17 Examples of Admitted Vaccine Failure

Let’s face it.

As parents, we’re inundated with mixed messages about vaccines.

On one hand, doctors and mainstream media tell you how effective and safe vaccines are. On the other hand, you have parents like me who claim vaccines injured their children, or, in this case, that vaccines really “don’t work” as advertised.

What is often quickly forgotten is how often (and badly) vaccines fail. Ask yourself, “Why don’t these vaccine failures regularly make the news?”

If you can imagine in your mind’s eye, for a moment, the cash register “cha-chinging” while Big Pharma is pulling out a wad of cash, I think you may be getting close to the real answer. There’s big money in making sure the vaccine program is perceived as a success by you.

But this isn’t why you’re here.

Before I give you the 17 examples of how vaccines have failed, please investigate the United States vaccine schedule. Children are injected with 36 vaccines by the time they are 6 years of age.


The United States has the most aggressive vaccine schedule in the world.

You’ll notice a common theme that when vaccines fail, the proposed solution is often more vaccines, even when the child has already received multiple doses to “protect” them.

As promised, here are examples of the children being injected with toxic and ineffective vaccines, which their parents trusted would protect their children from getting the disease.

Vaccine Failure #1 – Mumps Outbreak in Orthodox Jewish Communities in the United States (2010)

A large mumps outbreak occurred among highly vaccinated U.S. Orthodox Jewish communities during 2009 and 2010. Of the teenagers vaccinated,

  • 89% had previously received two doses of a mumps-containing vaccine
  • 8% had received one dose

Those infected who received a vaccine: 97%. [1]


Vaccine Failure #2 – Mumps Epidemic in Iowa (2006)

In March, 2006, a total of 219 mumps cases had been reported in Iowa – the largest epidemic of mumps in the United States since 1988.

Of the 219 cases reported in Iowa, the average age of infection was 21. Of the 133 patients investigated with a vaccine history,

  • 87 (65%) had received 2 doses
  • 19 (14%) had received 1 dose
  • 8 (6%) had no doses
  • 19 (14%) vaccine status could not be documented

Those infected who received a vaccine: 79% (at least). [2]


Vaccine Failure #3 – Mumps Outbreak at a Summer Camp in New York (2005)

On July 26, 2005, the New York State Department of Health identified 31 cases of mumps, possibly introduced by an unvaccinated camp counselor from the United Kingdom (UK). The vaccine coverage for the entire camp was 96%. Of the infected 31,

  • 16 (52%) had received 2 doses
  • 4 (13%) had received 1 dose
  • 9 (29%) had no doses
  • 2 (6%) vaccine status could not be documented

20 of the 31 people infected (65%) of the people infected were vaccinated.

Vaccine coverage for the camp: 96%. [3]

Vaccine Failure #4 – Mumps Outbreak in a Highly Vaccinated Population (1989)

From October 1988 to April 1989, an outbreak involving 269 cases of mumps occurred in Douglas County, Kansas. Of the 269 cases, 208 (77.3%) occurred among primary and secondary school students, of whom 203 (97.6%) had received a mumps vaccination. [4]


Vaccine Failure #5 – Two Fully Vaccinated Doctors Get Measles (2009)

A measles outbreak in 2009 exposed and infected two physicians, both of whom had been fully vaccinated with two doses of the MMR vaccine. These physicians were suspected of having been infected by treating patients diagnosed with measles. [5]


Vaccine Failure #6 – Major Measles Epidemic in Quebec Despite 99% Vaccine Coverage (1989)

The 1989 measles outbreak infecting 1,363 people in the province of Quebec was attempted to be explained away as occurring because of “incomplete vaccination coverage.”

However, upon further investigation, it was discovered the vaccination coverage among cases was at least 84.5%. Vaccination coverage for the total population was 99.0%. [6]


Vaccine Failure #7–Outbreak of Measles Despite Appropriate Control Measures (1985)

In 1985, of 118 cases of measles which occurred on a Blackfeet reservation in Montana, 82% were vaccinated. Twenty-three of those cases occurred in the schools in Browning, Montana, where 98.7% of students were vaccinated. [7]


Vaccine Failure #8 – Measles Outbreak in a Fully Immunized Secondary-School Population (1985)

In 1985, an outbreak of measles occurred in a secondary school located in Corpus Christi, Texas. More than 99% had records of vaccination with live measles vaccine. The investigators concluded “that outbreaks of measles can occur in secondary schools, even when more than 99 percent of the students have been vaccinated and more than 95 percent are immune.

Vaccine coverage for school: 99%. [8]


Vaccine Failure #9 – Measles in an Immunized School-Aged Population in New Mexico (1984)

The story keeps repeating.

In 1984, 76 cases of measles were reported in Hobbs, New Mexico. Forty-seven cases (62%) occurred among students. The school reported that 98% of students were vaccinated against measles before the outbreak began.

Vaccine coverage for school: 98% [9]


Vaccine Failure #10 – Measles Outbreak Among Vaccinated High School Students in Illinois (1984)

In 1984, 21 cases of measles occurred in Sangamon County, Illinois.

  • 16 (76%) were vaccinated
  • 4 (19%) were unvaccinated preschool children
  • 1 (5%) vaccinated college student

All 411 students of the local high school were documented as having received the vaccination on or after their first birthday. Investigators remarked, “This outbreak demonstrates that transmission of measles can occur within a school population with a documented immunization level of 100%.

Vaccine coverage in school children contracting measles: 100% [10]


Vaccine Failure #11 – Analysis of Measles Epidemic; Possible Role of Vaccine Failures (1975)

In 1975, a measles epidemic occurred in schools in Greensville, Ontario. Out of the 47 cases of measles,

  • 26 (55.3%) had been vaccinated
  • 18 (18.3%) had not been vaccinated
  • 3 (6.4%) vaccine status unknown

Researchers concluded one vaccine isn’t enough to protect children. They recommended children be injected with an additional measles vaccine.

Cases of measles in vaccinated children: 55.3%. [11]


Vaccine Failure #12 – Unexpectedly Limited Durability of Immunity Following Acellular Pertussis Vaccination in Pre-Adolescents in a North American Outbreak (2012)

In 2012, doctors at Kaiser Permanente Medical Center identified 171 cases of pertussis – 132 in children. They noticed increased cases in children between the ages 8-12. They claim vaccine effectiveness was as follows:

  • For ages 2-7: 41% effective (?!?)
  • For ages 8-12: 24% effective (?!?)
  • For ages 13-18: 79% effective

Outside of using colorful adjectives such as garbage, worthless, or junk, the doctors hypothesized children need more vaccines to become “adequately protected.”

Vaccine effectiveness for ages 8-12: 24%. [12]


Vaccine Failure #13 – Clinical Presentation of Pertussis in Fully Immunized Children in Lithuania (2001)

In 2001, Lithuania’s vaccine coverage was 94.6% as a country. From May to December of that year, 53 children showed a serological confirmation of pertussis. Of the 53 children,

  • 32 (60.4%) were fully vaccinated
  • 21 (39.6%) were partially vaccinated or unvaccinated

Researchers conveniently grouped both partially vaccinated and unvaccinated children together. Twenty-eight of 32 fully vaccinated children (87.5%) had also received antibiotics.

Vaccinated children (who received at least three DTP vaccine doses) represented 43.2% of all pertussis cases diagnosed in 2001.

Vaccine coverage for Lithuania: 94.6%. [13]


Vaccine Failure #14 – Pertussis Infection in Fully Vaccinated Children in Day Care Centers (2000)

Many health professionals are adamant that vaccines protect against infection. Evidence from a field investigation in Israel challenges this belief.

In 2000, a child died suspected of having pertussis. The baby received the first dose of DTP at two months of age – all family members were completely vaccinated with four doses of DTP.

The day care centers that two siblings had attended during the child’s illness were investigated. All the children in the day care had been vaccinated in infancy with four doses of diphtheria-tetanus toxoid pertussis (DTP) vaccine, and a booster dose at 12 months of age.

Five fully vaccinated children were found to be colonized with Bordetella pertussis.

At the conclusion of the investigation, researchers stressed the following information:

Vaccinated adolescents and adults may serve as reservoirs for silent infection and become potential transmitters to unprotected infants. The whole-cell vaccine for pertussis is protective only against clinical disease, not against infection. Therefore, even young, recently vaccinated children may serve as reservoirs and potential transmitters of infection.

They re-emphasized again, “Our results indicate that children ages 5-6 years and possibly younger, ages 2-3 years, play a role as silent reservoirs in the transmission of pertussis in the community.

Vaccine coverage in daycare: 100% [14]

Vaccine Failure #15 – Pertussis Outbreak in Vermont (1996)

In 1996, over 280 cases of pertussis cases were identified in Vermont. Here is the breakdown of the age groups of those infected:

  • 12 (4%) were aged less than 1 year
  • 32 (11%) were 1-4 years
  • 42 (15%) were 5-9 years
  • 129 (46%) were 10-19 years
  • 65 (23%) were greater than or equal to 20 years

How many of these 215 children were vaccinated? According to the report, of the children who had a known vaccine status,

  • 5 children aged 7-47 months were partially vaccinated
  • 14 children aged 7-47 months were vaccinated with 3 doses
  • 49 children aged 7-18 years were partially vaccinated
  • 106 children aged 7-18 years were fully vaccinated

Disturbingly, 174 children were vaccinated and over half (61%) of the school children were considered “fully vaccinated!” It’s also important to keep in mind that in 1996, 97% of children aged 19-35 months in Vermont had received three or more doses of DT or DTP vaccine.

Complete failure in vaccinated children: at least 80.9% [15]


Vaccine Failure #16 – Outbreak of Varicella at a Day Care Center Despite Vaccination (2012)

Sometimes instead of saying a vaccine is a complete failure, a term such as “breakthrough varicella” is used to describe how children get the disease for which they were vaccinated.

In December of 2012, an outbreak occurred in a private day care center in a small community near Concord, New Hampshire. There were a total of 25 cases of varicella reported in children.

  • 17 (68%) were vaccinated
  • 8 (32%) were unvaccinated – two of these children were vaccinated in late December and classified as “unvaccinated”

The investigators lamented that the vaccine was 44% effective, saying, “The reasons for the poor performance of the vaccine are not apparent…the findings in this investigation raise concern that the current vaccination strategy may not protect all children adequately.

Vaccine coverage: 73.1% [16]


Vaccine Failure #17 – An Outbreak of Chickenpox in Elementary School Children with Two-Dose Varicella Vaccine Recipients (2006)

When it is apparent one vaccine isn’t working, the answer is almost always more vaccines… ever notice?

In June 2006, a second dose of the chickenpox (varicella) vaccine was recommended for school entry. Shortly after school had begun, the Arkansas Department of Health was notified of a varicella outbreak in students.

Vaccination information was available for 871 (99%) of the 880 children. Ninety-seven percent of the children had been vaccinated for varicella! In this outbreak, 84 cases were reported.

Vaccine coverage: 97%. [17]



As you can see from the above examples, vaccines fail and do so often. Trust me, there are many more examples I didn’t cover here.

Here’s a tip for you if you want to look for more information. Open your browser right now. Go to Google.com and do a search for the terms “previously immunized for (x)” or “breakthrough (x) in school.” X, of course, represents a “vaccine preventable” disease such as pertussis, measles, varicella, etc., – you get the point.

As a parent, you trust doctors to provide you with accurate information. When doctors say vaccines work and they are effective, from whom are they getting their information?

Maybe even more importantly, why aren’t the vaccine failures covered by mainstream media to inform you? The likely answer is the organizations who really need protection from the truth are the members of Big Pharma – and I don’t think there is a vaccine for that (although they may try to create one).

If you find other examples, please post them below (with the link to PubMed) for other parents to read.


[contentbox headline=”References” type=”normal”]
  1. http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1202865
  2. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm55d330a1.htm
  3. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5507a2.htm
  4. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1861205
  5. http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/204/suppl_1/S559.full.pdf+html
  6. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1884314
  7. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=3618578
  8. http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM198703263161303
  9. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000476.htm
  10. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000359.htm
  11. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1956577/
  12. http://cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2012/03/13/cid.cis287
  13. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15918913
  14. http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/6/5/00-0512_article.htm
  15. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00049244.htm
  16. http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa021662
  17. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19593254

Photo Credit

Jeffry John Aufderheide

Jeffry John Aufderheide is the father of a child injured as a result of vaccination. As editor of VacTruth.com, he promotes well-educated health professionals, informed consent, and full disclosure and accountability of adverse reactions to vaccines.

  • Lymerix was another failed vaccine.

  • nonvacjack

    Vaccines are killing our future

  • Lou

    “As a parent, you trust doctors to provide you with accurate information.
    When doctors say vaccines work and they are effective, from whom are
    they getting their information?”

    IMO instead of asking your pediatrician about the dangers of “vaccination” please find out who is taking his office’s emergency night calls and talk to them; not always easy. You will find out a LOT about “common vaccine reactions” by panicked mothers who have a very sick baby a few hours after a “vaccination”. These nurses often know a lot more about the dangers of “vaccination” than their boss. Ask them how they feel about advising the panicked mother to “tough it out” until morning with a baby they feel is, and often is, in great danger.

  • jabadash

    I just want to say that I have a friend who is a pharmacist (pharm D ) and works in a vermont hospital. She has been an RPH for over 20 years. This RPH told me because of what is in vaccines and their ineffective ness neither she NOR ANY of the pharmacists she works with get vaccinated……. that should tell you something !

  • betsyanne

    It is discouraging to read of the high rate of vaccinations in this and many other countries. Very discouraging. Too many brainwashed people or many who are just too *pre-occupied* to fight the system so they vaccinate their kids to keep peace. I run a day care and I prefer children who are unvaccinated so that they catch wild viruses and spread wild viruses, not catch/spread the virus from a kid who WAS vaccinated and now the damn thing is shedding. Kids need to get sick in order to build up that immune system nirvana so they can fight off MORE stuff (naturally) later on. Vaccinations, IMPHO, weaken the immune system and create more and more illnesses. In fact, I believe that’s exactly what happened with the flu. In 2010 and 2011 people had the daylights scared out of them by the medical industry about getting a flu shot or suffering and dieing from this dread disease. Well, there was no epidemic in either year so the medical people panicked about mid-way through 2011 flu season and vaccinated even people who were ill. Now there were enough people shedding the flu virus so that 2012 was a Perfect Storm for the flu. I, for one, am VERY sensitive for vaccines which shed, because I have a damaged immune system (which I truly believe came from a flu shot I received in 2002 after my doctor convinced me to get one since I run a day care. I now have peripheral neuropathy in both feet from the knees down and I have Sjogren’s Syndrome which is related to RA. Either or both could be a result of that stupid shot. Of course, that was before I knew about the dangers of vaccinations.
    I always wonder why there are so many uninformed people, especially now in the age of computers, when people like Barbara Loe Fisher have been around and warning people of the dangers since the 1980s. Until I started using a computer I knew nothing about the problems with vaccines, nothing about the number of infant deaths, nothing about the fact that people who are sick are not supposed to be vaccinated with anything at all until they’re *well*. That is also discouraging because we should be able to make people aware.
    I know several families with young children who are aware, but they do it anyway and say, “oh that always happens to someone else, and that’ll never happen to MY baby/child”. They live in happy ignorance until something DOES happen, either to one of their children or someone close to them who has a child with problems from vax. It’s a bit late to start paying attention at that point sometimes.
    One of these days, when ObozoCareLess goes into effect, the insurance companies will make vaccinations mandatory. That’s my bet. I don’t think children of the future have a chance at avoiding it, but there’s always wishing!

  • brothersun

    The trouble with using the term “vaccine failures” is that it implies that vaccines normally work, but in these specific cases, they failed for whatever reason. I can’t think of a better term at the moment, but I’m just hoping people will put 2 and 2 together and realize that they simply don’t work.

  • Dulcimist

    What is Lymerix a vaccine for? I have never heard of it?

  • I had a relative (by marriage) Unfreind me on Facebook because she didn’t like the posts I was making on her Facebook page about vaccines. She even posted about how she needed to take her infant daughter to get vaccinated and then how sick she was after! Part of the problem is people don’t like to think they have been fooled and would rather believe the lie than admit they are wrong.

  • betsyanne

    That’s one of many reasons I’ve never joined facebook and I don’t tweet or any of that junk. She couldn’t have been a very good friend or she would allow you to have your opinion, just as she was able to have hers.

  • Argus

    And that is exactly what Jeffry’s example show – that the vaccines usually work, but for some individuals, they did not provide complete protection.
    What we really need to know is how many total persons were exposed in each of these situations, how many in that group were vaccinated or not, and how many of each of the vaccinated and unvaccinated subgroups came down with the disease.
    With those numbers, it is possible to calculate what percentage of vaccinated individuals that were exposed became sick (which will be a very low number) and what percentage of non-vaccinated kids became sick (which will be very high – probably near 100%).
    So let’s see *all* the numbers, Jeffry.

  • ThinkingMum

    In Australia in 2011 there were 38,000+ cases of pertussis reported to Health Depts – The Head of Immunology at Westmead Children’s Hospital stated on mainstream TV – that NEARLY ALL the pertussis is in the fully vaccinated. When the journalist asked him “What are parents to do then?” his reply was, “they must keep vaccinating their children.” Of course the journalist took this no further, possibly for fear of his job. Isn’t that a sign of madness, doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result! I am sure some wise person said that.

  • Argus, you’re more than welcome to go sift through the data in the resources I provide at the end of the article — but my assumption is you’re too afraid to do so.

    Here’s one question I’d like a Yes or No answer from you. Do vaccines protect against being or becoming infected?

  • Understood – most people are still led to believe they still work. The reports even state there is an overconfidence in vaccines from physicians… the line of thinking goes something like this… if the child is vaccinated for a disease, they cannot get infected by it. Therefore, the doctors don’t look for it.

    I can tell you of one child I know was vaccinated for pertussis… and the doctor diagnosed him with croup. Croup can be mistaken for pertussis (differential diagnosis). What do you think the odds would be if the child wasn’t vaccinated for pertussis, the doctor would have said the child had whooping cough?


  • This happens frequently. Vaccines can be an emotional topic for some people — I’m glad you have the courage to stand up for what you believe in.

  • Certainly a theory worth exploring.

  • It doesn’t make any logical sense to keep vaccinating — and yet that is what the “experts” recommend. My theory is because they have no other recourse or answers to solve the problem. If vaccines didn’t work, how much credibility would be lost? Much, I think. Thanks for the report – if you have links to the story, please send them. Thank you.

  • Fantastic advice – some of this advice is very familiar to many moms and dads… including me.

  • Thanks for sharing, Debbie. If you would be so kind to post some links, that would be amazing. Thank you.

  • Lyme disease.

  • I think you are pretty close to the target. First they had to see if they could get away with it with the nurses…

  • Let’s hope they are not threatened with losing their jobs like so many other healthcare professionals for their refusal.

  • David

    good article John, thank you. And as well as the failures what would success look like?

    Because someone doesn’t get the flu and have been vaccinated, it doesn’t mean the

    vaccine is effective! People who haven’t had a vaccine may not get the flu either.

    The Australian inventor of flu vaccine had this to say about it. The late Dr Graeme Laver, former Professor of Biochemistry at the Australian National University, was a co-inventor of the flu vaccine and also of the anti-viral drug, Relenza.: “It is better than nothing, and I wouldn’t want to advise people not to take it, but you can’t rely on it doing any good.”

    And then there were many instances where vaccines killed infants India, Japan, and

    in the UK where a 16 year old died from the HPV vaccine. In the UK also hundreds of children developed narcolepsy .Similarly in Finland!

    Most readers will know that Pharmaceutical Cos are engaged in criminal misrepresentation of their products and have the gall to admit that most of their drugs
    don’t work on most people. “it is well known in the Pharmaceutical trade”. according to an article in the UK newspaper, the Independent. here is the link to that article;
    http://www.independent.co.uk/…/science/glaxo-chief-our-drugs-do-not-wo. And as if that

    wasn’t enough here is a quote from leading drug co CEO

    First, we face a public environment where our industry –
    especially Big Pharma – is suffering from a loss of trust in the safety of our
    products and the honesty of our business practices … and we mostly have
    ourselves to blame” John Lechleiter,Phd CEO Eli Lilley. this insincere admission came out after they were fined $1.5 billion for fraud and misrepresentation. Notice the way he spreads the blame to the whole industry… as if to say we are not the only bad boys everyone else is bad as well.

    So thats OK then!!! It would mean something if they stopped their criminal activitity

    but they don’t. Not long after Pfizers the largest Pharmaceutical Co in the world

    were fined $2.3 billion for fraud and misrepresentation, and they were described by the judge in the trial as serial liars. Why serial? Because it was the 4th time in 10 years

    Pfizers had been fined for similar offences!!! Rarely in these cases are patients

    mentioned. Nor the pivotal role of doctors in furthering the aims of Pharma while

    earning commissions for every tablet they prescribe. These doctors should be named shamed and jailed where patients have been harmed. Fines don’t work. They just

    factor in a fine as a cost of doing business!!! And get tax relief !!!

