    Do you even science, bro?

  • jacobvk

    I think you should google it, every website is very specific.

  • jacobvk

    And yet not called an intraparebchymal hemorrhage…

  • LiLi

    How about I pull my medical books out and read about it again? Or I can google it. No, wait, I already did! . ALL ORGANS HAVE PARENCHYMA. IT IS THE FUNCTIONAL TISSUE OF THE ORGAN OPPOSED TO CONNECTIVE TISSUES. PARENCHYMAL HEMORRHAGE CAN OCCUR IN ANY PARENCHYMA WITH BLOOD FLOW.

  • jacobvk

    This may be referring to the fact that pulmonary hematomas are frequently also accompanied by intracranial bleeds because of one of the common treatments.

    From a PubMed paper titled “Pulmonary embolism and intracranial hemorrhage: is there still an indication for a caval filter placement?”:

    “The treatment of pulmonary embolism is mainly based on anticoagulants and intravenous thrombolysis in case of collapse. The cerebral hemorrhage is the main complication of thrombolysis and contraindicates anticoagulation. We report the case of a patient with a subdural and intraparenchymal hematoma complicating intravenous thrombolysis. The patient had persistent respiratory and hemodynamic instability related to the pursuit of embolic phenomena. The implementation of a cava filter was performed and the patient had a favorable outcome.”

    Indeed I find many references to intraparenchymal hemorrhage as a brain bleed in conjunction with pulmonary embolisms when I search for the two terms together.

  • jacobvk

    Not a reference to intraparenchymal hemorrhage, specifically there either.

  • jacobvk

    And again not a reference specifically to an intraparenchymal hemorrhage.

  • jacobvk

    But it would seem that whenever a doctor talks about an intraparenchymal hemorrhage they are referring to a brain bleed. At least from every source I can find.

  • LiLi

    “It would seem…” stands out to me. You really have no idea what you are talking about other than what your internet searches on PubMed yield. You lack the knowledge and understanding of anatomy and physiology. Doctors and other healthcare professionals have studied these subjects in-depth. Just because you don’t understand a medical term, or a term is used in a way you’ve never heard, does not render it a mistake.

  • LiLi

    As an RN, when I get a new patient admitted to my unit, I read their history and physical. I would not assume that an “intraparenchymal hemorrhage” was cranial, especially if they presented with respiratory sx.

  • jacobvk

    Well I’m no doctor, obviously I could be wrong but so far I haven’t found any sources that contradict me.

  • LiLi

    The medical examiner used the proper words referring to the specific part of the body. Under microscopic examination of the lungs, the doctor found that blood had leaked in between the tissues of the lung. The doctor used nomenclature particular to their field of study. Your ignorance of said nomenclature does not imply a mistake on the part of the doc.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Why do you consider it and such sources as biased;

    I consider them biased because there are blocks of wood more qualified to have an opinion.

  • LiLi

    I am a nurse. I have provided multiple sources which contradict you.

  • LiLi

    Read: educated

  • jacobvk

    Intraparenchymal hemorrhage has a set of associated symptoms more commonly found in brain related illnesses. Headache, nausea, fever and hypertension, nuchal rigidity, so you’d probably see a lot of that. Since intraparenchymal hemorrhages tend to result from the thrombolytic therapy used to treat acute pulmonary embolism maybe if you see intraparenchymal hemorrhage in conjunction with pulmonary embolism and see that thrombolytic therapy was done you can safely assume brain bleed.

  • LiLi

    Hey, do you read what I’m saying

  • LiLi

    Hello

  • LiLi

    You clearly stated you are not a doctor. You get all your info from the internet, right?

  • LiLi

    These words you are bandying about, you don’t even know what they mean.

  • LiLi

    The coroner, the doctor examining the tissues after death, examined the lungs.

  • LiLi

    To accurately describe what part of the lungs were effected, the doctor used the word “intraparenchymal”

  • LiLi

    As opposed to “stroma” or connective tissues

  • LiLi

    The tissues were full of blood which leaked out, or hemorrhaged.

  • jacobvk

    Which words would those be?

  • LiLi

    You can not “safely assume” anything. You have to read all the information. Have a baseline understanding. Use contextual clues.

  • jacobvk

    And when I do a search for intraparenchymal hemorrhage lungs the only results I find that put the two together are results about pulmonary embolisms, thrombolytic therapy and intracranial bleeds.

  • LiLi

    Apneic infant, born apneic to a GBS+ mother. She had to provided rescue breaths? All point to pulmonary irregularity or infection. The coroner very clearly, in the spot marked “Lungs,” listed intraparenchymal hemorrhage.

  • LiLi

    Those are the results you find. Is the totality of medical knowledge limited to what you search for?

  • LiLi

    Can you describe what parenchyma is?

  • LiLi

    what are emboli?

  • jacobvk

    And I can’t find hemorrhage listed under possible parenchymal lung diseases anywhere.

  • jacobvk

    When I search for information regarding lung hemorrhage I find lots of information, none of which mention parenchyma as a possible hemorrhage source.

  • jacobvk

    And yet I can’t find any reference to “intraparenchymal hemorrhage” referring to anything other than a brain bleed anywhere on the internet. I’ve even found sources that go as far as to say that an intraparenchymal hemorrhage is synonymous with an intracerebral hemorrhage.

  • jacobvk

    What I search for is obviously within limited domains haha. However at least the vast majority of medical knowledge is within the public domain and so would be indexed by internet search engines so a clever enough search should net most of the relevant information out there. If parenchymal hemorrhages in the lungs were common or likely or so identified, instead of being otherwise labeled, I should find some reference somewhere to that effect. These aren’t state secrets.

  • jacobvk

    The parenchyma are the cells that actual perform a specific function. In the case of the lungs they would be the cells in the gas exchanging portion.

  • jacobvk

    Emboli are things that travel through the bloodstream then get lodged and block blood flow.

  • LiLi

    I’m sorry you are trying to figure out something which you don’t understand. You are hung up on his simple thing. 1. There is pulmonary parenchyma. 2. There are blood vessels in it. 3. Any blood vessel can rupture. 4. Ruptured blood vessels lead to hemorrhage. The End.

  • LiLi
  • LiLi
  • LiLi
  • LiLi
  • LiLi
  • LiLi
  • LiLi

    Like bronchioles, alveoli. Hey listen, I would love to teach you further but I have a full time job. Go take some bio classes. Take anatomy. Educate yourself. For the record, google searching does not equal getting an education. You have no context, no frame of reference for the concepts you are talking about. Good luck.

  • LiLi

    “Intraparenchymal pulmonary hemorrhage” with quotation marks.

  • And if you used a sort of robotic training dummy that simulated the enemy but wasn’t actually armed to the hilt then the army would be stronger with respect to that specific opposing army because it would have a better idea of how to handle that specific invader but would have less risk than just charging into battle whilst being clueless what tactics are best to use for that specific opposing army, right?

  • Let’s be clear: Pertussis and Diphtheria really do release toxins in the true sense of the word.

  • Fortunately, even unnatural vaccines work, even though quite a few natural supplements are completely ineffective scams. It’s a lot more profitable selling alternative “medicine” at wacky prices than investing time and money to pursue a career in real medicine.

  • “Trust me, I wasn’t vaccinated, and I got sick with TONS of diseases! Your kids should be [diseased] like me!”

  • Yeah, parents save a lot of money when their kids don’t get sick and have to be kept home, given expensive medicine, hospitalized…

  • shay simmons

    I had mumps, measles, chickenpox and I completely recovered from all of them

    That’s kind of like me saying that because all of the veterans I know are alive, war doesn’t kill anybody.

  • guest

    Thank you for this information and the references. I now know “ALL ORGANS HAVE PARENCHYMA. IT IS THE FUNCTIONAL TISSUE OF THE ORGAN
    OPPOSED TO CONNECTIVE TISSUES. PARENCHYMAL HEMORRHAGE CAN OCCUR IN ANY
    PARENCHYMA WITH BLOOD FLOW”

    This information can be used as references when I read other reports.

  • guest

    Had the weekend off huh and now it’s back to business posting meaningless comments just to get your per deim. As I stated, people will read and make up their own mind. Why are you so afraid of anything that opposes the pharma talking point you have? People will read, they will ask questions. That’s what they are suppose to do. If they don’t believe what they are reading they can move on to something else. Informed Consent is a Federal Law. Asking questions in the US is still legal you know.

  • guest

    Please substantiate that comment with data instead of a sarcastic hyperbola.

    Data on how much money and time off from school/work parents save by vaccinating a child or better yet- that study that Congress asked the CDC to do over a decade ago:
    The health status of unvaccinated children in comparison to vaccinated children. Do you have that? Please-an Independent study.

  • guest

    Well you are diseased-body, mind & spirit so that explains your comments here. Nothing to add to the discussion but a lot of nonsense. Obviously you are a troll. The second wave always comes in Monday’s.

  • Whitney Hill

    Hi im Cash’s Mom, I’m telling you right now my son didn’t have a hemorragh of the brain. My son died because nobody would listen to me when I tried to get help for him. People are having some discussion like this is a debate with a (lack of a better word) random topic. When it’s not Cash was my child my son not just some topic to argue about on a blog. All I want is to make people aware so parents don’t have to feel the pain of losing a child. If your so determined to prove that vaccines was not the reason my son died then why are you even on this website. I want my child’s life to be remembered and to have a purpose to save the lives of other children. He was not just some “Random Topic” to argue about online to pass time when your board.

  • Oh no! Can you recommend a naturopathic scam that can heal me?

  • guest

    Hospital medical errors now the third leading cause of death in the U.S.
    http://www.fiercehealthcare(dot)com/healthcare/hospital-medical-errors-now-third-leading-cause-death-u-s

    Deaths by medical mistakes hit records
    http://www.healthcareitnews(dot)com/news/deaths-by-medical-mistakes-hit-records

    Medical errors in America kill more people than AIDS or drug overdoses. Here’s why. http://www.vox(dot)com/2015/1/29/7878731/medical-errors-statistics

    440,000 Deaths Annually from Preventable Hospital Mistakes
    http://www.thenationaltriallawyers(dot)org/2015/01/hospital-deaths/

  • To you, there’s no such thing as an independent study since you claim all doctors are paid shills for the conspiracy. If you were actually interested and honest, you’d have read dozens of such studies by now.

  • Jonathan Graham

    get your per deim

    I’m pretty sure that’s not what you are trying to say.

    Why are you so afraid of anything that opposes the pharma talking point you have?

    The only talking point I have is about rationality: Are people more likely to get an accurate opinion from the bare facts or from someones narrative? Reading a narrative doesn’t give you any information beyond what the author wants to give you. Reading the data – as close to the source as possible allows for a much wider number of interpretations that you can come to on your own. Reading a narrative before reading the raw data frames the study and will bias ones understanding.

    So my talking point is it’s better to simply let people read the information as close to the source as possible. You want to make sure people are prepped to a specific opinion. That’s your thing, I’m just pointing out it’s unethical.

    Almost every vaccine critical site is an exercise in spoon-feeding someone an opinion. Almost as if they’re afraid someone might start thinking for themselves.

  • guest

    You are lucky enough to live in a country that is able to provide the health care that it does, despite the faults it may have.

    The US has the highest costing heath care in the world yet the US is one of the sickest. 1 child in 45 is autistic.

    1 child in 6 is chronically ill- Trends in the Prevalence of Developmental Disabilities in US Children, 1997–2008 CDC.

    The US has one of the highest infant mortality rate in the industrialized world:
    U.S. Infant Mortality Rate Stays High, Report Finds: http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/us-infant-mortality-rate-still-one-highest-developed-world-n404871

    Despite the fact that the US spends the most money of medical care the life expectancy of the average American is 79.68 years, the US ranks 43rd by country in life expectancy.

    A Mayo Clinic study finds that nearly 70 percent of Americans are
    prescribed at least one medication, with antibiotics, antidepressants,
    and opioids topping the list. http://www.healthline.com/health-news/policy-seventy-percent-of-americans-take-prescription-drugs-062113

    America’s New Normal: Chronically Ill Kids: http://fearlessparent.org/americas-new-normal-chronically-ill-kids/

    Information and statistics about invisible illnesses and visible diseases: http://invisibleillnessweek.com/statistics/

    Many chronically ill Americans unable to afford food, medicine: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-chronic-americans-
    idUSBREA0T16X20140130

    ‘Kingdom of the sick’ grows as more are chronically ill
    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/04/10/kingdom-sick-chronic-illness/2067779/

    The Laws of the Pharmaceutical Industry: http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/pharmaceutical_business/laws_of_the_pharmaceutical_industry.htm

    The US (citizens) is a sick country.

  • jacobvk

    I’m sorry, I’m a very skeptical person. Obviously you don’t need to prove anything to me or anyone but on the flip side of that I don’t just take people’s words for it when they claim specific identities on anonymous forums on the internet.

  • guest

    Hello Ms. Hill. I am truly sorry for your loss. Please do not be offended by jacobvl comments or his obvious ignorance. He is a pharma troll. If you are not familiar with their activity on vaccine comment board know this—-what they are saying they get paid to say. Their comments have nothing to do with their lack of understanding about drugs, vaccines or autopsy’s. They are not paid to do anything except what they are doing. There are several on this comment board and they either question the experiences of your loss or they post distracting meaningless comments. Please don’t get upset or stressed over comments like this. They are not worth your time and energy. Again, I am so sorry for your loss.

  • guest

    You really should be ashamed of yourself. Hallmark of a troll—lack of compassion.

  • guest

    Yada yada yada. LET THE PEOPLE GO ———-and read the study for themselves. You are not the gatekeeper of their minds so just step away and stop creating a distraction.

  • guest

    Yea, how about that NO INDEPENDENT STUDIES.

    Never said all doctors are shrill. Never said conspiracy.

    One of the tell tell signs of a troll, when they get backed into a corner they throw out the word CONSPIRACY. At that point any slight creditability you, your current comments and any future comments may have had are moot.

  • guest

    Use of the “naturopathic scam” is another troll throw out phrase to misdirection & distract from the core issues of this article. Learn some new and improved skills.

  • I’ll make sure to write that down for later. There are plenty of studies, but alties like you always come up with more feeble excuses why only mommy blogs and ripoff artists are trustworthy.

  • Jonathan Graham

    …or even sparring with someone.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Lowell changed his post.

  • Sure.

  • Jonathan Graham

    and read the study for themselves

    If you took the time to read what I and others have posted. That’s exactly what we’re arguing for. What you want is to make sure they are prepped toward a very specific interpretation before they do. That’s your thing, I get it but it’s unethical.

    If you agree with us then all you have to do is ONLY post direct links to studies. Problem solved.

  • Jonathan Graham

    But I like the idea of robotic sparring partners. The day they make a robot which can fence at master levels is the day I say: “Take my money!”

  • jacobvk

    The simple fact is that I could change my display name on this forum to Whitney Hill were I so inclined, or Jesse Dewayne Thomas, or if I truly lacked compassion and were a troll I could change it to Cash Dewayne Thomas. This forum is anonymous and anyone can claim to be anyone.

  • Ron Roy

    Your miss-education is showing! Boosting the immune system with naturally occurring vitamin C or E or D3 vs injecting a chemical witches’ brew directly into the bloodstream is like night and day.

  • Ron Roy

    There are somethings that they’re not protected from if you get my drift. Harm my child face my wrath. Use your imagination and get even!

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    You are absolutely right, Whit. This person is a ‘troll’ whose job it is to discredit vaccine injury claims and try to get everyone off topic. You are so brave to stand up to them. I love you, and through you and Cash, other babies will be saved. I think people forget that the children they read about were flesh and blood and that the family reads their response. They think they are just arguing about some random person and say things they wouldn’t have the nerve to say to you in person.

  • donna mills

    Vaccines kill people too. Why would you make an analogy like that? Hypothetical analogy or not–EVEN ONE INNOCENT YOUNG LIFE TAKEN BECAUSE OF NEGLIGENCE FROM VACCINES IS UNACCEPTABLE! But there are many, and the numbers are multiplying SHAY!!
    Or, maybe you agree with Madeleine Albright, and you think “the price is worth it”, referring to all the child casualties from the preemptive military invasion of Iraq–Collateral damage, huh. Well, she can take her collateral damage and put it where the sun don’t shine–and so can you!! GET A LIFE!!

  • shay simmons

    Then you should have no trouble providing documentation of the verified deaths from vaccines over, say, the last ten years.

  • Tiny Hands

    Mom “just knows” it was vaccines? I’m sorry for their loss, as I’m sure it is immense and heartbreaking having a little one. But using terrible science and fear mongering to politicize Cash’s death is a pile of bovine digestive byproduct.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Yes, vaccination works. It have enormous amounts of science behind it and a well defined internally consistent model for immunology. So much so, that every study you’ve posted to show that vaccination doesn’t work ends up demonstrating the opposite.

    Taking vitamins for better disease resistance might as well be practicing witchcraft. It has very little in the way of scientific support and a generally made up and inconsistent model for immunology.

    Science or superstition. Your choice (and by your I mean anyone but Ron Roy who has already chosen “superstition”) :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    So what’s the response here? Can we just make a entirely unsupported response statement and then post links to things we haven’t read too?

    Ron Roy exemplifies what’s wrong with the frequent posters who are vaccine criticial here. The last thing they are interested in is defending their point. It’s just posting links they haven’t read and pretend like the answer is in there somewhere.

  • Ron Roy

    I read my posts and I also post many on Facebook to help enlighten people about the dangers of vaccines.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Sorry the evidence says that you just post stuff with titles that you agree with. For example you posted this: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/01/03/flu-shot-increase-flu.aspx

    But you never read the study because otherwise you would see that it doesn’t support what Mercola was saying at all. But then again I regularly flush things with more knowledge immunology than Mercola.

  • AutismDadd

    That describes the world at large, not just the people you are critical of. You need to practice being objective, you’ve lost that ability, if you ever had it.

  • AutismDadd

    What source of information isn’t biased?

  • guest

    Your online name is meaningless. Your rant is meaningless. You’re still a troll. Maybe if other trolls didn’t up tick you it wouldn’t be so obvious. FYI: There have been a few articles over the years on this site where parents have lost a child or a child has suffered significant vaccine damage. These grieving parents have shared documentation to show what their child was given prior to the life altering event and the only ones who questioned the validity of what the parents as well as the medical information provided were the online operatives otherwise known as trolls. No one expects you to take anything at face value-you don’t get paid for it but the lack of compassion is what stands out. Don’t feel bad and I’m sure you don’t, you’ve just become a member of the club.

  • guest

    First of all, it’s only you that has a bug up his rear end because he can’t have his way. The articles have the links to the studies embedded in them.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Lots of people try and make you see information through a particular lens. However, if you notice I’m the one arguing for providing data closest to the source and “guest” is trying to keep people away.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Re-read. Think. Then post.

  • Jonathan Graham

    it’s only you

    Actually I’m pointing out what another poster mentioned. So you’re wrong there.

    The articles have the links to the studies embedded in them.

    Yes, I know you would much rather have someone be prepped before they read the study. I’m just pointing out that it’s kind of an unethical thing to do.

  • guest

    First: please provide the studies.
    Second:
    “alties like you always come up with more feeble excuses why only mommy blogs and ripoff artists are trustworthy.”

    You have got to come up with not only better insults if you want to get a reaction but also much better excuses.

  • AutismDadd

    Nope. I’ll not follow your dumbass requests. Having read enough of your rants, you’d be wise to take your own advice. The longer your rant the less sense they make. That person that told you you are somehow superior to others wasn’t dressed in a clown suit was he?

  • AutismDadd

    If you were consistent, but you are ranting more and more. Your credibility isn’t what you think it is. I mean really, we see information through particular lenses? Are we not claiming that information on vaccines is manipulated as in OPTICS? You make claims inconsistently about many things, but get defensive about Big Pharma? Seems I’m seeing more emotional responses than rational ones.

  • guest

    How about that-NO INDEPENDENT STUDIES. That’s the point.

    Where in my comment did I say:
    “since you claim all doctors are paid shills for the conspiracy,”?

    Where in my comment did I say: conspiracy?

    Are you familiar with CIA DOCUMENT #1035-960 which gives directions on how to use the media to misdirect and mislead the public via newspaper and other media sources to control the flow of information and to control the messages given to the public.

    The only people on vaccine comment boards that post the word conspiracy or conspiracy theory are trolls.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’ll not follow your dumbass requests.

    Well I know you don’t follow the “think” one. So no surprise there.

    The longer your rant the less sense they make.

    This one was really short. So it made a lot of sense then?

    That person that told you you are somehow superior

    Outside of some modest understanding of math I don’t think I’m superior to anyone generally speaking. Now someone like yourself who can’t even trouble themselves to read a post that’s a few lines long probably does have superiority thing going on in their head. Just sayin’

  • guest

    naturopathic scam
    Another troll give away.

  • Jonathan Graham

    If you were consistent,

    I am, pretty consistent. Sorry to disappoint your imagination.

    Your credibility isn’t what you think it is.

    Dude, it’s the internet nobody has any credibility here.

    I mean really, we see information through particular lenses? Are we not claiming that information on vaccines is manipulated as in OPTICS?

    English please.

    You make claims inconsistently about many things,

    Please cite

    but get defensive about Big Pharma?

    Nope

    Seems I’m seeing more emotional responses than rational ones.

    Probably just you then.

  • guest

    “practicing witchcraft. Science or superstition.”
    SMH & LOL. You guys are really desperate. Is that suppose to make people who are for informed consent, anti-vaxx or or who want choice have a melt down. You are too much man. I don’t even believe your handlers made this one up. Always good to end the evening with a good chuckle.

    “It has enormous amounts of science behind it and a well defined internally consistent model for immunology”

    Please provide the science. You guys always say that just like the celebrity tv doctor talking heads. Please provide:

    independent scientific justification on how bypassing the respiratory tract (or mucous membrane) is advantageous and how directly injecting viruses into the bloodstream enhances immune functioning and prevents future infections?

    an Independent double-blind, placebo-controlled study that can prove the safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    a Independent scientific evidence on ANY study which can confirm the long-term safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    independent scientific evidence which can prove that disease reduction in any part of the world, at any point in history was attributable to inoculation of populations?

    independent scientific justification as to how injecting a human being with a confirmed neurotoxin is beneficial to human health and prevents disease?

    provide scientific justification on how a vaccine would prevent viruses from mutating?

    Independent means no studies not paid for by the pharmaceutical industry via any of their surrogate universities, hospitals, researchers, no HHS, FDA, IOM involvement in the US or Europe sine many studies are now being done across the pond making it difficult to trace the money trail.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You guys are really desperate

    You don’t think that taking vitamins to boost disease resistance is just made up nonsense?

    Please provide the science.

    Are you saying you don’t believe the seroconversion strongly correlates with disease resistance?

  • guest

    If people don’t like how I post—don’t read my comments and don’t respond to them. It’s very simple because you have a choice.
    Choice: the right,or opportunity to choose; option.

    It’s like watching a movie. If you can’t follow it, don’t like it, tired or whatever-change the channel or turn it off. Problem solved.

  • Jonathan Graham

    If people don’t like how I post

    I’m pointing out that your preferred practice of prepping people before they get to see a study is kind of unethical.

    don’t read my comments and don’t respond to them

    …or show you that the better way is to simply post links to studies rather than propaganda articles which have links to studies in them somewhere.

  • jacobvk

    As it’s an anonymous forum I just won’t let attempts to appeal to emotion override reason. If you wanna call that being a troll one simply must wonder why?

  • guest

    You folks are desperate on this comment board. We know the more you post and get people engaged-the more you make. I’m still laughing over the witchcraft comment you made. Here’s something for you to look at:
    Llewellyn’s 2014 Witches’ Spell-A-Day Almanac: Holidays & Lore (Llewellyn’s Witches’ Spell-A-Day Almanac) On amazon

  • guest

    You are preaching to the choir.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You seem to be avoiding the questions and my pretty transparent attempt at conversation by pretending you found something funny.

    Again are you saying that you don’t think the idea of using vitamins to boost disease resistance is just made up nonsense? Also are you claiming that you don’t believe that seroconversion is strongly correlated with disease resistance.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Then you’ll start posting links directly to studies and instead of propaganda sites. Great!

  • guest

    You can’t walk back your obsessive questioning of the autopsy, especially after it was pointed out to you by someone who was quite knowledgeable of the subject matter. You job was to create doubt and you cannot hide behind “I’m a very skeptical person” justification. That’s just BS that no one is buying-except your fellow cohorts.

  • guest

    Avoiding the question? Do your questions pertain to this article?

  • guest

    Preach brother preach!

  • Jonathan Graham

    The pertain to the questions I was asked.

  • guest

    Reading comprehensive is fun.

    Do your questions pertain to this article?

  • AutismDadd

    Denial…no surprise. Quite a childish reaction. Are you an only child or were you the youngest?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Reading comprehensive is fun.

    Grammar and spelling are too.

    I’m pointing out that “guest” asked me a question. Generally speaking, in human conversations this takes priority and since I answered those question it’s reasonable to expect a response.

  • AutismDadd

    Nice try turning tables. Actions speak louder than words. Read your posts and deny you act superior. If you still do its a denial reaction that must be well ingrained. My wife is like that, she goes opposite to anything I say even if its absurd and wrong. I notice this in people. You can manipulate them based on their predictable behaviors.

  • jacobvk

    I don’t need to create doubt, doubt is already there. At best the site linked to here provides anecdotal evidence that vaccines are harmful without actually factually establishing it using flawed post hoc ergo propter hoc reasoning. Any reasonable person should naturally be skeptical but the site attempts to bypass reason with appeals to emotion.

    I also don’t mind being wrong, but I don’t simply take people’s words on anything. I like to be presented with evidence. LiLi did provide plenty of evidence, and I appreciate that. I learned quite a lot, but it doesn’t verify the authenticity of the overall story.

  • “I never said ‘conspiracy!’ Are you familiar with the CIA [conspiracy]?”

    El Oël

  • Jonathan Graham

    I can agree with you when you say something moderately correct. :-)

  • AutismDadd

    Only child or youngest child?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Middle.

  • guest

    Tiny Hands. Tiner mind.

  • guest

    “doubt is already there”
    Only in your delusional mind. Oh, and your paid for cohorts.

  • guest

    Relevance.

  • guest

    SMH

  • Jonathan Graham

    Find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic.

    Then the topic change to injected vaccines vs. vitamins happened with Ron Roy’s post. Not mine. So you perhaps should direct your claims of misinformation at him.

    Create bigger distractions.

    Again, this appears to be not me. You want to turn a response to Ron Roy’s off topic post into something bigger than the usual kind of digression that happens on the internet.

    You completely ignored the questions asked of you

    I simply responded with a framing question. Most conversations allow for clarifying questions even when you are asking for me to explain things. This is simply efficient. If I was talking to someone in my field who, say doubted the provability of work done in the Bitcoin blockchain. I might say: “Well do you, or do you not believe that hashing algorithms are designed to be both deterministic and have a low computational complexity to prove but an exceptionally high computational complexity to invert?”

    That gives me a starting point to direct my argument. So if you want to discuss this, answer my question. Otherwise continue to be obstructionist and try to blame it on everyone but yourself. Either way suits me.

  • jacobvk

    So is everyone who disagrees with you paid to do so? How does that work in your mind, exactly?

  • Tiny Hands

    So science
    Much skeptic

    Very comeback
    wow

  • You and me, both!

  • LiLi

    It’s pretty funny. The page identified jacobvk as some pro-vaccine shill. I am an indirectly paid shill myself, but because I argued with Jakey, the page like all my arguments against him. Reading for content and comprehension is not strong here or people would’ve inferred that I am totally pro-vaccine

  • LiLi

    Natural News articles which cite themselves…

  • Jonathan Graham

    You have a rather impressive amount of patience around trying to communicate the meaning of “intraparenchymal hemorrhage”.

    I’m not even sure if it’s reading comprehension. It’s probably the fact that Googling creates knowledge in a vacuum. It’s just a word with a definition sans all the background knowledge.

    Incidentally I googled “intraparenchymal hemorrhage of” (in quotes just like that) and I was able to find “intraparenchymal hemorrhage of liver” in the seventh hit. So maybe it’s also knowing how to use google better. :-)

  • LiLi

    You’d rather people’s kids died than be autistic like yours?

  • LiLi

    Hey, psst, what did you major in in college? What’s your field of study?

  • LiLi

    I have 3 kids- early 20s and a preteen, and some of my patients have dementia. I actually enjoy trying to make complex concepts simple enough for all levels to understand. I believe Jacob was trolling, though. Can a person be that dense? The dunning-kruger effect is exquisitely demonstrated throughout this group.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’m in a similar spot. I have two myself (5 & 9) and I tutor them in reading, math and computer programming (just for the older one). Teaching them is easily the highlight of my day. In fact tonight I’m giving my wife the night off. So I’m also substitute violin teacher.

    Next to the extreme lopsidedness of their knowledge, what’s interesting to me about the folk here is how absolutely convinced they are. I’ve never seen anyone point to some twenty-subject, animal study which has no disease model and say: “Look of *course* vaccines cause….”. I almost can’t take them seriously.

  • Sonja Henie

    Re: your last paragraph-

    That’s my take on it as well. You have people on these boards who have a lot of education and experience regarding immunizations, and then you have these total pikers who haven’t taken a science course since high school, if then, who think they know it all. They’re always trying to tell the more knowledgeable of us what’s what! It would be funny if they weren’t convincing other people.

    And the black helicopter (conspiracy) people! Gimme a break!

  • Sonja Henie

    Things? That’s the best you can do?

  • jacobvk

    Yes, because there are several different things they could be. Blood clots, air bubbles, etc. So “things”.

  • Mike Stevens

    “(there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus)”

    B. pertussis is a bacterial infection, not viral.
    There is indeed a vaccine for it – what do you think the P in DTaP stands for?

    “According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.”

    That isn’t what Merkel said at all.
    The baboon study did demonstrate that baboons were less likely to become infected.
    And in human studies, the risk of infection is 23 times higher if a child is unvaccinated.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19482753

    What the baboon study showed was that vaccinated baboons may become infected despite vaccination, and that in that situation they may spread the bacterium to others.

    But remember – in humans the unvaccinated are 23 times more likely to get infected in the first place, and transmission from an unvaccinated symptomatic (coughing) child will always be greater than from a vaccinated asymptomatic child without any cough.

    Vaccination makes good sense – it is protective, and even if it doesn’t work it would result in less transmissable infection.

  • guest

    I was wondering when you and the others would show up. Third wave.

    If I typed in virus, my bad. Just falling in line with the others train of thought. Bacteria.

    The pertussis vaccines do not contain pertussis bacteria.
    The Tdap and DTaP vaccines that were phased in during the 1990s don’t
    confer immunity to pertussis bacteria. The vaccines contain pertussis toxoid. Toxoid is the inactivated version of the nasty exotoxin that the bacteria secrete during an infection that causes major damage to the human body. These “acellular” (meaning not whole cell) vaccines also contain pertactin, fimbria, and filamentous hemagglutinin– all of the gook that pertussis produces –in a failed attempt to stop pertussis from sticking to itself and posting up in your throat. Pertussis and pertussis toxin are not the same thing—think of it like the difference between grapes and wine. Do you get arrested for driving after eating grapes? No, you don’t. Because although one is made from the other, they’re not the same thing.

    The pertussis toxin is called an AB toxin because the B-unit (B is for binding) binds to your healthy cells whilethe A-unit enters through the membranes and wreaks havoc. It’s the B-unit that the body can learn to recognize and get some immunity to. The DTaP/Tdap vaccines are for teaching your body to fight when it encounters the B-units.

    But the key fact misrepresented by the media, lawmakers and medical establishment is this: the vaccines can’t fight pertussis until your body is infected and by then it’s too late to stop you from being contagious. There
    is no toxin to fight off–and no B-unit to recognize– until the infection takes hold anywhere from 4 to 21 days after exposure. DTaP
    and Tdap may be symptom-reducing vaccines, but they aren’t designed to
    prevent an infection from happening. They are not transmission-reducing
    vaccines. In fact, the pertussis toxin antibodies are of no use until an infection happens. https://leviquackenboss(dot)wordpress.com/2016/02/19/you-cant-protect-another-person-from-pertussis/

  • guest

    You present no science-just religious dogma

  • Mike Stevens

    Parenchyma in medical speak usually applies to lung tissue.

    In the autopsy report it is listed under “Lungs” – intraparenchymal hemorrhage, severe congestion.
    These are the findings one finds in asphyxiation.

  • guest

    I just worked for a state government. Nothing exciting. I continue to study vaccines and am grateful for verifiable information based on facts not corporate science. I do appreciate your comments on this article.

  • Mike Stevens

    Tragic loss of a child from accidental asphyxia. My heart goes out to the bereaved family and parents.

    I wonder why there was a fund raising appeal – as the case is to be considered by the NVICP, all fees should be automatically paid, including legal fees. That’s how it works, and I don’t think the fees are required up front.

  • Mike Stevens

    I can see how you might think that, but the lung tissue is parenchyma, and the autopsy report states this was lung parenchyma.

  • guest

    Please be specific. Relevance to the article:
    

2-Month Old Infant Suffered Apnea and Died Following 8 Vaccines.

  • Mike Stevens
  • Mike Stevens
  • Mike Stevens

    Just give it a rest.
    Parenchyma can and often does refer to the lung, the coroner wrote following autopsy that he found “Lung: intraparenchymal hemorrhage”, and you have been given many scientific cites indicating this can happen.
    It is a common associated finding in asphyxiation.

  • Mike Stevens

    “the FDA research also tested whole cell pertussis vaccine in baboons,
    and found that it (like the acellular vaccine) failed to prevent infection with pertussis.”

    No, that is an incorrect interpretation – vaccination of primates with DTaP will generally protect against infection. We also know this from human studies, where vaccination is associated with a 23-fold lower risk of infection.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19482753

    The FDA study showed that in some vaccinated baboons, it is still possible to subsequently infect them with pertussis. They will not become ill, but can become colonised and therefore still transmit infection. This may explain why widespread vaccination has not been able to eliminate pertussis and why outbreaks still occur.

  • jacobvk

    Parenchyma in medical speak usually refers to the functional tissue in any organ, not just the lungs.

  • jacobvk

    Yes I gave this a rest more than a day ago. LiLi beat you to this point. But thank you for adding to it.

  • Mike Stevens

    Thank you for correcting your mistake about the vaccine.
    But you don’t need to embark in some face saving exercise of detailing that you now know what is contained in a pertussis vaccine – I am a medical specialist in Infectious Diseases, and I know well enough what is in them.

    I remain perplexed by the thrust of your argument, however. If you truly believe that the vaccine does not prevent infection, but does prevent disease (as it did in the baboon study), then vaccination is still an immensely beneficial thing to get.

  • Mike Stevens

    OK, sorry to be unnecessarily adding to this.

  • Mike Stevens

    “Are you familiar with CIA DOCUMENT #1035-960 which gives directions on how to use the media to misdirect and mislead the public via newspaper and other media sources to control the flow of information and to control the messages given to the public.”

    I wondered why there was so much antivaccine froth around…Now I know!

  • Mike Stevens

    “So the vaccine strain caused the [Disney] outbreak”

    You yourself admitted the outbreak was Genotype 3B (Phillipines strain).
    Measles vaccine is Genotype A.

    It has never been associated with an outbreak, anywhere, ever.
    http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/204/suppl_1/S514.full

  • Jonathan Graham

    The effectiveness of vaccines would seem rather pertinent to any discussion of vaccines potential for harm. No?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Are you familiar with CIA DOCUMENT #1035-960

    Apparently you’re not familiar with CIA DOCUMENT #3411-327

    Because it says you’re wrong.

  • guest

    LOL.. Relevance.

  • guest

    Still waiting.

  • guest

    California measles outbreak possibly linked to Philippines, officials say
    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-measles-idUSKBN0LM1ZC20150218
    “A measles outbreak that has sickened at least 113 people in California after surfacing at a Disneyland resort involves a virus strain that also caused an outbreak in the Philippines, but it is too early to tell if the two waves of
    illness are related, health officials said.”

    1www.eurosurveillance.org
    Surveillance and outbreak report
    A unique measles B3 cluster in the United Kingdom and the Netherlands linked to air travel and transit at a large international airport, February to April 2014
    http://www.eurosurveillance(dot)org/images/dynamic/EE/V21N13/art21425.pdf

    Eurosurveillance, Volume 17, Issue50,
    13 December 2012
    Surveillance and outbreak reports
    Measles virus genotyping an important tool in measles outbreak investigation in Norway, 2011
    http://www.eurosurveillance.=(dot)org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=20340

  • guest

    I don’t wonder why you and the third wave are now commenting on this article. You do have a pattern. A couple of articles ago you and brethren appeared as the third wave and continued to comment even though most people have moved on. You guys appear on cue. Just like bots. If you are here to just post meaningless comments-do get a life.

  • guest

    Finally—-something we agree on. Hallelujah!

  • guest

    Wow. It took you a while to get to that comment. Most trolls use that as a first line of defense.

  • guest

    Back to relevance.

  • A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step…

  • guest

    Another entertaining evening on the web. Seriously Mike. After all we’ve been through. The toll trains, the anti vaxer pejorative that you keep throwing out that’s suppose to upset me or anyone else, the long nights of commenting on blogs other than VacTruth. Why Why Why Mike. Why you do me like this? Why you think like you think Mike. Tell me.

    If you truly think Vaccines work why don’t we MIP. I know a Doctor friend who can hook you up to take all the vaccines you’d like. Maybe even you buddy Orac can lay his hands on some A grade fine vaccines and we can do a challenge. You take the full load vaccine schedule and I’ll watch. This is the ultimate test of faith in vaccines.

    You see I am not trying to stop people from vaccinating-just providing information. So what do you say? Are you the Mike from England? That might make a MIP a little difficult. If so, answer this, why are you involved in a vaccine discussion for a country you don’t live in?

  • guest

    A poet and I bet you don’t even know it.

  • Jonathan Graham

    That’s covered in CIA DOCUMENT #2314-442

  • Jonathan Graham

    Are you saying they aren’t.

  • jacobvk

    How about for novelty you address anything I have actually said? Or is it because you can’t that you feel like you have to resort to ad hominems?

  • LiLi

    Man, politics kind of go over my head. I don’t know all the branches of government, who is responsible for what. I lean really hard on web searches when it comes to learning and trying to understand the electoral process. That and Schoolhouse Rock. I imagine that person that makes there career in that field has a deep fundamental understanding I will never achieve unless I go back to school. I still vote, of course. But nuances elude me. I admire that you are furthering your scope of knowledge. It would behoove you to undertake a formal education in basic cellular biology, anatomy, physiology, and microbiology. All adults should. Perhaps throw in English 1a to learn about recognizing credible sources. Natural News often cited it’s own articles as references. A statistics class would grant you knowledge of putting studies in perspective. Interpreting scientific data and complex theories can be skewed if one has no context. Copying and pasting cherry-picked paragraphs does not impart one with a working knowledge of a vast subject. Good luck. Stay civil. It’s good.

  • AutismDadd

    I think you are lying.

  • I knew that you would not and could not directly answer the question, and you never do. Lets see you back up your statement and outline
    what you feel determines bias in and as to this issue, and as to the information sources? Did I not ask you a direct question, and you refused to answer it.

    And so being that I would consider you as not much more than a block of wood in regard to your specific intellectual capacity and level of honesty here, how is it that you think that you are actually qualified to determine any form at all of, what determines a level of bias?

  • Really? How so?

    Here is some more reading material for you, per chance that you ever actually get around to educating yourself. But we all know that is never going to happen. In your ignorance you are having to much fun just staying a sheeple. So as well go ahead and disclose all of your conflicts of interest; and you know you never have and that you never will. If you had to post using a real identity, you know that we would never see you here again. How much credibility does that actually hold?

    Your Pediatrician Is Making More Off Of Vaccines Than Any Other Service Provided
    http://edgytruth.com/2016/06/21/your-pediatrician-is-making-more-off-of-vaccines-than-any-other-service-provided/#

    Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS) and its Major Causes Part I
    Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS): Major Causes are Known but Ignored
    http://healthimpactnews.com/2014/sudden-infant-death-syndrome-sids-major-causes-are-known-but-ignored/

    Vaccines Market worth $57.8 Billion by 2019
    http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/vaccines-market-worth-578-billion-by-2019-289805011.html

    ALL CHILREN have the RIGHT to not be injected with endless amounts of neurotoxins and vaccine contamination. I will stand on that claim and defend it to my dying last breath. Nothing is more wrong than what goes on with vaccines. No bigger lie has been told as to safety and effectiveness,, and no more greater harm has been done to our populations health and well being, than with vaccines, ever.

    Anti-vaccination pru/victoria/antivaccination-program-offered-to-gifted-children-in-primary-schools
    http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/antivaccination-program-offered-to-gifted-children-in-primary-schools-20160621-gpnzzp.html

    Eugenics Today: How Vaccines Are Used to Sterilize the Masses
    http://21stcenturywire.com/2014/01/14/eugenics-today-how-vaccines-are-used-to-sterilize-the-masses/

  • Why is it that you can not simply reply to a post directly, instead of using that broken up trash that you do? You simply look repeatedly in denial insane, and you quite obviously are.

  • He is what you call a psychic vampire…he is absolutely in denial sick. Obsessed and in denial psychotic would be a more correct terms.

  • Again, why can you not simply reply to a post directly, and without all that cut up trash? You certainly are extra special, now aren’t you. An extra special kind of in denial, and sheeple stupid.

  • Really ? Is that why they had to entirely change the diagnosis of polio, because the vaccine worked so well? And what about all the millions of cases of tumors and cancer caused by the vaccine green monkey contaminant, SV40?

    The Present Status of Polio Vaccines

    Excerpts:

    A full discussion of both these issues can be found in the Polio section of my book The Vaccine Guide. The criteria for diagnosing polio did change when the vaccine was introduced in the 1950s and this change in diagnosis apparently reduced the statistic for the number of polio cases dramatically. Monkey kidney cells are used to produce the oral vaccine and controversy rages about the contamination of OPV with monkey viruses. For a complete review of these issues, see the book. Here is one quote from the book. Dr. Bernard Greenberg, a biostatistics expert, was chairman of the Committee on Evaluation and Standards of the American Public Health Association during the 1950s. He testified at a panel discussion that was used as evidence for the congressional hearings on polio vaccine in 1962. During these hearings he elaborated on the problems associated with polio statistics and disputed claims for the vaccines effectiveness. He attributed the dramatic decline in polio cases to a change in reporting practices by physicians. Less cases were identified as polio after the vaccination for very specific reasons. Prior to 1954 any physician who reported paralytic poliomyelitis was doing his patient a service by way of subsidizing the cost of hospitalization and was being community-minded in reporting a communicable disease. The criterion of diagnosis at that time in most health departments followed the World Health Organization definition: Spinal paralytic poliomyelitis: signs and symptoms of nonparalytic poliomyelitis with the addition of partial or complete paralysis of one or more muscle groups, detected on two examinations at least 24 hours apart. Note that two examinations at least 24 hours apart was all that was required. Laboratory confirmation and presence of residual paralysis was not required. In 1955 the criteria were changed to conform more closely to the definition used in the 1954 field trials: residual paralysis was determined 10 to 20 days after onset of illness and again 50 to 70 days after onset…. This change in definition meant that in 1955 we started reporting a new disease, namely, paralytic poliomyelitis with a longer-lasting paralysis. Furthermore, diagnostic procedures have continued to be refined. Coxsackie virus infections and aseptic meningitis have been distinguished from paralytic poliomyelitis. Prior to 1954 large numbers of these cases undoubtedly were mislabeled as paralytic poliomyelitis. Thus, simply by changes in diagnostic criteria, the number of paralytic cases was predetermined to decrease in 1955-1957, whether or not any vaccine was used. Read more by use of the below link:

    The Present Status of Polio Vaccines (Clearly and obviously the change in polio diagnosis and re-definition right after the vaccine was in use, significantly reduced the polio case numbers, and not the polio vaccine).
    http://www.greatmothersquestioningvaccines.com/uploads/2/8/8/8/2888885/ratner_1960.pdf

    Scientific proof that the known cancer causing SV40 virus, a previous contaminant in the polio vaccine, is obviously either contagious; or the virus is still in the vaccine/s.
    http://www.vacfacts.info/scientific-proof-that-the-known-cancer-causing-sv40-virus-a-previous-contaminant-in-the-polio-vaccine-is-obviously-either-contagious-or-the-virus-is-still-in-the-vaccines.html

    Failure Of The Continued Polio Vaccine Campaign
    http://www.vacfacts.info/failure-of-the-continued-polio-vaccine-campaign.html

  • You should know that doctors have little to no knowledge of what is in vaccines, and even less as to how they work in combined doses as to the synergistic effect. No studies have ever been done, so you and your science so called classes are really nothing but a delusion joke. Just face it. Tell me, how many classes have you taken in regard to vaccines, vaccine ingredients, and their safety? Zero, am I right? Classes on what to prescribe for what, and as to what vaccines to push, that is not science; all that is is-is glorified drug and vaccine pushing.

  • Sonja Henie

    Oh, not that garbage again! All of what you said is bullshyte. Study after study has been posted here on all the topics you’ve brought up.

    I didn’t have any classes on prescribing anything, because I’m a nurse and nurses don’t prescribe.

  • Actually the referenced study, and lets say the studies and the information in that article were correct. Flu vaccines are largely worthless and cause more vaccine risk than potential benefit. So therefore flu shots benefits are not worth the risk of injecting a toxic and contaminated flu vaccine.

    The Currently Failed Flu Vaccine Expose/ With Original Antigenic Sin Study Info
    http://www.vacfacts.info/the-currently-failed-flu-vaccine-expose-with-original-antigenic-sin-study-info.html

  • Actually it is true, so just face it. So you are a sheeple nurse. And I knew that. You have produced zero studies, and quite clearly no epidemiological studies that have not already been shot down.

    And what did they study in those so called and claimed to larger epidemiological, (population based), vaccine safety studies? In fact they only studied one single vaccine, the MMR; and one single vaccine ingredient, Thimerosal. None of the larger epidemiological studies compared vaccinated to entirely unvaccinated. None of the studies looked at the safety profile of the entire CDC vaccine schedule. None of those studies as well looked at the safety profile of giving from 5 to up to 9 vaccines or more to and infant or small child, in a single day and office visit.

    Every one of the larger MMR, and Thimerosal epidemiological studies were clearly COOKED, for the results, period. Found were the use of flawed study designs, use of unreliable data, predetermined outcomes unsupported by the data, and as well major conflicts of interest in the studies funding sources; none of them being independent and nor unbiased.

    VACCINES AND AUTISM – WHAT DO EPIDEMIOLOGICAL STUDIES REALLY TELL US?
    http://www.rescuepost.com/files/vaccines-and-autism-epidemiology-rebuttal.pdf

    Vaxxed: From Cover-Up to Catastrophe Official Website
    http://vaxxedthemovie.com/

  • Jonathan Graham

    No wait. Younger. No wait. Older. No wait Middle.

  • AutismDadd

    At least you are putting in the effort. Can’t fault you for the Hell you call a life .

  • Jonathan Graham

    I knew

    Just keep patting yourself on the back there buddy.

    Lets see you back up your statement

    People who aren’t qualified to make a determination on something. Yet do so. Are by definition acting on a bias. Someone who is unqualified to make a judgement should – if they’re being honest – say “I am unqualified”.

  • AutismDadd

    He’s the King of Denial. Its his first response to everything. He denies he does it too which is hilarious.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I can respond in a single text block. It’s both clearer and more useful to do it the way I do. Which was the way people on many USENET groups did back in the day.

  • Jonathan Graham

    English please. The particular study in question shows near identical breadth of immune response to the tested subtypes when compared to those with natural immunity. If you have a specific comment about that specific study please cite the relevant portions. Or drag your feet about how you don’t have to – since you’re you I can guess what you will actually do. :-)

    Oh and nice to see you stalking me Lowell. I feel so special.

  • Jonathan Graham

    …and yet somehow I manage. Almost as if you’re making this stuff up. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    Here is some more reading material for you,

    The usual Lowell rules apply here. If you want to discuss one paper. Post exactly one scientific paper. Provide a clear, unambiguous hypothesis. Preferably with cites from the linked article. Long lists of links are ignored. Which is why you post them. :-)

  • tamajam10

    Dear Jonathan, I just saw that every single one of your posts have to do with ‘vaccines’. This tells me two things: (1) you are paid to infiltrate legitimate site that actually care about people; and, (2) you don’t care about the people you claim to care about. That makes you the Numero Uno Hypoctrite. Congratulations on my total lack of respect.

  • Sonja Henie

    Lowell, you have managed to totally piss me off. I have posted link after link here on Disqus. My comment history is public; you can look at it. I am through with any discussion with you. Your insults do not facilitate any discussion.

  • Lynn4JC

    Troll. Did you read the article? Vaccines are KNOWN to cause respiratory distress.

  • Or even….I remember witnessing a conversation that went something like this in … middle school, I think?

    ESL student: “Miss, do we use capitals for nouns in English?
    Teacher: That depends. Is it a proper noun? Is it at the beginning of a sentence?

    I stopped paying attention to the conversation after that but it gives you the general idea.

  • I haven’t taken a science course since high school, either.

  • Sonja Henie

    You seem to have learned the material better than some of these people.

  • Well…I certainly paid attention in chemistry and biology class (physics…not so much).

    I think the only difference is that I know that I didn’t keep it too much and I don’t think my ignorance is worth more than the knowledge of people who have actually dedicated their lives to studying this stuff.

  • JGC

    Ron Roy, can you be more specific regarding the meaning of “boosting the immune system”? What exactly does that translate as with respect to a meaningful biological readout, and how can one reliably distinguish between an un-boosted immune system and a boosted immune system–and for that matter, an immune system that’s been boosted too much, potentially resulting in autoimmune disorders?

    As for vaccines containing cells from aborted babies, this claim is false and there are none. Aborted babies are not used in the manufacture of vaccine. Two immortalized cell lines created more than 40 years ago from fetuses aborted due to medical necessity (WI-38 created in 1964 and MRC5 created in 1970) are instead used to culture attenuated viruses used in some vaccines. No intact WI-38 or MRC5 cells remain in the final vaccine formulations, however.

  • JGC

    I’m having trouble parsing your response: I note we do not know the identity of patient zero, and you respond by asking “Who is it?”

  • JGC

    No one’s paws are on any children, CEA: routine vaccination has not been made mandatory.
    It’s true that if you elect not to vaccinate yourself or your children you may not be eligible for employment in some fields (such as in healthcare) and your children my not be eligible for enrollment in public schools, daycare facilities, etc., where you would put third parties at increased risk of infectious disease, but I’m sure you agree that’s just s it should be.
    Surely you’re not arguing that the decisions you make should be consequence free?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Dear tamajama,

    I just saw that every single one of your posts have to do with ‘vaccines’.

    Some of them have to do with math. Just the other day I was explaining to someone how to design a study. I also spend time complaining about some of you and if you go far enough back in my post history you’ll see that my earliest posts are about politics – in particular the restoration of the long-form census.

    This tells me two things

    What happens when one of your observations is incorrect. My guess is you just replace “every single one” with “most lately” and then reach the same conclusion. Why let data drive your decisions?

    (1) you are paid to infiltrate legitimate site that actually care about people

    So, to you it’s impossible that this is simply a hobby for me. Right?

    (2) you don’t care about the people you claim to care about.

    Nonsense.

    Congratulations on my total lack of respect.

    So your prior post where you called me an idiot without a clue – there I HAD your respect?! I’m pretty sure I can do without it either way.

  • JGC

    LiLi? You did notice your cited profile not only does not implicate childhood vaccination as a cause of their pulmonary hemorrhage, but in fact doesn’t mention the word “vaccine” or “vaccination” even once?

  • JGC

    “But the key fact misrepresented by the media, lawmakers and medical establishment is this: the vaccines can’t fight pertussis until your body is infected and by then it’s too late to stop you from being contagious.”

    Which would be an argument that we should return to a whole-cell pertussis vaccine, and not an argument against the safety and efficacy of the DTaP vaccine in specific or against vaccines in gnereal–agreed?

  • JGC

    Relative risk would be pertinent: whether the risks associated with a vaccine are greater than the benefits associated with that vaccine. Efficacy simply allows one to quantify one of those benefits.

  • JGC

    “Vaccines have historically and always will continue to do, MORE harm than good.”

    Lowell, your evidence that vaccines now ,and in the future will, do all-caps MORE harm than good would be what, exactly? Be specific.

    I mean, you do actually have some–right?

  • JGC

    Actually, they rigged it in favor of plaintiff seeking compensation for claimed injuries, enacting a reduced standard of proof for their claims, underwriting of the legal cost of bringing suit without regard for whether they win their case, and by designating multiple table injuries for which compensation is given without the plaintiff having to rove a causal association between the vaccine received and the injuries claimed.

  • JGC

    Your evidence that doctors uniformly have little to no knowledge of what is in vaccines would be what, Lowell?

    I mean, you do actually have some–right?

  • JGC

    “Every one of the larger MMR, and Thimerosal epidemiological studies were clearly COOKED, for the results, period.”

    Your evidence that every large MMR and Thimerosal epidemiologic studies were cooked would be what, exactly, Lowell? Be specific.

    Tell you what: start with Anders’ Hviiid et al “Association Between Thimerosal-Containing Vaccine and Autism”, 2003, and illustrate how that study’s conclusions were ‘cooked’.

  • JGC

    And your evidence that routine childhood vaccination harms, rather than protects, children would be what?

  • LiLi

    Exactly.

  • LiLi

    I doubt this baby died from anything related to vaccination.

  • Jonathan Graham

    As explained I can’t agree with things when you say things that are so patently stupid.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    How did you reach the conclusion that a “vaccine strain” caused the Disney outbreak? There seems to be something missing in your chain of reasoning.

    There was a hospitalization rate of over 10% from the Disney measles outbreak. And apparently one death.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    Especially the children who died from these diseases; they never got them again!

  • Andrew Lazarus

    Not that I want to say anything to support antivax clowns, but Vitamin A is associated with better resistance to measles and better outcomes (given that in the absence of vaccination, measles infection is endemic, I would assume the ‘resistance’ is really subclinical cases), at least in the malnourished. Not as effective as the vaccine, but way ahead of witchcraft.

    You can find this in real journals with a quick Google.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’ve seen RCT’s about treatment http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2845860/ with some evidence of utility. I haven’t read anything about prevention. I’ll take a look later tonight.

    Not that I want to say anything to support antivax clowns

    No worries. Evidence is evidence – there are no sides.

  • Bj

    How many innocent lives need to die before Americans wake up? It is parents responsibility to be informed and protect their children. The same thing is happening to our elderly. They accept whatever they are told by a doctor and end up with 10 medications. This baby was prescribed Zantac? Really? That is ridiculous in and of itself. What a money making proposition for the drug and medical companies. They are making money off the young and old and we are sicker for it and some are dying because of it. Criminal wouldn’t you say?

  • JGC

    BJ, can you offer any evidence at all supporting the conclusion that vaccines (or Zantac, for that matter) are causally associated with fatal apnea in infants?

  • JGC

    I read the article, but it offered no evidence that vaccines are causally associated with chronic apnea.

  • JGC

    What mistake do you believe the medical examiner made, gaela?

  • JGC

    I have. It presents no evidence supporting a casual association between routine childhood vaccination and autism spectrum disorders or other neurodegenerative disorders.

    What do you believe its relevance to this discussion is?

  • JGC

    Herd immunity is not only a real thing, it’s something that can be accurately modeled mathematically. See PMID: 21427399, PMID: 3906406, and PMID:11078115 to get started actually understanding it.

  • guest

    Not real. Just like the Flu death numbers are not real they are based on models. Not real.
    Vaccines were not a part of the observation.

  • guest

    Welcome Lazarus–you’ve finally risen. The third wave has missed you.

  • guest

    You should have been here for the first wave of trolls. By the time the third wave arrives-you guys are just plain boring and boorish.

  • guest

    That is so profound. Has anyone told you that you are deep. Probably not. Is the third wave suppose to be the cleaners or the weak links?

  • guest

    JG., Yea, people figured out his game shortly after his arrival on the other articles.

  • guest

    I appreciate the insights.

  • guest

    You haven’t posted anything comment worthy. Keep trying though.

  • guest

    Tisk tisk tisk–still waiting.
    With all the nonsense comments you’ve made on this comment board you should be able to buy yourself a nice dinner.

  • jacobvk

    From what I’ve seen you don’t respond to the substance of anyone’s comments. Ad hominems are all you have. Is that because your own position is entirely without substance?

  • The survivors of the disease are always so much more talkative than the dead ones.

  • Jonathan Graham

    So again, you’re being obstructionist. Hey it’s your life be as terrible at discussing things as you want.

  • The EVIDENCE is right in front of you in the said and well done analysis of all the largest and most known epidemiological studies on both the subject matters of the MMR vaccine and Thimerosal. You know the same studies that have been used in the federal vaccine court to deny thousands any compensation for the vaccine harm that was done.

    Since 1988, over 17,028 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 27 year time period, 14,602 petitions have been adjudicated, with 4,687 of those determined to be compensable, while 9,915 were dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $3.3 billion.

    http://www.hrsa.gov/vaccinecompensation/data/index.html

    So you simply refuse and ignore the information that is in front of you, and then and simply move the goal posts.

    How about if you start in on these studies? One study, and that is all you have?

    125 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Causation
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/125-Research-Papers-Supporting-the-Vaccine-Autism-Link

    Numerous studies here in the below link, on both aluminum adjuvants and as well heavy metals like Thimerosal in vaccines. Why are they still finding high levels of mercury in the autistic, and when evaluated and treated with biomedical treatment. There are only supposed to be trace amounts of Thimerosal and from the manufacturing process in those killed attenuated vaccines. What steps has the FDA taken to assure that big pharma operates on their honor to only leave trace amounts in those vaccines?

    Vaccine aluminum adjuvant causation of neuroglial activation and neuroinflammation in the brain of patients with autism- Page 2
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-aluminum-adjuvant-causation-of-neuroglial-activation-and-neuroinflammation-in-the-brain-of-patients-with-autism–page-2.html

  • Sonja Henie

    The first refers to vaccines, provided by doctors and paid for either by insurance or the government.

    The second refers to “supplements” sold by woo practitioners, paid for in cold hard cash.

  • JGC, another new trolling shill on the front line. Likely a same person with a new character name.

    Again you have it backwards. If you are so knowledgeable about what training doctors and Pediatricians actually receive in regard to vaccines, then it is up to you to present with the curriculum they actually receive. Do you even have a working knowledge of that issue? Obviously not. If I am incorrect then present with that curriculum and the number of hours of training in all relevant subject categories? Lets see the outline? Then tell me as well what you can refute as to the information in these two articles.

    “Consult Your Doctor” on Vaccines? Medical Doctors Receive Little to No Training on Vaccines in Medical School
    http://vaccineimpact.com/2016/consult-your-doctor-on-vaccines-medical-doctors-receive-little-to-no-training-on-vaccines-in-medical-school/

    Doctors Are No Experts on Vaccines
    http://www.thevaccinereaction.org/2015/11/doctors-are-no-experts-on-vaccines/

  • That is right, I do. Are you willing to educate yourself? Of course you will refuse. I am not here to educate you. You have a brain and honest reasoning power I would assume, so if you are no hell bent on complete denial then you have no excuse for not doing so. You can do and accept honest and independent research just as well as I can and/or anyone else can. Obviously you refuse to. I simply do not have all day to educate you with mile long references posts, and it can already be seen that you have already refused any and all reference material that has been put in front of you to this point.

    Failure Of The Continued Polio Vaccine Campaign, (and with the real history in regard to the small pox vaccine)
    http://www.vacfacts.info/failure-of-the-continued-polio-vaccine-campaign.html

    Scientific proof that the known cancer causing SV40 virus, a previous contaminant in the polio vaccine, is obviously either contagious; or the virus is still in the vaccine/s.
    http://www.vacfacts.info/scientific-proof-that-the-known-cancer-causing-sv40-virus-a-previous-contaminant-in-the-polio-vaccine-is-obviously-either-contagious-or-the-virus-is-still-in-the-vaccines.html

  • guest

    I, like others have responded to you and the others trolls more often than you deserve. 1 child is 6 in the US is chronically ill. 1 child in 45 is on the Autism spectrum. Stephanie Seneff, PhD says Half of All Children Will Be Autistic by 2025 and you and your co-horts have turned this into some kind of sick game on comment boards. Your purpose is to cause confusion to people who are looking for information their doctors and the government will not give them. As far as I am concerned you are as low as a human being can go. Ad hominems–you don’t even know what it means.

  • I could care less if you get pissed off to the point of blowing up and burning up, and/or burn to the ground. I have no respect for pro-vaccine, multiple vaccine pushing and vaccine caused baby killers, and those who deny the vaccine harm done to thousands of infants, children, and as well that destroyed the future of so many families. You have nothing and you have posted no studies, just admit it. Your info game is as in denial worthless as it could ever get.

    Go ahead and as well start with these studies? You have, nothing; and you never will. When you are done with that I can progress onto dozens and dozens more studies that show the harm of vaccines and the vaccine injury and autism connection.

    125 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Causation
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/125-Research-Papers-Supporting-the-Vaccine-Autism-Link

    When you are done with that, then start addressing these subject matters.

    Another Big-Screen Movie Just Released Investigates Vaccines For Autism Implications

    By Catherine J. Frompovich

    Hot on the heels of the CDC-whistleblower and vaccine-fraud-documentary VAXXED, a new feature length film – Man Made Epidemic – made its debut in London (UK) at the Curzon Cinema in Soho on Thursday, June 16, 2016!

    http://www.activistpost.com/2016/06/another-big-screen-movie-just-released-investigates-vaccines-for-autism-implications.html

    About the movie
    http://man-made-epidemic.com/about-the-movie/

    Movie Trailer
    http://man-made-epidemic.com/

    God Does Not Support Vaccines
    http://www.livingwhole.org/god-does-not-support-vaccines/

    Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS): Major Causes are Known but Ignored
    http://healthimpactnews.com/2014/sudden-infant-death-syndrome-sids-major-causes-are-known-but-ignored/

    “Consult Your Doctor” on Vaccines? Medical Doctors Receive Little to No Training on Vaccines in Medical School
    http://vaccineimpact.com/2016/consult-your-doctor-on-vaccines-medical-doctors-receive-little-to-no-training-on-vaccines-in-medical-school/

    Doctors Are No Experts on Vaccines
    http://www.thevaccinereaction.org/2015/11/doctors-are-no-experts-on-vaccines/

    INOCULATED: How Science Lost Its Soul in Autism
    http://www.ageofautism.com/2016/06/inoculated-how-science-lost-its-soul-in-autism.html

    Shocking Report from Medical Insiders

    F. William Engdahl (NEO) : A shocking admission by the editor of the world’s most respected medical journal, The Lancet, has been virtually ignored by the mainstream media. Dr. Richard Horton, Editor-in-chief of the Lancet recently published a statement declaring that a shocking amount of published research is unreliable at best, if not completely false, as in, fraudulent.

    Horton declared, “Much of the scientific literature, perhaps half, may simply be untrue. Afflicted by studies with small sample sizes, tiny effects, invalid exploratory analyses, and flagrant conflicts of interest, together with an obsession for pursuing fashionable trends of dubious importance, science has taken a turn towards darkness.”

    To state the point in other words, Horton states bluntly that major pharmaceutical companies falsify or manipulate tests on the health, safety and effectiveness of their various drugs by taking samples too small to be statistically meaningful or hiring test labs or scientists where the lab or scientist has blatant conflicts of interest such as pleasing the drug company to get further grants. At least half of all such tests are worthless or worse he claims. As the drugs have a major effect on the health of millions of consumers, the manipulation amounts to criminal dereliction and malfeasance.

    The drug industry-sponsored studies Horton refers to develop commercial drugs or vaccines to supposedly help people, used to train medical staff, to educate medical students and more.

    Read more:
    http://nsnbc.me/2015/06/19/shocking-report-from-medical-insiders/

    Vaccine Production With – Human Diploid cells (aborted fetal cell tissue)
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-production-with—human-diploid-cells-aborted-fetal-cell—tissue.html

    Vaccine Contamination
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-contamination.html

    Gardasil-The Flagship Example of the Failure of Vaccine Authorities to Regulate and Assure Vaccine Safety
    http://www.vacfacts.info/gardasil-the-flagship-example-of-the-failure-of-vaccine-authorities-to-regulate-and-assure-vaccine-safety.html

  • Why would I when you can address absolutely nothing in any honesty that has been presented with by me here, so far. Your reply posting is a waste of time to read, and your ability to do anything make endless denial of vast amounts of vaccine truth information and studies are nothing more than the equivalent of nothing better than a pile of rotting trash in a dumpster. Every reply you have ever made on this site is absolutely worthless to anyone looking for the vaccine truth. So instead of making the pro-vaccine side and their disastrous to public agenda look only more evil and entirely in denial insane; perhaps you should just walk away and let someone with more honesty and intelligence, simply take your place

    125 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Causation
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/125-Research-Papers-Supporting-the-Vaccine-Autism-Link

    Another Big-Screen Movie Just Released Investigates Vaccines For Autism Implications

    By Catherine J. Frompovich

    Hot on the heels of the CDC-whistleblower and vaccine-fraud-documentary VAXXED, a new feature length film – Man Made Epidemic – made its debut in London (UK) at the Curzon Cinema in Soho on Thursday, June 16, 2016!

    http://www.activistpost.com/2016/06/another-big-screen-movie-just-released-investigates-vaccines-for-autism-implications.html

    About the movie
    http://man-made-epidemic.com/about-the-movie/

    Movie Trailer
    http://man-made-epidemic.com/

    God Does Not Support Vaccines
    http://www.livingwhole.org/god-does-not-support-vaccines/

    Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS): Major Causes are Known but Ignored
    http://healthimpactnews.com/2014/sudden-infant-death-syndrome-sids-major-causes-are-known-but-ignored/

    “Consult Your Doctor” on Vaccines? Medical Doctors Receive Little to No Training on Vaccines in Medical School
    http://vaccineimpact.com/2016/consult-your-doctor-on-vaccines-medical-doctors-receive-little-to-no-training-on-vaccines-in-medical-school/

    Doctors Are No Experts on Vaccines
    http://www.thevaccinereaction.org/2015/11/doctors-are-no-experts-on-vaccines/

    INOCULATED: How Science Lost Its Soul in Autism
    http://www.ageofautism.com/2016/06/inoculated-how-science-lost-its-soul-in-autism.html

    Shocking Report from Medical Insiders

    F. William Engdahl (NEO) : A shocking admission by the editor of the world’s most respected medical journal, The Lancet, has been virtually ignored by the mainstream media. Dr. Richard Horton, Editor-in-chief of the Lancet recently published a statement declaring that a shocking amount of published research is unreliable at best, if not completely false, as in, fraudulent.

    Horton declared, “Much of the scientific literature, perhaps half, may simply be untrue. Afflicted by studies with small sample sizes, tiny effects, invalid exploratory analyses, and flagrant conflicts of interest, together with an obsession for pursuing fashionable trends of dubious importance, science has taken a turn towards darkness.”

    To state the point in other words, Horton states bluntly that major pharmaceutical companies falsify or manipulate tests on the health, safety and effectiveness of their various drugs by taking samples too small to be statistically meaningful or hiring test labs or scientists where the lab or scientist has blatant conflicts of interest such as pleasing the drug company to get further grants. At least half of all such tests are worthless or worse he claims. As the drugs have a major effect on the health of millions of consumers, the manipulation amounts to criminal dereliction and malfeasance.

    The drug industry-sponsored studies Horton refers to develop commercial drugs or vaccines to supposedly help people, used to train medical staff, to educate medical students and more.

    Read more:
    http://nsnbc.me/2015/06/19/shocking-report-from-medical-insiders/

    Vaccine Production With – Human Diploid cells (aborted fetal cell tissue)
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-production-with—human-diploid-cells-aborted-fetal-cell—tissue.html

    Vaccine Contamination
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-contamination.html

    Gardasil-The Flagship Example of the Failure of Vaccine Authorities to Regulate and Assure Vaccine Safety
    http://www.vacfacts.info/gardasil-the-flagship-example-of-the-failure-of-vaccine-authorities-to-regulate-and-assure-vaccine-safety.html

  • Sonja Henie

    Snort!