  • ds

    There is a vacine for big pharma, it’s called advertising dollars.

  • AntiVaccineGrandmother

    Hi Betsyanne: I am sorry you fell prey to the vaccine gestapo.So did we. Pls. consider detoxification to ease your health concerns. We were ignorant and vaccinated my grand-daughter, 7 days later she almost died. I now know more about vaccines that the average pediatrician but because I don’t have an MD after my name, my knowledge counts for nothing. How sad. The very people we trust, know so little about the poisons they inject into our precious little infants. And worst of it all, it is very difficult to sue them. So they just go on vaccinating innocent children. Doctors are so very busy making money that they forget the basic principles of care. Just like an attorney needs to know the law, a doctor should know medicine. If pediatricians know the full toxicity of vaccines and the low protection against disease they offer, they could no longer vaccinate and that would cut into their profits. So, they stick their head in the sand and just continue the lies they been fed to by the pharmaceutical companies. They know they can’t get sued so what’s the harm? My grand-daughter is recovering nicely but only because we immediately linked the bleeding in her brain to vaccines and never vaccinated her again. All doctors basically said she was doomed and you should see her now! I have lost my respect for doctors with the exception of Drs. Blaylock, Mercola, Yazbak, Tennpenny and Ayoub and a few more….

    Medicine is nothing but a profit making business which is not how it started. Nobody minds doctors making a profit but if they are so busy running after the big bucks that they neglect their primary objective which should be gaining knowledge to protect their patients from illness, they missed the very nature of their calling. One could argue that vaccines do just that but when you learn about mercury and aluminum and the affects on the human brain, you quickly have to conclude that they are very dangerous . When you further educate yourself about child hood illnesses, you will also learn that they are curable with often simple methods for example high doses of Vitamin C for whooping cough (per Dr. Susanne Humphries). Doctors have always ignored natural methods and always look to Pharma first. Most medications only cover or ease symptoms but do NOTHING to eliminate the underlying cause. In my mind, A TOTAL BACKWARDS APPROACH and as we continue to learn a very dangerous approach. Medical Schools need to stop accepting financial support from Big Pharma and focus on natural healing methods. Medicine in this country needs a total overhaul, especially in regards to medications and vaccines. VACCINES KILL AND CAUSE HARM. Vaccines may have been a good concept on paper long ago but times have changed a lot. Vaccines are a DANGEROUS and antiquated theory of protection against illness.
    I hope you will find a natural healer to help you detox and remove the mercury and aluminum from your body and hopefully restore you to full health.

  • Argus

    Why should we have to do the work you failed to do in writing this wildly misleading article? If you are to live up to the name of this site, you have a responsibility to tell the truth, not lies based on the witholding of pertinent facts.

    Vaccines work by training the immune system to react quickly to infection by a particular disease. What is your point in asking this question?

  • AntiVaccineGrandmother

    One more comment from me, yes, vaccines are an emotional topic for some people. What’s most shocking to me and my family is how agressively some people (and doctors) defend the efficacy of vaccines and when you talk to them a little bit more, you find out they have very limited knowledge. Why would you defend something you know soooo little about? I think a lot of it is guilt. Of course they have to defend vaccines because if they don’t they would in effect admit that they did something foolish or even dangerous. And what parent wants to admit that they allowed a doctor to inject their infant with toxic mercury and aluminum? So, they defend themselves by defending vaccines.

  • How can you claim the work hasn’t been done Argus, when the details as to each outbreak are in the listed references? What, nejm.org, the CDC, Pubmed, and Oxford Journals are not good enough references for you? This is one of the classic and typical avoidance and denial tactics used by the standard shill, vaccine harm and ineffectiveness denialist’s. Making again and again complete denial of the existence of proof information and data in front of them. You could rub their nose in it all day long, and they would still refuse to see it. If you are to lazy to actually review anything here; who’s fault is that, Argus?

    All you are doing is reinforcing again and again the already well known knowledge and understanding, that for the pro-vaccinator’s, NOTHING is ever enough. No amount of data, unbiased and real science; and no amount of common sense reasoning would be enough. They must deny it. But keep on spouting and touting that same old well known and long past debunked, and false vaccine propaganda, Argus.

    If you can keep tying your blinders on for long enough, you will never need to face the truth.

  • PA

    never argue with a troll

  • betsyanne

    @ AntivaccineGrandmother: Well, firstly I don’t really believe in detox. I believe the body does a lot of that on its own, all the time. I mean, that’s what our organs DO.
    But I do believe in chelation therapy (similar concept) and that has helped many people I know. So have many of the practices of TCM, such as “like treats like” wherein you give support (nutritionally or with herbs and supplements) to the effected organ. If you have liver problems, you eat liver or desiccated liver tablets. If you have pancreatic issues, you take a glandular based supplement to support those organs. I just do not believe in stressing already stressed out organs through detox. I’ve never thought that was a good idea. Organs in stress need support. The only type of “detox” I truly believe in is sweating, which we do naturally. I take salt baths and milk baths, etc.
    But I was vaccinated back in 2002, so it’s a little late anyhow. I am treating both of those diseases with alternative methods and actually doing quite well, except that my eyes are getting worse with each passing year. But maybe they would have anyway because I’m no spring chicken!
    I’ve heard of all of those doctors you mentioned and agree with you entirely, and have now been fully aware – as in COMPLETE awakening – to the entire ruse behind the medical industrial complex, as well as many other facets of the evil which is now shaping our world. The doctors DO know about the dangers – and that is the sad part of this picture – but they don’t want you or anyone else to know, or to know that they know, er, you know what I mean. They understand the dangers because few doctors vax their own children. They want you and I and the rest of the world, however, to believe in science fiction.
    At the root of the whole mess, however, is where the blame needs to be squarely placed and that’s with our corrupt gubment officials in WADC. That’s where we need to start cleaning house but I’m sure nothing is going to be effective other than an all-out, bloody-if-necessary, revolution by we the people. There’s just nowhere else to go with this mess that’s been created.
    I was sorry to read about your granddaughter, but happy to see she is doing better.

  • TheRefusers

    Hey Jeffry,

    Facebook is now blocking this VacTruth article with the Web of Truth propaganda
    program. Is this like living in East Germany or what? Try clicking on your article through FB and you get the Big Brother newspeak blocker. Somebody doesn’t like you. PS: Let’s talk. MB

  • What is far more concerning in this, than vaccine failure; are the questions for example of just what exactly is going on with the situation. In regard to Pertussis, some significant questions can be raised as to if the vaccine is actually doing more harm than good, not only in regard to adverse vaccine reactions, but as well in regard to mutation changes (increasing virulence) in the pertussis pathogen, and as well in regard to causation of other similar pathogens to become stronger and more prevalent. Pathogens not currently in the vaccine. One example of that, you will find below.

    Acellular pertussis vaccination enhances B. parapertussis colonization

    An acellular whooping cough vaccine actually enhances the colonization of Bordetella parapertussis in mice; pointing towards a rise in B. parapertussis incidence resulting from acellular vaccination, which may have contributed to the observed increase in whooping cough over the last decade.


    B parapertussis antigen is not in the current vaccine; and most often PCR testing is not done. Like Jeffry said in his comment; there is an overconfidence in vaccines from physicians… the line of thinking goes something like this… if the child is vaccinated for a disease, they cannot get infected by it. Therefore, the doctors don’t look for it.

    As for potential pertussis pathogen mutations; of course you are not going to find the CDC ever actively addressing that. You can have slight variations in the pertussis bacteria pathogen that allow evasion by the vaccine strain antibodies. You can have a mutation causing increased virulence. Instead of focusing on the obvious problem, they each and every time at the CDC only look for lame excuses to blame the un-vaccinated, and thus promote further fear mongering campaigns to get vaccinated, and/or get another booster.

    They have gone to even vaccinating whole families in what they call cocoon style vaccinating; and that too has failed. Now they are and have gone to pushing this failed DTaP vaccine on adults and added it to that schedule as well. Nothing would be enough. In the CDC’s world, literally no vaccine can fail, if they have their say about it. Pharma as well is not going to pay the cost of formulating a new vaccine, (if that would even help), if they can still get away with using the old one. Of course and as well with the vaccine truth movement as strong as it is; the CDC of at this point greatly fears giving their non forced acknowledgement that any vaccine is unsafe or ineffective. Look at all they have as well denied regarding the obviously known harm of Gardasil.

    In reality is that in most US schools they have never had enough existing vaccine exemptions, to ever fall below the so called determined and required percentage level for vaccine derived herd immunity. So thus obviously there should be sufficient vaccine coverage to prevent outbreaks, (boosters included) and so that would seem to be a given. Unless they think that they need to change that, and that they now need 100% coverage for herd immunity to work? A 10% non vaccinated rate, you know that’s pretty high, (insert sarcasm). That wouldn’t be much of a statement in claiming that vaccines work, now would it?

    The claim is that these vaccines do not shed, but yet we have this below statement as to the day care center outbreak in Israel. (Vaccinated children may be asymptomatic reservoirs for infection). So who is actually at risk? Perhaps after all it is the other way around, and it is the un-vaccinated that are indeed at risk being exposed to the vaccinated? The vaccine misinformation we have been fed is just amazingly endless.

    Pertussis infection in fully vaccinated children in day-care centers, Israel.


    We tested 46 fully vaccinated children in two day-care centers in Israel who were exposed to a fatal case of pertussis infection. Only two of five children who tested positive for Bordetella pertussis met the World Health Organization’s case definition for pertussis. Vaccinated children may be asymptomatic reservoirs for infection.

    How can we have information like this, and they still claim to that there is no problem with the effectiveness of the vaccine?

    Whooping Cough Epidemic Caused by Virulent New Pertussis Strain—And It’s the Result of Vaccine

    Bordetella pertussis Strains with Increased Toxin Production Associated with Pertussis Resurgence (PDF)

    Abstract excerpt:

    We present evidence that in the Netherlands the dramatic increase in pertussis is temporally associated with the emergence of Bordetella pertussis strains carrying a novel allele for the pertussis toxin promoter, which confers increased pertussis toxin (Ptx) production. Epidemiologic data suggest that these strains are more virulent in humans. We discuss changes in the ecology of B. pertussis that may have driven this adaptation. Our results underline the importance of Ptx in transmission, suggest that vaccination may select for increased virulence, and indicate ways to control


    Pertussis Vaccine Failure is not Just Modern but Historical: Vaccine has Never Been Effective

    Researchers find first US evidence of vaccine-resistant pertussis

    Read more:

    Post Vaccination – Vaccine Targeted Strain – Viral and Bacterial Pathogen – Shedding

    Varicella and Shingles Vaccine – For Profit Quackery

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  • freedom

    Vaccinations are blood assassinations, a retired policeman in Q’land Australia has stated in an interview that he believes SIDS is a result of vaccinations, not sure if I read that here or not, anyway, he went on to say that he saw the parents of vaccinated babies who died not long after the vac. treated as if they were murderers and some were even locked up.
    The police, politicians, doctors all work for the Big Pharma CorpoRATes and these are the very people who treat us all with such primitive and vicious violence.

  • Thanks Jeffry. I do not believe in vaccination and have been ‘studying’, researched for more then 23 years now. It’s all money making for the doctors and pharma and isn’t it odd that even doctors and nurses hush it up that they don’t vaccinate their own children….

  • Very true.

  • Do my messages vanish here if I write information that is truthful?

  • Paul,

    We already get the “official” story from government sites. Don’t insult our intelligence.

    Feel free to debunk whatever you wish, however, if you want to promote your Youtube channel and the Australian Medical Association, please let the readers know your bias. Thanks.

  • Thanks, Lowell – it’s just part of the typical tactics used.

  • Thanks for the heads up MB. Apparently some don’t like the dirty laundry aired…

  • Just for your information, Mr. Davis, Australia’s infant mortality rate: 4.55; Under 5 mortality rate: 4.9; Vaccines before 6: 27. Not really numbers to brag about, but I can see why folks like you need to keep up the cheer leading for vaccines.

  • Ginger Martin

    Our Heavenly received the dpt at four months and had a sever reaction to it. We were told our 9 at birth with no genetic problems would die within weeks. She will be three in May. Was blind 10 months loss use of her arms. Just now learning to hold her head up 90 seconds at a time. Can not sit up, roll over anything. She is fed by bottle. We have no idea if she knows any of us. She is totally dependent on us. Our Heavenly is a hero. Her story has stopped lots of parents from makeing that mistake of vaccines. She is a fighter. The light of our lives. Gods natursl foods have given her hope. She has never even had a cold or anything and is around children all the time. We ask for you to please pray for her recovery.i can be reached at [email protected]. Her case after two years of testing is confirmed from the vaccines.please put vaccine injury in reference area so i en fast.

  • Jim Bob

    Hey Jeff,

    Ever heard of a strawman argument? If not, look it up. It’s what your trying to do with that question. (Hint: Its an illogical argument)

  • Argus

    So, Jeffry, once again I ask you what is the point you are trying to make. What’s with the infant mortality and vaccination figures for Australia?
    Could you please state a hypothesis – then we can test it.
    Unless, of course, you want to go back to responding with another “straw man” in order to avoid the subject.

  • No problem’s Jeffry… By the way, let’s talk infant mortality and vaccination – I’ll use your logic (which is clearly surplus to your requirements). Let’s take the country with the LOWEST infant mortality rate, that’s Singapore. Right? Now let’s take the country with the highest vaccination rates, ummm, wait, that’s Singapore (again). Hang on a second, lowest infant mortality rate, highest vaccination rate… I think someone must be fudging the numbers – or is it something to brag about?

  • What an uneducated response… I seriously hope you’re either a) joking or b) deluded. Because in reality, vaccines do not cause SIDS – in fact, non-vaccinated babies have died as a result of SIDS. In New Zealand SIDS numbers have declined yet vaccination rates have increased – seems odd doesn’t it if there’s a link? So I guess it’s another out of the frying pan and into the fire with your out of context, disgusting, and highly inaccurate accounts of the world… congrats on all the misinformation that you feed the masses of mindless people… It’s junk food for the babies…

  • Actually, pertussis is one of the shorter lived vaccines in our body. Even immunity from the natural disease lasts no longer than immunity from the vaccine. If you’re a new parent, recently pregnant or planning on having a baby, the whole immediate family can be re-immunised for pertussis and this could save your babies life admist a whole range of epidemics of this serious and life threatening disease. I’m not afraid to admit that immunity is short lived on this bacterial infection – but I am afraid that people like you endanger the lives of innocent babies, new parents and families that just want the best for their children – immunising against pertussis while pregnant is SAFE! Proven!

  • The fact is – these sick babies very rarely stay sick – just like any virus, the body reacts in a way to protect itself – this could mean fever, it could mean bruising – this is usual, normal and not an adverse reaction (as such) but it is the miracle that is our immune system. I hope that the panicked mother syndrome you talk of is well and truly dismissed by the emergency nurse and the truth comes very clear about the importance of immunisation.

  • Where is your proof that Singapore has the highest vaccination rate??? They are one of the least vaccinate countries. The US is THE highest vaccinated country for children under the age of 6. That was confirmed today, multiple times, in the congressional hearing for an investigation of the CDC and NIH….confirmed by Congress member’s research AND the CDC’s doctors.

  • Matthew Brown

    those are great examples.

    the criticisms would be:

    1 That in the world, you can find examples of everything, what you need is data that is randomly selected – ie a study that shows that rates of measles are the same among the immunised and non-immunised. That would prove that the vacine doesn’t work. This data only proves that the vaccination isn’t 100% effective. Something that everybody already knows.

    2 The information needs to be presented in a more professional manner. From the moment you start reading it you know it is biased.eg: “measles 2, vaccinated doctors 0” seems unnecessary.

    Having said that, I’m impressed with your comittment to a worthy cause. There don’t seem to be many people like me who believe that some of the vaccinations the risk outweighs the benefit (the MMR being one of these), but that a great many of them do more harm than good. Everybody seems to be polarised. Consider the possibility that the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

    Dr Matthew Brown

  • Matthew Brown

    croup and pertussis are easily clinically differentiated. A common cold and pertussis however are not

  • Singapore – 5th equal with 95% vaccination rate… US is no where near the highest rate of vaccination – I think you confused coverage of disease vs population vaccinated… Sorry Missy, put you’ve misinterpreted your facts. I admit I wrote the above wrong, Singapore is ONE of the highest vaccinated countries on earth with the LOWEST infant mortality rates. Sweden, also with low infant mortality rates is 4th. New Zealand with a falling SIDS rate is 5th equal – seems odd to link SIDS to vaccines when SIDS rates are dropping but vaccination rates aren’t…

  • Matthew Brown

    Jeffry, the answer is a simple unequivocal yes. If you had asked do they provide 100% protection, the answer is a simple no. I hope that answers your question. That sort of ridiculous question puts people like me who have spent tens of years of our lives trying to help sick kids off reading what is on the whole, quality data that the majority of us are ignoring.
    Do what you like, but if you want a wider audience (ie one that includes those other than the hardcore conspiracy theorists – and to some degree I believe there is a big pharma conspiracy here – then I suggest you moderate your views and work on your medical and statistical education.

    But that’s just a suggestion.


  • And to compare, I best put USA’s data there too http://apps.who.int/immunization_monitoring/en/globalsummary/timeseries/TSWUcoverageByCountry.cfm?country=USA Clearly Singapore is more vaccinated in COVERAGE than the USA.

  • Matthew Brown

    Who is suing? The govt or pharma?

  • Matthew Brown

    straw man well noted.

  • Matthew Brown

    Good points. I don’t believe they’ll push through Obozo though. It’s a human rights violation and it has bozo in the name

  • Sorry Matthew, I didn’t write the story, but I was lead to believe it’s a federal investigation so I’d suggest it’s government. If you’d like to look further into the story I suggest you contact the ABC as I was merely making a comment based on fact.

  • Matthew Brown

    Medicine IS more than just a profit making enterprise, but it is skewed that way, especially where you live.

  • Matthew Brown

    Doctors HAVEN’T always ignored natural methods, in fact, in the beginning that’s all we had. We use many naturally occurring substances and derivatives of the same.

  • Matthew Brown

    Well said.

  • @98d6c80c3fedafc16b03a331df080bb6:disqus – Feel free to elaborate at any time.

  • Matthew Brown

    She feels that the benefit of vaccines outweighs the harm. You’ve just posted about her on the net. She did something much more passive which was to chose not to receive your posts (which may have been pretty exteeme – I don’t know).

  • I think it’s important to make the distinction. So what happens when a disease mutates? More vaccines?

  • Matt, thanks for your advice on the wider audience, but I’ll pass. The “science” of vaccinology is not very scientific. You can go read the sources for yourself and come to your own conclusions. At what point will you start asking the question, when are “more vaccines” not the answer?

  • I’m not talking about vaccine rates, Paul. I’m talking about number of vaccines, but I’d expect you to know the difference.

  • Vaccine rate is not the same as the amount of vaccines, Paul.

  • Safe and proven? Interesting Paul – Contaminated Spinach (11-2-2012): A total of 33 persons infected with E. coli were investigated by the FDA and CDC. It was traced back to Wegmans Organic Spinach and Spring Mix. Result: Product Recalled.


    Paul, look in VAERS for adverse reactions to the DTaP vaccine for 2013. Looks like the FDA and CDC remove a product that is contaminated and/or causes harm from the shelves pretty quickly, however, vaccines are exempt from this policy. If you need more examples, I’m more than happy to provide them.


  • Really, Paul? Where is your evidence?

  • Interesting statement, Paul… because I can show you right now where SIDs was listed on a vaccine insert as an adverse reaction to vaccines…but then again, you’ll probably just say it was a misprint.

  • Dr. Brown, parents are told vaccines are safe and that an adverse reaction is 1 in a million. It’s what I was told as a parent. Consider most parents who speak against vaccinations were once “pro vaccine” and blindly trusted their doctor’s advice.

  • No Paul, your messages were marked as spam and I had to approve them. This happens from time to time. As long as your comments are kept respectful you are welcome to post.

  • Exactly Jeffry – that’s EXACTLY how I intended my communication…

  • Then please share with everyone else how many vaccines a child from Singapore gets versus a child in the United States.

  • Since when is providing referenced documentation of fact, an illogical argument?

    As for your claim Jim Bob, A straw man or straw person, is a type of argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent’s position. To “attack a straw man” is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the “straw man”), and to refute it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.

    Now, to actually show that was the case here, (that it was a misrepresentation); YOU need to provide proof here in the form of an argument, that shows us why and how that the referenced information was NOT what it is claimed to be. So, to do that, you are going have a bit of a difficult job in doing so because those references come from the sources that you see they do. So, lets see you get started with that!

  • Hard core conspiracy theorists? What conspiracy theories do you find here? Start making a specific list? Facts backed up with references, are not just theories. As well please and try and write a little more coherently, if possible?

  • I think the hypothesis is that you are intentionally clueless Argus, and we have already tested that and found it to be true. Go read what I reply posted to this above, and see if you can argue with, that?