  • You are either uneducated to what Blaylock actually puts forth, or you a blatant liar. Which is it? Here come the attempts at false discreditation, 1,2,3; just watch.

    Session 22, The Vaccine Safety Conference: Dr. Russell Blaylock, MD, CCN
    THE CENTRAL ROLE OF IMMUNOEXCITOTOXICITY IN ALUMINUM AND MERCURY-CONTAINING ADJUVANT-TRIGGERED NEURODEVELOPMENTAL AND NEURODEGENERATIVE DISORDERS
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9DkcpEEBPI

    Dr. Russell Blaylock, MD, CCN, video presentation -(same video as above, for an alternate source).
    http://www.vaccinesafetyconference.com/videos.html#BlaylockVideo

    Vaccination and brain inflammation, (Blaylock)
    http://www.heartmdinstitute.com/prevention/immunity/vaccinations/167-vaccines-depression-neurodegeneration-after-age-50-years?showall=&

    Autism Spectrum Disorders and Aluminum Vaccine Adjuvants
    Lucija Tomljenovic, Russell L. Blaylock, Christopher A. Shaw

    Abstract
    Impaired brain function, excessive inflammation, and autoimmune manifestations are common in autism. Aluminum (Al), the most commonly used vaccine adjuvant, is a demonstrated neurotoxin and a strong immune stimulator. Hence, adjuvant Al has the necessary properties to induce neuroimmune disorders. Because peripheral immune stimuli in the postnatal period can compromise brain development and cause permanent neurological impairments, the possibility that such outcomes could also occur with administration of Al vaccine adjuvants needs to be considered. In regard to the risk of adjuvant toxicity in children, the following should be noted: (i) children should not be viewed as “small adults” as their unique physiology makes them more vulnerable to toxic insults; (ii) in adult humans Al adjuvants can cause a variety of serious autoimmune and inflammatory conditions including those affecting the brain, yet children are routinely exposed to much higher amounts of Al from vaccines than adults; (iii) compelling evidence has underscored the tight connection between the development of the immune system and that of the brain. Thus, it appears plausible that disruptions of critical events in immune development may also play a role in the establishment of neurobehavioral disorders; (iv) the same immune system components that play key roles in brain development appear to be targeted for impairment by Al adjuvants. In summary, research data suggests that vaccines containing Al may be a contributing etiological factor in the increasing incidence of autism.

    http://link.springer.com/referenceworkentry/10.1007%2F978-1-4614-4788-7_89

    Journal of American Nutraceutical Association 6: 21-35, 2003.
    Interaction of Cytokines, Excitotoxins, and Reactive Nitrogen and Oxygen Species in Autism Spectrum Disorders, Russell Blaylock, MD* Medical Director, Advanced Nutritional Concepts Ridgeland, Mississippi

    ABSTRACT

    There is growing and compelling evidence that excessive peripheral as well as central immune activation of brain microglia can result in alterations in brain growth and connectivity during rapid brain growth, the so-called “brain growth spurt.” A considerable amount of evidence, presented in this paper, demonstrates the deleterious effects of immune factors, such as cytokines, chemokines, and excitotoxins, when present in excess. The interaction between excitotoxicity, ROS and RNS injury and immune dysfunction is discussed. It is concluded that excessive activation of the brain’s immune system during critical growth periods can occur when vaccines are given as combination vaccines, using schedules that are too close together or by the use of certain live viruses in the vaccines.

    http://www.nutrimedical.com/news.jhtml?method=view&news.id=1084

    Aluminum Induced Immunoexcitotoxicity in Neurodevelopmental and Neurodegenerative Disorders
    Russell L. Blaylock*
    Visiting Professor Biology Belhaven University Theoretical Neurosciences Research, LLC Ridgeland, Mississippi, USA

    Abstract

    A great deal has been learned about the neurotoxicity of aluminum over the past two decades in terms of its ability to disrupt cellular function. Newer evidence suggests that a more central pathophysiological mechanism may be responsible for much of the toxicity of aluminum and aluminofluoride compounds on the brain. This mechanism involves activation of the brainâ € ™ s innate immune system, primarily the microglia, with a release of neurotoxic concentrations of excitotoxins and pro-inflammatory cytokines, chemokines and immune mediators. A large number of studies suggest that excitotoxicity plays a significant role in the neurotoxic action of a number of metals, including aluminum. Recently, researchers have found that while most of the chronic neurodegenerative effects of these metals are secondary to prolonged inflammation, it is the enhancement of excitotoxicity by the immune mediators that is responsible for most of the metalâ € ™ s toxicity. This enhancement occurs via a crosstalk between cytokine receptors and glutamate receptors. The author coined the name immunoexcitotoxicity to describe this process. This paper reviews the evidence linking immunoexcitotoxicity to aluminums neurotoxic effects.

    http://www.geoengineeringwatch.org/documents/Aluminum-Blaylock.pdf

  • Petition for Paul A. Offit, MD to take 10,000 vaccines at one time.

    Dr. Paul Offit, MD writes about vaccine safety, “each infant would have the theoretical capacity to respond to about 10 000 vaccines at any one time (obtained by dividing 107 B cells per mL by 103 epitopes per vaccine).” i.e. that an infant can respond to the challenge posed by the antigens in 10,000 vaccines.”

    If an infant can respond to 10,000 vaccines at one time, certainly Dr. Offit, in his supreme confidence of the safety and efficacy of modern vaccines and the CDC’s Vaccine schedule, would have no reservation about taking 10,000 vaccines himself at one time.
    But you do not have any actual studies done on children and/or any human beings that has ever shown that natural antigen exposure is the same thing as injected vaccine exposure. Just admit it. And certainly with all the toxicity known to be in vaccines and as well as the unresolved issue of vaccine contamination, you surely are not comparing anything at all here that in a rational and honest mind can actually be compared. What you are doing defies any form of human biology and as well all common sense in regard to known human physiology.

    We petition Dr. Paul Offit, MD of Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia to demonstrate his theoretical proclamation that a human being could take 10,000 vaccines at one time by, in fact, taking 10,000 vaccines at one time.

    Should Dr. Paul Offit, MD have reservations about such an action, we petition a smaller dose of 1,000 Vaccines at one time. Vaccines should be chosen from the CDC’s recommended (in some states, mandated) vaccination schedule. Surely, Dr. Offit would have no reservation about receiving 1/10 the theoretical capacity of a human being 1/20th his own weight and size.

    https://www.change.org/p/citizens-of-usa-petition-for-paul-a-offit-md-to-take-10-000-vaccines-at-one-time?recruiter=517312154&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=autopublish&utm_term=mob-xs-comment_share-reason_msg&fb_ref=Default

  • Vaccination is nothing even close to the same thing that occurs with and in regard to naturally acquired immunity to illness. It is time for you to get real.

    Vaccines Cause Chronic Immune System Dysregulation
    https://liveto110.com/vaccinations-cause-chronic-immune-system-dysregulation/

    How Vaccines Dysregulate The Immune System
    http://gdsajj.wordpress.com/2011/08/05/how-vaccines-dysregulate-the-immune-system/

    Autoimmune Disorders Caused by Vaccines
    http://healthimpactnews.com/2012/autoimmune-disorders-caused-by-vaccines/

    How Do Vaccines Work? Immune Mechanisms and Consequences
    http://pathwaystofamilywellness.org/component/option,com_crossjoomlaarticlemanager/Itemid,375/aid,1369/view,crossjoomlaarticlemanager/#sthash.rkJSugBv.dpuf

    Your Immune System, How It Works And How Vaccines Damage It
    http://www.vaccineriskawareness.com/Your-Immune-System-How-It-Works-And-How-Vaccines-Damage-It

    Infant Immunity Part II: Aluminum, vaccines, and fetal brain development, with Dr. Suzanne Humphries
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdSCY7W-BUo

    Warning to Pregnant Mothers – Toxic Dose of Aluminum in the Tdap – Paul Thomas MD, Pediatrician
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VoY6vXEMsU8

    Should Infants be Vaccinated Against Hepatitis B? How Much Aluminum is Safe for Infants?
    http://vaxtruth.org/2012/01/should-infants-be-vaccinated-against-hepatitis-b-how-much-aluminum-is-safe-for-infants/

    Study links vaccine induced immune overload to autism, diabetes, obesity
    http://www.sott.net/article/279911-Study-links-vaccine-induced-immune-overload-to-autism-diabetes-obesity
    http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_30175.cfm

    Self-Organized Criticality Theory of Autoimmunity

    Conclusions/Significance
    Systemic autoimmunity appears to be the inevitable consequence of over-stimulating the host’s immune ‘system’ by repeated immunization with antigen, to the levels that surpass system’s self-organized criticality.

    http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0008382

    Anatomy and Physiology of the Immune System, Part 4
    How pharmaceuticals destroy nature
    http://jonbarron.org/article/anatomy-and-physiology-immune-system-part-4#.UwH0pvldXbY

    Understanding immunity requires more than immunology
    http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v11/n7/full/ni0710-561.html

  • Really? It looks like the science did not go far enough in looking at vaccine contamination in the triggering of autism. It is not just one thing in regard to vaccines that can cause vaccine injury, and not just one thing in regard to vaccines that causes autism.

    And it is not just the MMR vaccine: it is vaccine contamination; it is aluminum adjuvants; it is cytokine immune reactivity after multiple vaccines, and more importantly multiple vaccines and when given in the same day; it is ischemia and ischemic stroke caused by aluminum adjuvants and vaccine induced immune reactivity; it is all of the above and much more.

    I think you are just to in denial lazy to actually educate yourself.

    Vaccine Production With – Human Diploid cells (aborted fetal cell tissue)
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-production-with—human-diploid-cells-aborted-fetal-cell—tissue.html

    Vaccine Contamination
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-contamination.html

    125 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Causation
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/125-Research-Papers-Supporting-the-Vaccine-Autism-Link

  • Why should anyone need to educate you to the information, when you could have easily done that yourself, and before you posted your reply?

  • jacobvk

    You know it’s just the teeniest bit dishonest when you cite a reference’s PhD without acknowledging that her PhD isn’t in a field in any way relevant to biology. Stephanie Seneff has a PhD in Electrical Engineering. Maybe you just didn’t know that. But she did get her Bachelor of Science degree in biophysics in 1968. So just for the record Stephanie Seneff is only a BS in any field even tangentially related to vaccines. The majority of her work and research for the last few decades since she got her BS in biophysics has been in electronics and computer science related fields. It is only recently that she’s shifted her focus to biology. What facts does she have to support the 50% by 2025 claim?

  • The Origin of the 42-Year Stonewall of Vitamin C
    http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/1991/pdf/1991-v06n02-p099.pdf

    Vitamin C and Polio
    The Forgotten Research of Claus W. Jungeblut, M.D.
    http://www.orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v09n16.shtml

    LIPOSOMAL ENCAPSULATED VITAMIN C
    http://www.vacfacts.info/anti-viral—liposomal-encapsulated-vitamin-c.html

    Information on the latest vitamin D news and research.
    http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/

  • Do you have any vaccine safety studies on the combined CDC vaccine schedule? How about some vaccine safety studies in regard to giving a small child fro 5 and up to 9 or more vaccines in a single day and office visit? Without actual safety studies, do you not think that reckless and irresponsible practice is simply, unconscionable? Then they simply deny any vaccine injury harm that is done, in claiming that in no way it could have ever been the load of vaccines, as cause of what they seen happen, right in front of them. SIDS, a dead child; all of it is again and again, simply denied..

  • AutismDadd

    And that’s patently denial

  • AutismDadd

    Right out of the shill manual

  • JGC

    Did you evrn read the citations I offered before dismissing herd immunity as ”Not real”? Herd immunity immunity isn’t based on models: it:s something we observe directly which is understood sufficiently well that it can be modeled.

  • JGC

    AD, what in my post is not accurate?

    Is the NVICP court’s standard for proof not less rigorous than in a non-NVICP litigation?

    Are the plaintiff’s legal costs not paid by the NVCIP regardless of the they win or lose their action?

    Does the NVICP court not award damages for table injuries which do not require the plaintiff demonstrate vaccines caused the table injury claimed?

  • JGC

    You mean lie the IOM report “Childhood Immunization Schedule and Safety: Stakeholder Concerns, Scientific Evidence and Future Studies”, January 2016?

    Exactly what ” vaccine injury harm done” do you believe is being simply denied, and how have you determined that harm is actually being caused by vaccination? Be specific.

    If it’s SIDS, exactly what evidence demonstrates routine childhood vaccination is causally associated with SIDS?

  • JGC

    Lowell, can you offer any evidence that takes the form of a peer reviewed first or second tier peer reviewed journal article in support of your claims? Those are after all the forum in which working svuentists present their data and defend the concusions they draw from it–not YouTube videos, not antivax websites like vaxtruth and healtjimpactnews, etc.

  • JGC

    You’re going to have to define “the same thing” before I can answer fully, but in one respect it’s obviously not the same thing: its orders of magnitude safer to develop s protective titer via vaccination than it is by contracting the infectious dfisease itself.

    Re: a
    “All the toxicity known to be in vaccines”, what toxicity is that? What ingredients found in vaccines are known to be toxic at exposure levels achievable by routine childhood vaccination? As always, be specific.

  • JGC

    Again
    None of these offers evidence demonstrating s causal association between routine childhood vaccination and ASD’s.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Why would I

    Thanks for admitting that you have no intention of discussing things. I think your post should warn people that you’re just a troll.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Yawn, I’ll just point out that right *here* https://disqus.com/home/discussion/vactruth/2_month_old_infant_suffered_apnea_and_died_following_8_more_vaccine_doses/#comment-2745614797

    Lowell admits that he isn’t interested in discussing things.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I haven’t asked them for anything but an answer to the question to help frame further discussion. Surely that isn’t too much. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    Again, when you say sensible things I’ll agree with them . When you say silly things I won’t. That’s not denial in any clinical sense. So please quit your bullying.

  • You forgot basic chemistry. Compounds aren’t elements as NN thinks they are.

  • guest

    Not real.. A model.

    Provide an INDEPENDENT double-blind, placebo-controlled “HUMAN STUDY” that can prove the MYTH of herd immunity.

    Otherwise you and the others are just blowing smoke.

  • guest

    You know it’s just the teeniest bit dishonest when you cite a
    reference’s PhD without acknowledging that her PhD isn’t in a field in
    any way relevant to biology.

    What is your PHD in? Please post.

    Typical troll character assassination tactics of not discrediting the information but attacking the person who provides it. Discredit her studies because unless your credential are superior to or even equal to hers, you are blowing smoke.
    This is right out of the Saul Alinsky had book.

    I look forward to seeing your credential which I will research for validity.

  • jacobvk

    Character assassination? No. But here is a simple question. Does a PhD in electrical engineering make someone qualified to comment on nutrition, vaccines and autism? Obviously no degree is required to hold an opinion and form beliefs, however how does a PhD in electrical engineering and a Bachelor of Science degree in biophysics from 1968 make her opinions and beliefs any more valid than anyone else who doesn’t have any degree in any relevant field?

    Character assassination would be if I claimed she was knowingly and willfully being deceptive or was a troll or was in the pockets of nutritional supplement companies. I’m sure she’s a nice enough person, I don’t know her. I’m sure she believes everything she says. MIT seems to have a lot of respect for her, however that doesn’t change the fact that her PhD is in Electrical Engineering and that the only biology degree she has is a Bachelor of Science degree in biophysics which she earned back in 1968. That’s not character assassination, that’s perspective.

    I haven’t attempted to discredit her studies, what I have done is pointed out that her recent studies are outside of the scope of any field in which she has been significantly trained. She could be right but if her conclusions are far outside of the mainstream, and they are, the fact that she’s drawing conclusions outside of any field in which she has received any significant and recent training suggests that her conclusions should be taken with a grain of salt not believed because she has a PhD. What she has that PhD in is relevant.

  • JGC

    You must be aware it would be unethical to conduct such a study?

  • guest

    Your PHD please that can be validate. Again you post a meandering comment without addressing the question which is:
    Your academic credential that qualifies you to dismiss the studies of a well know PHD who has studied at one of the most prestigious schools in the US.

    Everything else you’ve posted is just a distraction

    I look forward to reading about your academic credentials.

  • jacobvk

    I don’t have a PhD but you have to focus on me (another example of an ad hominem) and ignore the actual substance of everything I have said, again, don’t you? I take that to mean I have made a valid point.

  • guest

    Ah, the standard troll/medico fall back position of it’s unethical to do such a study. This is the same meme that the CDC has been pushing for over a decade when they are challenged to do a comparison of health status of unvaccinated children to vaccinated children. You know what they said. They couldn’t do the study because of Broccoli.

    VACCINE BEAT #3: Why Won’t CDC Do the Study?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-USEUgJxQU

    CDC says it will be hard to find 50,000 unvaccinated children. The Late Dr. Mayer Eisenstein practice has over 150,000 unvaccinated children. Also, the CDC admits that there are over a million unvaccinated children so what’s the problem?

    Studies are not valid because the whole idea is just an EPIDEMIOLOGICAL CONSTRUCT. In other words—-NOT REAL.

  • guest

    Lets be clear about your continual use of the phrase-ad hominem.

    Asking YOU to qualify your comments with substantiating information is not a personal attack which is what an ad hominem is. You dismiss a well respected PHD scientist’s work based on “your” perceived notion that she is unqualified to present such information yet YOU are not a PHD by your own admission therefore You are not engaging in substance but character assassination. Discredit the information. This is just as bad as trolls discrediting information because of the blog it was posted on.

    You initiated the character assassination on Dr. Seneff so please provide scientific information that discredits her work. It’s about the work.

    FYI-if I go ad hominem on you, there will be no doubt. However, you’re just not that important for me to get all worked up over. If you want to continue in this bantering back and forth-I’m in because it gives me the opportunity to post more internet troll tactics of misinformation for others to read and learn about.

  • jacobvk

    Let’s not pretend like you aren’t trying to discredit me personally so that you can feel comfortable not addressing any points I have made. The notion that one needs a PhD to recognize that electrical engineering is a field completely unrelated to nutrition, vaccines and autism is absolutely ridiculous. I would not want to be operated on by a surgeon whose only credential is a PhD in electrical engineering. Just for example. I’m sorry but PhDs aren’t interdisciplinary like that.

    Obviously a PhD in electrical engineering is impressive and if she were writing papers on artificial intelligence or super computers or the mars rover that PhD might mean something but you’re talking about work in fields for which her only relevant degree is a bachelor of science that she got in 1968. Electrical engineers don’t learn a lot of biology and she didn’t get any other biology related degrees.

    Not to mention the majority of biology related training she did get was back in the late 1960’s. How is all of this information not relevant because I don’t have a PhD? These are inconvenient truths for which you feel your only recourse is to discredit me personally. Textbook ad hominem attack.

  • Tiny Hands

    I did read the article. How often are they known to cause respiratory distress? Please cite.

    Don’t tell me to do “my own research”, because I’ve done quite a bit of that already.

  • jacobvk

    Let’s not pretend like you’re attempting to do anything other than discredit me personally. This notion that I must have a PhD to recognize that a PhD in electrical engineering is unrelated to fields of nutrition, vaccines and autism is patently ridiculous. I, personally, wouldn’t want to be operated on by a surgeon whose only credential is a PhD in electrical engineering. Just for an example. PhDs are impressive and require a lot of work to obtain but they’re also very specialized and don’t translate to other unrelated fields. Electrical Engineering is not a field that requires one to learn about nutrition, vaccines or autism.

    Obviously her PhD in electrical engineering is an impressive accomplishment, and were this discussion about artificial intelligence, robots, supercomputers or heck a Mars Rover her professional opinions would carry considerably more weight. She does have a PhD in relevant fields of research to those topics. However her most relevant degree to subjects about nutrition, vaccines and autism is a Bachelor of Science degree she acquired back in 1968. These are simply inconvenient facts that you cannot address directly so you resort to, instead, attempting to discredit me personally. That is textbook ad hominem attack.

  • JGC

    It’s not a fall back: it’s the ethical reality. To conduct a herd immunity study in a randomized double blinded fashion would require the investigators deliberately place the un-vaxed cohort at significantly increased risk of contracting a serious infectious disease.

    In fact, it’s unethical whichever side of the vaccine safety fence you’re on: if vaccines are safe an effective, you’re placing the un-vaxed cohort at increased risk of infection. If as the anti-vax side claims vaccines are not safe and effective, you’re placing the vaccinated cohort at increased risk of experiencing a vaccine injury.

    “so what’s the problem?”
    No problem, if you’re conducting a retrospective epidemiologic study. That isn’t what you’re asking for however, you’re asking to enroll unvaccinated children into a prospective study and randomly assign them to be vaccinated or left unvaccinated.
    How many parents of those unvaccinated children in Dr Mayer’s practice would allow their children to enroll when they know there’s a 50/50 chance those children will be vaccinated?

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    No, you are wrong! There are filing fees, fees to get medical records and expert witness fees. (an expert pathologist will re conduct the autopsy through preserved slides and other records). The money that is donated will go straight to the attorney. Eventually, the court will refund the money which will go back into a fund to help others who in our situation. That was a very good question. Thank you for asking.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Can you offer any EVIDENCE that it’s not?

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Actually, the first step to gathering scientific evidence is observation. Who observes a baby closer than a mother for changes in baby’s health or demeanor? If you poisoned a living being and watched it die, you would not have all the cold hard facts, but you would say “hmm…I gave it poison and it died..perhaps it died from the poison”.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Did you read the package inserts from the manufacturers that list apnea as a known adverse reaction? Or are you arguing with the pharmaceutical company?

  • JGC

    Which package inserts would those be? Let’s look at the actual text. Pediarix, for example, does not identify apnea as a known adverse reaction. The entire adverse reactions section is as follows:

    Common solicited adverse events following any dose (≥25%) included local injection site reactions (pain, redness, and swelling), fever (≥100.4°F), drowsiness, irritability/fussiness, and loss of appetite.

  • JGC

    this is a POE, right?

  • Tiny Hands

    If one viewed vaccines as poison already, it would seem the conclusion was in the premise. Not much inquiry required.

  • Mike Stevens

    I see that, thanks.
    The filing fee for a complaint is $400, and there may be upfront legal fees.
    But these will be reimbursed, so it behoves you and the people raising/collecting money to be quite clear about this, and be explicit about where the reimbursed money will end up.

  • Mike Stevens

    Also…
    Note the lack in awareness about the distinction between “adverse reaction”, and “adverse event”.

  • Sonja Henie

    “Go Fund Me” has made it so much easier for charlatans to take advantage of well-meaning people.

  • Jonathan Graham

    But of course you actually do not have any actual studies done on children and/or any human beings that has ever shown that natural antigen exposure is the same thing as injected vaccine exposure.

    Actually Ron Roy dug one up. I’d point it out but then you would just deny and then refuse to explain your denial. Because as you admitted to me earlier you aren’t interested in discussion. :-)

  • imho

    Actually Bj, it’s called informed consent and the physician didn’t give enough information for the parent to choose to give consent or refuse. The article quotes the Mother, “If I was told either of these vaccines could kill my baby, Cash would still be here, because I would have said no to them.” Frankly, without compassion who has an opinion? This was a stressful birth experience but why were the “awake” people dumb and mute until after the tragedy?
    My heartfelt condolences to this family.

  • AutismDadd

    NVICP is meant to pacify the public while protecting Vaccine makers. It achieves one of the 2

  • AutismDadd

    Yawn what nonsense

  • AutismDadd

    Its a no fault system clown. Why would there be anything but minor details to work out? Table injuries are as close to admitting vaccine cause as anything you can wring out of these turds. And why shouldn’t legal costs be paid with the .75 charged to parents on each vaccine?

  • AutismDadd

    Why read junk science? We’ve read enough already.

  • AutismDadd

    You must be dumb. Its obvious

  • AutismDadd

    lame

  • AutismDadd

    Read it? these Vaxxers are victims of it.

  • AutismDadd

    Crapola made up off the top of your head.

  • AutismDadd

    Yep the WOO is strong in J Graham

  • AutismDadd

    Quit bullying the guy already

  • AutismDadd

    Shill Manual. J Graham’s is signed by Paul Offit

  • AutismDadd

    Go away

  • AutismDadd

    Blathering at its best

  • AutismDadd

    Over stimulation also occurs from the unnatural assault through injection. It why we see weakness, fainting, seizure, anaphylactic response and death that could be called a spectrum of over stimulation.

  • AutismDadd

    Wrong. What an asinine comparison.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You’re responding to the wrong person on this thread.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Harass people elsewhere.

  • You are the one making the claim that something exists – it is your responsibility to prove it.

    Otherwise, anyone could claim anything:

    1+1 = 10000000000000000000000000000000000! Prove it doesn’t!

  • JGC

    The original intent behind the creation of the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program was twofold, but not with the goals you suggest. They were instead 1) to compensate victims and families of victims who suffered a vaccine injury as the result of receiving a vaccination covered by the act by creating a no fault system to resolve vaccine injury claims and 2) to ensure the continued availability of vaccines (such as the DPT vaccine) critical to public health.
    The NVICP courts employ the civil law standard of proof (preponderance of evidence), provide compensation for table injuries where no necessity to prove causation is required, and pay the legal costs of litigants whom file for compensation, making it far more plaintiff friendly than bringing suit through the existing court systems ever were.

  • JGC

    Court awarded compensation for table injuries represent a settlement, and no finding is made that the vaccine caused the injury claimed.
    You’ll also note that not only are autism spectrum Disorders not included on the list of table injuries but that the court has never awarded compensation for developing an ASD.
    I haven’t argued that legal costs should not be paid, only noting that the fact they are makes the NVICP proceedings extremely plaintiff friendly.

  • JGC

    AD, I’m slowly realizing it’s useless to attempt any discussion with you. Clearly one wastes one’s time trying to explain something to you–to make progress it would have to be possible to understand it for you as well.

  • guest

    Really?

  • Whitney Hill

    Which package insert would it be in that explain what a subnormal ignoramus is I can’t find oh wait let me Google it………… I found it. Don’t know do your own research!

  • guest

    It’s a fall back position, not real, not based on any real science and simply doesn’t exist because as I stated Vaccines were not a part of the observation. It’s a made up myth–kinda like Reality TV.

    Here’s an example again of what real scientist say about medical models:

    Flu model deaths have already been posted but if you forgot—
    “Top scientists from the University of Ottawa and around the
    world are on the record for stating the estimated deaths due to
    influenza are completely inaccurate and based on deeply flawed computer models. While Health Canada estimates between 2000-8000 Canadians die from the Flu and related illnesses every year, the true number lies somewhere closer to 400 per year.
    http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/flu-deaths-reality-check-1.1127442

    Medical model showed that Polio would ravage the US in the 1950 but instead after the vaccine the number of Polio cases increased. This was confirmed by Jonas Salk and the CDC:

    In 1976, Dr Jonas Salk, creator of the killed-virus vaccine used in the 1950’s, testified that the live-virus vaccine (used almost exclusively in the U.S. from the early 1960’s to 2000) was the “principal if not sole cause” of all reported polio cases in the U.S. since 1961 (Washington Post,September 24,1976). The virus remains in the throat for one to two weeks and in the feces for up to two months. Thus, vaccine recipients are at risk, and can potentially spread the disease, as long as fecal excretion of the virus continues ( American Academy of Pediatrics, Report of the Committee on Infectious Diseases:1986(Elk Grove Village, Illinois: AAP):284–5.

    -In February 1992 the Federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) published an admission that the live-virus vaccine had become the dominant cause of polio in the United States (Strebel PM., et al. Epidemiology of poliomyletis in U.S. n 1992, one decade after the last reported case of indigenous wild virus associated disease, Clinical Infectious Diseases CDC, February 1992:568–79). In fact, according to CDC figures, every case of polio in the U.S. since 1979 was caused by the oral polio vaccine (CDC reference above) Authorities claim the vaccine was responsible for about eight cases of polio every year (Institute of Medicine. An evaluation of poliomyelitis vaccine policy options.IOM Publication 88-04(Washington DC: National Academy of Sciences,1988). However, an independent study that analyzed the government’s own vaccine database during a recent period of less than five years uncovered 13,641 reports of adverse events following use of the oral polio vaccine. These reports included 6,364 emergency room visits and 540 deaths (Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS), Rockville, MD. & IOS. The Polio vaccine coverup COPV Vaccine Report: Document #14. http://www.ios(dot)com/~w1066/poliov6.html)
    Public outrage at these tragedies became the impetus for removing the oral polio vaccine from immunization schedules (Strebel PM., et al. Epidemiology ofpoliomyletis in U.S. one decade after the last reported case of indigenous wild virus associated disease, Clinical Infectious Diseases CDC, February 1992:568–79)

    Medical models are deeply flawed and useless. Ebola was suppose to sweep across the US, it didn’t. H1N1 death rate was based on a model and the vaccine caused more damage than the Flu. I read countless article since the number of outbreaks of childhood illness have been traced back to vaccine strains, Doctors going on record in articles say the CONCEPT of herd immunity. Not real. Mythological. Construct. Fake.

  • guest

    “I’m having trouble parsing your response”
    Too many mercury & aluminum laden vaccines grown on aborted fetal cells with the DNA still intact-maybe?

  • guest

    “Let’s not pretend like you’re attempting to do anything other than discredit me personally.”

    I don’t know you personally. The statement you made makes you sound paranoid.

    Are you a scientific researcher? No. So what would qualify you to asses the intellectual knowledge of a PHD scientist-regardless of what her degrees are in. Are you honestly saying that a researcher cannot research anything outside of the degrees that they academically earned? To even suggest this is disingenuous and indulging in hypocrisy.

    Here’s an example:
    Paul Offit. You know who he is. He is held up as an expert on Autism. What causes it and what doesn’t. YET, he doesn’t treat Autistic children and they have never been part of his medical practice.

  • JGC

    Let me try to explain how this is supposed to work to you, Whitney:

    You make a claim–that vaccine package inserts list apnea as a known adverse reaction.

    To the best of my knowledge they do not, although I’m aware that some vaccine package inserts (such as Pediarix) mention apnea following inoculation but not as an adverse reaction and only as having been reported in infants born prematurely. But you’re correct, though, and apnea is a adverse reaction associated with some vaccines, I’d certainly like to consider that information and possibly revise my understanding of the safety and efficacy of vaccination.

    So I do the reasonable thing and I ask you to identify which package inserts you’re speaking of. The reasonable next step would be for you to identify them, supporting your initial claim.so I can see the evidence myself and possibly change my position re: vaccine safety.

    That’s how it’s supposed to work (it’s called “an intelligent discussion”).

    And your response? Name calling and an admonishment I do my own research, which I can only take as an explicit admission you are also unaware of any vaccine package inserts that identify apnea as a known adverse reaction to inoculation.

  • JGC

    No, you’re just failing to communicate your meaning clearly.

  • guest

    Thank you for correcting your mistake about the vaccine.

    Dear Mike:

    Apology-hardly. Your perplexed because you are paid to be perplexed. But not really.

    “I am a medical specialist in Infectious Diseases, and I know well enough what is in them.”

    Yes, all of you guys are experts in infectious disease, nurses, scientific experts etc. Although I have heard rumor you are an MD. Yet, I found it PERPLEXING a year or so ago on a comment board where you argued with a blogger who stated there was no diagnostic test for Tetanus and that blogger pointed you to the CDC’s own webpage that clearly states there is no diagnostic test for Tetanus. Now why wouldn’t an infectious disease specialist not know that considering there is a vaccine for Tetanus?

  • guest

    Honest to heavens I would like to see the studies that confirm that Vaccines are 100% safe and effective. That vaccines work. Please post links ASAP.

  • JGC

    I’m having trouble again trying to understand what point you’re trying to make–nothing in your response addresses what we were discussing–the ethicality of conducting a prospective vaxed versus un-vaxed study. It doesn’t argue that herd immunity is not a phenomena we directly observe to occur or that can be accurately modeled mathematically.

    I’m aware of no epidemiologic model that predicted Ebola was supposed to sweep across the US as part of the most recent outbreak in Africa–which one are you speaking of?

    I’m also aware of no outbreak of an infectious disease that has been caused by a vaccine strain virus–again, which outbreaks are you speaking of?

  • 100%? They’re not. No medicine or procedure is.

  • JGC

    Well, if you’re going to do something you should try to do it right /sarcasm

  • JGC

    AD, I’m ready to believe you’ve read far more than enough junk science to arrive at your beliefs re: vaccine safety and efficacy. That’s why I’m trying to offer citations to real science–articles published in peer-reviewed journals.

  • No. That would be a fake study.

    However, can you point me to a study that says the VPDs are 100% safe and effective?

  • guest

    CDC’s Dr. Ann Schuchat daily briefing to the public. Easily found on the CDC’s website. You’ll need to start in 2014 until the official end date in April 2015.

    “There was a hospitalization rate of over 10% from the Disney measles outbreak. And apparently one death.”

    Please provide substantiating data on that? If you are referring to the woman in Washington State-she died from Giant Cell Pneumonia. Measles were discovered after her autopsy. She was FULLY VACCINATED According to the Washington State Health dept & her mother. She was immunocompromised suffering from other illnesses. She was also asymptomatic and reports stated she was infected at a clinic she was being treated at. Of course no one can ever say for sure. It’s also been reported she didn’t have the Disney strain.

    The Associated Press reported on July 3 that the Clallan County woman had received the measles vaccine as a child. The AP report quotes Dr.Jeanette Stehr-Green, the Clallam County health officer, as saying that “the woman had been vaccinated as a child, but because she had other health problems and was taking medications that interfered with her response to an infection, she was not protected.”
    “Moyer D. Measles led to death of Clallam Co. woman; first in US in a dozen years. Washington State Department of Health July 2, 2015.”

    Catherine J. Montantes, 28, had a rare inflammatory muscle disease called dermatomyositis but it left her severely immunocompromised. Pneumonia is a adverse reaction to any illness that suppress the
    respiratory system. It is an opportunistic illness. The causes are many
    including vaccines. A person can break a leg, develop pneumonia or
    have surgery, a bad chest infection, car accident, fall down stairs etc.
    The causes are many. Giant Cell Pneumonia is particularly aggressive. This is the same type of pneumonia that young man in England died from who was also diagnosed as having measles after he was autopsy. Giant Cell Pneumonia.