    U.S. Vaccine Schedule Verses Other Countries


    [PDF] AUTISM AND VACCINES AROUND THE WORLD (number of vaccines verses mortality comparison data and graphs)


  • In fact that is correct, homeopaths, chiropractors, and other types of naturopathy were once prevalent at a time approximately 100 years ago. In fact during the 1918 flu pandemic, homeopathy and chiropractic camps had much higher success and survival rates, than allopathic chemicalized medicine ever did. But where do you suppose the opportunity for big money and mark up, existed and still exists? That is why it was forced out, total allopathic monopoly control.

    The History of Influenza, (chiropractic and homeopathy statistics in 1918)

    Important for Swine Flu Epidemic: Homeopathy Successfully Treated Flu Epidemic of 1918

    The Real History of Medicine

    The False Foundations of Modern Medicine

  • betsyanne

    Meh, let Paul live in happy ignorance. He’s a plant (in more ways than one) so let him believe in the bogus science. The death rate is what can’t be hidden, but then doctors and science get to bury their mistakes, don’t they?

  • Jim Bob

    Alright, If I must. Although, I have to question your critical thinking skills if I have to spell it out. You’re asking a question but limiting the respondant for the purpose of creating a misrepresentation of the facts by leaving out pertinent information. Thereby creating an easy target (or strawman, if you will) for you to attack.

  • Jim Bob


    You realize that a couple posts above you put quotations around official as in the “official” government story, implying their intentions are nefarious and their information provided is dubious. Yet here you quote government statistics. You can’t say, “I distrust the government but I will use the information provided as fact towards my arguement because I believe it helps me.”

    Logic dictacts that if the government is providing false information, you shouldn’t use it as the basis for your own arguments because you are then buliding an argument around faulty assumptions which you clearly believe are false.

    Bad logic is bad.

  • Ginger thank you for spreading your sad story so that others are warned about vaccine dangers. I am very sorry about your little daughter’s suffering. Blessings.

  • Cherry Misra

    Singapore!- What a joke. Anyone can talk about another country. Have you been to Singapore and checked out what kind of stats they have for Kawasaki Disease, nephrotic syndrome in babies, extreme sensitivity to light, tunnel vision, eyes that dont focus (such as cross eyes or lazy eye) in toddlers, Lebers amaurosis, Do you know how many kids they have in schools for autistic kids- how many hyperactive kids? , How many kids who need growth hormone? If singapore is still using vaccines with mercury, all of these afflictions will be found there. Nice to survive the first year of life, but it would be nice to have a brain and healthy body after that. All of these nations where people eat a lot of fish, and the children are recipients of the mercury from the mother as well as mercury from vaccines and fish eaten by the child- have these health problems and many more. check out Japan- for example. We are told that one in four elderly Japanese will face Alzheimers- no one apparently available to warn them not to eat so much fish.

  • It’s interesting he doesn’t want to address or compare the number of vaccines. Iceland has very comparable numbers in regards to the numbers of vaccines given to infants and infant mortality rates. He’s comparing apples to oranges.

  • Tell me specifically how you know I was implying their intentions are nefarious and their information provided is dubious.

  • Argus can and has provided additional input if he so desires. Apparently you must believe he has no control over his own mental faculties.

  • How is the list ‘insane’? Seriously – how. What evidence do you have that vaccinating the ‘USA’ way is any worse than vaccinating the Singaporean way?

    Vaccine ingredients – this one I love – I could write a lot of information here on vaccine ingredients – but I want you to tell me one thing – firstly I want you to tell me how much of EACH ‘toxic’ ingredient is in the vaccine. Now, you’ll understand, as a physicist, I am quite interested in studies of mass, volume and physical quantities. So I did the research myself. I then analysed various toxicological data (I actually may be an environmental physicist, but I am also an environmental toxicologist – wow… I know, I talk heaps about myself, but hey, when you’ve done the time, it pays to show it to people). I linked recent studies, LD50s, dangerous toxins etc etc to what is in the vaccines. I then studied other sources of toxins… Only to discover pears had more formaldehyde than a vaccine… Aluminium is more prevalent in breast milk. Mercury – in the organic form is excreted almost entirely and any remainder has a tiny half life (less than 10 days). Not to mention the amounts were insignificant – and when I say insignificant I mean in my laboratory (which I am head of science and research) I don’t have scales (electronic balances) capable of measuring that low! This is how much your scare tactics just don’t work… Then you’ll say but what about the route?

    Well, I found a cool meme today that may help with that: http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/734030_474369052633109_1217822628_n.jpg

    When I made my comments above, I was FULLY understanding what I wrote – I was mentioning that Singapore had HIGH rates of vaccination in the population – not high rates of individual vaccines like you call in the USA. And I am sorry for the confusion, but I guess when you’re looking for answers in the wrong areas, you’re likely to find mistakes made (innocently) by those that have a contradictory answer to what you believe to be the truth. And for that I am not sorry.

    So – Singapore has a high population coverage of vaccine and a low infant mortality rate – end of story – stop nit picking.

    So no – I’ve made NO false claims and I 100% stand by the fact that the information presented in these topics is incorrect and based on no evidence or out of context, cherry picked examples – vaccines on the whole are SAFE and EFFECTIVE.

    Finally – when insulting your own intelligence don’t link anti-vax websites in your ‘reference’ list. We all know sites like THIS one can write what they want – and in fact, none of the ‘pseudoscience’ is ever checked and people like you go on believing this rubbish.

    So – answer me this:

    How many people have been killed by vaccines?


    How many people have been protected by vaccines?

    Do the maths – I worked out that the chance of dying by vaccine was less than being attacked on a passenger train by a rabbit with rabies!

    Oh, and by the way, there’s some countries that don’t even have rabbits or rabies…

  • He has a name… And Jeffry – I didn’t compare apples to oranges… I compared bollox to reality – and your type of bollox is rampant. You never answered what type of research scientist you were… Remind me of the years you’ve done in medical research? Have you even done research? What training have you got? What evidence have you got to show that vaccines are more harmful than good?

    Listen Jeffry, you’re ill informed and ill informing – basically you’re one dangerous mo… fo…

    I have no problems what so ever with evidence… And some of the above information is good… But it’s cherry picked or out of context. Be holistic in your approach – take the smooth with the rough… Hey, be an anti-vaccinator all you like – but point out the FACTS and be clear about them!

    The facts are, although vaccines aren’t 100% perfect, they are on the whole, safe, effective and necessary for the community and have helped reduce the incidence of diseases such as polio, small pox, pertussis etc etc (you know the list – it’s the same ol’).

    When you can invent a way to protect us from these diseases, please let us know.

    But right now, allow people in the community a chance to defend their young and the ones who can’t be immunised.

    Let’s work together to make this a better world with less disease… Let’s work with the DATA as a tool and not a weapon.. Let’s make this place one of FACT! And like your name presents, TRUTH!

    Because, really, at the moment, VacLies is what this is…. (because VacCherryPicking didn’t sound as good).

  • Actually, I’d disagree with your profit (prophet) statement. Had homoeopathic remedies actually worked, they’d be the medicine we currently use mainstream and this site would be debunking the science in homoeopathy instead of vaccines. But the truth be known, homoeopathic remedies didn’t and still don’t work and hence never made mainstream – if they did, pharmaceutical companies would be RAKING it in. Think of the mark up on a homoeopathic remedy containing just water and a very diluted substance… Profits would be skyrocketing and conspiracy theorists would then suggest there’s no science in homoeopathy and that ‘vaccines’ were the way to go (or something like that). It’s very easy to please everyone some of the time but not everyone all of the time… And homoeopathy is highly unsuccessful – sorry :(

    I seriously do wish it was the other way around – like SERIOUSLY wished it was… Honestly, right now I’d have a cure for hangovers that was 100% safe…

  • Cherry picked, out of context evidence is not evidence…

  • What is the LD50 for a retrovirus? Can you tell me what the LD50 is for SV40?

    I would argue vegetables save more people than vaccines. They save many from malnutrition. However, when there is a contaminated vegetable, the government takes it off of the shelf. Not true with a vaccine.

    Also, can you please show me the exact data you used to demonstrate it is safe to inject into babies? You see, I really don’t care if you are the head of a science department or even if you have an inflated ego. Just show me the data instead of giving me analogies or your opinion.

    You see, your arguments wear thin. The pharmaceutical literature doesn’t agree with “the ingredients are in such small amounts, etc, etc, etc…”

    It actually says the opposite of what you claim. Keep in mind, these ingredients are injected multiple times in a single visit. I would expect you to differentiate between being injected and ingested.

    “Pharmaceutical products may contain, in addition to the active or therapeutic agent(s), a variety of other ingredients, termed inactive or inert, which are categorized as excipients or additives (flavorings,
    sweeteners, preservatives, stabilizers, diluents, lubricants, etc.). The words inert or inactive may be misnomers for some excipients because some have been shown to cause adverse effects. Neonates and young children are at risk for such effects because they may not be able to metabolize or eliminate an ingredient in a pharmaceutical product in the same manner as an adult.” (pp.344)

    Encyclopedia of Pharmaceutical Technology Vol. 11
    Authors James Swarbrick & James C. Boylan
    1995 New York: Marcel Dekker, Inc.

    I think you assume a hell of a lot.

  • Why are you concerned about inactive viruses exactly – active viruses don’t have an LD50 so why would inactive ones have such? For crying out loud you’re a cry baby – harden up!

    You can argue vegetables save people more than vaccines – that’s fine, but I’d like to see a courgette protect you from small pox.

    Can you show me the exact data that shows it’s not safe to inject babies?

    See I don’t really care who you are, so long you tell the truth you egotistical self trumped up (well, what ever you were going to call me :) )

    I also made it clear that adverse reactions, although rare, do not necessarily make a vaccine bad! Now face the facts here – we know they’re not perfect, I mentioned that myself, but for the sake of it – let’s argue that they’re effective at doing what they’re designed to do – and that’s protect people from disease!

    Small pox vaccinations worked so well people were still immune 75 years after vaccination – rather effective.

    Conversely (to prove I don’t cherry pick like you do) pertussis vaccines aren’t nearly as long for effective coverage. However, natural immunity and vaccinated immunity are about the same recent studies show.

    So I guess we should argue facts shouldn’t we Jeffry? And stop nit picking – and you really do need to be less of a cry baby…

  • Paul,

    I guess you see where this is going which is why you have to call names. You speak in platitudes and even want me to “prove” negative statements. That’s pretty fantastic.

    Again, another complete non-answer. Bye.

  • Argus

    Giving up, Jeffry? He trounced you pretty good.
    What’s really telling is that you want to accuse him of using tactics that are your stock in trade.
    Name calling? – you called me ‘clueless’ recently.
    Prove a negative? – you do this all the time when you are asked to provide evidence for your unfounded assertions and try to turn it around by demanding the questioner provide the ‘proof’ you are wrong.

  • Argus

    And Jeffry forgot to tell you this site’s motto:


  • Jim Bob

    Really, Jeffry? You’re going to sit there after writing the following and tell me you weren’t implying they have a hidden agenda?:

    “We already get the “official” story from government sites. Don’t insult our intelligence.”
    If you weren’t questioning the government’s motives, you wouldn’t have put the quotations around official. As you stated above, please don’t insult our intelligence. Although I suppose you have nowhere else to go but outright lies after the misleading information you have posted.

  • The words of a little boy shamed…

    I have given an answer that you’re capable of digesting. Unfortunately, I guess using facts and truth is something you’re not terribly used to. It must be difficult for you and that I understand, when you get backed into a corner like a scared cat at the time that you’re exposed as a fraud.

    Hey – I’d LOVE it if vaccines were 100% perfect, the world was free of communicable or dangerous diseases or at the very least we could control them safely. I’d love it so much to live in a world like that.

    And you know, not that long ago, when small pox was rampant, people came up with the idea of inoculation. From what I understand there was a whole host of ‘fear’ regarding the original technique (which I admit would strike the fear of god in me if I believed). But it appears that regardless of the changes made in the future of vaccines, the fear remained present.

    Some of these fears are actually justified too – and you should concentrate on those. (Yes, I’m actually helping you become a better anti-vaxer). But when concentrating on the justifiable fears, open your mind a little, not so much that your brain falls out, but a little. All you need to do is tell the truth.

    For example, I recently read on a site that in the last 20 years 145,000 people died as a result of vaccinations… Well, to be honest I cringed a little and thought what a load of rubbish. But rather than calling the lie, I decided to call the truth…

    I only needed to take MMR vaccine in this and discovered in the same time period over 500,000,000 vaccines (to individual people) were given (notice I could have gone the WHOLE hog and had well over a billion vaccines given in the same time frame, hell, just the flu vaccine alone would have been in the billions over 20 years). Ok, so let’s do some simple math together now….

    500,000,000 people got an MMR vaccine (remember, this number is significantly lower than the number of people actually given vaccines over 20 years so the number doesn’t have to be accurate – considering the stat on the other side is just as inaccurate and probably inflated).

    145,000 people died….

    145,000 deaths / (per) 500,000,000 (*100%) = 0.029% chance of dying if only MMR vaccines were given over a 20 year period….

    Sounds high really doesn’t it?

    Well, nope… Not really, remembering this number of vaccines is GROSSLY underestimated and the number of deaths is GROSSLY overestimated. I guess we’d find numbers closer to fractions of 0.029% (which incidentally is less of a chance of dying from a vax to a disease that we’re currently vaccinated against – according to a popular anti-vax site).

    The numbers just never add up on your side of the fence – and I can see the reason why. You’re searching for an answer that just isn’t there… You’re searching to turn vaccination into a scandal, and it isn’t.

    I wonder how many kids I have saved by recommending their mothers and fathers vaccinate (including my own). Compared to how many people you have exposed to serious illnesses because you’ve scared new parents into not vaccinating with lies and myths.

    When I tell a new parent about vaccinations, I tell them it’s not without risk – and most agree.

    When you tell a new parent about vaccinations you’ll often decline to tell what can happen if more and more people fail to vaccinate and what real risks are out there for an unvaccinated child.

    You should be ashamed!

  • Or another way to put it is “Vaccines are creating our future….”

  • Failed it may have done (not that I care, we don’t have ticks where I come from) but what really happened? Isn’t this what ‘science’ does – by providing a specific mandate and protocol we can continue to discover and advance from theory to practice… And hey, we sometimes do fall over (don’t we?).

  • Matthew Brown

    No doubt. I agree it’s probably the government. concerning either way.

  • Matthew Brown

    that’s a good point Paul. You can’t please all the people all the time. everyone is colored by their own personal experience. The more intense the experience, the more resources you pour into proving your hypothesis correct, and the less likely you are too consider alternatives ( to do so would be admitting you might have wasted a lot of time). You all might hold evidence based medicine up as your holy grail, quoting shoddy papers back at one another, and asking me to show you the evidence that some are hard core conspiracy theorists ( have no idea what you were getting at there)
    Every day I am trying to decode research to figure out whether a treatment or test will help a patient. the most solid conclusion I can give you is that far more than half of the ‘ research’ is so biased ( usually to favor the drug companies), it is a minefield of mis information.
    on the other hand, you only have to look at the mortality differencefrom gangrene between the world wars to find evidence that allopathic medicine is miraculous. not only does it prevent almost certain deaths from infectious diseases, about once a month we loyally d bring a patient back from the dead, after their heart has stopped. This usually tends to change the views of the family if they were anti ‘ western’ medicine. The problem is that this all gets taken for granted these days, and people who turn their backs on medicine are all to ready to turn around when their partner clutches their chest and turns blue, or their child has a thirty minute seizure.
    I suppose the last resort is for deniers to claim that all these fatal diseases were caused by western medicine. sure, a small percentage are, anyone adopting this point of view is so far down the hole I simply feel sorry for them.
    Jeffry, I hope it doesn’t take a near-tragedy for you or a loved one to restore your faith in allopathy. I know your previous story and you have my sympathies.
    as for osteopathy, naturopathy, reiki, home opp athy, they’re all great treatments in the right individual, fir the right disorder, just like hospital medicine. it’s a free market… we’re just out there peddling our wares like everyone else, and I think that the fact that large numbers of people visit these practitioners ( and the practitioners do very well our of it believe me) is all the proof you need that they are needed.
    take some time for yourself Jeff, don’t kill yourself with this crusade. The world can be changed, but only at a certain rate. You burn yourself or pushing too fast and hard.

  • Matthew Brown

    And I believe there is too much side-taking, but if you look closely, you might see that I’m leaning towards yours.

  • Matthew Brown

    Sorry Lowell. I’m not sure what you’re getting at. You may have misunderstood me. My perceptive is that among those completely opposed to all vaccinations there is a feeling that certainly big pharma, and perhaps the government and the doctors are conspiring to either push vaccines they know are more harmful than beneficial on us, the motivation being profit. Hence the theory that there is a conspiracy (with which I agree, although I doubt the involvement of the govt and the doctors is a heavy as it’s portrayed.

    There is a big battle at the moment within medicine that will interest you. There are certain drugs that we know are killing more patients than they save, yet we continue to give them.
    It sounds crazy, but there is distorted research (funded by the drug companies of course) that is being used to back guidleines (written by medical experts who in many cases are also funded by the same companies) that mandate giving a drug that we know does more harm than good (Thrombolysis for stroke (CVA) is a good example).
    So in effect we know that we are essentially killing patients. To defy the guidelines would result in a costly lawsuit and eventually loss of your medical licence and any credit or influence you have with the medical community. This would dilute out the doctors who actually realise what is going on.
    So I hope you see the dillemma. Most people I tell this to find it unbelievable that the situation could even arise, but I ask you, before you judge, what would you do in such a situation, other than try to educate he other doctors?

    So as for conspiracy theories, I have no papers, or research aside from every single one that exists, the ones with the pro-vaccine and anti-vaccine biases that drive the conclusions further from the truth.

    There are conspiracies on both sides. On sites like this you get together and share selective and biased information, some of which is research, that you can add to your argument so as to try to pull your conclusion right over to the point where we abandon good therapy
    On the other side, there are features with huge funds and power, supressing research that proves they are committing fraud of such an extreme nature that there is large-scale manslaughter.

    So as unsexy and unsatisfying as it may seem, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Some vaccinations work well enough, and some don’t. Until we sit down and have a civilized discussion about it we’re all in the dark anger.


  • Matthew Brown

    The answer to that question is that we have already overstepped the mark. More vaccines are not the answer. I asked myself that question six years ago and came up with that answer.

  • Matthew Brown

    Sometimes, but not usually. It’s been surprisingly rare.

  • Matthew Brown


  • Matthew Brown

    in all sincerity.

  • Matthew Brown

    That’s true. I’m shocked at how we doctors are so slidly pro vac but so uneducated about it. It was drilled into us at medical school

  • Matthew Brown

    That doctor was wrong in my opinion. Many are. Be aware though, that he was acting in what he thought were the best interests of your child, as ignorant as he was. My personal opinion is that a significant adverse effect is in the order of 1/1000, which in many cases outweighs the benefit of the vaccine.
    I understand that you have gone through a horrific personal experience, and accept that this will make it hard for you to ever have an impartial view. It’s my opinion that if your views were adopted completely, then many children would be harmed unnecessarily. It would be natural for you to disagree, given your circumstance, I would.
    This won’t be well received, but it’s pretty clear that your view on this won’t be budged. I admire how stubborn you are.

  • So I guess this means you won’t show us just one reference.

  • Why show one when they’re ALL there! All of them…

    What about this organisation?


    Hmmm, not for profit, non-government… Oh, and they monitor vaccine safety too – wow!! Trounced (as Argus puts it) – I think it’s time to put your money where your keyboard is and start giving your best shots – because so far, you’re a long way from the VacTruth (unless vac was short for vacuum).

    The vacuum of truth – right here…

    Come on, for once admit defeat, show you’re a man and gracious and one day, you’ll come back to this place, you’ll see the studies are there, and that a lot of your ‘truths’ are not quite as they seem. But you know what, when you’ve admitted it – you’ll feel a lot better.

    I already feel good that I have helped maybe 100s or 1000s of people on your site to see the truth – it’s out there… Just open your eyes a little (oh, and your mind, but not to much or your brains will fall out).

  • How about you pick one from here…


    Would you like one on flu vaccine? Tetanus? Oh my… I think I am having a field day here… It’s too easy to beat you to a pulp and expose you for the fraud you are….

  • So your only evidence to present here Paul, in that you claim that homeopathy does not work, is based on the fact that mainstream is not using it? How twisted and delusional is your world? There is plenty of evidence that homeopathy does work, and as well historically that evidence is also there. You simply based on nothing mindlessly make up what you claim to be facts, as you go. You create your self believed facts to fit the situation you want to believe exists; which in reality the facts are just the opposite of what you claim to. You read none of the references I gave you, and you will read none of these I will further give you. Deliberate Ignorance is a choice, Paul!

    Here educate yourself, Paul!