    “He was said to be vulnerable to infection as he had begun a detox two weeks before his death after suffering from alcohol problems.

    Consultant pathologist Dr Maurizio Brotto said at 5ft 8in, Mr Colfer-Williams was ‘very underweight’ weighing just 7st 7lbs. DM

    Giant Cell Pneumonia is an opportunistic illness, rare, but it can manifest from any illness, especially if a person has a supressed immune system.

    In their March 20th report, CDPH made the following statement

    “The outbreak will be considered over when 42 days have elapsed
    from the end of the infectious period of the last known B3 measles cases that was a not a new importation. As of today, that date will be April 17, 2015.”

    Today, April 17th, no new measles cases have been found in California (the new measles case outside of California was reported on March 3rd). CDPH has now made our unofficial prediction official.

    http://www.rescuepost.com/.a/6a00d8357f3f2969e201bb081f4025970d-pi

    Please don’t forget to provide link to the number of hospitalizations, how many, what state and when.

  • guest

    I responded to this so I’ll guess I’ll send it to jeffrey to make sure it stays posted:

    The source of the initial Disney theme park exposure has not been
    identified. Specimens from 30 California patients were genotyped; all
    were measles genotype B3, which has caused a large outbreak recently in the Philippines, but has also been detected in at least 14 countries and at least six U.S. states in the last 6 months.

    Public Health Canada reports that 5 of the Quebec cases were genotyped and were also genotype B3.

    -The Philippines recorded 57,564 suspected cases of measles, including 21,403 confirmed cases and 110 deaths from January 1 through December 20, 2014.
    http://outbreaknewstoday.com/philippines-measles-strain-genotype-b3-found-in-california-patients-86538/.

    There are a lot more.
    -Philippines measles outbreak 2014: 58,010 cases, 110 deaths
    http://outbreaknewstoday.com/philippines-measles-outbreak-2014-58010-cases-110-deaths-31292/

    Niagara measles cases now at six: http://outbreaknewstoday.com/niagara-measles-cases-now-at-six-32008/

    Eurosurveillance, Volume 17, Issue 37,13 September 2012
    Rapid communications
    Ongoing African measles virus genotype outbreak in Tel Aviv district since April, Israel, 2012 http://www.eurosurveillance.org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=20272

  • Proponent

    What does ‘hyperbola’ mean, guest?

    … …

    I’m thinking.. you might be talking out of your usual orifice that you employ in these discussions, and.. preceded by some smoke that you blew up there yoursownself.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    The woman who died was immunocompromised, rendering her childhood measles vaccination irrelevant. Lurkers: Guest has kindly demonstrated one of the less-pleasant aspects of the anti-vaccination movement. They don’t care about the chronically ill (AIDS, chemo, etc.). Measles and other vaccine-preventable diseases should be revived as a way to cull the herd of these losers! (I am somewhat lost at the “underweight” claim, irrelevant as it is: 7 stone 7 is 105 lbs., quite reasonable for a small woman.)

    As for hospitalization,

    During January 4–April 2, 2015, a total of 159 measles cases (in 155 U.S. residents and four foreign visitors) from 18 states and the District of Columbia were reported to CDC (Figure 1). Patients ranged in age from 6 weeks to 70 years; 26 (16%) were aged <12 months, 18 (12%) were aged 1–4 years, 27 (17%) were aged 5–19 years, 58 (36%) were aged 20–39 years, and 30 (19%) were aged ≥40 years. Twenty-two patients (14%) were hospitalized, including five with pneumonia. [emphasis added]

  • Mike Stevens

    “I found it PERPLEXING a year or so ago on a comment board where you
    argued with a blogger who stated there was no diagnostic test for
    Tetanus and that blogger pointed you to the CDC’s own webpage that
    clearly states there is no diagnostic test for Tetanus. Now why
    wouldn’t an infectious disease specialist not know that considering
    there is a vaccine for Tetanus?”

    Not sure where that is meant to have come from, other than clear misunderstanding on the part of the antivaxer. Tetanus is one of those diseases that is so characteristic that it can be diagnosed clinically, if one has the experience. Tests for the offending bacteria may be rather hit and miss. Of course, antibodies will rise in response to primary infection, so these can be used sometimes in retrospect.
    As to the post specifically- I’ll take your “word” for what I supposedly said only when you provide a link to the original comment. Please do so.

  • Mike Stevens

    “Apology-hardly.”

    Saying “My bad”, as you did, is usually taken as an acknowledgement that you made an error.

    If you are trying to pretend you didn’t, and were not correcting your blooper of calling B. pertussis bacterium a “virus”, then I guess I’ll have to say “my bad.”

  • guest

    I admit an use of the wrong word-an error if you like. I’m a grown up, I can admit it. Error- an action or speech or in this case print.

    If you need to hang on to distorted characterizations ==please do. Childish behavior for an adult man but-hey whatever gets your mojo going. Join us.

  • Mike Stevens

    Now that little diversion is past, do you want to address my question? It was, to remind you:

    If you truly
    believe that the vaccine does not prevent infection, but does prevent
    disease (as it did in the baboon study), then vaccination is still an
    immensely beneficial thing to get, surely?

  • guest

    Those seeking information:

    “Guest has kindly demonstrated one of the less-pleasant aspects of the anti-vaccination movement.”

    The CDC’s own webpage on Immunocompromised individuals state that they can be IMMUNIZED. All they need to do is follow the protocol laid out by the CDC. Ck CDC webpage. Here is an aticle withinformation and links to the CDC’s webpage: What About the Immunocompromised?
    http://fearlessparent(dot)org/what-about-the-immunocompromised/

    Anyone reading this, if you are a parent with an immnocompromised child and wish to have them vaccinated, just contact the CDC. I’m sure they will fix you right up.

    So, you’re all bent out of shape because 159 people got the measles in the US from an UNKNOWN SOURCE. Why aren’t you concerned that fully vaccinated people were infected? That should concern everyone. No one has been permanently damaged and NO ONE DIED. In today’s political vaccine culture a person is hospitalized for anything, especially if they want to jack up the fear factor. Please provide details on the hospitalization of these individuals. No One Died so I’m assuming they are OK. No one died during this measles event-even Catherine wasn’t counted as a mortality. Just like they removed the young man name from the records as a measles death in Wales in 2013. In fact if you go back now and read updated information-it’s completely changed.

    You want to know what qualifies as a real epidemic? Not this corporate made up numbers for benefit of profit that we have seen over the last decade:

    Measles Epidemic
    ANNOTATIONS
    Measles epidemic [page 354]
    Br Med J 1959;1:351.2 (Published 07 February 1959)

    In the first three weeks of this year about 41,000 cases of measles were recorded in England and Wales. This is well above the corresponding figures of the last two years – namely, about 9,000 in 1958 and 28,000 in 1957 – though it is below the highest levels reached in the last nine years. To give some idea of the main features of the disease as it appears today and of how it is best treated, we invited some general practitioners to write short reports on the cases they have seen in their practices recently.

    These appear at p.380 (extracts from this page follow this article). It is interesting to note, first, that the distribution of the disease is rather patchy at present. It has not yet reached the areas where two of these doctors practise (in South Scotland and Cornwall), and other areas are known to be free of the disease so far. On the other hand, in Kent it is reported to have
    arrived in time to put the children to bed over Christmas. These writers agree that measles is nowadays normally a mild infection, and they rarely have occasion to give prophylactic gamma globulin. As to the treatment of the disease and its complications, the emphasis naturally varies from one practice to another. Amount of bed-rest, when to administer a sulphonamide or antibiotic, the use of analgesics and linctuses – all these may still be debatable problems in the treatment of what is said to be the commonest disease in the world. But there is probably much in the opinion which one of the writers expresses: “It is the frequent visiting by the interested clinician and not the therapy which produces the good results.”

    VITAL STATISTICS
    MEASLES
    REPORTS FROM GENERAL PRACTITIONERS
    Br Med J 1959;1:380 (Published 07 February 1959)
    EXTRACTS [pages 380-381]

    We are much indebted to the general practitioners whose names appear below for the following notes on the present outbreak of measles.

    Dr G. I. WATSON (Peaslake, Surrey) writes:
    Measles was introduced just before Christmas by a child from Petworth …….

    Treatment of Attack.
    – No drugs are given for either the fever or the cough; if pressed, I dispense mist. salin. B.N.F. as a placebo. Glutethimide 125 mg. may be given in the afternoon if the child is restless when the rash develops; 250 mg. in single or divided doses at bedtime ensures a good night’s sleep in spite of coughing. I encourage a warm humid atmosphere in the room by various methods: some electric fires and most electric toasters allow an open pan of water to rest on top; an electric kettle blows off too much steam to be kept on for more than short periods. Parents, conscious of the need to darken the room and to forbid reading, may carry this to an unnecessary extreme, starting even before the rash appears. To save a mother some demands, the wireless is a boon to children in darkened rooms. They are allowed up when the rash fades from the abdomen-usually the fourth or fifth day-and may go outside on the next fine day. Apart from fruit to eat, solid food is avoided on the daythe rash is appearing; fruit drinks or soups are all they appear to
    want.

    Complications. – So far few complications have arisen. Four cases of otitis media occurred in the first 25 children, but only one had pain. No
    case of pneumonia has occurred, but one child had grossly abnormal
    signs in the chest for a few days after the fever subsided, uninfluenced
    by oral penicillin. One girl had a tear-duct infection and another an
    undue blepharitis. Of three adult males with the disease, two have been
    more severely affected than any of the children.

    Dr. R. E. HOPE SIMPSON (Cirencester, Glos) writes:

    Wenmake no attempt to prevent the spread of measles, and would only use
    gamma globulin to mitigate the severity of the disease in the case of the exposure of a susceptible adult or child who is already severely debilitated. Bed rest, for seven davs for moderate and severe cases and of five to six days in mild cases, seems to cut down the incidence of such complications as secondary bacterial otitis media and bronchopneumonia.
    We have not been impressed by the prophylactic or therapeutic use of
    antibiotics and sulphonamides in the first week of the disease. As soon
    as the patient is out of bed we allow him out of doors almost regardless
    of the weather. Otitis Media and Bronchopneumonia.-These conditions
    often appear so early, sometimes even before the rash, that in such
    cases one can only conclude that the responsible agent is the virus
    itself. Despite their initial alarming severity, they tend to resolve spontaneously, and treatment apart from first principles seems useless.
    When, on the other hand, otitis media or bronchopneumonia comes on
    after the subsidence of the initial symptoms of measles, it is probably
    due to a secondary bacterial invader, and we find antibiotics or
    sulphonamides useful…..

    MILD AILMENT
    Dr. JOHN FRY (Beckenham, Kent) writes:

    The “expected” biennial epidemic of measles appeared in this region in early
    December, 1958, just in time to put many youngsters to bed over
    Christmas. To date there have been close on 150 cases in the practice,
    and the numbers are now steadily decreasing. Like previous epidemics,
    the primary cases have been chiefly in the 5- and 6-year-olds, with
    secondary cases in their younger siblings. No special features have been noted in this relatively mild epidemic.
    It has been mild because complications have occurred in only four
    children. One little girl aged 2 suffered from a lobular pneumonia, and
    three others developed acute otitis media following their measles. In
    the majority of children the whole episode has been well and truly over
    in a week, from the prodromal phase to the disappearance of the rash,
    and many mothers have remarked ”how much good the attack has done their children,” as they seem so much better after the measles.

    A family doctor’s approach to the management of measles is essentially a
    personal and individual matter, based on the personal experiences of the
    doctor and the individual character and background of the child and the
    family. In this practice measles is considered as a relatively mild and inevitable childhood ailment that is best encountered any time from 3 to 7 years of age. Over the past 10 years there have been few serious complications at any age, and all children have made complete recoveries. As a result of this reasoning no special attempts have been made at prevention even in young infants in whom the disease has not been found to be especially serious.
    https://childhealthsafety.wordpress(dot)com/2013/04/15/british-medical-journal-tells-us-measles-is-not-the-scary-disease-the-press-want-you-to-think-it-is/

    41,000 cases of measles were recorded in England and Wales in the first three weeks of 1959. That’s an epidemic and not one Doctor, although they didn’t interview every doctor in England and Wales–broke a sweat.

  • guest

    Prove it:

    -Please provide an INDEPENDENT double-blind, placebo-controlled study that can prove the safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    – Please provide INDEPENDENT scientific evidence on ANY study which can confirm the long-term safety and effectiveness of vaccines.

    -Please provide scientific justification as to how injecting a human being with a confirmed neurotoxin is beneficial to human health and prevents disease? Specifically thimerosal & aluminum.

    -Please provide scientific justification on how bypassing the respiratory tract (or mucous membrane) is advantageous and how directly injecting viruses into the bloodstream enhances immune functioning and prevents future infections?

    -Please provide scientific justification on how a vaccine would prevent viruses from mutating?

  • guest

    Warning warning Stalker Troll.

  • guest

    Agreeded. I would like to see what you have.

  • If you’ve managed to ignore the reams of studies that have already been linked, then there’s nothing I can do for you. I recommend seeing an eye doctor with actual training in ophthalmology.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    There were 49 deaths from measles in England and Wales in that “mild” year of 1958. There were over 90 the year before and after.

    The issue is not whether immunocompromised persons can be vaccinated; the woman who died from measles this year had been vaccinated. The issue is how well this vaccination will work when challenged. In this case, not well enough.

  • guest

    As with the Unvaccinated -Vaccinated health status study that Congress asked the CDC to do over 10 years ago, there isn’t one. The CDC or HHS will not pay for a study if they that can’t control the results. Like the rand study. However when you have top vaccine researchers saying the vaccines aren’t working-there’s a problem:

    “The measles vaccine has failed,” he explained two years ago in a prescient paper, “The re-emergence of measles in developed countries.” In that paper, he warned that due to factors that most haven’t noticed, measles has come back to be a serious public health threat. Poland sees the need for a major rethink, after concluding that the current measles vaccine is unlikely to ever live up to the job expected of it: “outbreaks are occurring even in highly developed countries where vaccine access, public health infrastructure, and health literacy are not significant issues. This is unexpected and a worrisome harbinger — measles outbreaks are occurring where they are least expected,” he wrote in his 2012 paper, listing the “surprising numbers of cases occurring in persons who previously received one or even two documented doses of measles-containing vaccine.” During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, “over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine.”
    Paper: The Re-Emergence of Measles in Developed Countries: Time to Develop the Next-Generation Measles Vaccines? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pmc/articles/PMC3905323/
    http://business.financialpost (dot) com/2014/05/01/lawrence-solomon-vaccines-cant-prevent-measles-outbreaks/

    -Arch Intern Med. 1994 Aug 22;154(16):1815-20.
    Failure to reach the goal of measles elimination. Apparent paradox of measles infections in immunized persons.
    Poland GA1, Jacobson RM.
    Conclusion: The apparent paradox is that as measles immunization rates rise to high levels in a population, measles becomes a disease of immunized persons. Because of the failure rate of the vaccine and the unique transmissibility of the measles virus, the currently available measles vaccine, used in a single-dose strategy, is unlikely to completely eliminate measles. The long-term success of a two-dose strategy to eliminate measles remains to be determined. http://archinte.jamanetwork (dot) com/article.aspx?articleid=619215.
    Dr. Gregory Poland is Professor of Medicine and founder and leader of Mayo Clinic’s Vaccine Research Group. Poland is one of the world’s most admired, most advanced thinkers in the field of vaccinology.
    ————————————————————

    -Study titled, “Outbreak of Measles Among Persons With Prior Evidence of Immunity, New York City, 2011,” http://cid.oxfordjournals (dot) org/content/58/9/1205.long This fully vaccinated young lady viral vaccine shedding resulted in her infecting 88 people. Of the 88 four secondary cases were confirmed that had either two doses of measles-containing vaccine or a past positive measles IgG antibody. All cases had laboratory confirmation of measles infection, clinical symptoms consistent with measles, and high avidity IgG antibody characteristic of a secondary immune response.”

    -PLoS study: “Difficulties in eliminating measles and controlling rubella and mumps: a cross-sectional study of a first measles and rubella vaccination and a second measles, mumps, and rubella vaccination. China has one of the most vaccination compliant populations in the world. In fact, measles vaccine is mandatory. So why have they had over 700 measles outbreaks from 2009 and 2012 alone? “The reported coverage of the measles-rubella (MR) or measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine is greater than 99.0% in Zhejiang province. However, the incidence of measles, mumps, and rubella remains high.” http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pmc/articles/PMC3930734/

    -Vaccine Failure – Two Fully Vaccinated Doctors Get Measles (2009) A measles outbreak in 2009 exposed and infected two physicians, both of whom had been fully vaccinated with two doses of the MMR vaccine. These physicians were suspected of having been infected by treating patients diagnosed with measles. [5] http://jid.oxfordjournals(dot)org/content/204/suppl_1/S559.full.pdf+html.

    -The largest measles epidemic in North America in the last decade, occurred in 2011 in Quebec, Canada, where rates of 1- and 2-dose vaccine coverage among children 3 years of age were 95%-97% and 90%, respectively, with 3%-5% unvaccinated.” “Among adolescents, 22% had received 2 vaccine doses. Outbreak investigation showed this proportion to have been an underestimate; active case finding identified 130% more cases among 2-dose recipients.”
    Largest measles epidemic in North America in a decade–Quebec, Canada, 2011: contribution of susceptibility, serendipity, and superspreading events.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pubmed/23264672.

    Primary Versus Secondary Failure Following Varicella Vaccination: Implications for Interval between Two Doses
    Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal 11 February 2013

    Abstract
    Background: Two-dose varicella vaccination is recommended for optimal control of varicella in populations with high (>90%) one-dose coverage. Optimal timing of the second dose may depend on whether breakthrough varicella results from primary vaccine failure (no protective immunity after vaccination) or secondary vaccine failure (waning protective immunity).

    Methods: Published literature
    (1995-2012) on vaccine failure following varicella vaccination cited in
    PubMed and other online sources was reviewed.

    Results: Nineteen publications detailed 21 varicella outbreaks with breakthrough varicella rates ranging from 0% to 42%; the publications showed no consistent trend between breakthrough varicella rate and time since vaccination.

    Conclusions: Literature to-date indicates a relatively high rate of primary vaccine failure and limited evidence of secondary vaccine failure amongst one-dose varicella vaccine recipients, suggesting that a short interval between two doses might be preferable in countries considering implementation of universal varicella vaccination to reduce breakthrough varicella. However, any potential disruption to well-established vaccination schedules should be considered.

    Two current studies speak to the above:
    -Study titled: “Acellular Pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate model,” used infant baboons to test the hypothesis that “current acellular pertussis vaccines fail to prevent colonization and transmission” of B. Pertussis. (there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus) http://www.pnas (dot) org/content/111/2/787.

    Lead author Tod Merkel did comment to the New York Times that when exposed to B. Pertussis after recently getting vaccinated, you could be an asymptomatic carrier and infect others, saying: “When you’re newly vaccinated, you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population.” According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.

    -Study: Whooping cough resurgence due to vaccinated people not knowing they’re infectious? clinicalnews(dot)org/2015/06/24/study-whooping-cough-resurgence-due-to-vaccinated-people-not-knowing-theyre-infectious/comment-page-1/. From study/article:
    “a detailed epidemiological model of whooping cough transmission to conclude that acellular vaccines may well have contributed to — even exacerbated — the recent pertussis outbreak by allowing infected individuals without symptoms to unknowingly spread pertussis multiple times in their lifetimes.

    ‘There could be millions of people out there with just a minor cough or no cough spreading this potentially fatal disease without knowing it,’ said Althouse. ‘The public health community should act now to better assess the true burden of pertussis infection.’ What’s worse, their model shows that if the disease can be spread through vaccinated, asymptomatic individuals essentially undetected.

    Two researchers have charged Merck with Fraud in regards to the Mumps portion of the MMR.

    Former Merck scientists file suit against Merck under False Claims Act:
    A formal complaint was filed in the Eastern Pennsylvania Federal District Court accusing Merck of a longstanding scheme to mislead and defraud Government health authorities worldwide. Two of Merck’s former employees have accused the pharmaceutical giant of marketing multivalent
    MMR vaccines under false pretenses. According to the complaint, these vaccines have been mislabeled, misbranded, adulterated and falsely certified as having a 95% efficacy rate.

    Virologists Stephen Krahling and Joan Wlochowski describe how Merck had to recertify the mumps component in 2000, in order to comply with regulatory requirements in order for the mumps component to be included in two new multivalent MMR vaccines. The usual test, which had certified the mumps component’s efficacy in the 60’s, failed when used in 2000. They claim the results were so low Merck decided to change its own test protocol by testing the vaccine against the weakened mumps vaccine virus instead of the wild (naturally circulating) mumps virus.

    When that modification didn’t result in the desired 95% efficacy figure, Merck’s executive directors of vaccine research, Drs Alan Shaw and Emilio Emini, instructed Drs David Krah and Mary Yagodich to
    implement a vast array of modifications to testing procedures3, then, allegedly pressured both Krahling and Wlochowski to participate.

    When these modifications also failed to demonstrate the desired 95% efficacy rate, it is alleged that Drs Shaw and Emini instructed Drs Krah and Yagovich to abandon “gold standard” testing, and implement a new procedure, supposedly with the agreement of FDA, which included adding animal antibodies to human blood samples taken both pre and post vaccination.

    By combining the very low levels of human antibodies with animal antibodies, a much higher total level of virus neutralization was obtained than could occur from human antibodies alone. The human
    antibody levels alone would never protect in the real world against wild mumps. But after adding animal antibodies, the human blood samples which had previously failed under the old “gold standard” testing were retested using the “enhanced” protocols and passed with flying colors. New ‘enhanced’ tests showed 100% efficacy, not against wild mumps virus,but against the mumps vaccine virus.

    However, combining the animal and human antibodies led to a new problem. In some of the tests more than 80% of pre-vaccine blood samples now showed up as immune. Usually, the highest number of pre-vaccine immune results any scientist could expect is 10%. Further manipulations of the animal antibody levels failed to bring the pre-vaccine blood test results down to the expected 10% levels.

    According to the complaint, Merck then implemented additional ‘creative’ strategies to show a lack of seroconversion in immune samplesin an attempt to reduce the pre-vax level to the expected 10% because had the FDA seen the high numbers of “immune” pre-vaccine samples they would have easily detected the fraudulent test procedures.

    The lawsuit claims that to this day, Merck has consistently misrepresented the potency by simply quoting the 40 year old data from the pre-MMR monovalent mumps vaccine, thereby misrepresenting the efficacy of four multivalent vaccines: MMR, MMRII, Europe’s MMRvaxpro, and ProQuad, which is MMR plus chickenpox.

    According to the two whistleblowers, not only have all the multivalent MMR vaccines been sold under false pretenses, but, as a result of this LACK OF EFFICACY, there have been numerous mumps
    outbreaks worldwide prompting calls for regular MMR boosters throughout life. These mumps outbreaks were predicted by Merck’s Dr Krah in 2001, yet Merck allegedly ‘willfully’ withheld this information from multiple governments while consistently claiming there was no need for a new
    mumps component.

    UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF PENNSYLVANIA
    United States of America ex rel., Stephen A Krahling and Joan A Wlochowski, AMENDED
    COMPLAINT FOR Plaintiffs, VIOLATIONS OF THE FEDERAL FALSE CLAIMS
    ACT FILED Merck & Co.inc . Defendant
    http://sanevax(dot)org/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Merck-mumps-suit.pdf
    COURTHOUSE NEWS SERVICE:
    Class Says Merck Lied About Mumps Vaccine By REUBEN KRAMER
    http://www.courthousenews(dot)com/2012/06/27/47851.htm

    *****Chatom Primary Care sues Merck for Sherman Act monopolization, breach of warranty, violation of consumer protection laws.
    The lawsuit record is available here:
    http://www.naturalnews(dot)com/gallery/documents/Chatom-Lawsuit-Merck-Mumps.pdf.

    I for one want studies. We need INDEPENDENT STUDIES not studies paid for and done by the CDC, HHS, IOM and any of their attached agencies. We will continue to go round in circles while corporate America plays Russian roulette with the lives of not only children but adults as well. Our children are chronically ill. According to the CDC own study it states 1 child in 6 is chronically ill-why? That number corresponds with the increase in the vaccination schedule. Toxins in our environment, fluoride in the water, GMO in the food chain has created children who will not live as long as their parents. Nothing should be off the table to scrutinize and study by research groups who no vested interest in the outcome and let the science go where it goes.

    America’s New Normal: Chronically Ill Kids:
    http://fearlessparent(dot)org/americas-new-normal-chronically-ill-kids/

  • guest

    What was the health status of those individuals? Adults, babies, children? Did they live in poverty where I’ve read that many deaths occured from Measles. Prior to the 1970’s measles was considered a illness of living in poverty. Please qualify. Not to minimize the deaths of anyone but, people die. It is a fact of life and in 1959 there was no vaccine but the death rate from measles had fallen in the US & England.

    “The issue is how well this vaccination will work when challenged.”

    According to Dr. Gregory Poland in a report that he wrote in 2012 it doesn’t work at all:
    “The measles vaccine has failed”, he explained two years ago in a prescient paper, “The re-emergence of measles in developed countries.” “In that paper, he warned that due to factors that most haven’t noticed, measles has come back to be a serious public health threat. Poland sees the need for a major rethink, after concluding that the current measles vaccine is unlikely to ever live up to the job expected of it: “outbreaks are occurring even in highly developed countries where vaccine access, public health infrastructure, and health literacy are not significant issues. This is unexpected and a worrisome harbinger — measles outbreaks are occurring where they are least expected,” he wrote in his 2012 paper, listing the “surprising numbers of cases occurring in persons who previously received one or even two documented doses of measles-containing vaccine.” During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, “over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine.”
    Paper: The Re-Emergence of Measles in Developed Countries: Time to Develop the Next-Generation Measles Vaccines? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pmc/articles/PMC3905323/
    http://business.financialpost (dot) com/2014/05/01/lawrence-solomon-vaccines-cant-prevent-measles-outbreaks/

    He even wrote about the vaccine in 1994:
    -Arch Intern Med. 1994 Aug 22;154(16):1815-20.
    Failure to reach the goal of measles elimination. Apparent paradox of measles infections in immunized persons.
    Poland GA1, Jacobson RM.
    Conclusion: The apparent paradox is that as measles immunization rates rise to high levels in a population, measles becomes a disease of immunized persons. Because of the failure rate of the vaccine and the unique transmissibility of the measles virus, the currently available measles vaccine, used in a single-dose strategy, is unlikely to completely eliminate measles. The long-term success of a two-dose strategy to eliminate measles remains to be determined. http://archinte.jamanetwork (dot) com/article.aspx?articleid=619215.

  • guest

    -Meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors, Office of Infectious Diseases Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Tom Harkins Global Communication Center Atlanta, Georgia December 11-12, 2013

    This is what is in the body of this meeting record from 2013:

    FDA has issued a warning regarding this crucial finding. Furthermore, the 2013 meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors at the CDC revealed additional alarming data that pertussis variants (PRN-negative strains)

    CURRENTLY CIRCULATING IN THE US ACQUIRED A SELECTIVE ADVANTAGE TO INFECT THOSE WHO ARE UP TO DATE FOR THEIR DTAP boosters, meaning that people who are UP TO DATE are more likely to be infected, and thus contagious, than people who are not vaccinated.

    -Waning Protection after Fifth Dose of Acellular Pertussis Vaccine in Children
    Nicola P. Klein, M.D., Ph.D., Joan Bartlett, M.P.H., M.P.P.,
    Ali Rowhani-Rahbar, M.D., M.P.H., Ph.D., Bruce Fireman, M.A.,
    and Roger Baxter, M.D.

  • Link to the study so we can see it in situ please.

  • guest

    I haven’t ignored anything. As you stated there are reams of studies out there it would be disingenuous to say I’ve read them all which is why I’m interested in what you have. Always willing to read a study.

  • I haven’t been saving the links, but take a look at the post histories of Justthefacts (@disqus_kKV66ElrUw) and
    One other person is typing. (@disqus_tlEIT18b4g).

    They’ve put up some meaty stuff.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    Don’t be silly. Measles was not a disease of poverty. On some other thread your ilk mention it was part of “The Brady Bunch” sitcom, not a family known for its impoverished lifestyle. Were the 400 dead from the bottom end of the economic spectrum? Maybe, although the deaf boy I went to school with was from the middle class.

    Lurkers: Twice in one subthread, it is clear that antivaxers feel death or permanent damage from vaccine-preventable disease happened to losers. They can never explain why the clean-living American Indians were decimated by the diseases Europeans imported, because they reject the Germ Theory of Disease for the discredited Filth Theory of Disease. That way their own avoidance of measles, polio, and smallpox is not about widespread vaccination, but their kale-and-yoga lifestyle.

    Did you notice that half of the victims of measles being vaccinated means that the circa 5% who are not vaccinated were also half of the cases. That makes the unvaccinated 19 times as likely have gotten sick. Great news for the vaccine!

    As for your second paper, the upshot is we switched to a two-dose strategy. That seems to be adequate.

    Why do you want measles so much? Are you angry you missed out on bonding with Mommie in a sickroom?

  • guest

    You can’t google that, really? Cause that’s the first posting that comes up on Google when you put the title in the search box. Disappointing. Tell you what. google it and if you can’t find it I’ll give you the link.

  • guest

    I never thought it was a disease of poverty but that’s how thy wrote back in the day.

    The studies speak for themselves and Poland, one of the celebrity Docs wrote them so hey if you have issues you can contact him. He’s at the Mayo Clinic.

    Troll tactic-gotcha:
    Why do you want measles so much? Are you angry you missed out on bonding with Mommie in a sickroom?

    Really? Desperate move. Very revealing.

  • guest

    I promise I will take a look at the studies and I will also follow the money trail and the academic associations of the researchers. That’s always very telling.

  • guest

    Just because you haven’t seen anything or are not aware of anything-doesn’t mean they don’t exist.

    Herd Immunity is reality TV on a blog. It doesn’t exist:

    Herd Immunity Vaccine Myth Explained
    How Vaccination Compromises Our Natural Immunity
    Immunolgist Dr. Tetyana Obukhanych
    http://eisensteincenter.com/podcast/herd-immunity-vaccine-myth-explained

    Brilliant woman. I’ve had the pleasure of attending some of her lectures.

  • guest

    Vaccine damage-not good.

  • guest

    I don’ know you personally. You sound a little paranoid.
    Discredit Dr. Seneff’s research. That’s all I’m saying.

  • guest

    Herd Immunity is a myth and doctors are even qualifying it in articles saying the concept of herd immunity.

  • Proponent

    Define.. ‘agreeded’, guest; aka Danchi.

    Or, if you prefer.. and to make things easier for you.. the origin of language will suffice. I am pretty resourceful and can look up the meaning myself.

  • Thanks! You’re a champ!

  • You’re welcome.

  • You are a liar. I am clear;ly interested, or I would not be here. But I am only interested in an honest and diligent discussion, and which you have refused to be part of since the very first post you ever made on this site. I am not interested in intellectual dishonesty, cognitive dissonance, rejecting data and studies, and the complete denial of anything but pro-vaccine claims and information. You do understand that, right; or would drawing a picture help you at all?

  • Obviously I just made a major step in framing that for you, and again you simply ignored it.

  • Really? And again with that much direct information, data, and as well studies put directly in front of you, you have the audacity to claim that I am the person not interested in discussing things. And while you yourself can address nothing here whatsoever. No one here is interested in playing your twisted and in denial games. That was what has been actually said.

    And again, you pointed out nothing at all.

  • I already told you, no one here including myself, have any interest in your moving the goal post in denial games. No on is interested in your complete denial, cognitive dissonance, and/or your high level of intellectual dishonest. You can twist it around and make more false claims, all you want. The first step would be to look in your own mirror and to admit what you really are, and what you represent.

  • Really? And obviously any readers here can clearly see that you are lying. You trolling shill people simply can not, and refuse to be wrong, ever. That is some major blindness and in denial sickness you have going on.

  • Since when is putting forth the truth and the reality about you, the equivalent of harassment?. May be you should just quit with your false level of self pity, and as well your endless whinging, and crying around.

  • No evidence exists of and as to toxicity, and no evidence of contamination?

    Maybe this will give you some idea.

    If you think that vaccine ingredients have been proven as safe and even when combined vaccines are used, ask you doctor for the studies? They do not exist.

    Vaccine Ingredients and Manufacturer Information
    (alphabetical order by vaccine)
    http://vaccines.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=005206

    The Toxic Ingredients in Innoculations

    Most people who vaccinate their children do not realize the kind of ingredients contained in vaccines—and even if they do know, they may not fully understand what that particular ingredient does or what it means. This article is written to help those individuals better understand what they are injecting into the bodies of their loved ones.
    What prompted me to put this list together was the staggering number of people reporting adverse reactions to vaccines. I wanted to know why so many children experience many of the same reactions. What I found was that many of the adverse reactions fit into many of the side effects of many ingredients contained in vaccines. Please educate before you vaccinate! Don’t wait for something bad to happen before you begin researching vaccines.
    INGREDIENTS OF COMMON VACCINES

    Red more:
    http://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/vaccination/adjuvants-in-vaccines/

    49 doses of 14 vaccines by the age of 6
    https://www.nvic.org/CMSTemplates/NVIC/pdf/49-Doses-PosterB.pdf

    INDESCRIBABLY DISGUSTING VACCINE INGREDIENTS

    SO WHAT ABOUT THE FLY IN OUR SOUP?

    It may not do any harm at all, especially if it has been well heated in the soup!

    However, all injected substances including insect fragments bypass the body’s intricate defense mechanism. The same substances which are harmless when ingested are shown to be extremely detrimental to health when injected. This is learned by medical students and others, but many doctors, health authorities and other vaccine promoters appear to ignore this basic fact.