    The Brazilian public health care system (SUS) has employed registered homeopathic physicians all over Brazil with great success for the last few decades giving free of charge treatment to the public and for large range civil populations.

    So now Homeopathy is forever consolidated in Brazilian people’s memories as a safe and effective non-toxic medical therapy.

    And finally to end this report about this nonsensical affair, it was proven by real facts that the real hidden target in Big Pharma Plot’s in Brazil was to avoid by all possible means the installation of a top German industrial plant laboratory branch in SaoPaulo of the manufacturer of a well known large range of homeopathic biologicalmedicines which was finally established in 2003.

    After this, the Big Pharma plot against homeopathy was forever over in Brazil!

    Read more:

    A Little History of Homeopathy in Brazil

    Here is some first rate information on the American Medical Associations decades long wrongful attack on the success of Chiropractic, Paul. I know that you will refuse to educate yourself, but that is your choice. Wake up.

    There is some science on this page as well, in fact a link to over 100 studies.

    Chiropractic – Correcting Physiological Function and Strengthening Immunity

    Face it Paul, the money that can be made in such as homeopathy would never have allow for the corrupt and dishonest mark up and billion dollar profits, that pharmaceutical industry and their drugs have had. They go with whatever makes the big money. For 100 years this scam has gone on; falsely discrediting driving out and disallowing any competition. This is a prime example of real QUACKERY, modern medicine; now clearly known as well their drugs and protocols, as a leading cause of death in America. Your choice, Paul! Most properly knowledgeable and thinking people, know what they would choose.

    Paul, have you ever heard it said that detoxification, and adding the right cellular nutrition to the diet, will reverse more adverse health conditions than pharmaceutical drugs ever have? But for you, standing at the pharma counter with prescription for chemical drugs seems far more sensible to you; and as well getting a toxic and potentially contaminated flu shot. How about some chemical Tamiflu to go with it, Paul. Have you ever heard of the benefits of vitamin D and C? Oh your pharma school indoctrinated doctor never told you? What a shame.

    Here is a very informative historical background video for you, Paul, and should do well to bust just a few of your allopathic delusions.

    Origins of Medical Industry Corruption

    The Real History of Modern Medicine

    The False Foundations of Modern Medicine

    Death By Medicine

    Charlotte Gerson on Cancer and Disease

    Gerson Therapy

    What is the Hallelujah Diet?

    Pharma Not in Business of Health, Healing, Cures, Wellness

    Ex-Pharma Sales Reps Speaks Out – Pharma Not in Business of Health, Healing, Cures, Wellness.

    Gwen Olsen spent fifteen years as a pharmaceutical sales rep working for such healthcare giants as Johnson & Johnson, Bristol-Myers Squibb, and Abbott Laboratories. She enjoyed a successful, fast-paced career until several conscious-altering experiences began awakening her to the dangers lurking in every American medicine cabinet. Her most poignant lessons, however, came as both victim and survivor of life-threatening adverse drug reactions. She left pharmaceutical sales in 2000.


    Gwen Olsen – Confessions of an RX Pusher

    Gwen Olsen spent fifteen years as a sales rep in the pharmaceutical industry working for health care giants including Johnson & Johnson, Syntex Labs, Bristol-Myers Squibb, Abbott Laboratories and Forest Laboratories.


  • Matthew Brown

    I am sure that you guys already know this, but vaccines are the most widely used homeopathic (same pathology) therapy. They give you a little of what causes the symptoms, and the body responds in many cases by preventing the development of full-blown symptoms. It’s not allopathic (opposite, or different, pathology) medicine at all.

    That by no means indicates that they are worthwhile, but I had to say something given there are so many refererences to them as allopathy, and in the next breath the virtues of homeopathy are extolled.

    I’ve found that dilution homeopathy didn’t work for me (apart from arnica which isn’t homeopathic), and the workings behind it haven’t been discovered yet, however many of my patients find it helps them. Those who get the most benefit seem to have disorders that we in the hospital are still struggling to treat – chronic back pain, irritable bowel syndrome, general fatigue. There is frustration on the part of the patient and the doctor who both feel their time is being wasted, when in truth we need to admit that we don’t have a good grasp on those diseases.

    On the other hand if my son were to be stung and develop anaphylaxis, I would be reaching for adrenaline rather than a dilution.

  • Paul, I went through both lists of studies that you linked to. What you are claiming that is as to actual vaccine safety is not even close to what it actually is and as to what is found there. If I had the room and the space here which isn’t exactly possible, I could show you exactly the reason why every one of those studies are near to meaningless, one by one. As well, for those those studies, I can find you other studies in Pubmed showing the opposite finding for many of them. So, don’t even start in with any bogus accusation of cherry picking, as to anyone here.

    In fact as is typical as to those studies, the few that attempt to be trying to show some sort of safety, they list serious side effects but yet in the end only write them off in some twisted fashion as to being insignificant; how is that in any honesty even possible. You had one study as to the MMR vaccine that actually showed a great deal of danger.Those studies are misguided as well in that they are never actually looking for what they should be. Why? Because they do not have even a basic comprehension as to vaccine reactions as to what they should actually be looking for. Your said lists are thus a huge misrepresentation and a literal joke.

    Other than the one said MMR study, those studies as well are not even looking at the vaccines that have been the most problematic, nor most even the issues physiologically speaking that are problematic. The rest of the studies only look at antibody titers; whoo eeeh, as if that is actually any evidence at all of actual efficacy in real life? Entirely misguided and ridiculous.

    In your second list there were only two studies, one of which was as study on the safety of Gardasil, the same study as listed on the first list. Are you kidding, and the study done by Kaiser Permanente Vaccine Study Center, and known scam facility that any pharmaceutical company can now go to and get studies to show anything they want them to, just pay them; been seen before. Top it off the study itself is funded by Merck, the maker of Gardasil. And would they have us believe they actually and fully reviewed 350,000 medical records of young women who received Gardasil? And even with the horrendous damage and with the endless acounts of unrecovered from outcomes due to Gardasil, all they found was an already known problem with fainting after the shot; and nothing else whatsoever was noted as any form of an issue. They never went to VAERS, and no data as well was looked at as to VAERS reporting. Merck has its ow database from what I hear, where adverse reaction reports are sent directly to them, similar to VAERS. As a fact there is enough Gardasil damage reported in those files, that they never should have needed any external study. These people are criminals, and both they and GSK have repeatedly as well paid millions to the DOJ for fraud and even lack of safety reporting violations. The corruption is endless with them and there is nothing that can be trusted that they have EVER stated, ever.

    Here is a far more accurate study that shows what is really happening with Gardasil. This study actually took an unbiased look at the VAERS data as well. The FDA as well claims they have found no common links; they are lying; and there is quite obviously to much to lose, the truth be known. You can keep on with your delusions Paul, and keep on trying to put the smoke and mirrors
    out in front of you and others, but when the dust settles, you are going to find that some people have actually done the right unbiased research, you can not get away from.

    Conclusions: Our study suggests that HPV vaccines containing HPV-16L1 antigens pose an inherent risk for triggering potentially fatal autoimmune vasculopathies.

    Practice implications: Cerebral vasculitis is a serious disease which typically results in fatal outcomes when undiagnosed and left untreated. The fact that many of the symptoms reported to vaccine safety surveillance databases following HPV vaccination are indicative of cerebral vasculitis, but are unrecognized as such (i.e., intense persistent migraines, syncope, seizures, tremors and tingling, myalgia, locomotor abnormalities, psychotic symptoms and
    cognitive deficits), is a serious concern in light of the present findings. It thus appears that in some cases vaccination may be the triggering factor of fatal autoimmune/neurological events. Physicians should be aware of this association



    Gardasil – The Real Truth

    FDA Reply Letter – and Further Questions Raised on Gardasil

  • The irony is I provide you with site of reputable content, you rubbish them, lie about them, and then try to find misguided facts from anti-vax sites filled with lies? You’re the homoeopathy guy – right? I think we can take some credit from your conspiracy theorist ways and suggest you’re just plainly wrong – especially in the fact that you believe water has a memory… Did it remember all the poo that was in it?

    Please, it’s people like you that try to sound intelligent but actually didn’t read the studies in full – you read a bunch of abstracts and then ‘abstracted’ from the truth of the matter.

    1) Vaccine studies have been completed for safety and efficacy.

    2) The evidence is vaccines are safe and effective.

    That’s end of story there. Pure and simple.

    I’m not going into a war of wits with an unarmed opponent. You need to show some facts that vaccines have caused more damage than good – seeing as I showed unbiased and ethical studies, you should try the same… Go on… I dare ya…. This is your site, I’ve proven you and Jeffry wrong on several occasions and I’ve only been here a week. Personally, you’re just one who has a clear vision that vaccines are the work of the ‘devil’ – and that vaccines are trying to control the population… It’s a shame really, because I bet you were a vaccinated child – and the population control ideal didn’t work… Am I right?

    I can’t honestly win an argument that has already been won – we see no small pox… We see no polio… Measles, mumps, rubella almost non-existent (certainly only a handful of deaths now). We also have protection from tetanus, whooping cough and when was the last case of diphtheria you saw? How about TB? Nope? Any of that?

    See, the argument has been won… By the vaccines themselves… By science – by the fact that observations lead to new views rather than lack of observations leading to myths…

    I don’t actually care what you think… I came here to write on this site to dispel stupidity and myths. But some, facts will stare them in the face and they’ll just laugh at them and shrug them off like a vegan at a Thanks Giving dinner looking at a turkey…

    You’ve just driven the idea of how correct I am even further into the ground – it’s now a firmly fixed rooted tree that is growing new green leaves and – the reality is, we (the vaccinators) have already won!

  • Did water have a memory enough to remember the poo that was in it?

    When you think I am delusional just remember that one popular drug that used to be ground up willow tree bark…. One great example of natural meeting medicinal mainstream (nice alliteration isn’t it?).

    That’s not the only case of course… But that’s the easiest to remind you of.

    When a natural remedy is proven to work, it becomes mainstream medicine – currently there’s research on everything from grape skins to fish eggs. So don’t think that there’s not a motive for current, modern day pharmacy to involve natural remedies (and probably turn them just a little synthetic to add some cynicism to my comment).

    Basically, I’m sorry, but homoeopathic remedies are just a placebo, and I’m not saying placebos don’t work… I’m just calling a spade a spade!

  • That is actually funny, Paul. I use government sources and valid scientific studies, and you claim the information is from anti-vaccination web sites. You never even looked at what was there, admit it. You just moved on again to more of your near to mindless and twisted ranting. You know what? You should at least make some attempt to stop making yourself look so deliberately ignorant. You, proclaim to a physicist, but yet you can not put together anything more direct and actually addressing the issues here than the endless twisted spin that you have, and without literally a single reference to back it up? Not even a well written article? What are you a physicist in the field of? Unless just throwing a bucket of poo up a wall and watching it run back down, like your reply posting did here, somehow makes a person a physicist?

    The determination of the dose that has or would lethal to 50% of the test population, LD50; has no application and is irrelevant to what we are talking about here in regard to vaccines. You made the claim that in regard to Thimerosal, which is ethyl mercury, opposed to methyl mercury; that all the mercury such as if it were injected that typical 25 mcg amount for example in a flu shot; that it has a half life of 10 days. So, you are stating then that the said mercury would remain in the body for 20 days? And no harm would be done? And all of it would be gone fro the body in 20 days. Well, for one, you are not even quoting the correct statistics and that, and you better actually look it up. So, none of that mercury will lodge in the brain nor any organ in those 20 days it is circulating in the blood stream, by your said analysis? How about the brain of a fetus where the mother received the flu shot?? That is a nice factually incorrect hole you keep digging? As for the claim that Thimerosal is somehow less toxic or harmful than methyl mercury, how about a study. This one.

    Read the whole abstract, not just what I excerpted.

    Arch Toxicol. 1985 Sep;57(4):260-7.

    The comparative toxicology of ethyl- and methyl mercury.

    Excerpt: There was little difference in the neurotoxicities of methylmercury and ethylmercury when effects on the dorsal root ganglia or coordination disorders were compared. Based on both criteria, an equimolar dose of ethylmercury was less neurotoxic than methylmercury, but a 20% increase in the dose of ethylmercury was enough to raise the sum of coordination disorder scores slightly and ganglion damage significantly above those in methylmercury-treated rats.


    As to aluminum adjuvants, as well are you as to the human body that biologically inept as to any physiologically understanding of toxicology, that you can not realize nor comprehend the difference and that there is a significant difference between dietary ingestion and the exposure by injection of a vaccine. An just because Paul Offit claims there is no difference, and the CDC claims there is no difference, simply because they have never had nor ever produced even a single safety study; you assumed that it was true. Well, if that were true, then it would NOT be possible for all these studies to exist showing the exactly mechanisms of harm being done with those vaccines.

    For BOTH aluminum and thimerosal the studies and the data are so numerous I couldn’t even begin to list them all here on this reply format, nor should I need to when they are already collected as they are. Science and data, all you should ever need.

    On this page, and the ones that as well follow below.






  • Ella

    Hi Paul I don’t comment very often on vactruth but just had to mention something here to you. sometimes we can say things without really listening so I hope you will get my point here. You said homeopathics..don’t work..if they did, pharmaceuticals would be raking it in…homeopathics (are) a very diluted substance…pause.. Think about it, think about it, wait for it, did you get? What do you think the foundation of how a vaccine works is? A very diluted substance of a disease… Wait for it…

  • Trounced, Argus? That’s a pretty big word. “He trounced you”? Like, it gets better. He trounced the trousers off of you. He trounced you awfully good. You trounced him but he trounced you back. I can’t believe he trounced me. I trounced him good! You trounced me. LOL..

  • And to think that after all this crap; you Paul can still not comprehend that there is a difference between the percentage of vaccine coverage, and the number of vaccines given; because you are STILL making the same senseless argument. No matter what anyone has said or put in front of you, you simply had no argument to begin with; and you are to stubborn to admit it. Everything you have stated is a twisted, undocumented, unverified collection of standard issue false vaccine promoting propaganda. I am a curious, what sort of a place are you a physicist at; because I don’t think you are qualified for anything beyond hammering peanuts into peanut butter? Does BIG LIES BUILT ON NO TRUTHS…Argus (Leader), work in the same building? Argus, I think you and Paul VanCherryPicker need to just pack it up, until you can come up with some honest arguments that might actually have a chance to work.

  • What a senseless and dumb statement. I think the readers here however have many of them memory long enough to realize the poo that was in your reply posts, Davis.

    Once again you are full of it, Mr Paul. Your twisted, delusional, and selective ignorance is obviously beyond any form of education or help. No one disputes that pharma has altered some substances to a point that it was altered enough that it could be qualified as a whole new substance, and thus patented as a drug. Odd isn’t it that those substances from that point on never work as well as the original, nor without added side effects. Big Pharma will cast their nets after nor on nothing that will not make huge profits either as a prescription drug, or the mass marketing of an over the counter product. No pharmaceutical company is going to spend millions on FDA required clinical trials, that produce a low dollar item and especially one that they do not have a or the patent on. You can not patent natural products.

    Has no one ever in your life ever conveyed nor impress upon you the need of having proof of the claims that you make? Or were you raised to believe that just anything that came off the top of your head was probably true? I just gave you all the proof that and sane, honest, and rational person would and should ever need, as to the success of homeopathy. Again you reviewed nothing and actually addressed nothing that was there; other than to again make denial of obvious fact. On the other hand you as well have had all the opportunity you should have needed back up your claims, and you have yet not given even one single example as proof of homeopathic failure, nor ineffectiveness. Not one. Just admit it, you made it up and you actually have no clue!

    So, you Paul are thus telling me that you would rather accept a clearly failed system of allopathic protocols, utilizing chemical pharma’s so called drug medicine. You accept this said system as the best means to health, unquestionably. A said system that is know in and by two well done studies, to be a a leading cause of death in the U.S. The first and originally by the way published in the AMA Journal itself, by Barbara Starfield. In your mind nothing else but big pharma works, never has and never will. Why do you think it is that so many people that modern medicine has failed, end up going to the naturopatic side and as well chiropractors in the know nutritionally, and they get their health back, all previous prescription drugs discarded. You seriously need to wake up, and cut the bullcrap; as your misinformation and lies all the way down this page, are way to obvious.

    Death By Medicine

    Even if you reject this Mr Paul Davis; there are others likely here that are interested in this health care truth information, and will realize it as the fact. This video by Charlotte gerson gives you the basics of the understanding, and says it quite well. But you just go on believing the disinformers and misinformers, there Davis; your choice.

    Charlotte Gerson on Cancer and Disease


  • Argus

    TROUNCED: past participle, past tense of trounce (Verb)
    1.Defeat heavily in a contest.
    2.Rebuke or punish severely

    Yes – I would say both definitions fit here.
    Mr. Davis has trounced Jeffry, and now he is trouncing you in another thread.

  • Argus

    “. . . vaccines are the most widely used homeopathic (same pathology) therapy. ”

    Complete nonsense.
    What kind of a “doctor” are you, again?

  • Umm hello? Anyone home… How much ethyl-mercury is in our vaccines?

    Ummm, hello… Aluminium is the most common metal on earth and the most common metal in our foods – I think there’s tests out there somehow… Oh, wait on a moment, there is! Look at this one for green tea: http://www.agronomy-journal.org/index.php?option=com_article&access=doi&doi=10.1051/agro:2003045&Itemid=129

    So, yeah, aluminium is WELL studied!

    Let me give you an idea about half life, I think you’re unfortunately uneducated in this phenomena.

    The half life of a substance does not mean in 2 half lives the substance has disappeared completely… One half life means one half gone, then the next half life is the next half of the remaining half of the substance… Gosh, that was confusing for you I think.

    Sorry Lowell, I can tell now that you’ve only ever done google studies, you’ve never actually been in a laboratory and studied toxicology. I can’t continue this with you – because I’ll end up showing you up…

    Do you even know what a microgram is? Do you know what a milligram is? What about a gram? Do you have an idea of the 1000 times difference 1mg is to 1mcg? Can you read in scientific notation (ie 25.0 x 10^-6 g)? I just need to know what level I can approach your stupidity with.

    Because then we can talk… And then I can prove you wrong. But the more narrow minded you’ve become the more impossible it is for you to understand the truth…

    But for the time being I’ll put it into simple terms for you so my arrogance doesn’t show:

    Vaccines are not 100% perfect, they never will be. It’s a shame, because if they were, you’d still find something to complain about. But at present, with our collective scientific knowledge, vaccines are by far the best defence we have as humans against specific diseases. Including highly contagious diseases and others that are just purely debilitating. Furthermore to this, any adverse reactions, although quite horrific in some cases, are unfortunate circumstances of a terrible reaction. These circumstances are rare but certainly do not go unnoticed. Just recently a vaccine was changed after noting incidences of narcolepsy – this is what science does – if there’s a mistake, which ultimately there will be, it can be observed, changed or removed. So please don’t preach to me with your ideas of scams, I know pharmaceutical companies aren’t all above board, that’s ok. I understand there’s an element of unscrupulous behaviour. I get that. In fact, I don’t trust them either…. But you know what I do trust… Evidence. And there’s plenty of that. And when I say plenty, I mean PLENTY!

    I’m not asking you to go and vaccinate the world – ok? I’m asking you to be realistic and understand that vaccines aren’t perfect, and you should highlight that when talking to people. But don’t just sit there and take it, why not go do the study yourself?

    I LOVED my time at university. I did environmental toxicology and I did the ultimate studies in this field – I LOVED every second of it. I know get to be out in the field every day educating young minds about an amazing world we live in and how, unfortunately, we don’t always get it right, but at least we have observable views…

    Do you understand that? Or should we go back to science speak?

  • Hehe… You’re funny Lowell… Unfortunately I have to go to work where I hammer peanuts into peanut butter… Unlike you, where you’ll believe half life means in two half lives a substance has completely disappeared.

    I wait with baited anticipation for the link to a scientific study, using scientific method, of a rigorously tested homoeopathic remedy and a similarly administered placebo… Yep… I’m guessing you won’t provide that link… But if you do, and I find it is acceptable, I will bow down to you Lowell and call you ‘da man’….

    But right now, do the ACTUAL research by going to your local university and undertake the studies yourself, that is what I did before I became a peanut hammerer (incidentally, I am being sarcastic just in case you wondered… I’ve eluded to my position as head of science and research at a local institution prior and I now educate young minds and free them of any reason to not critically analyse ANYTHING – kind of like what you do, except they’re critical!).

  • Argus

    No, homeopathic dilution is not how a vaccine works. And if you do not know that, then everything else you think you know about vaccines is most likely wrong as well,

  • Argus

    More to the point, where placebos do appear to “work” is only in changing the symptoms – which is subject to patient perception.
    Neither placebo treatment or homeopathy have ever been shown to have any effect on an underlying disease process.

  • Argus

    “Pertussis is a highly contagious bacterial disease that causes uncontrollable, violent coughing. The coughing can make it hard to breathe. A deep “whooping” sound is often heard when the patient tries to take a breath.”

    How would anyone ever confuse this with a common cold?