    Read more:
    http://birthofanewearth.blogspot.com/2012/01/indescribably-disgusting-vaccine.html

    Gardasil Vaccine Becomes International Scandal: Deceptive Emails by Health Officials Exposed to Public
    http://vaccineimpact.com/2016/gardasil-vaccine-becomes-international-scandal-deceptive-emails-by-health-officials-exposed-to-public/

    Is HPV Vaccine Safety an Illusion Maintained by the Suppression of Science?
    http://sanevax.org/hpv-vaccine-safety-an-illusion-maintained-by-suppression-of-science/

    Allegations of Scientific Misconduct by GACVS/WHO/CDC Representatives et al
    An open-letter of complaint to the Director-General of the World Health Organization, Dr. Margaret
    Chan
    http://sanevax.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Allegations-of-Scientific-Misconduct-by-GACVS.pdf

    SEVERE GARDASIL INJURIES & COVER-UP! ~ Mothers Speak at NYC City Hall 1-20-16
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4I1_bcj4Ow&list=LL8me2gYHgXwUdkWqb1DW0SQ&index=1

    Here is another issue that they have. If Gardasil is EVER recalled, and AFTER all their LIES that is still found to be safe, they go directly under the GUN as to what they knew and when they knew it. Just like as to all vaccines, the CDC and FDA have all along known what was happening, and chose not to admit to it. A large spot light put on Gardasil, and as it will be if recalled, will then bring into the spotlight the contamination issues with all vaccines, and as well the safety.

    Adventitious Agents and Vaccines
    Philip R. Krause (go to full text pdf)
    Food and Drug Administration, Bethesda, Maryland, USA
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2631857/

    Full text:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2631857/pdf/11485673.pdf

    Issues Associated With Residual Cell-Substrate DNA (I found Explorer worked to download this unbelievable read, and chrome did not)

    (Page 20 and 47 mention the said WHO limit of 10ng of human DNA in a vaccine. But many of the current vaccines are produced with said human diploid tissue, and so what then? No mention of that issue appeared to have been made. As well see there reference made of ongogenic activity, and infective activity. Obviously they do not have any actual and nor sufficient animal and nor human studies on and in regard to this said issue. What they have is literally only presumed estimates. The FDA thus clearly knows of the cancer causing potential, infective potential, and of the unknown potential to create both known and unknown created adverse health situations with these vaccines; such as autoimmune disease as well Wow.)

    http://www.fda.gov/ohrms/dockets/ac/05/slides/5-4188S1_4draft.ppt

    New Study in Journal of Public Health and Epidemiology Correlates Autism Disorder Increase and Human Fetal DNA, Retroviral Agents in Vaccines

    (My review of the information): So it should come as no surprise that the FDA has known for decades about the dangers of insertional mutagenesis by using the human fetal cell lines and yet, they chose to ignore it. Instead of conducting safety studies they regulated the amount of human DNA that could be present in a vaccine to no greater than 10ng. (See the FDA PDF reference link below titled, Issues Associated With Residual Cell-Substrate DNA)

    Unfortunately, Dr. Deisher’s team discovered that the fetal DNA levels in vaccines produced with aborted fetal cell tissue, ranged anywhere from 142ng – 2000ng per dose, way beyond the so-called “safe” level.

    “There are a large number of publications about the presence of HERV (human endogenous retrovirus – the only re-activatable endogenous retrovirus) and its association with childhood lymphoma,” noted Dr Deisher. “The MMR II and chickenpox vaccines and indeed all vaccines that were propagated or manufactured using the fetal cell line WI-38 are contaminated with this retrovirus. And both parents and physicians have a right to know this!”

    Certainly these discoveries by SCPI should generate an immediate investigation by FDA officials, if not an outright ban on the use of aborted fetal cell lines as substrates for vaccine production. There are numerous other non-human FDA-approved cell lines that can and should be used.

    New Study in Journal of Public Health and Epidemiology Correlates Autism Disorder Increase and Human Fetal DNA, Retroviral Agents in Vaccines
    http://www.standardnewswire.com/news/965249574.html

    Dr Deisher’s study is available on the Academic Journals website at: http://www.ms.academicjournals.org/article/article1409245960_Deisher%20et%20al.pdf

    Or on their website at http://www.soundchoice.org/scpiJournalPubHealthEpidem092014.pdf

    CDC ADMITS THE PROBLEM

    – Many novel vaccines are produced in animal cell substrates, and emerging infectious diseases may theoretically be transmitted from animals to humans through these vaccines. The challenge of identifying potential adventitious agents in vaccines closely parallels the challenge of identifying the agents causing particular emerging infectious diseases.” http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2631857/pdf/11485673.pdf

    If You Are In Support of Vaccinations, Read This If You Dare
    http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/if-you-are-in-support-of-vaccinations/

    Most of the below information is taken from the above two articles.

    FDA: ONLY NONBINDING RECOMMENDATIONS FOR TESTING

    There is no incentive for vaccine promoters to find substances which are detrimental to health. FDA only presents nonbinding recommendations:

    “If an adventitious agent is known to be present in your cell substrate or viral seed, then you should demonstrate that your production process is sufficiently robust to eliminate or inactivate the agent with an appropriate margin of safety.” http://www.fda.gov/downloads/biologicsbloodvaccines/guidancecomplianceregulatoryinformation/guidances/vaccines/ucm202439.pdf

    POSSIBLE CONSEQUENCES OF INJECTING FOREIGN DNA

    “ – DNA is used from such organisms as animals, animal viruses, fungi, and bacteria. It has been documented that injecting foreign DNA in a human may cause it, or a portion of it, to be incorporated into the recipient’s DNA. The horrendous implications for the unborn defy the imagination.” http://healthwyze.org/index.php/vaccine-secrets.html

    “- most vaccines are contaminated with a number of known and yet-to-be discovered viruses, bacteria, viral fragments, and DNA/RNA fragments. And, further, our science demonstrates that these contaminants could lead to a number of slowly-developing degenerative diseases, including degenerative diseases of the brain.” http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/if-you-are-in-support-of-vaccinations/

    “- The risks of residual retinal DNA and stray viral contaminants from the animal tissues getting into flu shots are real. DNA snips are classified as either “infectious” or “oncogenic” (tumour causing) by researchers who worry that the stray DNA is being incorporated into the recipient’s DNA …” http://www.newswithviews.com/Tenpenny/sherri123.htm

    Interview with Dr. Suzanne Humphries. (Regarding contaminants from 33 minutes):
    “- DNA particles from disease matter can get into our DNA and alter us and in my opinion these vaccines are turning us into genetically modified organisms.” http://naturalnews.tv/v.asp?v=BAE7F6323813CFAFB8338173FB11D429

    SV40 VIRUS IS PASSED THROUGH GENERATIONS

    “- many of the contaminant organisms can pass from generation to generation. For example, new studies have found that SV-40, a major contaminant of the polio vaccine until 1963, not only existed as a latent virus for the lifetime of those exposed to the vaccine but was being passed on to the next generation, primarily by way of sperm, something called vertical transmission. This means that every generation from now on will be infected with this known carcinogenic virus. There is also compelling evidence that some polio vaccines manufactured after 1963 may contain SV-40 virus. What makes the SV-40 contamination disaster of such concern is its association with so many cancers…” http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/if-you-are-in-support-of-vaccinations/

    “ – It is impossible to remove DNA contaminants from vaccines. Although weight limits for contaminating DNA were set by the FDA as far back as 1986, vaccine makers have never been able to reach that goal. The CDC decided to limit their weight recommendation to cancerous cell lines and then increase the other DNA contamination allowance one hundred-fold. However, these limits are only “recommendations” and, therefore, the FDA is unable to enforce them. Vaccine manufacturers continue to have the freedom to take scientific measures to reduce contaminants only if they wish. http://www.opednews.com/populum/diarypage.php?did=14455

    Simian virus 40 in humans

    To date, the prevalence of SV40 infections in humans is not known. Recent studies, based on PCR and serological techniques, indicate that SV40 infection occurs both in children and adults. (i) SV40 DNA sequences have been detected in normal and neoplastic tissues of people either too young (1 to 30 years) or too old (60 to 85 years) to have been vaccinated with SV40-contaminated anti-polio vaccines [19,33,76-81]. This finding may also explain the lack of difference in cancer incidence between individuals vaccinated with SV40-contaminated and SV40-free anti-polio vaccines [82]. (ii) SV40 sequences and Tag were detected in blood and sperm specimens from normal individuals and oncologic patients [80,81,83-88] and in lymphoblastoid cells [32]. These results suggest that (peripheral blood mononuclear cells) PBMCs, could be a reservoir and vehicle of SV40 spreading in the tissues of the host and among the individuals. (iii) SV40 sequences were found in urine and stoole samples, from children and adults [84,89,90], indicating that the haematic, sexual and orofecal routes of transmission are likely to be responsible for SV40 horizontal infection in humans.

    Read more:
    http://www.infectagentscancer.com/content/2/1/13

    Advances in Virus Research, Volume 50

    Pages 83 and 84, read. (Also see the study titled, Simian virus 40 in humans, below on this page)

    Excerpted:

    Moreover, blood and sperm fluid may represent important means for spreading of SV40 in humans.

    Indeed in these investigations, (Martini etal;, 1995,1996) 61% of the neoplastic patients positive for SV 40 sequences were of an age excluding exposure to SV 40-contaminated polio vaccines, suggesting contagious transmission of SV 40 by horizontal infection.

    http://books.google.com/books?id=PfO7D8ZoSMkC&pg=PA84&lpg=PA84&dq=sv40+is+contagious&source=bl&ots=AlaWsAkp95&sig=RnycQFX2ucD-3zybHQ07FAIeJYk&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kZLfT5_mA4qc2QXKz6jtCA&ved=0CFoQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=sv40%20is%20contagious&f=false

    SV-40 Deadly Cure
    http://www.viewzone.com/sv40x.html

    Types of SV40 Associated Cancers:
    http://www.sv40foundation.org/Types.html

    The 9 Magic Words That Prove Vaccines Are Unavoidably Unafe!

    THESE are the words.

    “If this vaccine injures my child, who is responsible?”

    http://www.riseearth.com/2013/02/9-magic-words-prove-vaccines-are.html

  • Jonathan Graham

    You are a liar. I am clear;ly interested

    Nope. The only thing in evidence is that you like to copy paste large number of links and then revert to arguing by logical fallacies. Actually discussing them there is little evidence to support that claim.

    And I do not see here that you posted the study.

    Don’t care. Lowell start demonstrating some ability to discuss things intelligently to me and we can talk. Otherwise, there’s really no motive for me to do more than just point out that you really have no interest in discussion.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Nope. The question necessitates someone responding about what they believe didn’t. Come back when you can make a statement of that sort. Cheerio. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    with that much direct information, data, and as well studies put directly in front of you, you have the audacity to claim that I am the person not interested in discussing things

    …information and data is not necessarily a discussion.

    And while you yourself can address nothing here whatsoever.

    Lowell I’ve already pointed out the problems you have communicating. You don’t know how to structure an argument using research material – you have been shown the format and have flatly refused to use it, so I’m only interested in discussing one paper at a time with you. Which I’ve attempted to do a few times and you simply refuse to clarify things to my satisfaction.

    Hence you are not interested in communicating with ME – and probably most rational people who have limited time. I’m sure there are more gullible folk who will stroke your ego for you.

  • The problem for you here, is that the pro-vaccine side claims that they are the purveyors of the so called science. So it is actually your responsibility “to find me” studies that refute what i just put in front of you. Show me how it exists that vaccines actually work in a much more natural way, and similar to natural immunity, and just as you have claimed to be. You can not do it, and because the information i put forth is exactly correct. Come on, prove me wrong? Stop just shifting the goal posts in and as to what was actually your responsibility to show the evidence for, as to your previously said claims. The level of shifting the goal posts hypocrisy here with you people, is simply at a level of being amazing.

    Several of my site pages contain large amounts of data and studies regarding the harm of aluminum adjuvants, and these are not the only ones.

    Vaccine aluminum adjuvant causation of neuroglial activation and neuroinflammation in the brain of patients with autism- Page 2
    http://www.vacfacts.info/vaccine-aluminum-adjuvant-causation-of-neuroglial-activation-and-neuroinflammation-in-the-brain-of-patients-with-autism–page-2.html

    ​More Aluminum Adjuvant Harm Done Studies
    http://www.vacfacts.info/more-aluminum-adjuvant-harm-done-studies.html

    Dr. Paul Offit’s Aluminum Deceptions and Academic Misconduct (one very important article, to read)
    http://vaccinepapers.org/dr-paul-offits-aluminum-deceptions-academic-misconduct/

  • Jonathan Graham

    I represent someone who will look at an argument when it is well presented. Short clear citations framed in an argument with a clear hypotheses and a clear argument that forces that conclusion.

    You simply don’t want to do that. So as a compromise I’m willing to examine say one paper. When you won’t do that – I’ll pick the first paper in your random list of papers. I find it to be not even making your point and you just dig your heels in and refuse to clarify. I give my own example of how to argue a point and you say you have a criticism but refuse to clarify.

    Given those facts why would anyone consider you interested in discussion?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Following people around and annoying them, is targeted harassment.

  • I have long ago already read that IOM report. If you think that report actually gives you something to stand on in regard to vaccine safety you are delusional. It even as well admits in that report that no safety studies have ever been done in regard to multiple vaccines on teh CDC schedule, and that none have been done in regard to multiple vaccines given at the same time, and on the same day and office visit. The report also admits that those never done studies, are needed. You again have nothing.

  • Really, now how could you at this point look any more pathetic? Is that “SNORT” I will just keep on promoting the vaccine injury of those those infants and babies all I want, and there is nothing you can do because the parents are all mislead about the safety and effectiveness of vaccines. That is what you are really saying. Anyone that replies with simply “Snort!” is obviously one very sick and in denial individual; and that is the honest truth.

  • You can also review this long list of studies supporting and even replicating the findings in the 1998 Wakefield, Lancet study. Unless there were a cover-up going on, all those studies would not have been continued to be ignored,

    Callous Disregard-Research
    http://www.callous-disregard.com/research.htm

  • You are posting on a public forum on vactuth, no one is following you. You are quite obviously here to do nothing but cause repeated annoyance, disruptions, and distractions for any honest and diligent debate on these articles, and you know that is your only goal here. So lets just see if you can actually admit to being a blatant and obvious hypocrite, and right now?

  • You are in denial, you are entirely delusional, and you are lying; simple as that. Just face it. How entirely obvious would that need to be for you, and before you would just give it up, and your lies? Nothing would ever be enough, would it? You know that.

  • And you think that somehow that there just has to still some gullible folk out there yet that would yet be dumb enough to believe what you just stated. What you just stated is nothing but in denial and mindlessly repeated trash; just face it. There is no truth in it, just face it.

  • What they believe didn’t. Didn’t what, you blind fool? Most football fields would be to small for the number of times in your in denial crazed condition that you attempt to move, remove, and move again the info goal posts.

  • Like I said it is you that has clearly failed to actually discuss any information that has ever been put in front of you. You are nothing but an in denial goal posts moving hypocrite, just face it. Your directly obvious level of sickness, is beyond appalling.

  • Instead of refusing to do your own independent research before you reply post here, and asking for others to do it for you and provide it for you. perhaps you should consider instead providing scientific evidence against the information and the claims that you see stated and presented with here. Wouldn’t that be more productive than just only operating within a realm of complete denial? But then disrupt and distract is of course the only game you people ever have going on.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You are posting on a public forum on vactuth, no one is following you.

    Following people around on a forum silly. Targeted harassment is against the basic rules.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You are in denial,

    No, you can of course prove me wrong by doing what I ask but you won’t and the only reason for that. Is that you’re not really interested in talking. QED.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    I don’t have to ask Dr Poland. I only have to copy here what he really thinks.

    On the one hand, we have the most transmissible disease known in humans, and on the other hand we have an excellent vaccine – which is not a perfect vaccine – and we don’t induce immunity in somewhere between 2 to 5 percent of the people who receive it. When everybody is vaccinated, the only cases you’ll see are those in cases who are immunized, though you’ll see very few cases compared to a population that doesn’t have high levels of herd immunity. This is counterintuitive, and people misunderstand it. For any other disease, that’s an out-of-the-ballpark, grand slam vaccine, but with measles, it’s not because of the high transmissibility and the high level of herd immunity needed. […] We’ve eliminated measles through indigenous transmission, but we have a small failure rate of the vaccine, and a growing sub population of people who won’t get the vaccine. The point in my editorial was that we might be able to solve all those problems by developing an even better vaccine. [emphasis added]

    Now, what was it you were saying about Dr Poland?

  • Jonathan Graham

    At no time have I called upon people to trust me. Everything I’ve posted can be pretty clearly seen in my post history. Again you can always simply comply to my satisfaction and I will have no excuse. You cannot ergo you have nothing to say. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’ve added the missing mystery word.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Actually I have several times started to discuss things but you threw up the usual roadblock of logical fallacies.

  • Sonja Henie

    You can’t prove a negative, silly.

  • AutismDadd

    Peer review is a joke. Journals are full of trash science

  • AutismDadd

    No need for another example

  • AutismDadd

    Who asked you to?

  • AutismDadd

    What garbage. Lets party, our child has been harmed. Not including ASD is a choice not proof it isn’t a vaccine injury. They award if you call it a brain injury. And by not confirming or admitting the injuries means it creates no legal precedent or evidence, so its more of the slippery slime that it represents.

  • AutismDadd

    Shove it

  • Mike Stevens

    I’ll address your questions when you’ve adequately answered mine. Deal?

  • JGC

    No, they don’t include iautism under other names, and it isn’t included on the list of tablr injuries because it fails to meet the criteria for incvludion: it has not been shown to be an adverse consequence associated with vaccination.

  • JGC

    You’ve offered that list before, and have had it pointed out that these studies neither support nor replicate Wakefield’s retracted Lancet paper.

  • JGC

    One more time, Lowell:

    Can you offer any evidence demonstrating that any ingredient included in vaccine formulations is toxic at exposure levels achievable by routine vaccination?

    If not, your entire argument reduces to nothing other than “Oooh, ingredients–scary stuff!”

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Whitney, he is a troll. Don’t engage with him, it only keeps him going. You’ve got enough to deal with as it is. He obviously has not stopped to consider that you are already hurting and that this is very personal to you. I hope he never loses a child and has to find out first hand how emotional and painful this is to you and our family. You don’t have to defend yourself to him.

  • AutismDadd

    Ever hear of Spell Check? Autism is compensated if you call it brain damage. So Autism is vaccine caused brain damage according to NVICP standards.

  • guest

    This comment was responded to so I’ll guess I respond again:

    If you think vaccines are safe and effective, prevent disease and such answer this:

    -Provide an INDEPENDENT double-blind, placebo-controlled study that can prove the safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    -Provide INDEPENDENT scientific evidence on ANY study which can confirm the long-term safety and effectiveness of vaccines?

    -Provide INDEPENDENT scientific evidence on the safety and effectiveness of combining vaccine -up to 9, to be administered at one pediatric visit.

    -Provide Independent scientific evidence which can prove that disease reduction in any part of the world, at any point in history was attributable to inoculation of populations?

    -Provide scientific justification as to how injecting a human being with a confirmed neurotoxin is beneficial to human health and prevents disease?

    -Provide scientific justification on how bypassing the respiratory tract (or mucous membrane) is advantageous and how directly injecting viruses into the bloodstream enhances immune functioning and prevents future infections?

    -Provide Independent scientific justification on how a vaccine would prevent viruses from mutating?

    Independent means no CDC/HHS/IOM/FDA researchers, no researcher associated with any hospital or research organization that receives any funding from the pharmaceutical industry or via government grants, non research groups from Europe that receive funding from the European arm of the pharmaceutical industry as well as the various governments (ex: Britian-your home country). No organizations or researchers with vested interest in the outcome of such studies.

  • guest

    If you truly believe that the vaccine does not prevent infection, but
    does prevent disease (as it did in the baboon study), then vaccination
    is still an immensely beneficial thing to get, surely?

    The Baboon study as presented by Newsweek and the other astro-turf sites was fraudulent because a big deal was made about SafeMinds paying for part of the study-however they did not and that part of the study was never done as David Foster writes (link below).

    Marco Cáceres
    “Firger, who interviewed SafeMinds president Sallie Bernard and vice-president Lyn Redwood by phone, noted that they said the study’s
    findings “contradict both an earlier pilot study and interim progress
    reports the organization received from the researchers.

    In her piece, Firger points out that Bernard and Redwood believe that the researcher “may have cherry-picked their data.” Firger writes:

    SafeMinds Director Lyn Redwood, a registered nurse, says she received an email in 2013 from the researchers reporting a ‘statistically significant’ 11 percent reduction in certain types of hippocampal cells in the vaccine groups. But she says the authors did not include these findings in the new paper.”1

    On October 5, Redwood published a response to the Newsweek article on the SafeMinds website. She noted that the study was actually
    the second phase of a broader study that began in 2003. She writes:

    Earlier findings of phase one of this study, which SafeMinds has been funding since 2003, were published in 2010 in Acta Neurobiologiae Experimentalis and the Journal of Toxicology and Environmental Health.
    Researchers then reported that the infant primates exposed to the
    vaccines displayed a different pattern of maturational changes in the brain and also evidence of greater total brain volume compared to the control group. And in the second publication that a single dose of hepatitis B vaccine routinely administered to human infants at birth resulted in significant delays in the development of root, snout, and suck reflexes compared to unexposed animals.11

    Redwood continues:
    In 2008 SafeMinds was approached to help support a second phase of the ongoing study. The researchers felt so certain about the connection between vaccines and brain abnormalities at that time that they were also planning to includea Phase 3 of research, which was to test treatments to help the
    primates recover from neurological damage.11

    Then a few years later in 2012 SafeMinds was approached again to
    provide funding for an additional arm of the study that would expose the
    primates to the 1990s vaccine schedule that was not accelerated to
    account for difference between human babies and monkey infants. At that
    time the researchers reported a significant decrease in Purkinje cell
    number and CA1 hippocampal cell size in monkeys given the 1990s
    vaccination schedule at an accelerated rate based upon much more rapid
    brain development of the monkeys vs. human. They said they wanted to be
    sure the findings that “parallel those observed in post‐mortem autism
    brains” were not due to the accelerated schedule of vaccine
    administration (and to satisfy any reviewer concerns at publication).11

    Redwood notes that “the part of the study that SafeMinds specifically
    was asked to fund was never conducted. The scientists chose not to look at the brains of the primates from this arm of the study.”11 According
    to Redwood, the researchers have been reluctant to explain the reason
    for this, and she was informed that they are not allowed to talk about
    the study’s findings or the “discrepancies” in what was reported to
    SafeMinds and what was published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. The insinuation here is that not all of the brains of the monkeys were examined.

    -http://www.thevaccinereaction(dot)org/2015/10/thimerosal-monkey-study-fuels-media-smugfest-despite-unanswered-questions/ (14 links at site)
    -Monkey Business with SafeMinds Dollars: http://autismrawdata(dot)net/1/post/2015/10/monkey-business-with-safeminds-dollars.html

    If you want someone to comment on the effectiveness of vaccines and that they prevent transmission as well as prevent the vaccinated individual from contracting the illness the vaccine is for I can give you this:

    -“The measles vaccine has failed,” he explained two years ago in a prescient paper, “The re-emergence of measles in developed countries.” In that paper, he warned that due to factors that most haven’t noticed, measles has come back to be a serious public health threat. Poland sees the need for a major rethink, after concluding that the current measles vaccine is unlikely to ever live up to the job expected of it: “outbreaks are occurring even in highly developed countries where vaccine access, public health infrastructure, and health literacy are not significant issues. This is unexpected and a worrisome harbinger — measles outbreaks are occurring where they are least expected,” he wrote in his 2012 paper, listing the “surprising numbers of cases occurring in persons who previously received one or even two documented doses of measles-containing vaccine.” During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, “over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine.”
    Paper: The Re-Emergence of Measles in Developed Countries: Time to Develop the Next-Generation Measles Vaccines? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pmc/articles/PMC3905323/
    http://business.financialpost (dot) com/2014/05/01/lawrence-solomon-vaccines-cant-prevent-measles-outbreaks/

    -Arch Intern Med. 1994 Aug 22;154(16):1815-20.
    Failure to reach the goal of measles elimination. Apparent paradox of measles infections in immunized persons.
    Poland GA1, Jacobson RM.
    Conclusion: The apparent paradox is that as measles immunization rates rise to high levels in a population, measles becomes a disease of immunized persons. Because of the failure rate of the vaccine and the unique transmissibility of the measles virus, the currently available measles vaccine, used in a single-dose strategy, is unlikely to completely eliminate measles. The long-term success of a two-dose strategy to eliminate measles remains to be determined. http://archinte.jamanetwork (dot) com/article.aspx?articleid=619215.
    Dr. Gregory Poland is Professor of Medicine and founder and leader of Mayo Clinic’s Vaccine Research Group. Poland is one of the world’s most admired, most advanced thinkers in the field of vaccinology.

    I can also give you this from the CDC:
    FDA has issued a warning regarding this crucial finding. Furthermore, the 2013 meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors at the CDC revealed additional alarming data that pertussis variants (PRN-negative strains) currently circulating in the USA acquired a selective advantage to infect those who are up to date for their Dtap boosters (see appendix for the CDC document Item #3) meaning that peope who are up to date are more likely to be infected and thus contagious, than people who are not vaccinated. http://www.cdc(dot)gov/maso/facm/pdfs/bscoid/2013121112_bscoid_minutes.pdf

    “Acellular Pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate model,” used infant baboons to test the hypothesis that “current acellular pertussis vaccines fail to prevent colonization and transmission” of B. Pertussis. (there is no vaccine for Bordetella Pertussis virus) http://www.pnas (dot) org/content/111/2/787

    Lead author Tod Merkel did comment to the New York Times that when exposed to B. Pertussis after recently getting vaccinated, you could be an asymptomatic carrier and infect others, saying:

    “When you’re newly vaccinated, you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population.” According to Tod Merkel of the FDA, it has now become clear that the vaccine does almost nothing to prevent the spread of whooping cough. Although it does seem to prevent about 80 percent of people from showing symptoms of the disease, it does not prevent them from catching it or spreading it.

    Most current study:
    Study: Whooping cough resurgence due to vaccinated people not knowing they’re infectious? clinicalnews(dot)org/2015/06/24/study-whooping-cough-resurgence-due-to-vaccinated-people-not-knowing-theyre-infectious/comment-page-1/. From study/article:

    “a detailed epidemiological model of whooping cough transmission to conclude that acellular vaccines may well have contributed to — even exacerbated — the recent pertussis outbreak by allowing infected individuals without symptoms to unknowingly spread pertussis multiple times in their lifetimes.

    ‘There could be millions of people out there with just a minor cough or no cough spreading this potentially fatal disease without knowing it,’ said Althouse. ‘The public health community should act now to better assess the true burden of pertussis infection.’

    Primary Versus Secondary Failure Following Varicella Vaccination: Implications for Interval between Two Doses
    Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal 11 February 2013

    Abstract
    Background: Two-dose varicella vaccination is recommended for optimal control of varicella in populations with high (>90%) one-dose coverage. Optimal timing of the second dose may depend on whether breakthrough varicella results from primary vaccine failure (no protective immunity after vaccination) or secondary vaccine failure (waning protective immunity).

    Methods: Published literature (1995-2012) on vaccine failure following varicella vaccination cited in PubMed and other online sources was reviewed.

    Results: Nineteen publications detailed 21 varicella outbreaks with breakthrough varicella rates ranging from 0% to 42%; the publications showed no consistent trend between breakthrough varicella rate and time since vaccination.

    Conclusions: Literature to-date indicates a relatively high rate of primary vaccine failure and limited evidence of secondary vaccine failure amongst one-dose varicella vaccine recipients, suggesting that a short interval between two doses might be preferable in countries considering implementation of universal varicella vaccination to reduce breakthrough varicella. However, any potential disruption to well-established vaccination schedules should be considered.

    If you want to dispute the studies conclusions, as I sure you will, you have identified yourself as an infectious disease specialist so please pull up the studies and contact the researchers. I’d be very interested to know how they reply to your arguments.

  • guest

    Quote:
    The measles vaccine has failed.
    Dr. Gregory Poland

    Anything else is just filler.

  • guest
  • Andrew Lazarus

    Unsurprisingly, that quote doesn’t appear anywhere in the article guest has cited. It is available online. She(?) has been duped by some distorted version offered up on inaccurate, deceitful antivax sites.

    Reminder: Nothing antivaxers say may be trusted; everything must be checked against the original.

  • Proponent

    Danchi; aka guest: “Quote:
    The measles vaccine has failed.
    Dr. Gregory Poland

    Anything else is just filler.”

    … …

    “In the avalanche of media coverage about the current outbreak,
    Poland’s comments have frequently shown up but often out of context. So I interviewed Poland to learn what he thinks about the current measles vaccine, the ongoing outbreak, those who refuse to vaccinate and the future.”

    “The point is, to say the obvious, that we have an excellent vaccine, but we find ourselves in a unique situation right now. We’ve eliminated measles through indigenous transmission, but we have a small failure rate of the vaccine, and a growing sub population of people who won’t get the vaccine. The point in my editorial was that we might be able to solve all those problems by developing an even better vaccine. But that’s what people misunderstand. Both sides hear what they want to hear, and when I’m writing to scientific community, I think some of the nuances could be misinterpreted by laypeople or by people with an agenda. They think, “Hey, here’s somebody who’s saying it’s not good vaccine” because that’s what they want to hear.”

    (Source: Forbes | “Vaccine Researcher Gregory Poland Says Measles Jab Is Amazingly Effective But Not Perfect” )

    … …

    Danchi; aka guest is.. wrong.

  • Proponent
  • I feel that I should admit to being amused in a gallows-humour kind of way that one known cause of autism is CRS. Be Careful What You Wish For.

  • JGC

    To the exact same extent the spontaneous human combustion is compensated if you call it encephalopathy cowhide is to say, not at all. Autism is not vaccine caused brain damage by the NVICP’s or anyone else’s standard: it’s a neurodevelopmental disorder.

  • JGC

    To the exsct dsme sxtent they award compensation for spontaneous human combustion if you call it encephalopthy, which is to say not at all.

  • AutismDadd

    HUH? English your second language?

  • AutismDadd

    I hadn’t thought of that utter nonsense.

  • AutismDadd

    The H bomb

  • Jonathan Graham

    When you harass people, it’s important to point it out.

  • In regard to the information I gave you, do you have any vaccine safety studies that have been done in regard to any of those vaccine ingredients and or the obvious contamination issues that exist with vaccines? Of course you don’t, and again in your denial you are once more just simply wasting my time.

    Go ahead and vaccinate your child, but you have no right telling anyone anyone else who is actually educated to the real issues of vaccines, to vaccinate their child. You falsely fear mongering, fool.

    Millions of Children Infected with ‘Vaccine Safety Experts’ Rotateq Vaccine: Dr. Paul Offit

    Unfortunately for Dr. Offit (not so affectionately named Dr. Profit), a 2010 study published in Journal of Virology revealed that his multi-million dollar grossing patent on the Rotateq vaccine contains a live simian retrovirus (with a 96% match of certainty) that has likely infected millions of children over the past few years with a virus that causes great harm. Retrovirus infections are permanent, and can carry on indefinitely into future generations. In other words, once they are inserted into the human genome they can not be removed. View the entire PDF here.

    Moreover, a 2014 study published in Advances in Virology found Dr. Offit’s vaccine contains a “a baboon endogenous virus strain M7…likely due to the monkey cell line in which RotaTeq was produced from.” View the entire PDF here.

    Read more:
    http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/breaking-news-millions-children-infected-vaccine-safety-experts-rotateq-vaccine

    VACCINE CONTAMINATION: A THREAT TO HUMAN HEALTH
    http://www.nvic.org/Downloads/Rotavirus-Campaign/VACCINE-CONTAMINATION–A-THREAT-TO-HUMAN-HEALTH.aspx

    Rotavirus Vaccines Still Contaminated With Pig Virus DNA
    http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/rotavirus-vaccines-still-contamined-pig-virus-dna

  • You are LYING, and you should know it.

    How about if you used a real identity like I do, and then listed openly all of your conflicts of interest, and who you work for? JGC,such a cowardly use of just a character name.

  • Just keep throwing another load of BS at it; you are doing so well. Such a very sick man; why have you not been banned, yet? Disrupt, distract, and falsely antagonize and badger the opposing reply poster, is all you ever do. You are not here to debate anything at all in any honesty, so just face it and admit it.

  • That word should be …BANNED. The only mystery existing here is as to why that has not happened to you.

  • Again, you are such an obviously sick and twisted man. Your major level of pointless and baseless arrogance, is simply beyond appalling as well.

  • What and follow you up and with your again and again moving the goal posts game, and simply because you chose to ignore and not respond to the reference information that is in front of you? Again, not happening. A million studies showing the vaccine injury potential of vaccines, and the connection to autism, would never be enough for you; and you will still deny it. You have nothing, just face it. You have been shown that repeatedly, and yet you continue to deny it.

  • You could prove me wrong by actually responding directly to the information and references in my posts, but you refuse to. You simply want to move the goal posts and make the issue one of me directly, and again attempting more false discreditation. You refuse to educate yourself, just face it. Vaccines are the issue, and not me personally and your attempts at making the issue of one being, only all about me; will fail for you again and again,

  • Again, no one targeted you. If so then go ahead and explain in it in no uncertain terms. Your posts are open game for anyone that is posting here.

  • Again, just stop your whining and crying around. You are obviously deserving of anything you get.

  • Just another load of delusional and twisted, BS.

  • Just more BS, you are wasting my time in even reading such trash.

  • shay simmons

    Prior to the 1970s measles was considered an illness of those living in poverty?

    That would be news to all of the kids who came down with the measles in my white collar, upper middle class American suburb in the early 1960’s. In fact, if you were born in the US prior to 1957, it’s assumed that you had the measles.

    http://www.cdc.gov/measles/about/faqs.html

  • AutismDadd

    If you don’t tell them, how can they enjoy it?

  • Jonathan Graham

    No, what I’ve said about your behavior is correct and easily demonstrated. However there is no difference in your responses if I link to your roadblocks and logical fallacies or not. So just pointing this out is more efficient.

    As for debating things there are literally mountains of evidence showing my posting well cited (which is the opposite of what you do) posts arguing my point and responding politely to questions and criticism. Can’t really say the same for you. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    Yawn, more of your deflection nonsense. Respond to the point Lowell.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Again your argument was that I’m presuming people are gullible however at no point in my arguments have I asked people to trust me. Your arguments, on the other hand often end in ad populum fallacies

  • Jonathan Graham

    A million studies showing the vaccine injury potential of vaccines, and the connection to autism, would never be enough for you;

    Well a) you don’t have a million studies and b) studies need to be weighed not counted. A million studies that are sufficiently weak aren’t worth anything. Bring me some statistically strong evidence and we can talk. You will have to be able to demonstrate that it is – in fact – statistically strong.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You could prove me wrong by actually responding directly to the information and references in my posts,

    The objective evidence says you’re wrong. Going through your mountains of links would be fruitless. Every time I’ve tried to discuss something with you. You throw up roadblocks. Agree to clarify things to my satisfaction and we can talk. Otherwise, this conversation is not different enough from the discussion we would have to sufficiently interest me.

    Try to be less boring.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Autism Dadd does deliberately target particular people. You can see that from his post history.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Blaming victims is a way that abusive people like yourself avoid taking responsibility for their actions. Just sayin’

  • Jonathan Graham

    Again you could easily prove me wrong by simply responding in the (much more useful) way I’ve described several times.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Wrong as usual Lowell. It’s impossible for me to waste your time.

  • Jonathan Graham

    If I don’t point out when you are abusive or harassing. How are you going to fix it?

  • Sonja Henie

    Good one!

  • JGC

    I’m not lying, Lowell.

    For example, three of the thirteen papers list Wakefield himself as sole or first author and cannot be considered to represent independent replication of his previous and retracted Lancet publication’s claims. Two are authored by Arthur Krigsman, who like Wakefield has been censured for performing medically unnecessary invasive procedures (endoscopies) on autistic children for research purposes and for conducting research without Securing IRB approval. neither of his papers present evidence supporting the existence of ‘autistic enterocolitis’ –the first paper makes no attempt to compare it’s findings in autistic children to values for a non-autistic population and the second describes proposed treatment.

    The others are a rag-tag collection of publications concerning gastrointestinal problems unrelated to vaccination or autism–for example, the Vodjani papers address food allergies and celiacdisease..

    As for using my initials instead of my full name and who I work for–did you have a point? It’s completely irrelevant to our discussion: arguments stand and fall on their own merit, not on the basis of who embraces or advances them.

  • Jonathan Graham

    This is the same way that misogyny propagates in society. We allow people to say hateful crap without so much as a “Hey, NOT cool!” then we are part of the problem.

  • JGC

    No, I just have trouble hitting the small keys on an iPhone accurately when texting. I’ll edit the response to correct the typos.

  • guest

    Did you read my comment to lazarus? I thought it was also absurd. Type this information into google and you will get multiple researchers/articles stating this.

  • guest

    Super Troll

  • guest

    Well, your and Mike Stevens continuous use of the pejorative “antivaxxer” isvery telling of your weak position. Because name calling is all you have. You either threw out a typical Dorit Reese move-saying something like ‘just how many kids do you want to get the measles? The comment you made earlier is classic Dorit. You have learned well grasshopper.

    The use of the pejorative Antivaxxer was a good tactic, is one that you people at the behest of the CDC/pharma enjoyed throwing around to minimize the concerns of people who want choice in their families medical care. But now-people don’t care. See the problem with you, mike, proponent, the MSM and the others continual use of it–has been overplayed. It’s gone on too long and lost it’s luster and effectiveness a long time ago. With the number of people turning away from vaccinating it is not serving your cause. The fact that you need to keep reminder people that there are anti-vaxxers is very revealing.

    It also backfired big time with the film VAXXED which has now being sought after overseas. Also, you have no idea what my position is in regards to this issue so either you are fishing or just blowing smoke.

    -Arch Intern Med. 1994 Aug 22;154(16):1815-20.
    Failure to reach the goal of measles elimination. Apparent paradox of measles infections in immunized persons.
    Poland GA1, Jacobson RM.
    Conclusion: The apparent paradox is that as measles immunization rates rise to high levels in a population, measles becomes a disease of immunized persons. Because of the failure rate of the vaccine and the unique transmissibility of the measles virus, the currently available measles vaccine, used in a single-dose strategy, is unlikely to completely eliminate measles. The long-term success of a two-dose strategy to eliminate measles remains to be determined. http://archinte.jamanetwork (dot) com/article.aspx?articleid=619215

    Obviously the two shot strategy isn’t working.

    “Measles To Be Eradicated in 1967 With 55% Vaccine Coverage”
    On 1st November 1966 US Government vaccine experts announced momentously to the world in a paper presented to the American Public Health Associations meeting in San Francisco, November 1,1966 that measles was to be eradicated in 1967 and just 55% vaccine coverage would do the trick. You can read it for yourself here in this formally published paper by those experts: EPIDEMIOLOGIC BASIS FOR ERADICATION OF MEASLES IN 1967. (still online)

    With the isolation of the measles virus and the development and extensive field testing of several potent and effective vaccines, the tools are at hand to eradicate the infection. With the general application of these tools during the coming months, eradication can be achieved in this country in the year 1967.

    This paper states the epidemiologic basis in support of this statement, specifies the essential conditions, and outlines the priorities for attaining this goal.“

    The experts were the Sencer and Dull with their colleague Langmuir.
    They were from the forerunner to the The US Centers For Disease Control – The Public Health Services National Communicable Disease Center of Atlanta, Ga. , USA. Dr. Sencer was chief and Dr. Dull was assistant chief of the Center. Dr. Langmuir was chief of the Epidemiology Program.

    They wrote:
    ….. it is evident that when the level of immunity was higher than 55 percent, epidemics did not develop. This is an estimate of the threshold of herd immunity providing protection to the city against a measles epidemic.
    ………
    There is no reason, however, to question the validity of the basic assumption that the occurrence of measles epidemics depends upon the balance of immunes and susceptibles, and that for all areas and special groups in this country the immune threshold is considerably less than 100 percent.

    So from 1966 to 2013 the measles vaccination programmes were based on this wisdom from the US CDC. And from 1966 to 2007 something else did not change – the CDC’s ineptitude – except when it comes to spending billions of tax dollars.

    The US CDC was castigated by the US Senate as one which “cannot demonstrate it is controlling disease“. “CDC Off Center” is an extraordinary 115 page review published in June 2007 by the US Senate on the US Centers for Disease Control:-

    A review of how an agency tasked with fighting and preventing disease has spent hundreds of millions of tax dollars for failed prevention efforts, international junkets, and lavish facilities, but cannot demonstrate it is controlling disease.” “CDC OFF CENTER“- The United States Senate Subcommittee on Federal Financial Management, Government Information and International Security, Minority Office, Under the Direction of Senator Tom Coburn, Ranking Minority Member, June 2007.

    *******So what is the score today? Health officials have kept increasing and increasing the level at which vaccine uptake is necessary to eradicate measles. Today it is 95%. Yet, the CDC provides not one single reason why 95% is a magic bullet. In fact, every time they’ve increase the vaccine uptake numbers they have never provided a scientific explanation for it. They have increased the number of times children have to be vaccinated. It was just one shot of measles vaccine and then one of MMR. Now it is two shots and teenagers and adults are also told they can be vaccinated with the MMR at any time they like. Now they are talking about adding a third shot.

    -Oxford Journals Medicine & Health Clinical Infectious Diseases
    Volume 58, Issue 9 Pp. 1205-1210.
    Outbreak of Measles Among Persons With Prior Evidence of Immunity, New York City, 2011
    Jennifer B. Rosen1, Jennifer S. Rota2, Carole J. Hickman2, Sun B. Sowers2, Sara Mercader2, Paul A. Rota2, William J. Bellini2, Ada J. Huang3, Margaret K. Doll1, Jane R. Zucker1,2, and Christopher M. Zimmerman1
    A fully vaccinated 22-year-old theater employee in New York City who developed the measles in 2011 was released without hospitalization or quarantine. But like Typhoid Mary, this patient turned out to be unwittingly contagious. Ultimately, she transmitted the measles to four other people, according to a recent report in Clinical Infectious Diseases that tracked symptoms in the 88 people with whom “Measles Mary” interacted while she was sick.” – American Association for the Advancement of Science (AAAS), 2014

    -PLoS study: “Difficulties in eliminating measles and controlling rubella and mumps: a cross-sectional study of a first measles and rubella vaccination and a second measles, mumps, and rubella vaccination,” has brought to light the glaring ineffectiveness of two measles vaccines (measles–rubella (MR) or measles–mumps–rubella (MMR) ) in fulfilling their widely claimed promise of preventing outbreaks in highly vaccine compliant populations.
    China has one of the most vaccination compliant populations in the world. In fact, measles vaccine is mandatory. So why have they had over 700 measles outbreaks from 2009 and 2012 alone? “The reported coverage of the measles-rubella (MR) or measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine is greater than 99.0% in Zhejiang province. However, the incidence of measles, mumps, and rubella remains high.”

    -“The largest measles epidemic in North America in the last decade, occurred in 2011 in Quebec, Canada, where rates of 1- and 2-dose vaccine coverage among children 3 years of age were 95%-97% and 90%, respectively, with 3%-5% unvaccinated.” “Among adolescents, 22% had received 2 vaccine doses. Outbreak investigation showed this proportion to have been an underestimate; active case finding identified 130% more cases among 2-dose recipients.”
    Largest measles epidemic in North America in a decade–Quebec, Canada, 2011: contribution of susceptibility, serendipity, and superspreading events.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih (dot) gov/pubmed/23264672

    -Major Measles Epidemic in Quebec Despite 99% Vaccination Coverage
    Boulianne N, De Serres G, Duval B, Joly JR, Meyer F, Déry P, Alary M, Le Hénaff D, Thériault N. Département de santé communautaire, Centre Hospitalier de l’Université Laval. [Major measles epidemic in the region of Quebec despite a 99% vaccine coverage] [Article in French]. Can J Public health. 1991 May-Jun;82(3):189-90

    -Transmission of measles among a highly vaccinated school population–Anchorage, Alaska, 1998. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9921727&dopt=Abstract

    “This was the largest outbreak of measles in the United States
    since 1996. 33 confirmed measles cases were reported to the Anchorage Department of Health and Human Services and the Alaska Department of Health and Social Services (ADHSS). Of these, 26 cases were confirmed by positive rubeola IgM antibody test, and seven met the clinical case definition.”

    -J Infect Dis. 2001 Feb 15;183(4):532-8. Epub 2001 Jan 18.
    Prolonged measles virus shedding in human immunodeficiency virus-infected children, detected by reverse transcriptase-polymerase chain reaction.
    Permar SR1, Moss WJ, Ryon JJ, Monze M, Cutts F, Quinn TC, Griffin DE.

    Abstract
    A reverse transcriptase-polymerase chain reaction assay was used to detect measles virus RNA in peripheral blood mononuclear cells, urine, and nasopharyngeal specimens from Zambian children during hospitalization and approximately 1-2 months after discharge. Of 47 children, 29 (61.7%) had prolonged measles virus shedding, as defined by detection of measles virus RNA in > or =1 specimen obtained 30-61 days after rash onset. Ten (90.9%) of 11 human immunodeficiency virus (HIV)-infected children had prolonged measles virus shedding, compared with 19 (52.8%) of 36 HIV-uninfected children (P=.02). Prolonged measles virus shedding did not correlate with levels of measles virus-specific antibody. HIV-infected children with measles may have a prolonged infectious period that potentially enhances measles virus transmission and hinders measles control.

    – Eurosurveillance, Volume 18, Issue 49, 05 December 2013
    Rapid communications
    Case of vaccine-associated measles five weeks post-immunisation, British Columbia, Canada, October 2013

    Citation style for this article: Murti M, Krajden M, Petric M, Hiebert J, Hemming F, Hefford B, Bigham M, Van Buynder P. Case of vaccine-associated measles five weeks post-immunisation, British Columbia, Canada, October 2013. Euro Surveill. 2013;18(49):pii=20649. Available online: http://www.eurosurveillance.org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=20649
    Date of submission: 15 November 2013

    -“We report here the case of a child presenting with fever 8 days after vaccination with a measles-mumps-rubella vaccine. Measles virus was isolated in a throat swab taken 4 days after fever onset. This virus was then further genetically characterized as a vaccine-type virus.” – PubMed – National Center for Biotechnology Information, 2002 Vaccine. 2002 Feb 22;20(11-12):1541-3.
    Detection of measles vaccine in the throat of a vaccinated child.
    Morfin F1, Beguin A, Lina B, Thouvenot D.)

    -Two Fully Vaccinated Doctors Get Measles (2009)
    A measles outbreak in 2009 exposed and infected two physicians, both of whom had been fully vaccinated with two doses of the MMR vaccine. These physicians were suspected of having been infected by treating patients diagnosed with measles. [5]
    http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/204/suppl_1/S559.full.pdf+html

    -Measles elimination efforts and 2008-2011 outbreak, France. Emerg Infect Dis. 2013 Mar;19(3):357-64. doi: 10.3201/eid1903.121360. PubMed PMID: 23618523; PubMed Central PMCID: PMC3647670.
    In 2013, Eurosurveillance published a report of vaccine strain measles occurring weeks after MMR vaccination in Canada. Authors stated, “We describe a case of measles mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine-associated measles illness that was positive by both PCR and IgM, five weeks after administration of the MMR vaccine.” The case involved a two-year-old child, who developed runny nose, fever, cough, macular rash and conjunctivitis after vaccination and tested positive for vaccine strain measles virus infection in throat swab and blood tests.[3] Canadian health officials authoring the report raised the question of whether there are unidentified cases of vaccine strain measles infections and the need to know more about how long measles vaccine strain shedding lasts. They concluded that the case they reported “likely represents the existence of additional, but unidentified, exceptions to the typical timeframe for measles vaccine virus shedding and illness.” They added that “further investigation is needed on the upper limit of measles vaccine virus shedding based on increased sensitivity of the RT-PCR-based detection technologies and immunological factors associated with vaccine-associated measles illness and virus shedding.”

    -Virus Res. 2015 Jan 22;196:122-7. doi: 10.1016/j.virusres.2014.11.015. Epub 2014 Nov 20.
    Measles virus genetic evolution throughout an imported epidemic outbreak in a highly vaccinated population.
    Muñoz-Alía MÁ1, Fernández-Muñoz R2, Casasnovas JM3, Porras-Mansilla R1, Serrano-Pardo Á1, Pagán I4, Ordobás M5, Ramírez R5, Celma ML1.
    Abstract

    Measles virus circulates endemically in African and Asian large urban populations, causing outbreaks worldwide in populations with up-to-95% immune protection. We studied the natural genetic variability of genotype B3.1 in a population with 95% vaccine coverage throughout an imported six month measles outbreak. From first pass viral isolates of 47 patients we performed direct sequencing of genomic cDNA. Whilst no variation from index case sequence occurred in the Nucleocapsid gene hyper-variable carboxy end, in the Hemagglutinin gene, main target for neutralizing antibodies, we observed gradual nucleotide divergence from index case along the outbreak (0% to 0.380%, average 0.138%) with the emergence of transient and persistent non-synonymous and synonymous mutations. Little or no variation was observed between the index and last outbreak cases in Phosphoprotein, Nucleocapsid, Matrix and Fusion genes. Most of the H non-synonymous mutations were mapped on the protein surface near antigenic and receptors binding sites. We estimated a MV-Hemagglutinin nucleotide substitution rate of 7.28 × 10-6 substitutions/site/day by a Bayesian phylogenetic analysis. The dN/dS analysis did not suggest significant immune or other selective pressures on the H gene during the outbreak. These results emphasize the usefulness of MV-H sequence analysis in measles epidemiological surveillance and elimination programs, and in detection of potentially emergence of measles virus neutralization-resistant mutants.

    -A measles outbreak in early 1989 among approximately 4200 (fully vaccinated) students at a high school and two intermediate schools in suburban Houston, TX, was investigated to evaluate reasons for vaccine failure and to predict the efficacy of a booster dose of measles vaccine. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pu

    -J Clin Microbiol. 1995 Sep;33(9):2485-8.
    Detection of measles virus RNA in urine specimens from vaccine recipients.
    Rota PA1, Khan AS, Durigon E, Yuran T, Villamarzo YS, Bellini WJ.

    -Epidemic Measles in a Highly Vaccinated Population
    D. Michael Shasby, M.D., Thomas C. Shope, M.D., Harry Downs, M.S., Kenneth L. Herrmann, M.D., and Jane Polkowski, M.D., M.P.H.
    N Engl J Med 1977; 296:585-589March 17, 1977DOI: 10.1056/NEJM197703172961102

    -Scand J Infect Dis. 1997;29(2):187-90.
    Five cases of measles secondary vaccine failure with confirmed seroconversion after live measles vaccination.
    Hirose M1, Hidaka Y, Miyazaki C, Ueda K, Yoshikawa H.

    -Measles Outbreak among Vaccinated High School Students — Illinois
    17 high school students came down with measles even though 99% of the high school got the MMR vaccine.
    http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000359.htm

    -Corpus Christi Texas high school where 14 students came down with measles after 99% of the student population received the MMR shot. And that’s from the New England Journal of Medicine.
    http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM198703263161303

    -Vaccinated Children Cause Whooping Cough Outbreak In Florida
    A group of vaccinated children in Florida is now at the center of a whooping cough (pertussis) outbreak. A report released by the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases have tracked a whooping cough outbreak all the way back to 2013. More than two dozen Florida preschoolers were diagnosed with the illness. Included are two staff members and 11 other family members. Almost all the children in the preschool were listed as vaccinated from pertussis.

    Pertussis vaccine doesn’t work either:
    -Meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors, Office of Infectious Diseases Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Tom Harkins Global Communication Center Atlanta, Georgia December 11-12, 2013.

    FDA issued a warning regarding this crucial finding. Furthermore, the 2013 meeting of the Board of Scientific Counselors at the CDC revealed additional alarming data that pertussis variants (PRN negative strains) currently circulating in the USA acquired a selective advantage to infect those who are up to date for their DTap boosters (see appendix) for the CDC document Item#3), meaning that people who are up to date are more likely to be infected and thus contagious than people who are not vaccinated.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    Such a long post, and yet, the quote you claimed from Dr Poland is nowhere to be found. But humans don’t like to admit they have been duped.

    We’ve seen all these articles before. You don’t read them; you find short summaries and links on antivax disinformation sites curated for the purpose. That way, you don’t have to struggle with such plain facts as

    Two-dose recipients had milder illness and a significantly lower risk of hospitalization than those who were unvaccinated or single-dose recipients.

    which appears in the last paper (Quebec) you cited, right after the part you did quote. Why did you stop there? And you also left out that even though 95-97% of the population was vaccinated, a majority of the sick were unvaccinated. That must be why the authors conclude

    In this regard, unvaccinated individuals remain the top priority for immunization programs, but elimination goals require that we also anticipate, assess, and address residual vulnerability in 2-dose vaccine recipients.

    Antivaxxers are dishonest.

  • guest

    There are no anitvaxxers or an anitvaxxers movement:

    There is no Anti-Vaccination Movement
    https://leviquackenboss(dot)wordpress.com/2015/01/03/there-is-no-anti-vaccination-movement/

    Your hail Mary use of the the pejorative antivaxxers has fallen far far short.

  • Andrew Lazarus

    It’s telling that “dishonest” doesn’t bother you—manufacturing a non-existent quote—but “antivaxer” does.

  • AutismDadd

    Yeah sure

  • AutismDadd

    If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. I think Abraham Lincoln said that.

  • AutismDadd

    Who’s criteria? Oh yea those who make vaccines ALSO create the criteria for what isn’t an injury. A conflict of interest perhaps?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Yet you do harass people. So you should fix that.

  • [The others are a rag-tag collection of publications concerning gastrointestinal problems unrelated to vaccination or autism-]

    That reply is FALSE, and there are many studies there that explore the MMR gastrointestinal problems, autism link, and none of those are connected to Wakefield.

    No reply here can be taken seriously and/or in any honesty when the first paragraph is and amounts to nothing more than an attempt at nothing but false discreditation, refusal of the studies, and attempted character assassination. You are still lying and ignoring that long list of studies on that reference page. You simply can not be and refuse to be wrong. Those studies ARE being ignored, and their significance is obviously being ignored, so just admit it.

  • I see you are again flaunting your sick level of demeaning arrogance.

    You clearly have serious problem with your level of double standards hypocrisy. Demanding what you have never done, and can and will never do, yourself. You refuse entirely the large bulk of studies and data showing directly how vaccines injuries are happening, and as well as to the vaccine connection to autism. Its NOT just one study, it is the combination of realizing the depth of all combined studies and the scientific explanation data by experts, on these said issues. Of course in your world if it is not pro-vaccine information it is all simply off the table. Each and every time, you just simply move the goal posts to avoid facing and addressing directly any of the information. And yes, repeatedly dealing with someone as obviously in denial and as twisted as you, is a waste of my time.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’m just pointing out that it’s impossible for me to waste your time. If you have more profitable business elsewhere then I would expect you to do the rational thing and do that. Ergo you can only be here – rationally – if this is the most profitable use of your time.

    Or if you admit you’re being irrational. QED. Logic – learn it sometine Lowell.

  • Why have you not responded directly to the information that has already been put up here? Until you do that, there is no chance I am letting you avoid that, and by your simply moving the goal posts. You were told before, I will not play your in denial, twisted, ignoring the evidence, and antagonizing games.

  • So you tell me that and accuse me of that just because AutismDadd made a reply to you? Who is following you and where? And you are a claiming to be VICTIM? And after the endless and repeated antagonizing of me, and other reply posters here that you have done. “LOL” Lets have a large PITY party for you, I can bring you a nice set of crying towels and pint of Jack Daniels so maybe you can acquire some testicular fortitude for a least a while.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You were questioning if I’m the person I claim to be which was:

    I represent someone who will look at an argument when it is well presented. Short clear citations framed in an argument with a clear hypotheses and a clear argument that forces that conclusion.

    The only clear way to refute that is to post in the way that I describe. Which is, far more useful than the way you do. :-)

    Why have you not responded directly to the information that has already been put up here?

    This has zero bearing on the point-at-hand. Which was, am I the kind of person I described myself to be. Whether I respond to a poorly phrased argument (Lowell posting style) does not necessitate that I will not respond to a well phrased or simply better phrased argument.

    there is no chance I am letting you avoid that,

    Actually that’s precisely what you are doing. You are creating a situation where there is zero value in reading your long list of studies. That your argument is going to be poorly defined and riddled with logical fallacies and footdragging. As long as you do that you give me the perfect reason not to bother.

    …which of course you know and is exactly, precisely and always what you want. :-)

  • Just respond directly to the information and those long lists of studies. That was all you had to do, and so instead you simply ignored it all and you failed to do so, now claiming it would be fruitless. And who do you think is actually going to believe your twisted rants? The only roadblock to anything here at all, exists within your own in denial and must refuse the information, mind. The ONLY roadblock here is within your own mind. And you can’t yet, comprehend that?

  • Jonathan Graham

    So you tell me that and accuse me of that just because AutismDadd made a reply to you?

    Abuse is abuse. Abuse enablers are abuse enablers. You do both from time to time.

    Who is following you and where?

    Autism Dadd sniffs around specific people and makes short disparaging posts on a large swath of their posts across multiple message boards. Again you only need to look at his posting history to see that.

    And you are a claiming to be VICTIM?

    The object of someone’s abuse is always the victim.

    And after the endless and repeated antagonizing of me,

    Lowell we’ve already discussed this I have every right to politely respond to your posts and to point out when you are being abusive. None of that is being antagonistic.

    You have repeatedly used abusive and derogatory speech, attempted to blame me for it. You have a socialization problem. Figure it out.

  • I have shown and directed you to reference pages to directly appropriate lists of applicable studies, and which those total number studies would number I would estimate to be close to 300 studies. And here you are still finding every false excuse in the book to ignore it all.

  • Jonathan Graham

    The ONLY roadblock here is within your own mind. And you can’t yet, comprehend that?

    Only in the sense that I don’t do leisure activities I don’t enjoy. I like a good discussion, even a mediocre one. I like discussing research with people, even someone with an opposing view. However all of this requires some commitment to making their argument sufficiently clear to me and to conform to the rules of logic. Neither thing you are interested in. So how can that discussion be fruitful?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Again bring me a study that is statistically strong and I’ll read it. However you have less than zero clue what that means….so here we are.

  • shay simmons

    Your failure to provide corroboration noted.

  • You twist and spin the truth like it came straight from the devils tongue. That’s right, you do somehow in your narrow mind, still think that there is yet some deceived and gullible soul left out there somewhere that will believe your posted trash. You see the only people that have and ever will give you a “like” on your posts are those other shills that do what you do, and/or people who must continue to support the false vaccine propaganda. People looking for and supporting the actual vaccine truth, are basically turned off by your take over of this sites reply posting section. You have basically ruined that, and you know that is the only reason you are here; to endlessly and repeated, distract and disrupt any and all honest and diligent debate.

  • Yawn all you want. No one has ever persistently deflected away from the real vaccine truth like you have, and you have had some close competitors.

  • You have actually cited nothing, and much more that has not been obviously shot down. You have had no mountains of evidence, ever.

    I am really getting beyond tired of reading of your twisted lies and delusions. Wow, and just how beyond pathetic are you, and can you actually get?

  • Jonathan Graham

    You twist and spin the truth

    Don’t think I can show where you make these logical flaws? Go ahead call. So no, I don’t spin. I’m honest and without guile and that’s why I beat you every time.

    Why am I here? Because it’s a hobby. That little Dan Brown novel you spin in your head full of intrigue where you are so important? It’s like all the other Dan Brown stuff….fiction.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You had a question. I answered it. You went on to talk about something else. You deflected. QED.

  • Just more of your twisted lies and literal insanity, again going on here..Nothing new to see here. Same old same old.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You have actually cited nothing,

    I do, you even commented on one of my cites earlier.

    I am really getting beyond tired of reading

    That’s a complete lie. I’m giving you exactly what you want most. The ability to fume and screech and swear but without actually having to think. If you look at your post history you spend more time responding to me than anyone else here. I am giving you what you want. QED. Boom! :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    Again you are refusing to continue the discussion after I answered your question. You are deflecting.

  • You have it wrong, the ONLY people who are important are the infants, children and adults who will be at risk of vaccine injuries. I do this free of charge and have never made a dime on it. I do it because it is needed, and it is right.

    Again as much as you want to attack me personally as to the mission of vaccine truth I have been on; it has nothing to do with me. It is all only about the needed information, and only that. If you think what I have gone through since I started this, is somehow some sort of importance trip, the you do not have a clue. Just keep twisting the reality of it all, and all you want; and if it makes you feel better about yourself. And I have read enough of your insanity filled rants, for one day. So, just keep on posting away with more of your trash filled replies.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You have it wrong, the ONLY people who are important are the infants, children and adults who will be at risk of vaccine injuries. I do this free of charge and have never made a dime on it. I do it because it is needed, and it is right.

    What you just wrote is a narrative which raises you up as an important defender of the helpless. Yes Lowell, you live in a story where you have written yourself in as the hero

    Again as much as you want to attack me personally

    Lowell I’m not attacking you. Again that’s part of the little story you tell yourself. I am being critical of you. There’s a difference. Not to mention if you want to talk about something else. Then post one study and promise to clarify your position to my satisfaction. Otherwise, talking about your social problems is really no less interesting.

    If you think what I have gone through since I started this, is somehow some sort of importance trip,

    The phrase is “ego trip” and yeah that’s what this is.

  • JGC

    No, the NVICP established the criteria which must be met for an adverse consequence to be included on the list of table injuries, AD, and the NVICP has not and does not manufacture or sell vaccines.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Cash’s grandmother, Gaela Fisher, is a former Labor & Delivery Nurse (LPN) and she is currently working as a Certified Labor Doula. Gaela is concerned about her other grandchildren, some of whom are redheads like Cash was. She is concerned there isn’t enough research to understand if redheaded children are more susceptible to vaccine injuries due to a genetic defect they carry in their MCR1 gene.

    Redheads have a variant of the human MCR1 gene. The MCR1 gene plays a role in the brain’s central functions. This gene variant affects melanin production and leads to the individual being more or less likely to feel pain while under anesthesia. Many doctors are aware that redheads may require a different dose of anesthesia because of their pain tolerance or intolerance.

    I’ll just point out that MCR-1 is a gene found in yeast, not people. What you’re referring to is the MC1R gene, in partciular the alleles Arg151Cys, Arg160Trp, Asp294His, and Arg142His.

    Also why are you asking a L&D nurse’s opinion on the amount of research required to determine if redheads have some unspecified problems with vaccination? Why is this persons opinion important? Especially since they (or the author of the article) can’t seem to differentiate between a genotype and a phenotype. See because the red hair alleles are recessive about 25% of the population have it. Meaning if there was a significant problem we would have seen it just by studying the general population in any reasonably powered study.

  • Ron Roy

    Even the so called mainstream experts are clueless about vaccines. They simply repeat what the drug companies tell them. Do some research and learn:http://www.whale.to/a/lie_tested.html

  • Ron Roy

    I can hardly wait until Johnny says Whale? blah, blah, blah. These vaccine promoters are deathly afraid that the information on Whale will get around.

  • LiLi
  • Jonathan Graham

    Ron, you haven’t done any research to see if whale.to is correct. You barely read anything you post. So you are just regurgitating what they are saying. Hypocrite much?

  • LiLi

    I’m reading these all, one by one. So far, you’ve posted links to articles which cite themselves, anecdotes,studies with remarkable small sample sizes, studies which were never replicated, posts authored by PsyDs who are not trained in medicine- trying to sell some book, articles focusing on heavy metal toxicity, studies that do not mention the words shot-vaccine-or immunization once, studies deemed flawed by the scientific community, etc. I’ll keep going untill I’ve read them all. I just wonder, what is your level of education? How are you interpreting these studies and articles? Do you even know what half of this stuff means? How can you differentiate a credible source from bunk? Did you actually read any of these shit links you posted?

  • Sonja Henie

    I used to work in L&D. There are lots of “old wives tales” floating around L&D departments, especially about redheads.

  • LiLi

    The majority focus on thimerosal as the culprit. Can you tell me why autism rates continues to rise despite the removal of thimerosal as a preservative from most childhood vaccines? How about the whole “aborted fetus cells”?!? https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/aborted-fetal-tissue-and-vaccines-combining-pseudoscience-and-religion-to-demonize-vaccines-2/

  • Jonathan Graham

    We are a mystical bunch. I’m not really that red anymore but I was as a child. I carry the Arg151Cys allele.

  • LiLi

    Ra-men

  • LiLi

    Why should Jonathan be banned, Lowell?

  • LiLi

    The above questions come from a posting titled: 9 Questions That Stump Every Pro-Vaccine Advocate and Their Claims. You are not even asking your own questions, guest.

  • LiLi

    “independent scientific justification on how bypassing the respiratory tract (or mucous membrane) is advantageous and how directly injecting viruses into the bloodstream enhances immune functioning and prevents future infections?”
    Answer: “Vaccines are not injected into the blood stream, they are infected into the soft tissues. At a simple level, an infection enters to body, the body makes a variety of antibodies to the constituent parts of the infecting organism and next time the patient is exposed, the pre-existing antibody can, if there is a match with new strain, inactivate the new infection.

    It doesn’t matter how the antigen is presented to the immune system, the response is the same. Natural influenza, inhaled influenza vaccine, or injected influenza vaccine, the same antibody will be made to the proteins.”

  • LiLi

    “an Independent double-blind, placebo-controlled study that can prove the safety and effectiveness of vaccines?”

    Answer: “Efficacy of 23-valent pneumococcal vaccine in preventing pneumonia and improving survival in nursing home residents: double blind, randomised and placebo controlled trial” http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20211953

  • Sonja Henie

    I have a redhead. My hair is (well was) very dark brown, and my spouse’s was light brown. DD’s hair is still very auburn.

  • LiLi

    “a(n) Independent scientific evidence on ANY study which can confirm the long-term safety and effectiveness of vaccines?”

    Answer: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17989383
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12925846
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11505437

  • LiLi

    “independent scientific evidence which can prove that disease reduction in any part of the world, at any point in history was attributable to inoculation of populations?”

    Answer: http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=209448#ArticleInformation

  • LiLi

    “independent scientific justification as to how injecting a human being with a confirmed neurotoxin is beneficial to human health and prevents disease?”

    Answer: “I presume the issue is mercury. Maybe aluminum. The latter is not in most vaccines, although as been discussed at length on this blog, the amount of mercury and aluminum found in vaccines is minimal and, at the dosing and formulation, has never been demonstrated to cause neurotoxicity from vaccines. Of course, I am old school and think there is a dose response effect of drugs, and that a greater amount leads to a greater response. Most naturopaths receive extensive training in homeopathy, where the less the amount, the greater the response. So I would presume arguments based on chemistry would have little meaning to an ND, although I would not want my appletini made by a practitioner of homeopathy.

    Of course, it is not the ‘neurotoxin’ that is being used to prevent disease, but the antigens of the potential infection. That is assuming that the author of the nine questions does not consider the antigens to be neurotoxins, and to judge from his understanding of disease later in the post, I am not so certain he warrants the benefit of the doubt.”

  • LiLi

    guest, do you have any questions, using your own ideas and own words, regarding vaccines? Genuine, honest questions about how the immune/complement system works in relation to vaccines? It seems like you have some real curiosity here, but have had your head turned by sensationalists. We can help you learn. The first thing is learning about the scientific method and whether something qualifies as “scientific.” If an idea is not testable, repeatable, observable, and falsifiable, it is not considered scientific. https://answersingenesis.org/what-is-science/what-is-science/
    This is the first step. There’s no shame in being new to these concepts. But if you really, truly want the truth, understand what truth is, how it is verified and measured. And, as my old bio prof said on that long ago, stormy night before the final exam, “No anecdotes.”

  • LiLi

    By the way, here is the link for the quotes answers: https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/nine-questions-nine-answers/

  • Sonja Henie

    Are you left-handed? My daughter is. I’ve “heard” that a lot of redheads are lefties. Someone told me Thomas Jefferson was left-handed.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Right handed. A quick search seems to imply that handedness is genetically multifactorial. It’s heritability is apparently only 24% http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0028393208003722

  • Jonathan Graham

    Here’s a fun litmus. There are about twelve papers there. Search each one for “n=” (and “n =”) and then look at the numbers you get.

    n = 127
    n = 23
    n = 21
    n = 43

    I’ve omitted one n=36 from Wakefield’s review of the Denmark study and one other paper of Wakefields because the link was broken. The largest population looked at in these papers is 127 (which started with a sample of 143 IIRC and then excluded some).