    What kind of doctor are you, again?

  • Matthew Brown

    Emergency medicine senior medial officer. I see pertussis daily. In all but babies it presents as coryza, a common cold.

  • Matthew Brown

    See above. I’m not sure why you think it’s nonsense. Sure, we widely accept the term to mean dilution of sustances for cure, which is different to a vaccine. Unlike vaccination it is based on non-sicentific principles (which doesn’;t mean it doesn’t work).

    I’ve read your posts, jesus you have a go at everybody, don’t you. At least you have an outlet for your anger I suppose. Widen your mind a little and accept that you might not be the only ‘right’ one.

  • Oh, I can see why you don’t comment very much… It’s because you don’t have a lot to say… I actually laughed a little when I read your comment and I may have snotted on my screen (sorry, my maturity level is very low when I am around stupidity).

    Can you just say it again – a diluted version of the disease is the same as a homoeopathic remedy… *cough….

    Vaccines aren’t dilute diseases – inactive vs dilute are hugely different.

    For example, you can’t have inactive baking soda – it’s either baking soda or it’s not… So when your homoeopathic remedy containing baking soda in it is diluted, it’s the same baking soda in the solution, just much much much less – and shaken in a very particular way.

    When a virus is inactivated (for example, let’s say polio here) it is not diluted in any way shape or form. And let’s just say it was… Let’s just humour you a second here – if it was diluted, it’s not diluted by the extent a homoeopathic remedy is diluted – is it?


    Here’s some examples – now if you use part of the virus (like the protein coating) that’s not diluting… That’s like (we’ll use baking soda again) – taking baking soda and baking a cake with it – the carbon dioxide is released leaving just sodium behind… It’s not diluted at all – in fact, if you had 1 mole of baking soda, you’d release the same mass of CO2 that is available – the dilution does NOT change.

    So the next time you liken homoeopathy to vaccinations, think again. Just think, be a little critical in your analysing – but think – is it really dilution?

    If you’re at all concerned, I can help you learn the difference between dilution and inactivation – I’m actually quite the chemist too you know :)

  • What a senseless and dumb statement. I think the readers here however, many of them have memory long enough to realize the level of poo filled
    filled drivel in your reply posts; though, Hubbs.

    Once again you are full of it, Mr Lowell. Your twisted, delusional, and
    selective ignorance is obviously beyond any form of education or help.

    It appears you’ve misread me Lowell, I am in fact an educator hence my mind was capable of critical analysis… I’m just going to question your statement about a new substance – like aspirin I guess, that’s a good one – right? It’s common. I wonder if you’ve ever looked up the side effects of people taking the original aspirin. I tell you what, you don’t need me to link you to those, you can find them yourself. I’ll give you a hint though, modern day synthetic aspirin is a hell of a lot safer!

    The same about patenting could be said of health food companies that don’t require FDA approval – for example vitamin D seems to be the craze at the moment. I don’t think there’s too many restrictions on that – is there? But… When you look at the facts of something like vitamin D – you quickly see it’s helping some people. It’s helping people who are deficient in vitamin D. But do health food companies go out and check if the people buying their products are deficient in Vit. D? Nope… Not at all – they’re selling this product willy nilly to anyone at all.

    So health food companies have an equal suggestive appearance of fraud if that’s the way you want to look at it.

    I don’t believe all studies, I know that the ‘bad’ data is often omitted, which is why I am so happy that GSK has joined up with Goldacre’s scheme to help release the bad data truthfully – and for that we’re looking at a HUGE leap forward. That’s how I see science – I see it as an observable trend in data that leads to ‘observations’ – from this we can continue to rigorously check and find more data.

    What worries me the most about your ramblings is your inability to accept GOOD data. I don’t mind accepting the bad data – but for crying out loud, stop being such a baby about it and accept the good data too!

    I don’t want to prove homoeopathic remedies wrong – I want to prove that vaccines aren’t as bad as you make them out to be – and I think anyone who’s done a little study can easily see that I have achieved my goal. But Lowell, not you, you’re in a league of your own – you want to ramble on about homoeopathy.

    All I asked was provide me with evidence (scientifically tested) and peer reviewed data that places a homoeopathic remedy ahead of the placebo in treatment for a specific disorder other than dehydration.

    But secondly, Lowell, you seem to link pharmaceutical ‘drugs’ and vaccines together where I keep these separate. I’m advocating the SAFETY and EFFICACY of vaccines and I have done so with ease. I have suggested homoeopathic remedies do not work to protect against polio or small pox – or will not treat a disease any better than a placebo – I do not need to provide a study for such as my objective isn’t that. But I am happy for you to provide me with just one link that scientifically evaluates a double blind placebo homoeopathic remedy working!


  • Sorry, Jeffry, please help me here, what are we talking about spinach for? Were you suggesting that vaccines aren’t recalled if there’s an issue…? Or are you suggesting we’ve added spinach to vaccines?

    Seriously – are we on the same planet?

    You know you can get separate whooping cough vaccines – right? And that’s what I am talking about.

    Jeffry, I do feel for you, you try so hard but I worry you’ve been fed so many lies that it’s already too late for you. It’s sad, because clearly you’ve had a bad experience and for that I am sorry. I am a little hard on you – but I’d only expect the same from you…

  • Mr. Paul Davis. Once again, you have a long and rambling, twisted, and near to incoherent mess going on here. A reply that essentially, refutes absolutely nothing; promotes absolutely no applicable studies; no reasonably valid argument, nor did it provide anything more than a waste of time in even reading it. I can as well see that you again entirely ignored my reply and with its numerous studies on those titled site pages you were given links to. The reason I know that, is because you could not have replied with the garbage that you did if you had actually reviewed any of it. That is why I think it is time for you to go, and Jeffry needs to ban you from reply posting any more of your obvious and intentional trouble making on this site.

    I provided you on those linked to pages, numerous studies found as well in Pubmed, directly showing the the direct mechanisms of harm done by aluminum adjuvants in vaccines. And you show back up with what was not a safety study, but nothing more than what was an article on the content of aluminum in green tea??? Are you kidding. And yet you spout off the intentionally demeaning trash that you have in that reply.Just like you have done repeatedly in most every reply you have made on the last two articles on this site. Like I said, in my opinion, it is time for you to go, period.This site and its reply posting are intended as and for providing information and constructive debate, if any. What you are doing is nothing more than and is only an intentional trashing any constructive discussion here on this site at all. That has become all to obvious.

  • I am and obviously was fully aware of what the word means, Argus. FYI; he Mr so called Davis, is as a fact not trouncing anything as far as me and my replies and information. If you think so you better go and actually start start reading my replies, comparatively to his. The guy is nothing more than a twisted rambling and poor excuse as for any rational and honest for debate going on her at all. And you actually think that kind of thing is impressive. And that is actually impressive to you? It wouldn’t matter to you how bad it was Argus; as long he remained your one supporter; anything goes, right?

  • Your answer and reference to multiple studies are over on the other most current article, where you first asked the question. I am not posting it twice. Go read it; and start bowing!!! As well this website and its articles are not about homeopathy; this site is about vaccines and vaccine safety; in case you have forgotten. But nice diversion tactic, while you dodge the real issues that you can not honestly nor in any rational way respond to.

  • Are there no end to your twisted and irrational delusions, Mr Davis? Your incompetence as the to presentation the actual facts and reality here, is at this point beyond even being written off to the lack of knowledge and outright ignorance. Are your reading what is replied to you comprehension skills actually that deficient, or is there simply something majorly wrong with you? You write and sound as if you are literally insane?

    I made no original claims to homeopathy, you did. I never even brought the subject up other than to respond to the incorrect and without any merit claims that you have made against it.What a twisted man; unbelievable.You would actually call this on your part, debating an issue? Homeopathy as well is not, nor is it the subject matter of this site, nor any of their current articles. Homeopathy is as well not the same thing as vaccination. Your point is?

    Specifically as to reply which I responded to. Your reply contained two studies as said. I addressed both of those said studies and explained in no uncertain terms exactly why the Merck Gardasil study can not be, nor should it be relied upon. So, I not only fully addressed that Gardasil study, but I as well provided you with a study that shows just the opposite of safety of Gardasil to be true.

    That said study addressed Gardasil safety on multiple levels to include the VAERS data, which yours never did. I actually as well already addressed this on the other article; where you made the same incorrect claims.The study I provided as well was an independent study not connected to either Merck nor any form of big pharma. What more do you want nor could you ask for. Just because you do not like the outcome of my analysis and reply; why take it out on me for showing you the truth of the matter. We are or were talking about vaccine safety studies, and not what level of antibody titer’s were found at what later date regarding the pertussis vaccine; which of course was the subject matter of the other study in your page link.

    Obviously as well you have not heard of, nor done enough research to know as well that the current pertussis portion of the vaccine, is known as a fact as a very failed vaccine right now. There have been far to many outbreaks of pertussis in fully vaccinated school children, for any previous antibody titer study to even make any difference in anyone’s mind nor opinion anymore. No one in their right mind would even care what a clinical trial nor any other study showed; when the real life outcome has shown that kind of failure.

    So, what do you have left to stand on here as to the issue of your said reply? Obviously nothing at all, period! . .

  • Lowell, answer me a simple question – have you LOOKED yourself?

    For days I have posted safety studies (you say you debunk them), I
    post more (you say they’re a scam), so I post anecdotes (you say there’s
    no proof). Do you see where we’re going here? You’re blind.

    Then, you suggest Offit’s CHOP rationalisations are pseudoscience as
    though you’ve never insinuated a pseudoscientific response prior to your

    So Lowell, how about you give me guidelines so I can effectively
    transmit information to you for the purpose of solely proving the
    effectiveness and safety (overall) of vaccines… Please give me
    specific guidelines for me to adhere to.

    When you have given me numbered dot points I will be able to enquire
    at universities or institutions for said documentation. If it doesn’t
    exist, then it can only be one of two things:

    1) your guidelines don’t allow for scientific study or;
    2) there are no studies that suit your needs.

    So – If one does exist you must do this:

    1) Be prepared to admit there are studies that prove the safety and efficacy of vaccines
    2) Be prepared to apologise publicly to me and any other pro-vaccinater that has spent time debunking your pseudoscience
    Find a paper that fits the EXACT same guidelines that you presented to
    me for one on homoeopathic remedies which either a) suggests their
    efficacy or b) proves they don’t work.

    Are you prepared to take the challenge?

    You know what – I don’t think you are…

    I don’t think you’d know what to ask for in a ‘scientific’ study…
    So – how much time do you need? I might need a little while to find the
    said study, but I’ll say in touch… Just give me the guidelines and
    then be ready to admit defeat, publicly apologise and find me the paper
    on homoeopathic remedies that fits the exact same guidelines that you
    request… I am so up for the challenge… And Argus? You keen to help
    out too? Maybe Artgirl or anyone willing to take up the challenge, I’m
    all for it… Please Lowell, now is your chance!

    ($5 says he can’t do it).

  • By the way Lowell, I did read your links on your anti-vax sites – I have to admit, you’ve really done the least possible research you could possibly do. But I’ll humour you – please take me up on my challenge before Jeffry bans me like you ask him to (very typical anti-vax behaviour, I was banned from Tenpenny’s site when I questioned something there, and I literally only questioned a link – did you get me banned?). I don’t fear being banned… I do fear stupidity tho – and I’m willing for you to put your money where your mouth is… If you didn’t read the challenge, here it is in short:

    So Lowell, how about you give me guidelines so I can effectively
    transmit information to you for the purpose of solely proving the
    effectiveness and safety (overall) of vaccines… Please give me
    specific guidelines for me to adhere to.

    When you have given me numbered dot points I will be able to enquire at universities or institutions for said documentation. If it doesn’t exist, then it can only be one of two things:

    1) your guidelines don’t allow for scientific study or;
    2) there are no studies that suit your needs.

    So – If one does exist you must do this:

    1) Be prepared to admit there are studies that prove the safety and efficacy of vaccines
    2) Be prepared to apologise publicly to me and any other pro-vaccinater that has spent time debunking your pseudoscience
    3) Find a paper that fits the EXACT same guidelines that you presented to me for one on homoeopathic remedies which either a) suggests their efficacy or b) proves they don’t work.

    Are you prepared to take the challenge?

    You know what – I don’t think you are…

    I don’t think you’d know what to ask for in a ‘scientific’ study…
    So – how much time do you need? I might need a little while to find the said study, but I’ll say in touch… Just give me the guidelines and
    then be ready to admit defeat, publicly apologise and find me the paper on homoeopathic remedies that fits the exact same guidelines that you request… I am so up for the challenge… And Argus? You keen to help out too? Maybe Artgirl or anyone willing to take up the challenge, I’m all for it… Please Lowell, now is your chance!

    ($5 says he can’t do it).

  • Take my challenge then Lowell… Take it up!

  • Nope… I’ve set a challenge for you Lowell – if you can meet it, I’ll do the same… time to put your money where your mouth is I think… Because you now need to set the rules – and these same rules will apply to you too :)

    I think it’s time we played the game with reality in mind… So – you got the rules – you go for it – set the guidelines for a study that would satisfy the data you require… If you poopoo my studies that meet your guidelines then we’ll know you’re a hoax and a fraud… If I can’t find a study that fits your guidelines – well, it can mean two things – but we’ll see if your guidelines are realistic or not, because to fit your guidelines you’ll need to find a study that suits these guidelines for homoeopathic remedies… But I just thought about it, you’re right, I’m putting in a diversion tactic – so let’s up the ante just a bit more… You find a study that proves that vaccines are ineffective and dangerous that fits the same guidelines you give me… :)

    Now I’ve got it without diversion… I can’t wait…

  • gingerperth

    i’ve heard that those people who have full vaccinations, while being more likely to succumb to an epidemic of the disease they were vaccinated against, are more likely to get a milder version of the illness compared to those who have had no vaccinations. is this true?

  • Your arrogance has shown, with embarrassing and obnoxious fervor! However educated and scientifically trained you may be, you discredit yourself and turn people off with your hubris and condescension! You obviously spend too much time alone in a laboratory, as your interpersonal skills are grossly lacking! The other man you have been bantering with was, I believe, trying to engage in a sincere debate while discussing differing opinions, facts, and data. I don’t recall him stooping to the low level of immaturity and name calling in order to defend his position. In fact, he supplied you with innumerable resources and websites to validate his position. You resorted to name calling and belittling as your defense and repeatedly reminded him that you are smart and he is obviously stupid! How ridiculously immature! You sir are a pompous ass and I honestly don’t know why he engaged in this wasted effort at a legitimate debate and exchange of opinions/facts. It is clearly a waste of time. Your ego simply wouldn’t allow for anything other than you “winning” with your condescension and arrogance being the driving force. Good luck to you…. I don’t imagine many people can honestly stand your presence for long…

  • Matthew Brown

    That’s incorrect Argus

  • I keep missing older messages, ok, can you link me to this vaccine insert that lists SIDs as an adverse reaction?

  • Argus might be a bit hard on you, but I don’t blame him one bit, it is a very poor analogy that you’ve linked to here with dilution and vaccines.

    For example, you don’t dilute a virus by removing specific proteins that cause your immune system to react… That’s not dilution.

    I don’t want to spend to much time educating you here, but adrenaline isn’t a vaccination (despite it being in a needle, it’s an injection, but not a vaccination).

    So please forgive us ‘vaxers’ but we do love the correct information to be put across by the general populous – I think it’s the biggest bug bear of mine, that people go into denial over things like this from spread myths and lies…

  • So is: Kawasaki Disease, nephrotic syndrome in babies, extreme sensitivity
    to light, tunnel vision, eyes that dont focus (such as cross eyes or
    lazy eye) in toddlers, Lebers amaurosis, Do you know how many kids they
    have in schools for autistic kids- how many hyperactive kids… All this caused by vaccines?

    Before you say yes, Lowell Hubbs (in many posts above) has eluded that things like Autism does not occur as a cause by vaccines (he linked to a paper with this very statement on it, despite him being strongly opposed to vaccination).

    http://www.hrsa.gov/vaccinecompensation/adverseeffects.pdf See page three of this link that Lowell has given, there’s a section of rejection – and this is where Autism lies… In the rejection spectrum of the vaccination scandal…

  • Thanks… I do need to clean up my language a bit – I agree… Sorry for any offences that I have made – but I just want the truth… Like you…

  • This is an interesting question, and one that is often posed to many people. I’d like to hear varying views on this subject myself (views from educated professionals to people with experience in this effect).

    Here’s a link by one of the most hated vaxers on Earth – good ol’ Paul Offit… But notice here, he doesn’t say you should have 10,000 vaccines, he just explains the answer to your question…


    Here’s a great little suggestion from the CDC http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/6mishome.htm#Themajorityofpeople

    So is that a little answer to your question?

  • Argus

    That was a good answer to her question about being vaccinated and having a milder form of the illness being protected against.

    But it didn’t answer the part about being “more likely to succumb to an epidemic of the disease they were vaccinated against”. Its unclear whether the word “succumb” here is meant to have the usual meaning (to die from) or she is just asking about *contracting* the disease.

    I have not seen evidence that being vaccinated makes it more OR less likely that one will “catch” something if you are exposed to it. The vaccine trains the immune system to respond quickly and the “invader” will be fought off much more vigorously than if there were not already antibodies to the disease in place.

    gingerperth, do you want to clarify your question?

  • Actually, there was some name calling, but the reason I ‘call’ names is because it doesn’t affect me – hence, when someone calls me a liar, I just ask for proof…

    In reality, I am an incredibly personable person. I have a wonderful sense of humour and I am adored by many (I know, it seems impossible doesn’t it). But what doesn’t come out in the words I type, is my disdain for ignorance (wait, that’s exactly what comes out in my words I type).

    I’ve offered Lowell a fair proposition – Lowell has indicated there are NO safety studies conducted that fit his non-pseudoscience ethics. Unfortunately I’m not 100% sure what a scientific (fair) study is in Lowell’s mind, so I’ve asked him to provide me with guidelines that will allow me to find a document with evidence that fits his scientific mind.

    That’s fair isn’t it?

    I am immature, I have no worries admitting it – it’s actually what gives me some of my most prominent features – I’m able to think at the same level as a child yet, have the wealth of knowledge that is backed up with years of study and research. I kind of like where I’m at – a child at heart with wisdom to boot… I guess when you don’t know someone it’s rather easy to ‘box’ them into a persona that suits your cause – and you would like me to be wrong, so you’d like my style and netiquette to be wrong too.

    Fair enough – you do have to fight dirty when you’re not on an even playing ground – and touche’ to that!

    But do you know what it is I want to win?

    You do realise what I want isn’t for you to concede that vaccinations are safe (I want Lowell to do that though, because of his continual condescending attitude). What I want from the populous is less lies, more truth and more information being objective rather than selective.

    I don’t know why that’s not considered fair?

    But I want to congratulate the calibre of the people on this site, it’s not all about being one sided – it’s about getting to the truth. And I’ve opened up Lowell to allow this to occur – I look forward to it (as though it was my weekend game of tennis against my arch-rival who I’ve never beaten yet).

    So – we over our little ‘boxing’ Mr Davis into a corner – now we’re ready to take our gloves off and go MMA on ourselves… Let’s do it :)

  • Argus

    Since you claim to be an ER doc, name one injectable substance that you use in medical care that is administered “full strength” – i.e. undiluted. Are you then going to suggest that all approved drug products are “homeopathic” since they are not given without being diluted?

    I think you are somehow trying to lend legitimacy to the homeopathy scam by suggesting that they are the same as tested and approved drug products.

    Homeopathic products are diluted to the point that no trace of the “active” ingredient remains. And despite being in use for over 200 years, no validated evidence has ever shown that they are effective. It doesn’t matter whether the “principle” by which they work is understood – where’s the evidence?

    Based on the statements you have been making here, I seriously question whether you have any scientific or medical training.

  • You see pertussis daily? Really? Daily.. Like at least 200 cases a year (I took off weekends and a couple of weeks vacation for you)? In which large municipal emergency centre would one be working to see that?

    To me that sounds like a lack of vaccination – we know full well (Lowell has said it too) that pertussis vaccination gives immunity for around 5 years (other stats suggest 8 – 10 years, but I’ll go with the lower and go with Lowell’s statement).

    So what age group is the MOST common pertussis cases (you have 200 cases per year that you personally tend to so you can give me the EXACT details of ages and vaccination stances of the parents).

    I look forward to hearing from the Senior Medical Officer of Emergency Medicine who personally sees 200 cases of pertussis per year.

  • Argus

    I’m beginning to think Brown is a faker . . .

  • Sorry Jeffry, I’m missing these retorts from you – It means that I don’t answer quickly enough.

    I do have a question on your question tho – you’ve asked me for evidence but will you accept anecdotal evidence?

    For example, when my daughter got her DTap vac she got a lovely bruise on her leg, from the injection site. She was right within 2 days though. The reason I suggested that sick babies rarely stay sick is because that’s the truth – the body does react to vaccination in much the same way as the actual disease – doesn’t it? Except, th ebody calms down quicker when it’s dealt with the disease and immunity has been gained (in >90% of cases).