    So only four (five if you count Wakefield’s review) of the twelve are actually doing any science and only one of them is looking at a sample greater than 100.

    Which should make us wonder…why are we looking at such incredibly low powered work? Why isn’t there just one study in the 10 000s or even the 1 000s? Should we assume this is the BEST evidence for their position? If so, then it doesn’t tell us very much.

  • AutismDadd

    What a clueless clown. Who set up and runs NVICP??

  • JGC

    The United States Department of Health and Human Services.

  • AutismDadd

    And what’s their involvement regarding vaccines?

  • JGC

    Other than operating the NVICP program, allowing for streamlined no-fault compensation to families claiming vaccine injuries? You tell me–but I sincerely hope this is going somewhere other than into the gray mists of conspiracy theory.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Actually, the first step to gathering scientific evidence is observation.

    Sorta. Pure unstructured observation is better suited to generate a hypothesis not confirm one. What the article claims and what Tiny hands was responding to was that someone believed that this child’s death was confirmation of their instincts being correct.

    you would not have all the cold hard facts, but you would say “hmm…I gave it poison and it died..perhaps it died from the poison”.

    What the article actually says is

    They entrusted the doctors with their infant son and know the vaccines led to his breathing problems and ultimately his death.

    It doesn’t say perhaps anywhere it says they know.

  • Let’s see:

    Chance of a vaccine injury is one in a million per NVICP cases x 1 in 68 autistic kids. So 1 in 68 million people would be expected to both be autistic and be vaccine-injured by chance alone.

  • AutismDadd

    Right, as far as you go its a trip to Shill Land with the same blah blah.

  • joe

    Will I live long enough to see you make one EDUCATED post? and NO,Crapola is not it.

  • Ron Roy

    Joe you’re out of your league. Get away from your computer.

  • Ron Roy

    Oh so vitamin C doesn’t prevent scurvy and vitamin B1 ( Thiamine ) doesn’t prevent Beriberi or that vitamin A will prevent someone from getting measles? In that case the Helen Keller Foundation has been wrong in giving people in third world countries vitamin A to prevent blindness from measles.

  • Jonathan Graham

    As usual I have to remind you of your own thesis….

    Boosting the immune system with naturally occurring vitamin C or E or D3

    You are talking about the immune system. A disease like scurvy isn’t caused by a problem with the immune system it’s caused by a deficiency of ascorbic acid and you definitely don’t need it to be naturally occurring.

    vitamin A will prevent someone from getting measles

    Unlikely. Vitamin A deficiency contributes to delayed recovery, high rate of post-measles complications and measles itself may create a vitamin A deficiency. http://www.who.int/wer/2009/wer8435.pdf There is some evidence to suggest that it may prevent mortality. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11869601
    It’s AFAIK standard-of-care to give vitamin A to children who are hospitalized with measles. However there appear to be no large trials showing prevention.

    Preventing mortality and avoiding illnesses due to denying your body of chemicals needed for normal function are not boosting your immune system.

  • Jonathan Graham

    He’s right in a sense, Autism Dadd is even more frightened than you are about actually engaging on an issue. The vast majority of Autism Dadd’s posts are just backbiting with no substance.

  • Ron Roy

    You didn’t address the Helen Keller Foundation specifically. Why does it give vitamin A to prevent measles if it, according to you and not science, doesn’t PREVENT measles. Nutrients are the whole of the immune system period. Your employers have spent a fortune trying to downplay that fact because they would rather have people believe that their drugs are the answer to all our health problems. I’m 71 and I’d be willing to compare my overall health to yours any day. Blood pressure excellent ( two years ago it was 125 / 80 ) and no I didn’t go to a doctor. Cholesterol I haven’t a clue, it has 0 bearing on heart disease anyway. Resting heart rate averages 60, oxygen 98, eyesight 20/20. Now go and have some more chips and coke.

  • Ron Roy

    OMG you’ll back up those poison pushers to your grave. If there is some sort of reward or punishment after death I wouldn’t want to be in your shoes. You really don’t have a conscience do you?

  • Ron Roy

    I see you haven’t because anyone with any common sense can grasp the truth when they see it. I’ve read everything that I post. Whale contains hundreds of studies / papers and personal observations written by HONEST scientist, doctors ( a rare breed ) and historians. I will keep posting links to Whale on every medium available to me much to the chagrin of you poison pushers.

  • Jonathan Graham

    You didn’t address the Helen Keller Foundation specifically

    You didn’t cite them specifically.

    Why does it give vitamin A to prevent measles if it, according to you and not science, doesn’t PREVENT measles

    So according to you if I create an organization and as a program I give people Twinkies. Then Twinkies must prevent measles as well? I have no idea what the motives of the Helen Keller Foundation are nor do they matter. Either there is science supporting the hypothesis or there isn’t. So far it seems that there isn’t and you can’t provide any. :-)

    I’m 71 and I’d be willing to compare my overall health to yours any day.

    Ok.

    Blood pressure excellent ( two years ago it was 125 / 80 )

    The kids forced me into a BP cuff on Sunday – 120/79. My resting heart rate is about 63. I have no idea what my oxygen is.

    So all your efforts yield nothing. Congratulations.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I’m not backing anyone up. I’m simply pointing out what is and is not science. When these people said

    They entrusted the doctors with their infant son and know the vaccines led to his breathing problems and ultimately his death.

    Their statement had nothing to do with science.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I see you haven’t because anyone with any common sense can grasp the truth when they see it

    In other words you agree with me. You have done ZERO research on the information at whale.to and you simply regurgitate it. Right? That’s Right isn’t it? You don’t appear to be saying anything different, Not one shred of investigation. Right? :-)

    I will keep posting links to Whale on every medium available to me much to the chagrin of you poison pushers.

    …and you will keep pretending that I have a problem with you posting this in order to feel like you’re the hero in some story that you tell yourself.

  • guest

    Anti-vaxxer. Anti-vaxxer. Anti-vaxx . Anti-vax. anti-va. anti-v. anti. ant. an. a. ………………………….—————————————-

    Notice the more you use the pejorative it loses it’s meaning and impact which happened a long time ago. Now with you and your ilk constant use of the word it’s a red flag of a troll because you people have nothing else. Anti-vaxxer (see I can type it and the world doesn’t end) is a construct of the CDC’s little-known Epidemic Intelligence Service (EIS). This is the CDC’s version of the CIA/NSA all rolled up into one. Their soul purpose is to create medical realities out of thin air. People who are in this dept actually get their training at Langley along with trainees for the CIA. Surgeons General; CDC directors; medical school deans and professors; medical foundation executives; drug-company and insurance executives; state health officials; medical editors and reporters in media outlets all spent time there to lean how to spin and create all types of realities from nothing. They manufacture relevance out of the blue which creates distraction to sucker the world population-not just in the US. These people lie so well they make the Devil jealous if there is one.

    They created the pejorative–anti-vaxxer. As I stated-it’s been overplayed.

    Oh, this is for the readers you call Lurkers.

  • JGC

    Tell you what, Ron: identify what you believe to represent the single most credible, most compelling study you’ve found on whale-to indicating the risks associated with routine vaccination exceed the risks associated with remaining vulnerable to the infectious diseases they protect against and we’ll discuss it here.

  • guest

    Science based medicine is a pharm paid shrill site and I don’t go there because I have been attacked by blogger “Orac” allows free reign. Also, if they are the answers I think they are, I’ve seen those from the original writer.

  • guest

    Lili can you post all you comments in one post? It would be easier to respond.

    I don’t know how long you have been posting on comment boards but what happens over many many responses is demands for specific quotes, studies, statements dates, times etc are made so to expedite the process-I post what has already been reported. Why reinvent the wheel when what has happened many many times is the demand for the original source. It’s saves time. Also, by providing the actual information others who do not have the information can copy it and do their own readings from it. It’s a way of sharing info. It’s the way I blog and as I have told others if it bothers you simply don’t read it or respond to it. Many people over the last few years have thanked me for the information as I thanked you for your contributions. However if how I blog bothers you OK. I guess we will not be interacting online.

  • guest

    I presume the issue is mercury. Maybe aluminum.
    There are no studies that state any mount of thimerosal or aluminum are safe. Thimerosal is in vaccines in trace amounts. Dr. Boyd Haley states that because the vaccines solution is so contaminated sterilizing is a big problem. This is admitted by the Vaccine industry. In order to de-contaminate them thimerosal is added and than removed however he states all of it cannot be removed in the final process thus trace amounts that the CDC admits to. Rea:
    Fear of the Invisible and The Vaccine Papers by Janine Roberts who attended over a decade of govermnet level vaccine meetings and workshops and reported on them. She quotes many of the vaccine scientist’s concerns about contamination.

  • guest

    Funding/Support:
    The authors were employees of the US federal government (Centers for
    Disease Control and Prevention [CDC]) when this work was conducted and
    prepared for publication. No funding/support was received from other
    sources.

  • guest

    Government grants. You need to follow the money sources.

  • guest

    this was tossed about last year. It is funded by the Japanese government which controls all health care in the country.

  • guest

    Answer: “Vaccines are not injected into the blood stream, they are
    infected into the soft tissues.

    Never said they were injected into the blood stream but they do enter via the small capillaries.

    In 1995, Golding and Scott,2 published the need for strategies to make vaccines that would generate the “required” Th cell to the corresponding microorganism. Since that time, attempts to produce vaccines that would generate a “natural”- type response have failed. So, we are left with vaccines that generate “protective” responses as a second choice. How does this work? In vaccine-induced Th2 responses, called humoral responses, the body produces large quantities of specific antibodies that block the virus from entering cells. This response is why a vaccinated child doesn’t get a full blown infection and why the child won’t spread as many viruses into the environment. However, antibodies cannot get into cells to
    eliminate viruses once the viruses are in the cells or cannot kill infected cells themselves. Therefore, the body has no choice other than
    to internalize the virus and be chronically infected when the body is forced into a Th2 antibody response. The body is essentially constipated
    with viruses that it cannot expel!

    Golding & Scott are scientist with the FDA. They were working for the FDA when they wrote this. They are also mentioned in the book I suggested to you: Fear of the Invisible.

  • guest

    I know where the questions are from. Never have taken credit for creating the questions. Like I said why reinvent the wheel. The question have been around for a few years so no one is surprised by them.

  • JGC

    “Why does it give vitamin A to prevent measles if it, according to you and not science, doesn’t PREVENT measles.”

    Because although vitamin A supplementation does not protect against measles infection, once infected vitamin A supplementation is protective against measles associated pneumonia. See http://www.who.int/elena/titles/bbc/vitamina_pneumonia_children/en/

  • guest

    Corroboration to what?

    Reading comprehension is fun.

  • LiLi

    Nope, but thanks

  • Pacifying the public? You can still sue afterwards, after all.

  • Not deathly afraid. More like ‘laugh at people who think whale.to is a credible source of information’.

    If we were deathly afraid of whale.to getting around…wouldn’t we at least attempt to censor it?

  • Don’t trust the CDC/FDA or Pharma companies but the package inserts and VIS written by Pharma Companies and regulated by the FDA are perfect and flawless? REALLY?

  • Ron Roy

    This is just a small sample of what just one doctor( Dr. med. Gerhard Buchwald )has to say about vaccines. O[15 February 1920 – 19 July 2009. And all on Whale you know the site / articles I don’t read. I hope everyone following this discussion does.

    Dr. med. Gerhard Buchwald,
    was a specialist for internal medicine and lung diseases. For four decades he
    campaigned tirelessly for freedom of information and freedom of choice
    concerning vaccinations. He gave about 500 lectures and wrote about 200 scientific papers concerning vaccinations and damage
    caused by vaccinations. He has also provided about 150 medical assessments of
    cases of vaccine damage for claims for compensation.]

    Back then, I was working in one of the oldest lung illness
    treatment centers in Germany, and just by chance, I looked at the files of those people
    who had fallen ill during the first German epidemic of smallpox, in 1947. Up to 1974,
    starting after the WW II, we had eleven smallpox epidemic events in Germany. We had always
    been told that the smallpox vaccination would protect against smallpox. And now, I could
    verify, thanks to the files and papers, that all of those who had fallen ill had been
    vaccinated. This was very upsetting for me…”

    L.: Why do you refer to vaccination as a business?

    B.: You know, one vaccine against smallpox costs about 600 DM, and the
    proclaimed target or goal is to vaccinate three billion people in this world. So if this
    is not business… The vaccination against hepatitis costs 250 DM and you need three of
    them… Vaccination is a huge business for the pharmaceutical industry.

    L: If you take this stand in your country, have you been reprimanded by
    the medical authorities?

    B.: I wrote a paper entitled, “Vaccinations: A Crime Against our
    Children”. I received written reprimands from the College of Physicians… In
    Germany, we have a law called “Kronegesetz” in the Civil Code, which stipulates
    that everyone has the right to freely voice his or her opinion. When I was fed up with
    this nonsense with the College, I drew their attention to the fact that their responses
    were actually a breach of those sections of the law. German judges, who deal with these
    issues, are very touchy on this issue… It is impossible to suppress the free speech of a
    physician in a free country, which is why the College knew that it would lose. They also
    knew that the press would really have a field day. Since then I’ve heard nothing
    more…

    If you want to read the whole article:http://www.whale.to/vaccines/buchwald9.htm

  • Ron Roy

    September 1994, Clinical Infectious Diseases stated that all acute
    measles cases should be given vitamin A.

    Barclay et al (1987). In the Mvumi hospital in central Tanzania, 180 children
    admitted with measles were randomely allocated to receive routine treatment alone or with
    additional large doses of vitamin A (200,000 IU orally, on admission, and again the next
    day). Of the 88 children given vitamin A, 6 died, of the 92 controls, 12 died.
    In the under 2 age group, out of 46 receiving vitamin A one died, while in the
    control (receiving no vitamin A) 7 out 42 died. (Scheibner p91)
    If giving vitamin A to those who already have measles will prevent some from dying it’s logical to assume that taking it BEFORE will prevent or at least ameliorate the symptoms.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Well thanks for that example of posting without researching. :-) I’m sure you’ll do it for pretty much the rest of your life.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Ron, do you actually read what I post? My guess is no. I’ve already mentioned the uses of vitamin A to treat specific outcomes.

    If giving vitamin A to those who already have measles will prevent some from dying

    I guess you finally looked around and figured out that there are no studies showing prevention. Right?

    it’s logical to assume that taking it BEFORE will prevent or at least ameliorate the symptoms.

    If by “logical” you mean “ignorant” sure. All it means is that people pre-supplemented with vitamin A will show similar likelihood of mortality. Not to mention that for anyone but the under 2 – the effect is non-existent. Even there it barely makes significance (my calculation puts P = 0.0518 for under 2 and P = 0.1741 for over 2).

    But of course that has nothing to do with your original thesis which was
    :

    vitamin A will prevent someone from getting measles

    and that you are claiming you are

    Boosting the immune system

    Even if you were to assume that some people were to show no symptoms of measles. That doesn’t mean that they don’t have it. It just means they are asymptomatic. Not to mention that the effect is pretty weak

  • Ron Roy

    You or I should say the MEDICAL MAFIA has censored it. Try and find any mention of Whale on Wikipedia.

  • Not appearing on wikipedia is Not the same thing as deathly afraid it will get out at all.

    However:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Scudamore

    “John Scudamore (Creator of website whale.to)”

  • AutismDadd

    Give your head a shake shill, the process is no walk in the park. But you shills throw it out there as if its easy to do. Its simply another obstacle to justice.

  • AutismDadd

    Are you still dancing in the ballet?

  • What do you think’ll happen in REAL court where you actually have to prove fact?

    BSPG = GFY + FAD.

  • Take it up with B.L. Fisher.

  • shay simmons

    Pity you have none.

    There is no foundation to your statement that prior to the 1970’s measles incidence was associated with poverty. Your failure to provide any corroboration to this assertion is noted.

  • shay simmons

    Nice re-write of what Dr Poland actually said. Why can’t anti-vaxxers ever be counted on to tell the truth?

  • shay simmons

    If the smallpox vaccine was so ineffective, why was the last case of smallpox in 1978?

  • Ron Roy

    Got you! If we were deathly afraid of whale.to getting around…wouldn’t we at least attempt to censor it? Who is we? This proves you and Johnny, JGC, Sonja etc are working for the pharmaceutical industry.

  • That answer is self evident, if you had any sense of honesty and reality.

  • YOU and only YOU, are deflecting. Your posts are so repeatedly twisted that there is no point in even responding to your hypocrisy and nor any of your continued false claims.

    So you said you have two children. When of the proper age as recommended by the CDC, be sure to get them both the three shots of Gardasil 9, now approved for both boys and girls.

    Inject them with

    Recommendations for Use of HPV Vaccines

    ACIP recommends that routine HPV vaccination be initiated at age 11 or 12 years. The vaccination series can be started beginning at age 9 years. Vaccination is also recommended for females aged 13 through 26 years and for males aged 13 through 21 years who have not been vaccinated previously or who have not completed the 3-dose series (1). Males aged 22 through 26 years may be vaccinated.† Vaccination of females is recommended with 2vHPV, 4vHPV (as long as this formulation is available), or 9vHPV. Vaccination of males is recommended with 4vHPV (as long as this formulation is available) or 9vHPV.

    http://www.cdc.gov/mmwR/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6411a3.htm

    Gardasil contains HPV DNA bound to insoluble aluminum adjuvant – a new chemical with untested toxicity?
    http://sanevax.org/gardasil-contains-hpv-dna-bound-to-insoluble-aluminum-adjuvant-a-new-chemical-with-untested-toxicity/

    FDA approves double the aluminum in new Gardasil vaccine
    Looks like ‘safety concerns’ take a backseat to selling vaccines
    http://www.naturalhealth365.com/gardasil-vaccine-dangers-1341.html

    The great Gardasil vaccine cover-up
    By Cynthia A. Janak
    http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/janak/070227

    THE TRUTH ABOUT GARDASIL
    http://truthaboutgardasil.org/

    Gardasil Syndrome
    http://www.gardasilsyndrome.com/

    Gardasil-The Flagship Example of the Failure of Vaccine Authorities to Regulate and Assure Vaccine Safety – “HPV Vaccine Has Done This to My Child”
    http://www.vacfacts.info/gardasil-the-flagship-example-of-the-failure-of-vaccine-authorities-to-regulate-and-assure-vaccine-safety.html

    HPV VACCINE VAERS REPORTS TO APR 2016

    Description Total
    Disabled 1,443
    Deaths 260
    Did Not Recover 8,265
    Abnormal Pap Smear 611
    Cervical Dysplasia 271
    Cervical Cancer 107
    Life Threatening 731
    Emergency Room 13,298
    Hospitalized 4,181
    Extended Hospital Stay 288
    Serious 5,729

    Total Adverse Events 44,214

    http://sanevax.org/

  • Ron Roy

    Like all other diseases it ran its course and we have developed a natural immunity. Since only 10% of the human race was ever vaccinate against smallpox how can anyone say the vaccine was responsible for its elimination?

  • Ron Roy

    Again I see you’re avoiding the question: Who is we?

  • Ron Roy

    Is that your best rebuttal. Your pay will be docked!

  • And it is not just the MMR vaccine: it is vaccine contamination; it is aluminum adjuvants; it is cytokine immune reactivity after vaccines, and more importantly multiple vaccines and when given in the same day; it is ischemia and ischemic stroke caused by aluminum adjuvants and vaccine induced immune reactivity; it is all of the above and more.

    Oddly for some children that have vaccine injuries, and as well autism, mercury continues to be an issue, and with mercury and other heavy metal toxicity found during biomedical treatment and in the need of detoxification. Where is it coming from, if not the vaccines? We know there are said still trace amounts of mercury in several of the killed/attenuated childhood vaccines. Just how is the FDA checking on and regulating that issue where mercury is used in the manufacturing process, but then said removed other than for trace amounts remaining. How do they assure that Thimerosal has been removed, other than to assume it has been done, and that on the honor of the pharmaceutical companies. We all know what that trust and honor is worth; absolutely nothing.

    Vaccines have historically and always will continue to do, MORE harm than good. There is a better way, and they refuse to look. They have everything to lose, and they will in their denial, continue to refuse to let that happen.

    125 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Causation
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/125-Research-Papers-Supporting-the-Vaccine-Autism-Link

    Your not so science based source is nothing but false propaganda. Face it. It is not worth anything for anyone looking for the real vaccine truth.

    Vaccine Shills and Their Bullying Tactics
    http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?58790-Vaccine-Shills-and-Their-Bullying-Tactics

    Professor David Gorski, a well-known online character assassin masquerading as a science defender

    Internet Trolls Attack Anyone Resisting Vaccine Party Line

    Excerpted: The more you read, the more you start to realize that there is a growing number of doctors, scientists, nurses, and other health care providers who have serious questions about the current vaccine paradigm favored by the pharmaceutical industry, government agencies, such as the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and Food and Drug Administration (FDA), medical trade groups, and the mainstream media.

    Increasingly, professionals within a wide range of health care and science fields are giving interviews and writing articles and books voicing their concerns about vaccine risks, the misrepresentation of the historical role of vaccines in reducing mortality from infectious diseases, the expanding schedule and number of vaccines mandated, or even the basic mechanism theories behind vaccine science.

    Predictably, every time you give the name of a contrarian doctor or scientist in response to the 99.9% figure, what you tend to get is, “Eh, well, he’s a quack, she’s not credible.” Also, you get referred to blogs such as Science-Based Medicine,1 or Respectful Insolence,2 or the Skeptical Raptor’s Blog.3 They’re often written by or associated with a guy named David Gorski, MD, who also goes by the alias “Orac.” Gorski is a surgical oncologist and an assistant professor of surgery at Wayne State University School of Medicine in Detroit, MI.4

    Should you wish to debunk someone, anyone, who dares to disagree with mainstream thinking on vaccines, all you need do is inform Orac, and the good doctor will gladly oblige by writing up a boorish piece, long on insult and short on science. Orac’s methods are painfully predictable. In one piece earlier this year, he criticized a prominent immunologist5 who had the nerve to write an open letter on vaccine science to state legislators in California about to vote on a bill eliminating personal belief vaccine exemptions. He started out by dismissing the individual’s credentials outright. Orac writes:

    Read more:
    http://www.thevaccinereaction.org/2015/11/internet-trolls-attack-anyone-resisting-vaccine-party-line/

    “Science”Blogs: Seed Media’s Aggressive Weed
    Part I: Fertilizer From Pharma
    http://www.ageofautism.com/2009/09/scienceblogs-seed-medias-aggressive-weed.html

    Least We Forget the Blatant Cruelty of the Vaccine Industry and Their Propagandized Trolls and Shills
    http://www.thelibertybeacon.com/2014/06/26/least-we-forget-the-blatant-cruelty-of-the-vaccine-industry-their-propagandized-trolls-and-shills/

    Dr. David Gorski named in medical conspiracy allegations complaint filed with Karmanos Cancer Center and Michigan Attorney General. (Blogger at “science blogs” and author of so called, “Science Based Medicine).
    http://www.naturalnews.com/053736_Dr_David_Gorski_medical_conspiracy_allegations_Karmanos_Cancer_Center.html

  • And yet all you have offered here is just more attempts at false discreditation and denial, and without actually and nor directly addressing any of the information that was put forth. Typical pro-vaccine trolling shill. Such replies just simply waste my time.

  • Jonathan Graham

    The point of this discussion was that you whined that other people don’t do their research. I simply pointed out that I doubt anything you have ever done could be considered “research”. Since, as you did above. Just copy and paste something – more than half the time you don’t read and/or understand what you’re posting.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I said:

    The question necessitates someone responding about what they believe. You didn’t. Come back when you can make a statement of that sort. Cheerio. :-)

    and you went off on some tangent. So you are deflecting. QED.

    I will just simply respond to you with more information

    That’s kind of a generous term for what you post.

    , and use you for a sounding board

    Well in order to do that you will have to conform to my requests about clarity and format. Otherwise we will just talk about your abusive speech, logical fallacies and foot dragging.

    So you said you have two children. When of the proper age as recommended by the CDC, be sure to get them both the three shots of Gardasil 9, now approved for both boys and girls.

    In Canada there is no specified age for HPV vaccination just when they are older than nine and before they are sexually active.

    As usual you are posting more than one link and not using a useful format. So you know that I won’t bother which is of course what you want more than any other outcome. So I guess I’m happy to oblige. :-)

  • None of those studies looked at actual vaccines in regard to the current CDC vaccine schedule, with the exception of one, a Pediatrics study which looked at epidemiological (population study) numbers in regard to neuropsychological test performance numbers.

    We must also remember that Pediatrics also produced a study showing that injecting Thimerosal in vaccines improved the test scores of children in some areas, and where those children who had no injected Thimerosal performed not as well. Pediatrics clearly can not be trusted to produce anything but to much to lose the truth be known, junk science.

    Even the IOM report clearly stated in no uncertain terms that those said studies regarding multiple vaccines and as on the current CDC schedule have never been adequately studied for safety, and that those studies were yet needed. So produce a study for me showing the safety profile of giving a small child from 5 and up to 9 or more vaccines in a single day and office visit?

    New Junk Science Study – No link between ‘too many vaccines’ and autism risk
    http://www.vacfacts.info/new-junk-science-study—no-link-between-too-many-vaccines-and-autism-risk.html

    The Rehash Of ONLY The Old Vaccine So Called Safety Studies – Presented As A Current And New Study
    http://www.vacfacts.info/the-rehash-of-only-the-old-vaccine-so-called-safety-studies—presented-as-a-current-and-new-study.html

    Dr. Paul Offit’s Aluminum Deceptions and Academic Misconduct
    http://vaccinepapers.org/dr-paul-offits-aluminum-deceptions-academic-misconduct/

    Petition for Paul A. Offit, MD to take 10,000 vaccines at one time.

    Dr. Paul Offit, MD writes about vaccine safety, “each infant would have the theoretical capacity to respond to about 10 000 vaccines at any one time (obtained by dividing 107 B cells per mL by 103 epitopes per vaccine).” i.e. that an infant can respond to the challenge posed by the antigens in 10,000 vaccines.”

    If an infant can respond to 10,000 vaccines at one time, certainly Dr. Offit, in his supreme confidence of the safety and efficacy of modern vaccines and the CDC’s Vaccine schedule, would have no reservation about taking 10,000 vaccines himself at one time.

    We petition Dr. Paul Offit, MD of Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia to demonstrate his theoretical proclamation that a human being could take 10,000 vaccines at one time by, in fact, taking 10,000 vaccines at one time.

    Should Dr. Paul Offit, MD have reservations about such an action, we petition a smaller dose of 1,000 Vaccines at one time. Vaccines should be chosen from the CDC’s recommended (in some states, mandated) vaccination schedule. Surely, Dr. Offit would have no reservation about receiving 1/10 the theoretical capacity of a human being 1/20th his own weight and size.

    https://www.change.org/p/citizens-of-usa-petition-for-paul-a-offit-md-to-take-10-000-vaccines-at-one-time?recruiter=517312154&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=autopublish&utm_term=mob-xs-comment_share-reason_msg&fb_ref=Default

    PAUL OFFIT DOUBLES DOWN ON HIS 10,000 VACCINES
    https://vaccinesbytheoutliers.wordpress.com/2016/06/01/paul-offit-doubles-down-on-his-10000-vaccines/

    Hear Our Stories: Vaccines Are NOT Safe
    Want Your Children To Be Safe? We Do Too! Stop Vaccinating!
    Vaccines Are Neither Safe Nor Effective. Here’s Why…
    http://www.stopmandatoryvaccination.com/

  • shay simmons

    Because it was. Google ‘ring vaccination.’

  • Just another load of twisted BS, and nothing more. You are a really sick and creepy person, and you can not even begin to deny that. In your twisted mind and your twisted world, perhaps you don’t even realize it. Don’t forget that Gardasil for the two kids you say you have. Recommended at age 11, but can be started at age 9.

  • Jonathan Graham

    No Lowell, what I said was correct. You wrote a little story about how you are so noble to being doing this without pay.

  • I simply responded to the person who continually responds to me, and for much of that time the only person who has. I have never said that I choose to be responded to with your twisted deflection, failure to actually address directly any studies, data, and information I put forth, and with a generally dishonest agenda of only putting forth a front of falsely attacking antagonistic disruption.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I have never said that I choose to be responded to with

    I didn’t say “choose” I said “prefer”. If you enjoy talking about research more than this. Then either we would be doing that or you are being irrational.

    The most reasonable conclusion is that you get exactly the same amount of enjoyment out of these exchanges that you would if we were discussing a paper. So all your complaining is just hot air.

  • I answered your first question with direct reference links on vitamin C and D information and as related to infectious illness and as the pro-vaccine side so calls it, disease. You failed to even as much as acknowledge it, much more address it and that specific information. Who’s actually, deflecting?

  • Jonathan Graham

    answered your first question with

    Nothing that addressed the question. Again, if you need be to explain why that doesn’t address the question I’ll be happy to. So yes, you are deflecting like you usually do with link-vomit. :-)

  • You have had more than adequate time to directly and honestly respond to the information I have provided on this article, and many others. You have failed to on every level.

  • Anything further that you had, was nothing but nonsense.Why should or would i respond to that? Spin it and twist it all you want.

  • That is not how it works, and again I am not playing your in denial avoidance games.

    Go ahead and additionally tell me which of these studies and what about this information right here do you disagree with or have counter studies to show the opposite to be true, and thus showing vaccine safety instead of vaccine injury harm done?

    Facts & Science
    http://www.educate4theinjured.org/#!the-factsscience/cc2d

  • Jonathan Graham

    Yawn. Whenever Lowell can’t answer it’s back to him doing whatever he does to incur short term memory loss and me reminding him as to the reasons that this conversation doesn’t really happen.

    Lowell either you can clarify to my satisfaction when we are talking or we can just talk like this. Assuming you know this fact it’s reasonable to believe that you prefer this kind of conversation. So your complaints are meaningless.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Nope. I simply pointed out what the question actually was and why what you said had nothing to do with it. I can repeat if you like :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    So you know how statistically strong your studies are or you do not know?

  • So when are you going to actually get to any of that here, and in discussing and debating actual vaccine related issues? To this point you have refused to, and again and again you only ignored and evaded the information; with at best only and simply a reply of moving the goal posts. You are in your denial only wasting my time, and that is all you ever intend to do.

  • Jonathan Graham

    So when are you going to actually get to any of that here

    …and if you read my post you can see I replied with

    However all of this requires some commitment to making their argument sufficiently clear to me and to conform to the rules of logic. Neither thing you are interested in.

  • Just more crazed ranting and broken into bits twisted insanity. I am not even going to take the time to read it.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Putting your fingers in your ears isn’t going to make you a better person Lowell.

  • “Same old same old”; and more false excuses. Again, I am not even going to take the time to read through a mess like that. Again, when was the last time you addressed the actual vaccine issues that have been put forth here? This kind of posting should be banned from the vactruth site.

  • Jonathan Graham

    “Same old same old”

    Apparently you need a lesson in the use of quotation marks…again.

    Again, you are making my point. You don’t really want to converse as much as you want to just to pitch, whine and froth at the mouth.

  • How many more posts did you make here filled with only more of your antagonistic evasion and false excuses?

  • Jonathan Graham

    Sorry Lowell, as explained politely and honestly responding to your posts is not being antagonistic. I have every right to do so.

  • “We” = Pro-vaxxers.

  • Every goverment in the world and every major health org in the world and the consensus of respectable medical and scientific journals for a start.

    Your point?

    No, see, I’ve done my independent research and you’re wrong.

  • Ron Roy

    Like I said many times before we became immune to that disease because of better nutrition and sanitation. This is small excerpt from the link I posted:
    A glance at the following table of official statistics from England and Wales shows us
    how smallpox deaths declined only after the people began their opposition to the
    vaccination law and an ever increasing number refused to be vaccinated.
    CHART
    SHOWING DECREASE IN SMALLPOX DEATHS AFTER DECLINE OF VACCINATION
    Period –
    Percentage of Births Vaccinated Smallpox Deaths

    1872-1881 96.5

    3,708.3

    1882-1891 82.1

    933.0

    1892-1901 67.9

    436.5

    1902-1911 67.6

    395.3

    1912-1921 42.3

    12.2

    1922-193 1 43.1

    25.0

    1932-1941 39.9

    1.4

    Here we see that at the time when nearly all (96.5%) of the babies were vaccinated,
    smallpox caused almost 4,000 deaths in that 10 year period; but, when the vaccinations
    were resisted until only 39% would submit to it, the death-rate dropped down to only 1.4
    cases.

    Before the passage of England’s compulsory vaccination law in 1853, the highest
    authentic smallpox death-rate was only 2,000 for any two year period, even during their
    most serious smallpox epidemics; whereas, after almost 20 years of compulsory vaccination
    there occurred the most devastating scourge of smallpox in 1870 to 1871 that the world has
    ever known. It took 23,062 lives in England and Wales and spread over Europe in all the
    countries where vaccination and inoculation had been practiced on a large scale. After
    that the vaccination laws were enforced even more rigidly until the people began to notice
    that smallpox was not decreasing by this practice but continued to ravage the homes of the
    vaccinated. During the same epidemic in Germany 124,948 people died of smallpox. All had
    been vaccinated (according to their carefully kept records.) “In Berlin alone no less
    that 17,038 persons had smallpox after vaccination, and 2,884 of them died.”http://www.whale.to/a/mcbean.html#CHAPTER%20II

  • Ron Roy

    Now explain to me just how any pro-vaxxer / poisoner would have the capability / power to ban anything? You gave yourself and your cohorts away and you will never admit it but………..GOT YOU!

  • I said “at least attempt to”. Well….if we have such a big conspiracy behind us then one of us should.

  • Ron Roy

    I spend hours everyday ( nice to be retired ) doing research. I will spend the rest of my life exposing the truth about vaccines. I use these comment sections and your replies as a way of gaining more knowledge concerning the dangers of vaccines. And I learn a lot from others like Lowell who does a good job at spreading the truth about vaccines.