    You use the CDC from time to time – so I thought maybe I can link to an educated section of the CDC that covers your prime neglect to cover all angles on this document about 17 examples of admitted vaccine failures… So here it is, for all your readers (from a site you regularly reference – so you can’t just now say that my copying and pasting is any better than yours… Or for that matter any worse!).


    “In a high school of 1,000 students, none has ever had measles. All but 5 of the students have had two doses of measles vaccine, and so are fully immunized. The entire student body is exposed to measles, and every susceptible student becomes infected. The 5 unvaccinated students will be infected, of course. But of the 995 who have been vaccinated, we would expect several not to respond to the vaccine. The efficacy rate for two doses of measles vaccine can be higher than 99%. In this class, 7 students do not respond, and they, too, become infected. Therefore 7 of 12, or about 58%, of the cases occur in students who have been fully vaccinated.”

  • I do wonder that myself… But I don’t like jumping to conclusions like how someone once called you a ‘paid troll’. I find that is the most common retort from an anti-vaxer – that because we don’t have the same view point as them, they think instantly that we’re paid pharmaceutical or government employees…. I honestly wished I could make money out of this gimmick – I love what I do – I love research and learning… If I could make money out of it and quit my day job, I’d love to… However, greed isn’t my motivation, otherwise I wouldn’t be an educator either…

    I’m glad that you’ve taken time here Argus – it’s tough to say the least to get a message across to the other side – but there’s so much fear and myth that the real ‘smoke and mirrors’ occur.

    I am worried that Jeffry will just end up banning us because of the ‘truth’ – which is a little of a conspiracy amongst itself – isn’t it? I kind of like being a conspiracy theorist for the side of truth… Anyway, the best we can do is the three E’s… Educate… Educate… and Educate…

  • Ahhh, so if you’re vaccinated are you more likely to get ill or more likely to die or… Conversely less likely to die and less likely to get ill… Of course the latter is the premise of vaccines – so we’d only hope the latter occurs.

    So I guess another good analogy is – let’s look at vaccinated populations vs unvaccinated populations… The worry here (of course) is that unvaccinated populations often come from third world or low socio-economic areas – and the argument could be based on treatment. I mean, never has the USA had 158,000 people die as a direct result of measles – right? But yet the WHO show this many people died as a result of measles in 2011. That works out to 18 deaths every hour… Ouch!

    So – anecdotally then, we’d say vaccinated populations are LESS likely to succumb to a pathogen such as measles.

    But of course the problem is – we’d have to either up the socio-economic situation of the countries where the death rates are the highest and then still NOT vaccinate them to see if there’s a difference. Now, that would be a call for conspiracy and guinea pig human testing. So let’s not do that.

    Another thing we could do is keep the same socio-economic situations of the said country and go an vaccinate them (like Bill Gates). This is morally far more correct, possible and yet still so widely debated by anti-vaxers as though Bill was a Nazi eugenicist (I’ve heard him being called that by a fellow on another site).

    So, we’re left with a third situation – just up the socio-economic standings of the said countries exposed to measles deaths and let them choose whether or not to vaccinate….

    This would be a fair test – surely?

    Alternatively, another statistic suggests measles deaths were at 2.6 million people per year prior to 1980… That’s significant, right? But in 2011, just 30 years later, the drop is down to 6% of that number! In 30 years have we really cleaned up our countries that much?

    Nope… Have we had wide coverage vaccines released to most of the world… Yes…

    So, is that the answer you want gingerperth? Since the release of the vaccine against measles, especially since widespread vaccination drives occurred in the 80s, measles deaths dropped by over 90%.

  • Argus

    Then you can easily prove what I said is incorrect by showing us the studies that demonstrate that either a placebo or a homeopathic product has positive effects in treating a medical condition.

  • Here Davis; get a cup of coffee, start reading, and educate yourself.

    Failure Of The Continued Polio Vaccine Campaign

    Scientific proof that the known cancer causing SV40 virus, a previous contaminant in the polio vaccine, is obviously either contagious; or the virus is still in the vaccine/s.



    The real story of the covered up failure of the small pox vaccine.

    History Repeats Itself: Lessons Vaccinators Refuse to Learn, by Jennifer Craig, PhD

    VRM: The Re-emergence of Polio in The Third World (compliments of the World Health Organization & Bill Gates)

    VRM: Polio Scam

    Letters from Albert Sabin

    Analyzing the DNA of Scientific History

    Smallpox Vaccine: Origins of Vaccine Madness

    The Dangers of Smallpox Vaccination, (with again lots of historical record)

    a 1912 book BY J.T. BIGGS J.P.





    Suppressed Facts About Vaccination
    By Eleanor McBean 1957


    The Hidden Dangers In Polio Vaccine
    (Chapter 10 of Poisoned Needle plus addendums)
    by Eleanor McBean

    Herbert Shelton DC

    Vaccines and Serum Evils
    by Herbert Shelton (c1940’s)

    History of Vaccination 1712-1993

    The polio vaccine: a critical assessment of its arcane history, efficacy, and long-term health-related consequences

    Smoke, Mirrors, and the “Disappearance” Of Polio, by Suzanne Humphries, MD

    CDC and Friends Sprinting Towards the Polio “Finish Line,” by Suzanne Humphries, MD

    Interview with Dr Suzanne Humphries, with Mike Adams, of Natural News

    Suzanne Humphries, MD

    Decline of Diseases Prior to Available Vaccine Graphs

    Link Index for Graphs – A quick way to see Historical Trends

  • Mr Davis, YOU are lying. You are lying because my website is just full of endless studies straight from Pubmed, or the the studies are listed in other journals but as well are listed in Pubmed. I back up everything I have stated and claim to with facts, data, and science; which is something you seem to find impossible to do, and for the most part because no such thing exists. The next problem for you is that you have never considered researching any unbiased information. All you parrot is the false and misleading propaganda. In now having debated dozens of people on various articles, I find you to be the most inexperienced of all of them, to date. Hows that grab ya?

    What you just wrote in that twisted expose above, is nothing more than complete nonsense. From square one here all you have done is make excuses for why you can not produce any studies that show vaccine safety. Show me the study, that is all you have been asked by anyone to do. Lets as well see if it actually shows what you say it does; expect a counter analysis. You received one; on what you did provide, and without any actual and viable counter argument you didn’t like nor could you accept the outcome, So, in turn you created the twisted trash you see that you wrote, above.

    You were asked for specifically as well one single scientific study that shows the safety of aluminum adjuvants. You again failed to provide any such study; and that is all you had to do. So, and again you come up with the silly excuses you see written above. That is why you are being banned. You refuse to allow any form of honest, rational, and constructive debate to take place here. Other people like to discuss these articles as well; and you have totally ruined that. And no, I as well have no connection to Dr. Sherri Tenpenny, nor anything you mentioned.

  • All you had to do was provide one single study showing vaccine safety, that the study was what you said it was. All you had to do was provide a study that could not be refuted with counter analysis, and /or counter studies showing just the opposite to be true. In the end it would be and have been left for the readers as well to determine if the study carried the claim of vaccine safety that you presented that it does. So, do you expect to just present material here Davis and to just have it accepted that you say it represents vaccine safety studies or a safety study; when no such thing was as a fact true. Do you expect to remain unquestioned as to your self believed expertise, and said claims? You can choose to fabricate your literal delusions, but it and that simply will not pass the mustard with anyone that has actually done the proper research.on this issue. Get over it.

  • For days, you have posted safety studies??? WHERE??? Mr Davis where would that be? You had little to nothing. Compare that to the dozens of studies I put in front of you that exist on the pages of my site. You were linked to the specific pages, and you ignored it all! Do you have anything left that I have not addressed as to your material? Of course not.

    If you had found any actual science, or even one single vaccine aluminum adjuvant safety study on Offit’s CHOP or the CDC’s site; all you had to do was JUST post it! Do you not think I have already long ago scoured that CHOP and the CDC site, and know that there are no such said safety studies there? How many more lame excuses do you have left in that twisted bag of tricks, to avoid producing what you say you can?

  • The guidelines are quite easy, find some studies that refute the findings of the studies that are all over my website; dozens of studies that show the direct mechanisms of harm of vaccines. I already gave you those specific pages, and you ignored it. With that many studies, I am definitely not going to list them all here, when they are already in a collection you can easily access; go take a look.

    Your level of dishonesty and going back on your word is already again apparent; because you have asked me for studies showing the effectiveness of homeopathy, and I clearly did that. However, as I just told you I answered that on the first post that you made the request, on the other and most current article. I told you I am only going to reply to that with the studies, one time. Not on each reply post that you asked for it on, again. So, you have already failed to follow through on your word; which again makes you look like the fool, that you actually are..

  • Well Paul, if you had some good data; I would actually be interested in seeing it; but you present with nothing, so its pretty hard to accept anything when there is nothing there offered. You data was refuted perfectly as near to worthless; so just get over it. You simply can not accept the reality of that you have nothing viable for data to offer. that was your responsibility in making the claims that you have; not mine. Nor am I to blame because you can not back up your claims.You are the only one here that brought up the subject of homeopathy; yet you say I have and that I keep promoting it. Wow, Homeopathy does not harm people, like vaccines do; and is not the subject matter of this article.

    Furthermore, in what in posted above, if you actually had taken the time to review it all; you would realize what that shows you. It shows you that the not only vaccines are based on false and incorrect principals, but that modern medicine itself as a whole is based on a false foundation of understanding. That material shows you as well a complete 100 year history of how and why it became that way. Start actually educating yourself Mr Davis.The general public has been entirely mislead as to what modern medicine and vaccines actually represent. It is a completely failed system that is doing far more harm than good, and due to its own failed design and foundation of premise and understanding of the human body. You can get it, or choose not to get it, your choice. As I said I have already answered your question as to the said studies you requested in regard to homeopathy, and that was done on the other most recent article. I told you that. Yet instead of reviewing that, you insist on ignoring it, and expect me to answer it again on the half a dozen places here, that you again asked that question. A question that is as well irrelevant to the subject matter of the article here. How many times do you want to divert, and move the goal posts?

  • Vaccines ARE in reality, semi diluted versions of the virus, as an antigen; but obviously there is not nearly as much dilution done, as is used in homeopathy. Homeopathy as well makes diluted solutions that are used as vaccines by the way, to do the same thing.

  • In how many places did you ask me, and how many times would I have to repeatedly answer this, for you to actually see it, Davis? This data should be good enough evidence, for anyone. Unless you yet chose to just be that deep in denial. Or did you move the goal posts, and as well refuse to read what is already here. Have you been to my site yet to read all the vaccine shown mechanisms of harm science; or are you still avoiding that out of convenience? You know, the pages I linked you to?

    Clinical effectiveness of homeopathy: the evidence from published research. …. , . .




    I seen several positive studies in Pubmed, but am not about to list them all for you; do your own research.

    Homeopathy. 2012 Jan;101(1):5-12. doi:

    Randomized controlled pilot study to compare Homeopathy and Conventional therapy in Acute Otitis Media.


    Individualized homeopathy is an effective conventional treatment in AOM, there were no significant differences between groups in the main outcome. Symptomatic improvement was quicker in the Homeopathy group, and there was a large difference in antibiotic requirements, favouring homeopathy. Further work on a larger scale should be conducted.



    A Little History of Homeopathy in Brazil

    Swiss government report declares homeopathy is ‘cost effective’ in treating patients

    Homeopathy “Officially” Approved for Use by the Swiss Government

  • Do you simply not know how to do any of your own research, Argus? Or are you just scared of what you might find? Its just easier for you to make false and clueless claims against something that doesn’t fit with your allopathic medicine is great, promoting agenda. And then you hope that no one actually looks it up, or has the answer, right. This should be enough information and studies, for any rational person to conclude, that homeopathy is a effective. It has been effective for over 100 years; just like chiropractic. Here is the good part; it doesn’t ruin peoples health, like the pharma drugs and vaccines do.

    Clinical effectiveness of homeopathy: the evidence from published research. …. , . .




    I seen several positive studies in Pubmed, but am not about to list them all for you; do your own research.

    Homeopathy. 2012 Jan;101(1):5-12. doi:

    Randomized controlled pilot study to compare Homeopathy and Conventional therapy in Acute Otitis Media.


    Individualized homeopathy is an effective conventional treatment in AOM, there were no significant differences between groups in the main outcome. Symptomatic improvement was quicker in the Homeopathy group, and there was a large difference in antibiotic requirements, favouring homeopathy. Further work on a larger scale should be conducted.




    A Little History of Homeopathy in Brazil


    Swiss government report declares homeopathy is ‘cost effective’ in treating patients


    Homeopathy “Officially” Approved for Use by the Swiss Government


  • Matthew Brown

    I am amazed at how angry you can all be on both sides of the debate. Firstly, I should have stated that that includes parapetussis (which I have misspelled, so maybe I’m not a doc?) I don’t personally see them, I oversee a lot of them, sometimes I examine the patients myself, sometimes I just have them discussed with me by junior docs, and in truth I doubt that I do see 200 cases per year. I used daily to approximate it, so yes, that is a lie, or at best an exaggeration. It’s certainly much more than weekly but I don’t know the real number, because there are cases of confirmed pertussis in neonates and infants (both immunised and not. I’m not going to spend the time reviewing the numbers for you as I don’t think you’d appreciate the effort, and it would only tell you what you already knew which is that immunised kids get pertussis) and I’m including about 2% of the coryza we see in adolescents and adults that has persisted beyond a couple of weeks (This is why they call pertussis the 100-day cough).

    Sorry if you feel deceived.

  • Matthew Brown

    Dear Paul,

    I don’t have any desire to prove myself not a faker, and I’m not sure it would be wise to give out any details on this site that might confirm it. I’m not gaining a thrill out of this or anything, I just started browsing vaccination advice sites because I’m a doc who has started looking at the literature and realising that you guys might have a point.

    IF you don’t value my input, I’m ok with that, but I do have some expertise that could have helped you out.

    I do think it’s a bit ironic that Jeff’s article opens with ‘on the one hand’ when you guys seem to be only looking at one hand, but I appreciate how emotionally charged this issue is and so to some degree I understand it.

    I’m not going to visit this site any more as my thoughts don’t seem to be that well received, however I will tell you something that the more active of you might want to follow up.

    Last night we had two pediatric patients with vac reactions come into the department. They weren’t anything too severe, one child had a fever of 40.5 deg (celcius). The other had a local recation and become a bit lethargic I think. Neither was logged as a vaccination reaction. One doctor remarked that she remembers years ago there were always these yellow forms lying around which you had to fill out on these patients. After fifteen minutes of looking around the department and asking staff, she couldn’t find one.

    I hope you find that useful, because like you, I feel we have pushed this vaccination thing too far. While we disagree to the extent of this, I know that you are driven by the desire to do the best thing by your kids. I am driven by the same force, and I would point out that the majority of those who oppose you are also. However I don’t need to tell you there are a few who can somehow put on their blinkers to what is obvious for the sake of profit. it’s unfortunate, but not surprising, that they are dispraportionately powerful. Good luck, I’ll be rooting for you.


    PS – sorry for the group mail.

  • Matthew Brown

    This article depends whether you consider vomiting voluntary http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1034/j.1399-6576.1999.430306.x/abstract

  • Hi Dr. Brown,

    Thank you for sharing your insight. It’s rare doctors take your stance – very rare indeed. If you can pause for a moment and in your mind’s eye imagine most parents who are “anti-vaccine” have had children injured from them. In other words, they trusted doctors and vaccinated their child!

    Why would a parent be angry at a doctor?

    From a vaccine-injured parent perspective, there is the hesitancy or reluctance to acknowledge any injury has occurred. It’s often acknowledged from a medical perspective as collateral damage – or the price of admission for participating in society. Yet, when it comes down to using “scientific” measures, both before and after vaccination to show harm has been done, there is a strange silence.

    I strongly feel parents should have the ability to ask questions of their doctors and have them reasonably answered instead of having some type of Draconian policy to “fire them” if they don’t like the questions a mother asks.

    Parents need to know they have options.

  • Matthew Brown

    You missed the point – homeopathy means ‘same pathology’, regardless of dilution, allopathy means ‘opposite pathology’. I don’t believe that homeopathic dilution works. I tried it and it didn’t work for me, I’ve never seen it work on anybody and I can’t understand how it works. In my view it probably doesn’t, but I’m not treating patients with it, and most of the patient’s who use it probably don’t dig my stuff. But I have no issue with people who think it helps using it.

    As for a full-strength, undiluted medicine, I suppose intralipid would be one.

    If by ‘where’s the evidence?’ you are seriously asking me to produce papers that prove that vaccination works, I would say that you’re operating on a level far below that required to understand the topics being discussed here. Surely this, and many other blogs, papers, articles, television broadcasts and conferences are dedicated to answering this question. If you expect I’ll answer it by providing you a couple of links, I’ll have disappointed you, sorry.

  • Matthew Brown

    Glad I’ve brought the two of you together… Thanks for the education. And for pointing out the adrenaline thing.

  • Matthew Brown

    Dear Jeffry,

    I don’t have any desire to prove myself not a faker, and I’m not sure it would be wise to give out any details on this site that might confirm it. I’m not gaining a thrill out of this or anything, I just started browsing vaccination advice sites because I’m a doc who has started looking at the literature and realising that you guys might have a point.

    If you don’t value my input, I’m ok with that, but I do have some expertise that could have helped you out.

    I do think it’s a bit ironic that the article opens with ‘on the one hand’ when you guys seem to be only looking at one hand, but I appreciate how emotionally charged this issue is and so to some degree I understand it.

    I’m not going to visit this site any more as my thoughts don’t seem to be that well received, however I will tell you something that the more active of you might want to follow up.

    Last night we had two pediatric patients with vac reactions come into the department. They weren’t anything too severe, one child had a fever of 40.5 deg (celcius). The other had a local recation and become a bit lethargic I think. Neither was logged as a vaccination reaction. One doctor remarked that she remembers years ago there were always these yellow forms lying around which you had to fill out on these patients. After fifteen minutes of looking around the department and asking staff, she couldn’t find one.

    I hope you find that useful, because like you, I feel we have pushed this vaccination thing too far. While we disagree to the extent of this, I know that you are driven by the desire to do the best thing by your kids. I am driven by the same force, and I would point out that the majority of those who oppose you are also. However I don’t need to tell you there are a few who can somehow put on their blinkers to what is obvious for the sake of profit. it’s unfortunate, but not surprising, that they are dispraportionately powerful. Good luck, I’ll be rooting for you.


    PS – I don’t imagine that this will last long on the site, but I give you credit if you don’t delete it, as I’ll admire you for not dismissing an alternative point of view. I’m in awe of your drive and energy, and you guys certainly do have a wide knowledge base. Good luck. To some extent I think you’re shooting yourself in the foot, but as they say, any publicity is good publicity.

  • Matthew Brown

    Where do you find the time to do your real work?

  • Argus

    In this study, the “placebo” only worked against nausea – not vomiting.
    Reinforces what I said above about only changing the symptoms – not the disease process.

  • No, vaccine shedding and mutation, is not rare.

    Post Vaccination – Vaccine Targeted Strain – Viral and Bacterial Pathogen – Shedding

    Failure Of The Continued Polio Vaccine Campaign

  • The bulk of that I do agree with Matt. However, much of what is happening with the doctors and even state health departments is that they are trapped in a system that must depend on to base their recommendations. They have no choice but to follow that, and as well not question it, nor make any outspoken argument against it, or they risk losing their job and career. They truly have no choice but to go with the flow, or they are finished. They were taught everything they know and have ever been taught to believe, by a pharma connected and run medical school. Their only choice at that point is to jump ship and go into a form of alternative naturopathic health care. They simply most of them, will refuse to do it. Just like everything in those circles, they have to much to lose, but to only accept it as is. When their conscience can’t take it anymore, only then will they leave that largely failed system. Amazingly and unfortunately few of them ever come to that point. They of course and as well have all the support structure they could ever need, to keep on making denial of what they are doing, and as the recognition of ever having done more harm than good. They are so strongly and falsely indoctrinated, that most of them simply can not any longer think for themselves, nor outside that box; and nor are they even any longer willing to consider it.

  • So, Jim Bob; tell me exactly how and why the claims numbered #1 through #17 are, or should be considered outright lies and misinformation; when all of it is referenced directly from such as Pubmed studies and as well such as the CDC itself? Are you saying that the CDC’s own claimed to data, can not be used against them to burn down their own false claims of vaccine safety and effectiveness? Wow, isn’t that interesting as to what a twisted web of hypocrisy and deceit that claim surely seems to weave for you. As well are you now claiming as well that Pubmed is an invalid reference source? Why is that? Oh, I see, and I get it now; the pro-vaccine side has decided that Pubmed is only valid as a study and reference tool, if the study is in their favor. The CDC has long had a studies cherry picker with full blinders on it; so why would this be any different.

  • Jim in Texas

    I think this self proclaimedentity calling himself Paul Davis learned his interpersonal and debating strategies from Bill O’Reilley. He is likely a disinformation employee of the CDC ( center for disease creation) Don’t waste your time reading his BS unless you’re really bored. I just did, and I feel used.

  • Emma

    So in 50 years you can give 17 examples but we can give hundreds of examples if newborns dying from catching preventable diseases from un immunised adults. You are a part of the problem.

  • You’re not serious are you?

  • Phil

    The World Health Organization is another corrupt body set up by guess who…the Rockerfeller foundation. Fancy that. Wake up mate.

  • Phillip

    Polio presents from having a bad diet. Do your research.

  • Phillip

    more WHO misinformation. I guess Paul disbelieves the studies coming out about endocannabinoids and the prevention of cancer.

  • Phillip

    another credible source of information….Rockerfellers started the CIA also mate. You need to wake up.

  • Phillip

    You are using references from organisations set up by the rockerfeller group. Seriously, check out some independant scientific data. Not the same old bullshit from the same old people.

  • I take the generally accepted view that vaccine preventable diseases are prevented by vaccines. This view is shared by about 95 percent of American parents, which is why we have such high coverage nationally. Some parents reject that view, with disastrous consequences for their kids. Last outbreak of paralytic polio in the US: Amish vaccine refusers in rural Maryland, 1979. Read and weep.http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00050435.htm

  • Think before you speak

    Statistics can be skewed anyway you want them to- if the government or the CDC actually thought these vaccines were dangerous or caused autism they wouldn’t promote the spread of dangerous diseases- do you know how much more money it takes care of a severely autistic child? Do the research, know the research, know the disease states and the complications. I will always continue to vaccinate myself and my loved ones- I’ve had way more vaccines than my parents- and I’m fine- if anything I’m more open minded, intellectual, and more successful- I’ve had every vaccine on the market, and re-vaccinate regularly depending on my titers, possible contacts and current outbreaks. Look up who invented the first typhoid vaccine and why. No I refuse to allow my child to ever be exposed to a potential Typhoid Mary in the school systems- fund your own crazy anti-vaccine school system if you feel so strongly. In the end it will be your child who suffers- because of your decisions- live with it, be an outcast of society. Don’t expect others to accepts your believes when you don’t accept theirs.

  • Denise

    HA…”if the govn knew how they dangerous they were they wouldnt promote them”. sorry I dont mean to be rude, I just think its a little funny when people think the government is looking out for our best interest. You obv have NO idea how cruel and calculating the govn really is. If you could be a fly on their walls you’d be horrorized at the things you’d hear. EVIL DOES EXIST my dear……. There are people who want to harm us because its in their BENEFIT. when you asked if we know how much more money it takes to care for an autistic child, I just think, “Uh, YEAH of course….and you know who else knows — The big pharma.” They want life long customers after all. If they can make sure your kids will be sick enough to be buying their drugs for life, they are happy as a dog!

    and when you say you get vaxx all the time and are “Fine”…well, that is only your perception and not reality, sorry to say. Alot of times you dont “see” the harmful effects until they were well developed. For other minor things, such as allergies and asthma you blame on other things, not knowing it was the vaccines.

    The funny thing about pro-vaxxers is that you guys beleive our kids make your’s sick when its actually the other way around. because your child is injected with strains of the desease, it sheds onto our kids, and makes them sick. vaccines dont protect ANYONE from getting sick, nor do they prevent you from dying. vaxxed children die just as non vaxxed. so what is the point of the vaccine? Can you explain that?

    If you are open minded… “raising a vaccine free child” by wendy lydall is a great book full of facts, references, and information so you can understand why we went from being JUST LIKE YOU to willingly accepting the fact that people will make fun of us, insult us, and even outcast us. no one likes to be treated that way, but obviously there is a strong reason why were willing to go through that: We are the ones who read the labels. We are the ones who care ENOUGH to question everything instead of trusting blindly.

  • Dave

    You talk of Typhoid. Here’s a modern example – myself. I got the Typhoid vaccination, and just 3 years later I got typhoid fever. Then a year later I got it again! The vaccine that I got didn’t help at all. That experience lowered my trust in vaccines.

  • jimmy corn

    So your comparing the U.S. to third world countries? IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH VACCINES AND EVERYTHING TO DO WITH SANITATION AND WATER QUALITY and nutrition.

  • Lionheart

    My son is a year old in a week. Never received a single vaccination, and never will. He has never been sick, not even a small cold. Not even once. We’ve even let him hang around sick babies. We’ve never been too concerned with using sanitary wipes, hand sanitizer, or disinfectants to prevent sickness for our baby. His body is doing exactly what it needs to do on its own. I’ve never seen a human being more rock-solid like this little guy. Mix THIS lifestyle together with an all organic diet, and there’s no way you can get sick.

  • Lionheart

    If your response to anything is in defense to our government or the CDC, your argument is kinda invalid. Just saying.

  • Common Sense

    Example #3 actually shows clearly how effective the vaccines really were in that case. The completely unvaccinated made up 11 out of 31 infected (35.5%) despite comprising only 4% of the total population. If you do that maths, that means that the unvaccinated camp attendees were 13.2 times more likely to become infected than the vaccinated attendees.

    Example #6 shows that that the unvaccinated were 15.5 times more likely to be infected than the vaccinated.

    Example #13 shows that the unvaccinated were 11.5 times more likely to be infected than the vaccinated.

    The other examples do not include enough information to draw a conclusion.

    So vaccinate your kids, it reduces the likelihood of them becoming infected by 11.5 to 15.5 times. No one said vaccines were perfect, but making your kids 11.5 times safer is a no-brainer decision. The only reason antivaxxers exist at all is because some people failed basic maths at school and refuse to learn when their error is pointed out to them.

  • Common Sense

    But you antivaxers always claim that catching the disease is better than being vaccinated because you supposedly then have “lifelong immunity”. Didn’t work for you, huh?

    Most likely the real problem is that you’re one of the minority of people whose immune system simply doesn’t make long-lasting immunity to this particular disease, whether from vaccination or infection. So you particularly need everyone else to be vaccinated (community immunity) to reduce the chance you’ll be infected. If I was you, I’d be encouraging vaccination, no discouraging it – otherwise it’s more likely that you’ll catch typhoid again in the future, very likely from an unvaccinated person.

  • chris

    The vaccine failure in the School in New Mexico (number 9) It is important to note that Vaccination histories could only be verified in 49% of 47 cases studied, therefore the lack of medical records makes it difficult to assume that it was vaccine failure. Suggest not do research on Google, instead click directly on the links kindly provided here to get the real picture.

  • chris

    If it is all to do with sanitation and nutrition, then how do you explain why these diseases still exist in first world countries? and they why existed before junk food was even available?

  • Henry Rawlinson

    Clearly there may be debatable areas with references to the effectiveness or non effectiveness of vaccines. That is in fact a relative truth.
    One debate for which there is neither a for, or an against, which is a fact in law, is that, in the last decade various pharmaceutical companies have been fined 6 billion for fraud.
    Some may trust crooks, and some may not. This will depend on their prejudices.
    Although this doesn’t prove an isuue one way or another, some manufacturers of the drugs you take, however administered do not have your interest at heart.
    The proof is in the law suits that have seen them fined billions. Trust?

  • Unimpressed with your stats

    Condoms fail, so why bother using them? You relay numbers of cases but omit out of what size population.Quebec hasn’t a small population.

  • concerned mom

    I am so frozen with fear…get shotsnfor my baby don’t get shots….ugg. I have been reading and viewing videos onnthe internet for 7 months ( thatsbmy babys age) and I cant make up my mind. we have done 1 series of shots at age 5 months and he had a slight fever 101.2 and on the first night a slightly swollen fontanelle ( soft spot) That appeared swollen on when lying down…however it was full when upright when it is usually slightly sunken. ..does this mean something.? My doctor said it was ok because it returned to normal after about 24 hours. I want to continue shots so I can feel he is protected, but fear all the hings that couldngo wrong. it seems im damned if I do and damned if I don’t. how does one decide?

  • concerned mom

    I mean both sides have excellent points. But the furher I get into this research I fluctuate from one to the other. I just want to know they are safe, effective and wont cause any damge/har m to my child and ndo what they are inteneded for. I want peace wih this. I have a 16 y that fully vaccinated and never had an issue except a febrile seizure in infancy and I don’t know if it. was after shots or not. Whats the best choice? Anyone going crazy trying to figure nthis out like me?

  • Hugo

    the first example you gave the report concludes that the high rate of two doses prevented the severity of the disease!!!

  • Chris Furney

    Why would a certain-aged population in only one country (that uses the highest number of immunizations in the world) be five times as likely to test positive for a mild, vaccine like case of HepC? Hint- early poliovirus vaccine was known to carry rogue hepc virus all too often. Make it 18- and there are many others.

  • Clair King

    People like you are brainwashed into thinking that non vaxxers are carrier monkeys and we have these diseases that a vax would cure. We are not sick and spreading diseases and if you have faith in vaccinations then you’ll be safe because you have full immunity, right? The government doesn’t give a shit about you, they’re in bed with Big Pharma and Monsanto pumping you full of neurotoxins and pesticides. Do you know Bill Gates has 500,000 shares of stock in Monsanto? Do you know he backs a vaccination program that has left 50,000 children in India and Africa paralyzed? He’s a eugenicist and has publicly said he’d like to see the world population decreased by 15%. You think the government is protecting you? Look at what they allow to be put into your food, read the ingredient list for vaccinations. Allergies, diabetes, asthma, autism, seizures- these are all illnesses connected to vaccines that bombard our immune system and require lifelong medication to manage, not to mention cancer and HIV. Keep everyone sick, but alive by medication.

  • Jpower

    Keep reading. You can delay until you are positive you are making the right choice. You cannot undo vaccination. Good luck.

  • Jpower

    How come the vaccinated still got sick? If vaccines work? No need to be nasty or rude. Thanks.

  • The Truth of the Matter

    The biggest issue with vaccines that everyone seems to be missing is that they can contain aluminum, msg, thimerosal (mercury), and/or formaldehyde. All of these subtances are well-known to be toxic. Aluminum, mercury, and msg all cause brain damage (neurotoxins). Formaldehyde (embalming fluid) can cause cancer as well as a host of other things.

  • dontbeanut

    Fallacies of logic abound in your argument, but whatever. A couple of quick things: Many of these “failures” are 20-30yrs old, and vaccines have improved. 17 failures out of how many schools over how many years? That’s a pretty good success rate. While some of you are scrambling to google, as encouraged in an above post, go ahead and search smallpox and polio while you’re at it.

  • We could spend all day finding examples of vaccine failures. This is just 17 as I mentioned.

    I agree – go look at polio and smallpox and don’t forget to look into the cancer-causing monkey virus (SV40) which contaminated the polio vaccine.

  • Dontbeanut

    So basically your strategy is to let a disease be irradiated through vaccines, then not get vaccinated for said disease, and, finally point out the flaws with the vaccine. Gotcha. Funny thing…….they guy who posted this link on his Facebook page used to work for me, in a drugstore. 3 years ago, 23 out of my 26 employees received a flu shot. He was one of the 3 who opted out. 2 employees got the flu, both unvaccinated, and he was one of them. His was so bad it put him in the hospital.

  • Khedron Frank

    Vaccines are not 100% effective. This does not mean that they are useless.

  • Khedron Frank

    How does the government benefit by poisoning kids?

  • Medb

    Vaccines were invented in 1796. Disinfectant, hand sanitizer, sanitary wipes, and pesticides were all invented later. This means that prior to 1796, everyone was following your lifestyle and eating an all-organic diet. You say “Mix THIS lifestyle together with an all organic diet, and there’s no way you can get sick.” Which means you believe no one got sick before 1796? In which case, where’d they get the smallpox to vaccinate people with?

  • Maria

    In the examples above, you are calculating vaccine effectiveness incorrectly. You cannot use proportions, where the total population number is your denominator, to assess effectiveness or risk of a sub-population.

    For example: Say 90/100 people in a population were vaccinated for a disease and 10/100 were not. Then there is an outbreak of that disease, where 10 people in the vaccinated population get sick and 5 from the unvaccinated group get sick.

    Using your method, you would say that more vaccinated people got sick (10/100 = 10%) versus than unvaccinated (5/100 = 5%). But that is wrong. You need to use the denominator of the sub-population to decide if that vaccine increased or decrease your odds of getting sick in that outbreak or over any period of time.

    So using the correct method:
    In the vaccinated group, you have 10 sick/90 vaccinated = 11%, whereas in the unvaccinated group you have 5 sick/10 unvaccinated = 50%.
    So clearly the unvaccinated group had a higher infection rate than the vaccinated group.

    There are other tools to help evaluate Risk Ratios or Odds Ratios, but they are based on the same mathematical principle – using the correct denominator.

    Does this help clarify?

  • Parkerfamily7

    On facebook follow Mary E. Tocco I plead for your baby DO NOT VACCINATE! If you do and there is damage you can never go back in time

  • Parkerfamily7

    by charging money for life time worth of meds!

  • kari

    Not an applicably comparison, as there is no health risk to using condoms.

  • Thanks for sharing, @45c880c15b981f6f9683ca6b249b2b7e:disqus.

    Also – if a condom fails, we don’t point the finger at the person’s genetics. We say the condom didn’t work.

    On the contrary, if vaccines don’t work, the finger is rarely pointed at the vaccine.

  • Jessi

    Except that the method used *does* debunk herd immunity.

  • gomurr

    How do you figure? The fact that 97% of those infected had received either 1 or 2 doses of vaccine (the highest number …..89%…..of those infected having received 2 doses), shows no such thing. I see no mention of the severity of the disease.

  • gomurr

    I want to hear those words out of your mouth after it’s your child.

  • gomurr

    Doctors are also required by law, at least in the US, to inform the parents of any side effects or adverse reactions. You can probably count one hand how many actually do this.

  • gomurr

    If the CDC, WHO, and the AMA are to be believed about how great vaccines are, you should see a extremely low % of vaccinated children contracting these illnesses. I’d say 5%. Statistics show, however, in most outbreaks of mumps, measles, chickenpox, and pertussis, the large majority of victims are inoculated. When a larger number, who have been vaccinated, fall ill, as opposed to a very small %, NOT vaccinated, I’d say vaccine failure or ineffectiveness was to blame. Why take a risk with our children’s health, even life, for something not PROVEN to be effective, or even SAFE?

  • gomurr

    They are as far as I’m concerned. 10 years worth of research has convinced me.

  • gomurr

    I think saying “Vaccines were invented in 1796” is a rather blanket statement. Which vaccines? How many? Many required or forced on today’s kids weren’t even around when I was a kid, let alone the early 1800’s. How many that were had mercury, aluminum, or live virus (not related to vaccine) in them? You know as well as I do, “there’s no way you can get sick…” is not meant to be taken literally as 100% fact.

  • gomurr

    Of course they would. They passed the Monsanto Protection Act, didn’t they? The FDA is full of past and future employees of the pharmaceutical companies. They are the ones who dictate the policy. If you still believe, “I’m from the government, and I’m here to protect you”……well, keep feeding and injecting yourself and your loved ones with neurotoxins, aluminum, mercury, MSG, and agent orange. Have a healthy life!

  • gomurr

    They don’t get it. They still think government is their friend. The fact that everything that comes out of their mouth is a lie, just doesn’t register.

  • gomurr

    Uh…..he was vaccinated BEFORE he became ill. Had he not been vaccinated…..we’ll never know. One thing is clear. Vaccinating children before their natural immune system has time to mature, inhibits it. Oh, and keep paying Big Pharma to keep you well. That’s not even on their top ten list of priorities.

  • gomurr

    There are hundreds, if not thousands, of examples. Many communicable diseases naturally run their course before mutating into harmless or less potent strains. Sanitation and good hygiene has also stopped or inhibited the spread of many others. Oh, and that polio vaccine; seems 3,000,000 doses, given to those of us who were inoculated in the 1960’s, were infected with live cancer virus. That’s in the US. Who would have thought……the government and vaccine makers caring about our health, and all.

  • gomurr

    You should change your handle to “Iamanut”.

  • gomurr

    People receiving flu shots who succumb to the flu (50%) are MORE ill than those who get the flu (also 50%) that have NOT received a shot.

  • gomurr

    That has been shown to be false. Vaccines do nothing to boost immunity.

  • gomurr

    First you have to accept the figures from WHO. We all know they don’t lie or have an agenda. Bill Gates absolutely is a eugenicist. That is a fact. Do your own research on the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. Her “family planning” in India includes forced sterilization. That little eugenics project has been going on for decades via the Rockefeller Foundation, the UN, US, UK, and others. He makes no bones about his plan to vaccinate the world, nor the fact he wants to limit and reduce the population through vaccines. He also owns a big chunk of Monsanto, whose “Round-up Ready” crops are being shown to cause sterility and infertility, along with various cancers, etc. Round-up is basically Agent Orange.

  • gomurr

    Don’t bother “educating” him. Just go back and read what he said. He never says adrenaline is a vaccine. He says, “..if my son were to be stung and develop anaphylaxis, I would be reaching for adrenaline rather than a dilution…” He is talking about an emergency situation where dilution therapy, given the time needed to be effective, would most likely result in death.
    So, while you’re correcting everyone, you pompous ass, try giving yourself a reading lesson. Us “non-vaxers” like to make sure we understand what we have read before we correct someone.

  • gomurr

    The evidence is the people they have cured.

  • gomurr

    Homeopathic medicine is not loaded with mercury, aluminum, or other chemicals and neurotoxins. It also takes much longer to treat illness this way. The difference is, it DOES treat the underlying cause, rather than just the symptoms (which is all Big Pharma treats…..and that’s the way they like it). It’s what I choose personally and have found to be very effective. In the last 30 years, I have seen my conventional doctor twice, both times for antibiotics (which I rarely take) for severe respiratory infections. Unfortunately, many doctors aren’t knowledgeable regarding alternate therapies and therefore are skeptical about their effectiveness. It really isn’t their fault. In the past, medical schools have more or less been barred from teaching these practices at the risk of having their funding cut. Since much of their funding comes from large corporations and foundations (such as the Rockefeller Foundation) that have close ties, directly or indirectly, to the pharmaceutical companies, this has been the status quo. As the public begins to find these alternatives effective, and often less debilitating, than conventional therapies, this is starting to change. Conventional medicine is certainly called for in a case of anaphylaxis as time is of the essence, and a shot of adrenalin may be the only thing preventing sudden death. Dilution therapy takes time to work and must usually be taken several times a day when no food or liquids have been, or will be, ingested for a certain amount of time prior to, or after, ingestion. Also, conventional medicine often ignores (or is ignorant of) the root cause of certain conditions, and doesn’t treat it. An example is heavy metal toxicity or parasitic infections. Chelation therapy is also rarely used, although triple bypasses are common. This doesn’t even touch upon all the natural, known cures, inexpensive and readily available, which have been suppressed because there was no profit to be made. Very sad, but very true, unfortunately.

  • gomurr

    Wrong….for someone who only wants the truth, you’re very determined to see only one side.

  • gomurr

    Wrong….for someone who only wants the truth, you’re very determined to see only one side.

  • gomurr

    Re: What you were taught in medical school……just follow the money. It always comes back to the same thing. Thank you for being a doctor who actually questions things and admits a lack of knowledge in certain areas by medical professionals. Too many doctors today have the “God Complex”. Ego first, patient last.

  • gomurr

    Then you do it when your pregnant.

  • Argus

    No, it doesn’t. Not at all.

  • A voice of reason

    So you’ve pulled out 17 examples over the span of 40 years and made a sweeping conclusion based on that. How van you ignore the millions of lives that have been saved by vaccines. Sure, fair enough, some vaccines are not 100% effective, but vaccines “train” the immune system, they aren’t some miracle cure. They do not harm children, they drastically reduce th risk of diseases which could kill them. They may occasionally not be effective but as someone else said, condoms fail, does that make all contraception worthless?

  • honestly

    To the person whos saying that vaccines cause cancer and brain damage you are honestly retarded. Seriously, the only logical explanation i can think of for your point of view is that you’re some kind of paranoid conspiracy theorist. Not the kind of person who should be making decisions about healthcare and the like.

  • A voice of reason

    Well if a condom fails you can catch any number of STI’s due to sharing of bodily fluids. And the chances of having an adverse health effect from immunisation is tiny, so just get back in your box. Also given the minor severity of most side effects, is it really worth risking your childs life on the offchance that they might get a fever??? Have some common sense people…

  • In this article, I gave 17 contemporary examples. Rest assured there are many, many more (take note of the dates on these listed below — there are literally hundreds more I haven’t listed). The information is there for you to discover and I can’t do all of the work for you.

    To your analogy – if a condom breaks, naturally one would blame the condom for failing. However, in the case of vaccines failing, the medical community rarely blames the vaccines. Additionally, if condoms injured or maimed as vaccines do, you can bet the manufacturers would be sued. This isn’t the case with vaccines.

    Secondly, you should take time to look into SV40 and how this cancer-causing virus contaminated the polio vaccine for over a decade.