  • Jonathan Graham

    I spend hours everyday ( nice to be retired ) doing research.

    If I gave you a few studies you wouldn’t be able to determine which one represents stronger evidence. Since you can’t differentiate good evidence from bad…how can anything you do ever be called research that’s going anywhere? I suppose you could attempt to prove me wrong but in a challenge we know that you…. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9BQAAT10Mw

    And I learn a lot from others like Lowell

    Lulz.

  • guest

    You need to get a grip on reality. You know the real world. Not your trolled up world. If you read the comment I made to your co-hort I stated that I didn’t think that poverty had anything to do with measles. You are either mentally unable and cannot understand the written word or a troll just trying to earn more per deim. Either way you’re just making yourself look more ridiculous by NOT reading the comment but cherry picking at something you “think” I posted. Obviously didn’t have to pass a reading comprehension test to get this gig.

  • Ron Roy

    identify what you believe to represent the single most credible,
    most compelling study you’ve found on whale-to indicating the risks
    associated with routine vaccination exceed the risks associated with
    remaining vulnerable to the infectious diseases they protect against and
    we’ll discuss it here. One of the many soundbites used by vaccine / drug pushers. There isn’t a single one they ALL have merit.

  • guest

    The thanks go to Lawrence Solomon.

  • guest

    Reading is fundamental.

  • shay simmons

    Yes, I do know the real world.

    (Not to mention punctuation).

  • guest

    Than deal with it. Live in it.

  • Jonathan Graham

    They all have absolutely equal merit? Which one is the most statistically strong evidence?

  • AutismDadd

    yawn

  • Whitney Hill

    Are u people for real right now …for one this article is about the death of my son and your talking about your hair. Making sarcastic remarks about my mom. Must suck to be that heartless and ignorant. I feel sorry for you I really do

  • Ron Roy

    Which one is the most statistically strong evidence? Another sound bite. Depending on a particular discussion they ALL have EQUAL ( shall I go to the dictionary to explain the word EQUAL? ) MERIT.

  • shay simmons

    Lawrence Solomon? That explains it. Deluded and dishonest.

  • JGC

    Surely you find some of them to be make a stronger case than others? Identify one or two of these. Or, if they are in fact all equally credible and compelling, cite one or two at random.
    In any case, let’s actually discuss the evidence.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Another challenge that Ron is trying hard to bow out of!

    Another sound bite.

    Nope. You’re just trying to avoid answering the question. You know it’s ok to say: “I Ron Roy have not the slighest clue or ability to answer this question?”. No shame in being honest Ron.

    they ALL have EQUAL ( shall I go to the dictionary to explain the word EQUAL? ) MERIT.

    So in other words one might be strong statistically and another might be strong in some other way but they all balance out in these strengths. Right?

    However in order for you to be able to say that you have to know how they merit in all these respects including – statistical strength. Unless of course you’re saying that NONE of the studies in whale.to have any statistical strength (but they make up for it in some other way).

    I’m keenly interested in those very,very,very statistically strong whale.to studies…or seeing you admit that there’s nothing of any statistical value there…or admitting that you sort of lied.

  • shay simmons

    If immunity to smallpox is granted by better nutrition and sanitation –
    1) why have there been no cases of smallpox in places like India, sub-Saharan Africa, or the Phillipines in the last 35 years?
    2) why was the last smallpox fatality a medical photographer working in a research lab in the UK?

  • guest

    LOL. Is that all you got? He has a real job. You don’t and you call him dishonest. You’re a freaking troll. A paid operative for the pharmaceutical industry. You can tap dance around the fact that you are a troll all you want but the fact that you continue with these meaningless pointless comments so you can get paid is obvious. If you want to continue to dance we can do that but all it does is make you look silly. You really must be desperate for vacation money. Please don’t go into troll denial mode, everyone has read it before from some of the more sophisticated trolls on line. Your denial is the first indication that you are a professional liar. So outed. So pitiful.

  • Ron Roy

    Sorry Johnny I don’t use a calculator when I go to Whale. However I can post some Articles that I like and you can do the math.

  • Ron Roy

    Johnny I take vitamin and mineral supplement and I workout, eat healthy and I haven’t been to a doctor for health reasons in over 40 years. Can you say that? Oh I don’t get flu shots and I don’t get the flu. I practice what I preach. W e really have to meet some day. You could teach me how to fence and I can share seem of my skills with you.

  • Ron Roy

    She is boring. I’ll second that yawn.

  • shay simmons

    Playing the shill card. So noted.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Johnny I take vitamin and mineral supplement and I workout, eat healthy and I haven’t been to a doctor for health reasons in over 40 years. Can you say that?

    Why would I? I go to the doctor to get vaccinated and for annual checkups. As confirmed my BP is lower than yours slightly and my pulse is about the same. So again what exactly makes your weirdo austerity beneficial?

    W e really have to meet some day.

    Then I guess I was right. You had no intention of doing that debate. Want to meet finish defining the terms of the debate/vote in a way that someone with half a brain would agree to.

  • Jonathan Graham

    So I take that to mean you have no idea if there is anything statistically strong there. Right?

    Thanks for making my point for me. :-)

  • guest

    What a bunch of sad, pathetic sniveling little trolls you and your ilk are. No soul,no compassion for their fellow human being, no heart and most of all no wisdom.

  • Ron Roy

    I like them all. They all have merit. You go on Whale and pick one out. I will just post as needed. I will not comment any further on the subject now go back to your calculator I think it’s lonely.

  • Ron Roy

    I just answered you. Are you thick or what?

  • shay simmons

    No, you haven’t.

    You haven’t explained why smallpox has vanished from parts of the world with horrible nutrition and where sanitation is completely lacking. Nor have you explained why the last smallpox casualty resided in a first-world country with no food insecurity, clean water and indoor plumbing.

  • shay simmons

    Unfortunately, he does his research on places like whale.to.

  • shay simmons

    He’s addled. I mean, seriously addled.

  • Jonathan Graham

    It’s his brain but it’s interesting how much he admits that whale.to is low-quality evidence.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Bowing out of yet another challenge? Is there anything you actually follow through on?

    I like them all.

    I think this illustrates one of the difficulties you have with science. Science doesn’t care what you like. It’s about what makes a hypothesis more likely to be true.

    I think it’s pretty obvious from how I’ve made you squirm for all these posts that you can’t say there is anything of any statistical value at whale.to. :-)

  • onyormark

    Most of them are either shills for the gov’t/pharma complex or vax worshipping trolls who feel the need to “protect” their religion by posting on sites like this.

  • onyormark

    Amen to that Whitney. Unfortunately, most who post here ad nauseam are either shills for the gov’t/big-pharma alliance, ..or obsessed trolls exercising their vaccine worship by endlessly posting on sites like this. The latter are surely to be pitied since they have no rest for their angst.

  • Ron Roy

    Squirm? I was itching it had nothing to do with you. I just realized that you were trying to give me the opportunity to post a few article from Whale. Thank Johnny. Oh you pick one to criticizes:

    Thousands of teenage girls have suffered serious illness after being
    vaccinated against cervical cancer.http://whale.to/a/tens_of_thousands_of_teenage.html
    Official figures show the HPV vaccination programme drew 8,228 reports of
    suspected side-effects over the last decade – almost more than all other routine
    jabs put together.

    More than a quarter of these reports were classed as ‘serious’, a category
    that includes symptoms severe enough to require hospital treatment or even be
    life-threatening.

    http://www.hormonesmatter.com/hpv-vaccines-not-safe-effective-necessary/
    I was recently invited to present my research on the HPV
    vaccine at the Euroscicon Controlling
    Cancer Summit held in London on 12 May 2014. The theme of the
    presentations was Advances in Cancer Screening and Prevention Research and the
    paper I presented was titled: HPV
    vaccines have not been demonstrated to be safe and effective in the prevention
    of cervical cancer.
    HPV Infections Mostly Harmless
    In my presentation I provided evidence that HPV
    infections are harmless and asymptomatic unlessspecific
    environmental co-factors are also present. This is why HPV infections should
    not be feared by the public and why the medical literature states that cancer is
    a rare outcome from any type of HPV infection. The fact that cervical cancer is
    a higher risk in developing countries than in developed countries is explained
    by the presence of environmental co-factors that are necessary for an HPV
    infection to progress to cancer. These co-factors (risk factors) are more
    prevalent in the developing countries. The fact
    that HPV infections are mostly harmless on their own means that vaccinating
    all women in developed countries (e.g. Australia, US and the UK) results in the
    majority of women (99%) being on a drug for a disease that they are not at risk
    of getting. This is not cost-effective and it is also not necessary because the
    vaccine has not been proven to be safer or more effective than Pap screening
    combined with surgery.
    If the HPV vaccines are proven to have value in years to
    come it could be offered to women in the high-risk category. That is, women who
    are exposed to the environmental co-factors that are necessary for an HPV
    infection to progress to cervical cancer. However, as yet the vaccine has not
    been proven to be safe or effective in preventing cervical cancer. Currently
    governments are claiming that because the HPV vaccine targets 2 of the 15+
    strains of HPV associated with causing most cervical cancer, it will prevent some cervical
    cancer, but they have not determined how much can be prevented. This argument is
    flawed if the majority of women on the drug are not at risk of cervical cancer
    and if there is already an effective method of preventing cervical cancer in
    place. In this case, Pap
    screeningcombined with surgery is an effective method of prevention (9 out
    of 10 cancers) and it is risk free and will still be required by vaccinated
    women.
    The Global Harm Associated with HPV Vaccines

  • Ron Roy

    I’ll go S L O W S O Y O U W I L L U N D E R S T A N D. E V E N I F T H E N U T R I T I O N A L A N D S A N I T A T I O N
    S T A N D A R D S A R E N O T A S G O O D A S O U R S
    N A T U R A L I M M U N I T Y S T I L L C O M E S I N T O
    P L A Y. Do I need to go slower?

  • shay simmons

    But you havent’ explained what brought about this natural immunity. It obviously wasn’t nutrition and sanitation. How did this natural immunity arise? Diseases don’t run their course. Something has to combat the pathogen.

    (plus, smallpox is’n’t a fecal infection, so sanitation wouldn’t have played a role).

  • Jonathan Graham

    Squirm?

    uh…yeah. I keep asking “What is statistically strong at whale.to?” you have no other answer but “No, they’re all equally good”…or didn’t you realize that’s what was happening when your teacher was asked who their favorite student was and they answered “you’re all my favorites”?

    I just realized that you were trying to give me the opportunity to post a few article from Whale. Thank Johnny. Oh you pick one to criticizes:

    Say one is the most statistically strong article and I’m all for it. Otherwise I say we give it the treatment consistent with the treatment of articles of equal value: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-3Iq3XQkAw

  • joe

    As usual, all rhetoric,no substance.

  • joe

    Another one with rhetoric and no substance.

  • joe

    Still clinging to BS wHALE PLEEEZE

  • Ron Roy

    Like all other disease natural exposure over a period of time. But you know this your just trying to make a case where none exists: Proof all diseases were in sharp decline before vaccines:https://www.google.com/search?q=graphs+showing+disease+decline+site:http://www.whale.to&domains=WHALE&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjg7vXH69XNAhVGTSYKHUz5CFAQ_AUICCgB&biw=800&bih=471#imgdii=sr_rVqsckMpjPM%3A%3Bsr_rVqsckMpjPM%3A%3BveEayDI_ZfDx5M%3A&imgrc=sr_rVqsckMpjPM%3A

  • joe

    Sidestepping again Ron? something that all antivaxxers are good when caught out.

  • Ron Roy

    Yep GREAT SOURCE OF INFO. Keep mentioning Whale peoples natural curiosity sends them there. Thanks again for doing what I like to do.

  • joe

    Hey you left me out,am I working for big pharma?

  • shay simmons

    The charted declines are in morbidity, not mortality, and don’t show smallpox at all.

    If smallpox has died out and we all now have a natural immunity, why is it classified as a Category A bioterror agent?

  • shay simmons

    I sure hope they do go there. Rational people are so often unaware of the presence of such lunacy on the Internet — such places serve as a wake-up call.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Thank you, Whit. Don’t let it bother you. This man gets paid to be heartless and to try to derail the conversation and to keep people form questioning whether or not vaccines are safe or harmful. It doesn’t matter to him that the people in these stories are hurting. We are just nameless, faceless people to him. His smart alec replies are nothing but blowing smoke to try to hide what’s really important here. For your own sanity, stop reading these posts and let the other readers stand up for you and Cash. For all the thousands of replies he’s made, he only has 18 followers. I think most people see right through him.

  • Ron Roy

    Could be they made the virus more potent ( virulent ) in which case the vaccine wouldn’t work. Not that it ever did. And who said that that bioterror agent would have any effect on anyone?

  • Ron Roy
  • Ron Roy

    I NEVER SAID LOW QUALITY EVIDENCE. IF PEOPLE WANT LOW QUALITY EVIDENCE ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS FOLLOW YOUR POSTS. Now remember it’s:

    http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

  • Ron Roy

    Get it right it’s: http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

  • Ron Roy

    Another one with rhetoric and no substance. A NEW SOUND BITE? Not bad joe. If you want substance really good substance go to: http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

  • Ron Roy

    Read and see what real honest doctors, scientists and historians, who have risked their livelihoods in order to expose the truth about vaccine, have to say: http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

  • Ron Roy
  • Ron Roy

    Sidestepping is that a dance? Hey here’s an interesting site:

    http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

  • Jonathan Graham

    Well you admit that none of it has any statistical value. Right?

  • Jonathan Graham

    So we already know from some of the other nonsense graphs you’ve posted that the graphs have been manipulated. So searching on this criteria would have a lot more wrong answers than right. Than if you searched on more neutral criteria.

    This is a great insight into your psyche. You are constantly looking for things to support your position rather than to determine what is or is not true. This is called confirmation bias.

  • shay simmons

    “Who said that that bioterror agent would have any effect on anyone?”
    Every government, every military service, every intelligence organization, every international relief agency, and every epidemiologist in the world.
    I had some inkling of it before, but this most recent example of your stupidity is … breath-taking.

  • shay simmons

    As I said… lunacy.

  • It certainly is…interesting…I like the Time Cube website, too.

  • Ron Roy

    I see you sidestepped the vaccine portion of Whale. Afraid to see the truth? I don’t look at anything on Whale other than the vaccine portion. Whatever else is on there is not of any interest to me. http://www.whale.to/vaccines.h..is simply a compilation of what hundreds of HONEST doctors, scientists,researchers and historians have to say about vaccines. Men who risked their livelihoods to bring us the truth.

  • Ron Roy

    Don’t care what you say or think I don’t post for drug reps I post for those with an open mind.

  • Ron Roy

    Got news for you I have a source that is much more knowledgeable than any of you concerning vaccines and bio terror. Lieutenant Colonel Anthony Harp. He has a PhD in microbiology and a BS in microscopy. He had 32 years experience in his field. He worked for many years at the Walter Reed Complex ( in a building separate from the hospital) making vaccine against germs that could be used in biological warfare. He also worked for the World Health Organization. He once told me had he had children he never would have had them vaccinated. This if from a man who made vaccines and gave vaccines.

  • Ron Roy

    Oh I had it all wrong I thought YOU were suffering from confirmation bias.

  • I don’t consider it a trustworthy resource. I consider it a safe space for every conspiracy theory under the sun. Whale has no standards whatsoever, and will happily publish lies, hoaxes and scams so long as they support the conspiracy mindset.

  • AutismDadd

    Talking about yourself again I seee

  • shay simmons
  • Jonathan Graham

    You showed your colours when you posted a search for something that would confirm your bias. :-)

  • AutismDadd

    You flip burgers

  • AutismDadd

    At 71 your time is running out

  • eggman2

    This is really stupid. So you say that nutrition and sanitation are not needed, but a shot of ” GMO-PUTREFACTIVE-BIOHAZARDOUS material in a SOUP OF CARCINOGENS, MUTAGENS, AND TERATOGENS ” ( VACCINES ) is the ideal thing.

    If many people in this country reason like you , no wonder we have problems.

    Don’t be stupid. The injected pollution from vaccines debilitates the organism, so it will be prone to more illnesses. All pollutants do that.That is why cancer is one is the number one or two killer along with heart disease. Pollution affects the heart, too.

    A cute and healthy Pomeranian pup was vaccinated many times, and the stupid veterinarian said to the owner to keep him inside so he wouldn’t catch any diseases–as if there are no germs inside. The menace was already injected into the poor thing. And , I haven’t seen them taking him out for a walk in weeks. I hope the poor animal isn’t dead.

  • eggman2

    Einstein said that the measure of insanity is to keep doing the same thing while expecting different results. Provaccine people are insane.

  • shay simmons

    Except that I did not say that. Reading compretension fail.

  • Ron Roy

    Ok you posted a link just what do you want me to look at?

  • Ron Roy

    Oh Johnny here what you wanted sooooooo bad an article published on Whale I find one of the best:

    http://www.whale.to/c/polio_vaccines_laced.html

  • Jonathan Graham

    Is this one of the most statistically strong articles there? If so, should I show it to be weak or incorrect will you happily agree that I’ve defeated some of the strongest evidence.

    Otherwise, I’m not interested in weak evidence….why should you be?

  • shay simmons

    You could start with the introduction and the chapter on the history of biowarfare — written by military medical research personnel who are much more knowledgeable than you or I on bioterrorism.

    I don’t suppose it ever occurred to you to ask why your light bird — assuming he exists* — worked his entire career to develop, support and deliver something he doesn’t believe in.

    (*the only Anthony Harp I can find in the Army medical corps was court-martialed for submitting false pay claims. Was there another?)

  • Probably not, that sounds like an anti-vaxxer to me. He was probably just trying to get fairly compensated for all the twigs, leaves, and leg rubs he dispensed.

  • shay simmons

    Oh, I have no expectation that he’ll actually read it.

  • eggman2

    That’s on you. Don’t be so stupid, and read my comment until you understand it.

  • eggman2

    All infections go first through the digestive system to get a hold of the subject. ( including polio and all those stupid little skin infections ) It is the malnutrition of the organism what helps so much the critters.

    My son first got injected with the vaccine, so it went inside. Then it erupted on his skin with sores oozing blood and liquid. And he was going to die from it, if not for an herb.

  • shay simmons

    ” So you say that nutrition and sanitation are not needed”

    Hunka hunka burnin’ strawman.

  • AutismDadd

    Go test vaccines. Ask for 9 in one visit

  • AutismDadd

    bbrrraaattt

  • AutismDadd

    Hammy is a big baby. I believe he’s either the baby in the family or a single child

  • AutismDadd

    Its called personal style. There are no rules saying I have to post to please you.

  • AutismDadd

    My posts are at least entertaining. Yours cure insomnia

  • AutismDadd

    His are on wheels for quick, easy adjustments.

  • AutismDadd

    “independent”? You mean interdependent

  • AutismDadd

    Well there’s your independent science “I doubt”

  • AutismDadd

    Another shill with a new fake I.D.

  • AutismDadd

    An RN buh wah ha ha. How many vaccines have you invented? How many years of vaccine research? Let me guess ZERO!!!!

  • That has nothing to do with her statement. Are you lost?

  • Jonathan Graham

    No, we have a conversation on my blog that makes that clear. You claimed that you had something of merit to contribute – you just couldn’t deliver.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Harassing is more accurate.

  • Too bad your style is lies, insults, and fart noises. If that pleases you, you’re a pretty pathetic individual.

  • JGC

    No Ron: identify a couple you believe are both credible and compelling. I’m here to discuss your evidence, not help you search for some.

  • LiLi

    You stalked my profile and responded to something I wrote on another thread a year ago. Obviously this is not a “new fake ID.”

  • LiLi

    It seems as though you are unable to follow long conversations. Your comments are not relevant to the discussion I was having with another poster. Try reading for contextual clues if you get lost next time.

  • LiLi

    You are begging the question. I asked you why because it is not evident. You really don’t want to come out and say you want him banned because he makes you look bad. I am done with arguing this point on the internet. It’s like arguing with zealots. I’m just not that into it anymore. I’ll do my job, take care of my family, and continue on. I rally hope that none of your friends or family member’s children become ill or die from vaccine preventable illnesses. I think you all are a beautiful illustration of the adage “a little knowledge…” Good luck, see you in the Darwin Awards.

  • LiLi

    AutismDad, I suggest you forcibly insert some indigo crystals through the ring of muscles at the conclusion of your alimentary canal.

  • Ron Roy
  • Jonathan Graham

    Is this the most statistically strong article?

  • AutismDadd

    More of your SCIENCE?

  • AutismDadd

    I guess you don’t understand that comments DON’T have to be on topic,

  • AutismDadd

    I doubt that.

  • AutismDadd

    Good thing I’m not here to impress shills

  • AutismDadd

    I’m saving it for the right moment

  • AutismDadd

    RN’s are not vaccine experts. They hand out pills and collect bed pans.

  • Ahh, another shill gambit, cute!

  • Your ignorance of nursing is amazing, and you’ve still failed to explain how being a vaccine expert has anything to do with knowing the meaning of the word “parenchyma.”

    Just FYI, I was recently hospitalized for a few weeks after suffering a bad fall, and the nurses had nothing to do with the bedpans or urine pots. I know you’re trying to use that aspect of patient care to demean caregivers who do more than sell sugar pills and platitudes about “nature,” but the men who helped me evacuate my bowels and bladder when I was unable to stand were not nurses, and they deserve respect and courtesy, too. I hope you never have to learn the importance of their work firsthand.

  • AutismDadd

    EW too much information

  • AutismDadd

    You sound impressed

  • That’s what happens when you aren’t able to use the toilet by yourself. I expect doctors, nurses, and assistants to be grown-ups who can handle such patients with respect and compassion. Not so much with naturopathic charlatans who can only pretend at being caregivers, and would probably have reacted to my needs the same way you just have. They certainly would not know the meaning of the word “parenchyma.”

    If the routine processes of the digestive system are too icky for you to handle, discussing health might not be for you.

  • The only impressive things about you are the depth of your ignorance and the squirming desperation of your evasive, content-free posts.

  • AutismDadd

    I’ll take that. Is there any cash involved with this? Should I thank the Academy?

  • AutismDadd

    Shut up already

  • Whatever you find in the nearest payphone coin return is yours!

  • What are you, 10? Are pee-pee and poo-poo too icky for you? What kind of dad are you that you can’t handle this? Besides that, you never did answer the question, and you never will because you’re dishonest:

    What does knowing the meaning of “parenchyma” have to do with being a vaccine expert?

  • AutismDadd

    You don’t know?

  • Sonja Henie

    Damon, AD! You are one ignorant SOB!

  • Sonja Henie

    I’m sorry for your loss. I do wonder why you let vactruth publish your story. They are exploiting you.

  • I do not. Please explain it to me.

  • AutismDadd

    There’s no connection

  • AutismDadd

    But I’m accurate right?

  • Thank you. This means your attempts to mock, insult, and dismiss LiLi’s explanations were based on an entirely baseless accusation.

  • AutismDadd

    Don’t listen to Sonja Henie, she’s a pro-vac shill who defends vaccines no matter the harm caused.

  • AutismDadd

    Wrong, it was a comment separate from the main one.

  • But you admit that one does not need to be a vaccine expert to know the meaning of “parenchyma?”

  • AutismDadd

    whatever stooge

  • That’s a yes!

  • Sonja Henie

    No!You’re one of the most annoying people on disqus but you don’t have a clue nurses do. If I had the chance, I’d empty a bedpan on your head.

  • Bendys
  • AutismDadd

    See you had one handy and already have a plan. Besides, my wife is an RN so I’m well versed.

  • AutismDadd

    No that’s a stooge

  • Sonja Henie

    I feel sorry for your wife. It’s a shame you disrespect her profession so much. Either that, or you’re lying, which is far more likely.

  • Sean David Cohen

    so you’re also a troll who can’t spell supplements, or the word natural, or the word vaccines. wow. go back to elementary school, bro.

  • Ron Roy

    I didn’t think you would because for some unknown reason you refuse to face the fact that your wrong. But as I said many times others will make good use of the information on Whale / vaccine.

  • Billy Briggs

    Oh look! It’s Mr. journalistic integrity himself!

  • Or his wife is one of the NAAV/NAMV plonkers and because it feeds his ego, ADad’s all for her as “one of the good nurses” – facts and standards of care, be damned!

  • Sonja Henie

    But he said nurses hand out pills and collect bed pans. While I’ve done my share, nursing is a lot more than that!

  • So? For all you know, his wife refuses to do all of her job and ADAD got that idea from his sample of one.

  • Really? What about malaria? Rabies? Tetanus?

    Last time I checked, they didn’t go through the digestive system first.

  • Sonja Henie

    So-he has no idea what nurses do.

  • Proponent

    “It’s Official: Men Who Troll Women Are Losers – Literally”

    “But what makes the study really interesting, is the fact that Halo 3 actually works in a very similar way to most other online forums, such as Reddit, 4Chan or any number of comment sections. Meaning that it actually provides a disturbing insight into why some men (no, not all, but some) seem to think it’s OK to treat women so badly on other areas of the internet too. After all, it’s anonymous, and male players still significantly outnumber female ones – so they feel confident shutting down a rare woman who dares to speak (/play) out of line.”

  • Wow, you lie as a reflex, huh? What a scumbag.

  • It’s ADud.

  • Of course not.

    Those are immunologists.

  • AutismDadd

    Captain Obvious

  • AutismDadd

    Nonsense blah blah from Ken. As good as its ever going to be.

  • Whitney Hill

    They are helping me get his story out there. If Cash’s story helps save the life of one little baby then that is more then you could ever say about yourself

  • Sonja Henie

    I am sorry for your loss.

    You are are being duped.

  • Ron Roy

    Shills will say anything to keep that paycheck coming.

  • He does not make me look bad, you foolish and delusional woman. Or I assume you are woman. JG is just another crazed, delusional, and in denial insanity pushing pro-vaccine fool. You are the one with LITTLE knowledge, but you are to blinded by the false vaccine propaganda and your own denial, to ever see and admit to it. I have not been vaccinated in over 4 decades and nor have millions of other citizens in the US. Where is your vaccine derived herd immunity. Shouldn’t all those so called VPD be coming back? Think.

  • Here is something of substance, for you.

    Ep 21- Universal Vaccinations? LOL
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjmqOOJG7Rc

  • How about your own ignorance? This guy has a whole series of videos to educate you; get started.

    Ep 21- Universal Vaccinations? LOL
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjmqOOJG7Rc

  • Do something actually vaccine information constructive, and respond to the information in these videos?

    Ep 09- Vaccines Eradicated Small Pox? Part 1
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUF6BPQ2eYA

    The Missing Medical School Lectures- Ep01: Polio
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds9g5L1JtcA

  • Jonathan Graham

    As video is one of the slowest ways to transmit information I decline. Sorry, my time is just too valuable.

  • Anything better than some crank on YouTube?

  • LiLi

    You still failed to specify why he should be banned.

  • Jonathan Graham

    Lowell’s two big “guns” in his arguments are appeals to popularity i.e. “it’s obvious” and prejudicial language – “any honest person can see that”. You really can’t discuss anything with him because of these two roadblocks he puts up.

    He also does the Gish Gallop where he just dumps a long list of links.

  • Jonathan Graham

    He does not make me look bad,

    I sure do…or more correctly I just politely respond to your posts and let your various issues do all the work.

  • You are obviously as entirely delusional as it can ever get.

  • Badgering, falsely antagonizing, repeatedly false statements, endless denial, refusal of all relevant information, dishonesty, cognitive dissonance, intellectual dishonesty, intentions of only disruption and distraction instead of honestly debating the vaccine issues. How many more do you want?

  • So you refuse to respond, I knew you would. To much information for you?

    Ok, then address this information directly, or do you refuse that as well?

    HPV Vaccine: American College of Pediatricians Issues Rare Warning Against Vaccine Due to Premature Ovarian Failure
    http://circleofdocs.com/hpv-vaccine-american-college-of-pediatricians-issues-rare-warning-against-vaccine-due-to-premature-ovarian-failure/

    New Concerns about the Human Papillomavirus Vaccine
    https://www.acpeds.org/the-college-speaks/position-statements/health-issues/new-concerns-about-the-human-papillomavirus-vaccine

    Gardasil-The Flagship Example of the Failure of Vaccine Authorities to Regulate and Assure Vaccine Safety – “HPV Vaccine Has Done This to My Child”
    http://www.vacfacts.info/gardasil-the-flagship-example-of-the-failure-of-vaccine-authorities-to-regulate-and-assure-vaccine-safety.html

  • Liar. To much information for you? So then just keep sticking your nose in the CDC, WHO and Pediatrics and Offit/CHOP publications; as you are uneducated to any real historical truth and reality, and you choose to stay that way. Then just say that and admit to it.

  • First and third links are from pseudoscience-pushing liars, scammers, cranks, and the second link merely calls for investigation into a possible correlation that has not yet been rigorously tested. It is not a smoking gun, and it doesn’t claim that a relationship exists. They found a possible risk that hasn’t been specifically tested, and they are investigating it. VAERS is working.

  • Oh I think it is actually a smoking gun that they eventually will not escape from as to the truth. You are just unable to face and deal with your own obvious and major level of denial. And I don’t think you actually reviewed the information at all. You trolling shills, never do.

    Did Merck Deceive FDA About Gardasil Vaccine Research Omitting Data Concerning Ovarian Failure?

    by Cynthia A. Janak
    Health Impact News

    Comments by John P. Thomas
    Health Impact News

    Could the Research Design Measure Ovarian Dysfunction?

    The American College of Pediatricians stated:

    Few other vaccines besides Gardasil® that are administered in adolescence contain polysorbate 80. Pre-licensure safety trials for Gardasil® used placebo that contained polysorbate 80 as well as aluminum adjuvant. Therefore, if such ingredients could cause ovarian dysfunction, an increase in amenorrhea probably would not have been detected in the placebo controlled trials. Furthermore, a large number of girls in the original trials were taking hormonal contraceptives which can mask ovarian dysfunction including amenorrhea and ovarian failure. Thus a causal relationship between human papillomavirus vaccines (if not Gardasil® specifically) and ovarian dysfunction cannot be ruled out at this time.

    While data from those studies do not indicate an increased rate of amenorrhea after vaccination, the essential lack of saline placebos and the majority of participants taking hormonal contraceptives in those studies preclude meaningful data to rule out an effect on ovarian function. [1]

    Read more:
    https://healthimpactnews.com/2016/did-merck-deceive-fda-about-gardasil-vaccine-research-omitting-data-concerning-ovarian-failure/

    Cynthia A. Janak column – Gardasil
    http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/janak

    Cynthia Janak and Britt Fiste: “Gardasil Damage Explained” Feb 4
    http://holyhormones.com/vaccinations/cynthia-janak-and-britt-fiste-gardasil-damage-explained-feb-4/

    Britt Fiste – One Less Healthy Girl After Gardasil
    http://holyhormones.com/womens-health/cancer-womens-health/cervical-cancer/britt-fiste-one-less-healthy-girl-after-gardasil/

    Sanevax-Gardasil

    HPV VACCINE VAERS REPORTS TO MAY 2016

    Description Total
    Disabled 1,455
    Deaths 261
    Did Not Recover 8,346
    Abnormal Pap Smear 612
    Cervical Dysplasia 271
    Cervical Cancer 107
    Life Threatening 734
    Emergency Room 13,374
    Hospitalized 4,190
    Extended Hospital Stay 288
    Serious 5,749

    Total Adverse Events 44,633

    Yup, nothing to see here, folks?

    THE TRUTH ABOUT GARDASIL
    http://truthaboutgardasil.org/

    Gardasil has been linked to serious side effects including blood clotting, stroke, cardiac arrest and death
    http://www.thetruthaboutgardasil.com/

    Time for the Truth about Gardasil
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/04/17/time-for-the-truth-about-gardasil.aspx#!

  • Shill gambit? I accept your surrender.

    EDIT: Do you even read what you paste? Apparently I read your own sources better than you do. As I told you, they did not even say that a causative link is likely. The gist of the statement is that there isn’t enough good study data to rule out the possibility, so the possibility should be examined. Read what you paste, kid.

  • Jonathan Graham

    …and all I need to is respond politely to someone who calls me delusional and they look bad. :-)

  • Jonathan Graham

    Liar.

    Someone in a video speaks at approximately 150 words/minute. I can read about 700-800 words per minute. My wife can read over 900. So yes, videos are one of the slowest ways to transmit information. My time is more valuable hence I generally eschew videos.

    Please try to think before you respond.

  • Sonja Henie

    I agree! I rarely watch videos as “evidence”.

  • Jonathan Graham

    They also rarely properly support their assertions. It’s often hard to find references. Logicked a Canadian vlogger does a thing debunking creationists like Kent Hovind. Sometimes the sources they use are insanely obscure. He’s had to order books that have been out of print for years.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Yes, my daughter was “duped” but not by this article, she was “duped” by the doctors that didn’t inform her, the hospital that refused to help her and the vaccine manufacturers that made money from her. This publication is helping with the many fees that are involved with going through the vaccine injury court. This baby lived only 2 1/2 months, but his story has been read by thousands of people. I think my daughter..who is a private person….has shown nothing but extreme strength and bravery by allowing her story to be told. She is a hero…she is a mother who is trying to make sense of the loss of her precious child. I think it’s extremely sad and mean that you would tell her that the only people who have helped her get answers is “duping” her.

  • Gaela “Mike’sG” Fisher

    Before you attack people, do a little research. The genetics of red hair, discovered in 1997, appear to be associated with the melanocortin-1 receptor (MC1R), which is found on chromosome 16. Red hair is associated with fair skin color because low concentrations of eumelanin throughout the body of those with red hair caused by a MC1R mutation can cause both. It’s called “Google”. Try it sometime.

  • Jonathan Graham

    do a little research

    I’d suggest you do the same.

    The genetics of red hair, discovered in 1997, appear to be associated with the melanocortin-1 receptor (MC1R),

    I’ll note again that what is written in the portion of the article I cited is MCR-1 which is a gene found in yeast.

    However my point is that if the MC1R alleles for red hair are significant. Then you wouldn’t need to study redheaded people. Since the gene is present in a significant portion of non-readheaded people. What you appear to be confusing is that just because a phenotype like red hair is a recessive trait you are assuming that the genotype is “turned off”. Genetics aren’t that simple. For example while people consid