    Lastly, I think sanitation, hygiene, clean water, and food storage/preparation are downplayed in regards to the decline of disease.

    The psychic reactions following injections of bacterial vaccines.
    Int Arch Allergy Appl Immunol. 1950;1(3)
    PMID: 14794265

    Allergy to viral and rickettsial vaccines; review of the literature.
    Ann Allergy. 1950;8(5)
    PMID: 14800166

    [Sudden appearance of super acute fatal multiple sclerosis after a single injection of antityphoid vaccine.]
    Monatsschr Psychiatr Neurol. 1951;121(1)
    PMID: 14815597

    [Purpura rheumatica following mixed diphtheria-tetanus vaccination; effect of novocaine on the occlusive syndrome.]
    Arch Fr Pediatr. 1951;8(1)
    PMID: 14820381

    MUMME C,
    [Clinical and pathologic aspects of the injurious effect of typhoid,
    paratyphoid, and cholera vaccination upon the nervous system.]
    Dtsch Z Nervenheilkd. 1950;164(3)
    PMID: 15435281

    [No authors listed]
    [Case of vaccinal nephritis.]
    Homeopath Fr. 1951;27(4)
    PMID: 14823560

    [Problem of vaccinations.]
    Vie Med. 1951;32(8)
    PMID: 14877014

    RAMON G,
    [On the complications of diphtheria-tetanus anatoxin vaccination.]
    Vie Med. 1951;32(10)
    PMID: 14884474

    The effect of unrelated vaccines on the localization of paralysis in mouse encephalomyelitis.
    Proc Soc Exp Biol Med. 1951;77(4)
    PMID: 14891886

    BORY L,
    [Allergic disorders; some recent complications following compulsory preventive vaccinations.]
    Therapie. 1951;6(4)
    PMID: 14922294

    [Postvaccinal encephalomyelitis; clinical and histological aspects.]
    Rass Neuropsichiatr. 1951;5(3)
    PMID: 13177960

    An experimental study on problems of immunity and allergy in postvaccinal encephalitis.
    Arch Gesamte Virusforsch. 1951;4(4)

    PMID: 13249482
    Egg allergy in children; incidence and evaluation in relation to chick-embryo-propagated vaccines.
    AMA Am J Dis Child. 1952;83(3)
    PMID: 14902079

    The relation between recent injections and paralytic poliomyelitis in children.
    Am J Public Health Nations Health. 1952;42(2)
    PMID: 14903227

    The association of parenteral injections with poliomyelitis.
    Am J Public Health Nations Health. 1952;42(2)
    PMID: 14903228

    [No authors listed]
    RELATIONSHIP between inoculations and poliomyelitis.
    J Am Med Assoc. 1952;149(2)
    PMID: 14917585

    RENDU R,
    [Tuberculous manifestations consecutive to vaccination (except BCG vaccination) tuberculigenous vaccinal biotropism.]
    Rev Tuberc. 1952;16(1-2)
    PMID: 14930636

    [No authors listed]
    [Thrombopenic purpura following jennerian vaccination.]
    Lattante. 1952;23(1)
    PMID: 14939935

    [Kidney complications from vaccinations.]
    Concours Med. 1952;74(13)
    PMID: 14945192

    [Vaccination complications considered as industrial accident.]
    Minerva Medicoleg. 1952;72(2)
    PMID: 14947783

    [Hemorrhagic postvaccinal encephalomyelitis.]
    Schweiz Z Pathol Bakteriol. 1952;15(2)
    PMID: 14950157

    [Severe reactions in vaccine therapy of allergy.]
    Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen. 1952;72(12)
    PMID: 14958756

    [Appearance of lesions induced by vaccination or re-vaccination with formol-treated vaccine virus; relation to immunity.]
    Ann Inst Pasteur (Paris). 1952;82(6)
    PMID: 12976795

    [Fatal post-vaccinal reactions.]
    Rev Med Aeron Braz. 1952;4(2)
    PMID: 12983861

    [Biotropic eruption on the ninth day after a booster shot of diphtheria-tetanus-typhoid-paratyphoid vaccine; lipothymic shock
    occuring one hour after the injection; pathogenic discussion.]
    Bull Soc Fr Dermatol Syphiligr. 1952;59(3)
    PMID: 12987967

    [Chorea minor following vaccinations.]
    Nervenarzt. 1952;23(8)
    PMID: 13002581

    [Prevention of postvaccinal encephalitis.]
    Ned Tijdschr Geneeskd. 1952;96(34)
    PMID: 13013368

  • You need to turn off the television and get into the library and congressional records.


    Encephalitis can occur in the following ways:
    -A virus directly infects the brain.
    -A virus that caused an infection in the past becomes reactivated and directly damages the brain.
    -A virus or vaccine triggers a reaction that makes the immune system attack brain tissue (an autoimmune reaction).

    Executive Reorganization and Government Research of the Committee on Government Operations United States Senate, Ninety-Second Congress, Second Session. Page 499-505. April 20,21; and May 3,4, 1972.

    Page 500,

    “The next and only serious vaccine
    crisis that has occurred since the polio episode was the realization in
    mid-1961 that a monkey virus later shown to cause tumors in hamsters was contaminating both polio and adenovirus vaccines. The virus, known as SV40, was entering the vaccines and, just as in the polio case were
    surviving the formalin treatment.

    There were several states by which the full extent of the SV40 problem became known. First was the discovery in 1959-1960 by a DBS scientist, once again Bernice Eddy, that an unknown agent in the monkey kidney cells used to produce polio and adenovirus vaccines would cause tumors when the cells were injected into hamsters.”

  • Fed up

    Hey honestly, u honestly are so privileged to not have recieved the amount of vaccines that our babies are receiving today as well as what they are given, your what? 20, 30, or even 50? Why would there be a national vaccine injury compensation fund for the vaccines that cause brain damage, autism, or even DEATH, clearly you are the retarded one, you haven’t sat next to your baby in a hospital bed praying and watching them suffer and eventually have them die in your arms, so honestly go look up on Vears and the national vaccine injury compensation fund and realize that the government would NOT pay parents or the injured such vast amounts of money if this wasn’t a reality!

  • Huwbacca

    I could find many accounts of people dying whilst wearing a seatbelt. Does this mean I should not wear one?

    And another interesting thing, is that many viruses and bacteria do grow stronger against vaccines. If everyone where vaccinated the disease would die out and not become more resistant, but the more people who dont get vaccinations then the more they can evolve and get stronger.

    Aaaand finally. Vaccine failure is not a reason to avoid them. There is a substantially larger body of evidence in support of vaccines saving lives, and minimal reproduced, respectable work that links them with things like Autism. Apart from this essentially being a lie, it is strange to say that you would rather play the numbers game of getting life-threatening, relatively common illnesses, instead of the >1 in a 100 chance of being on a diagnosis of autism. (of which many many cases are not like the ones that are published with extreme trouble children attacking each other)

  • Are seat belts causing the death?

    And to your second point, as an example, show me “the evidence” the poliovirus was the only virus causing acute flaccid paralysis.

    To your last point — vaccine failure negates your second point. Your assumption is that if everyone were vaccinated, there would be no more
    “flavor” of that disease. There are no scientific measures that can prove vaccines work. In other words, try going to your doctors office and ask them to provide a blood panel or some other test proving you are immune from infection to certain disease. If you know of some – let me know.

  • Peter

    In example 3 you will notice that unvaccinated people are over represented among the infected, inferring a success for vaccination, no?

  • RenexVV

    “There are no scientific measures that can prove vaccines work.”

    That statement is just plain untrue:


    You can if you have a big enough sample. They do it all the time, and you can see it for yourself with an internet connection and understanding of statistics:


  • RenexVV

    No one is claiming vaccines never have adverse effects. But it is not reasonable to say that no one should take vaccines because of this, since the statistics show that it is safer to take vaccines than not take them.



    I know this sounds harsh, but you really should listen more to the people performing exhaustive research and statistical analysis then emotional parents untrained and unprepared to understand the causes of their loved ones suffering.

  • Joe Olden

    All of these substances are well known NOT to be toxic at the low concentrations found in vaccines. Aluminum is found in antacid tablets in much higher concentrations than in vaccines. You will get much more mercury eating tuna fish than from vaccines. Very small amounts of formaldehyde are found in fruits such as pears.
    The problem is that you have read the anti-vaccination side of the argument, but you haven’t gone over and read the pro-vaccination side, that has clearly shown that the anti-vaxx side is wrong.

  • That isn’t a scientific test that someone can go into their doctor and request. We’re not all genetically the same — so what you have is an assumption vaccines work in some of the population, don’t we?

  • Joe Olden

    So if someone tries to defend the government, they are automatically wrong? You are unable to believe the government ever says anything right? What paranoia.

  • Joe Olden

    You have absolutely no understanding of what pro-vaccine people think. None of the pro-vaccine scientists claim that vaccines give full immunity. You are pulling claims out of your read end. Go out and read what the pro-vaccine people are saying. Read both sides of the story, not just the anti-vaccine side.
    You are a typical anti-vaccine person full of conspiracy stories.

  • You fail to distinguish between ingestion (by the substance passing through the alimentary tract) versus injection.

    Additionally, you make a grave assumption the ingredients in vaccines have a negligible effect on infants. Even the pharmaceutical literature warns against making such a mistake.

    “Pharmaceutical products may contain, in addition to the active or therapeutic agent(s), a variety of other ingredients, termed inactive or inert, which are categorized as excipients or additives (flavorings, sweeteners, preservatives, stabilizers, diluents, lubricants, etc.). The words inert or inactive may be misnomers for some excipients because some have been shown to cause adverse effects. Neonates and young children are at risk for such effects because they may not be able to metabolize or eliminate an ingredient in a pharmaceutical product in the same manner as an adult.” (pp. 344)

    Encyclopedia of Pharmaceutical Technology Vol. 11
    Authors James Swarbrick & James C. Boylan
    1995 New York: Marcel Dekker, Inc.

  • Clair King

    Don’t tell me what I do and do not understand. I was pro vaccine, am fully vaccinated and partially vaccinated my children. I have spent countless hours researching both sides carefully and did not come to this decision lightly. I am not a conspiracy theorist or a crazy hippie. I am the mother of a vaccine injured child. Many people including doctors do not realize vaccines do not provide full immunity.

  • unreasonable

    Speaking of pulling out, read the fine print on condoms. Pulling out is drastically more effective at prevented an unplanned pregnancy than a condom (or pills for that matter), very much like eating right and taking care of your body is vastly more effective at preventing sickness and disease than vaccinations. Not to say they don’t have a place; dirty unhealthy situations might require a condom AND a vaccine.

  • Pete

    If you don’t and your child dies (statistically MUCH more likely even considering the nonsense “evidence” on vaccine injury) you can’t go back in time either.

  • Pete

    You’ve really illustrated the truth of this issue with this post. Hundreds of millions of vaccinated individuals who have never had cause to give polio or measles a second thought will never speak as loud as your one kid. If everyone who WASN’T injured by vaccines, and avoided dying of one of these diseases could be quantified, the relatively tiny voice of anti-vaxxers would be drowned out. But nobody writes passionate, moving rhetoric about how they WEREN’T permanently disfigured by polio.

  • Parkerfamily7

    they surely don’t create cures they ONLY create customers by making kids sick and then those kids need lifelong drugs for $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

  • Parkerfamily7

    What about Autism?? My son got autism after his DPT vaccine and I will never stop getting the word out that vaccines cause other problems. Will anyone in the industry sign off on “one will be covered financially if something like autism does happen” HELL NO! They tell you it’s not related to the vaccine and I say BS…. I saw my son go from a healthy NORMAL child to a child SUFFERING autism. You say “failures are 20-30yrs old and vaccines have improved” my a%$ they have…… they are screwing more kids today with autism now than ever before and the truth will surface with time as it always does…… why are more pediatricians agreeing with anti vaxxers if they are so “improved”?? The only doctors pushing it are the ones that get paid for it…. which in my eyes are not good doctors.

  • Parkerfamily7

    The ones who were vaccinated will most likely contract the diseases not a milder version (sadly)

  • Parkerfamily7

    From vaccines!

  • Parkerfamily7

    Well said Jeffry Thank you!!!! I am one of those parents……

  • Parkerfamily7

    1/1000 Mr. Brown are you that naive!!

  • Parkerfamily7

    well said again. Thank you.

  • Pete

    The point was that he got the disease twice after being vaccinated. Therefore he should have had natural lifelong immunity from successfully surviving the disease the first time and never gotten it the second time. The fact he got it a second time is more indicative that this individual’s immune system is not producing lasting immunity for some reason.

  • Pete

    HAHA! Cancer virus! Anything remotely persuasive you might have said goes out the window the second you say something like that..

  • http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/3/2/97-0227_article.htm

    Also look up Benjamin Sweet, Maurice Hilleman, and Bernice Eddy. Yes… CANCER virus.

  • gomurr
  • Pete

    The virus in question, which shows dubious correlation with cancer, is called SV40, not CANCER virus. How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when using deliberately incendiary language like that?

  • Cite your sources, Pete. Thanks.

  • Pete


    And even the CDC page most cited states “The majority of scientific evidence suggests that SV40-contaminated vaccine did not cause cancer; however, some research results are conflicting and more studies are needed.”


  • I suggest you research the history a bit more.

    The initial polio vaccine was quickly rushed into production, and no doubt it was contaminated with SV40, as confirmed by Sweet, Hilleman, and Eddy.

    Even in the statement you provide, there is a huge caveat. And — I think this is too important of an issue to make sweeping platitudes and assumptions, just to protect a mistake made in the 1950s.

    Here are just a handful (and trust me there are many more) studies showing a probable link to cancer and SV40.




  • Pete

    You’re right, it’s much more appropriate to give it a shocking, fear inducing label like “Cancer Virus”. And by the way, even if the link were substantiated by research, it’s still a far cry to suggest that a then unknown virus making it into a vaccine is part of some government conspiracy, as gomurr has suggested.

  • Well, I guess you have to ask yourself how long have they known about this and have NOT taken any action? At least since the late 1950s, early 1960s.

    Also, there is plenty of other evidence available showing the Standard Operating Procedures from FDA / CDC when there are contaminated products on the shelf.

    I would submit to you, there are people with reputations and careers on the hook if it were known people were injected with a cancer causing virus. I’m sure you can appreciate the delicate situation.

  • Pete

    What action do you suggest they take? Build a time machine and remove the virus from the original vaccine? Imprison a multitude of well intentioned, and now geriatric medical staff who were working to stop an epidemic we thankfully don’t even have a point of reference for today? Can you really go back and punish people for something they did not know? Sure, we know now, and that’s great moving forward, but what’s the recourse? And while we’re at it, what are we going to do about all of the construction companies that installed asbestos containing materials in homes? Might as well sue them all into oblivion because they should have known, right?

  • What action do I suggest? I’m glad you brought up asbestos.

    A good family friend of ours died from mesothelioma a few years ago. The company she worked for (where she was exposed) settled with her and compensated for her ill health.

    I think this would be a good start for those effected.

    Second, I think a public admission and apology would be another step in the right direction.

    There are others, however, I anticipate another sarcastic reply.

  • Pete

    I’m not being sarcastic. I do agree that if it is found somewhat conclusively that the link is, in truth, a causality, I would hope that they would apologize as well. And I’m sure the court system will line its pockets with the spoils, but while the vaccine producers would undoubtedly be found liable, I fail to see how it’s their fault for not detecting something they did not know existed. I also agree that the period between 1960 (discovery of SV40) and 1962 (elimination of SV40 from the vaccine) shows a relatively slow response, but on the other hand, nobody knew, and still today nobody really knows the effect this virus has on humans. And honestly, even if I knew there was a 1/6 – 1/3 chance that my kid’s vaccine contained what is commonly understood to be a benign virus, but would protect him/her from polio, I would authorize it.

  • Pete

    At the time anyway. Perhaps not today.

  • But they did know. That’s the problem.

  • Pete

    For the two year period between its discovery and before its elimination, they knew the virus was present in a percentage of the vaccines. But they did not know, and could not have known that a correlation would be suggested between it and cancer.

  • They knew it was causing tumors when injected into hamsters and it was ignored! Are you suggesting that this is a moot point?

  • Pete

    Alright, I’ll play. If you have a source showing that polio vaccine and/or SV40 was shown to cause tumors in any animal prior to 1962, please cite it.

  • Bernice Eddy, who at the time was a scientist at the Division of Biologics Standards (DBS), discovered a major problem. Page 500 of the Executive Reorganization and Government Research of the Committee on Government Operations United States Senate, Ninety-Second Congress, Second Session. April 20, 21; and May 3, 4, 1972, states,

    “The next and only serious vaccine crisis that has occurred since the polio episode was the realization in mid-1961 that a monkey virus later shown to cause tumors in hamsters was contaminating both polio and adenovirus vaccines. The virus, known as SV40, was entering the vaccines and, just as in the polio case was surviving the formalin [form of formaldehyde] treatment.

    There were several states by which the full extent of the SV40 problem became known. First was the discovery in 1959-1960 by a DBS [Division of Biologics Standards] scientist, once again Bernice Eddy, that an unknown agent in the monkey kidney cells used to produce polio and adenovirus vaccines would cause tumors when the cells were injected into hamsters.”

  • Pete

    That doesn’t really satisfy the statement that it was known to cause cancer prior to its elimination from the vaccine. Yes, as stated, they knew it was there for some brief period before it was eliminated from the vaccine, but they certainly didn’t know from the beginning, and they certainly didn’t know it caused cancer. Even showing that an agent in monkey kidney cells caused cancer in hamsters really isn’t enough. We know that cigarettes cause cancer, for example, but to then say that a single ‘dose’ of cigarette smoke would cause cancer is reaching. Also, saccharin was found to cause cancer in rats back in the 70’s, but that has since been expunged because it turns out that rodents aren’t an especially good analog for humans.

  • Okay – can you please cite when it was alleged to be removed from the vaccine?


  • Glenn Festog

    And YOU should list the double-blind testing done on vaccines, you know, the kind required to test the viability of a drug before marketing, but, wait, you can’t find any because EVERYONE knows vaccines work so why bother? Back in the mid-1800’s a Dr.Semmelwise was concerned about the deaths in his practice caused by child-birth fever (over 70%) when mid-wives had less than ten. Upon questioning mid-wives he found that the “secret” was to wash your hands between examinations. When he attempted to present this info to his “peers” he was mocked and vilified for adopting methods from those “untrained and unprepared to understand the causes” of their patients suffering. It was almost 100 years before Doctors washed their hands routinely between patients (or even autopsies and patients). As to your last; I believe its been stated that there are “lies, damn lies, and statistics.” So here’s one for you; when Japan ceased to slavishly follow the American Vaccine program the rate of SIDS (sudden infant death syndrome) DECREASED by over 50%. Japan now mandates 11 vaccines compared to our 46; figure it out……..

  • Glenn Festog

    Japan (in the past) had followed and fully adopted the American Vaccine Program for years. Pressure caused by spikes in vaccine reactions caused them to cease vaccinate from birth to 2 years of age which resulted in a 50% reduction in SIDS. So, Maria, spin those numbers into a pro-vaccine comment, or anyone else for that matter.

  • Glenn Festog

    This was the big argument against people who, upon getting their annual flu shot, get the flu. “It would have been worse without it” is a convenient response. Of course, the fact that I stopped getting such shots over 35 years ago because I was “getting” the flu anyway and, subsequently, gotten the flu 5 times since (mild, didn’t even miss work) is just a statistical anomaly I’m sure……

  • Glenn Festog

    Having looked at similar material in the past I prepared a legal document that I took with me when my ex went into labor. As soon as my son was born I went to the Doctor and inquired if he intended to “vaccinate” my child. When he said yes I informed him that he would have to sign my document first which required him and the hospital to be fully responsible for ANY negative reaction to same and that if they proceeded I would file formal charges of assault upon a minor. We were allowed to leave without the shots. That was ’89, don’t know how that might go over now…….

  • Neil

    SV40 found in the polio vaccines of the 60’s causes cancer.

  • EHS

    Actually, there are titers for mumps, rubeola, hepatitis B, etc. that you can check to assess for immunity from a particular disease. If your levels are high enough, you are immune, period (there’s more nuance to this, as your levels can be low and still be immune, but that’s a more complicated answer). Unless you become immunosuppressed (i.e. chemotherapy) for some reason. If not, you may need a vaccine booster, or perhaps you’re in the very small percentage (< 3 to 5 percent), where the vaccine doesn't work for you. No one ever said vaccines were 100% effective, but it's in the high 90s, but you can say no medicines or surgeries are 100% effective, you have to always outweight your risks and benefits. And I think the benefits of eliminating smallpox, polio, measles (which is an airborne disease, so you can't say better sanitation is the reason that's eradicated) – outweighs these anecdotes, Seeing that you have to quote outbreaks from the 1980s to fill up your report show just how effective vaccines can be.

  • EHS

    see answer above regarding titers to these diseases.. there is a scientific test you can ask for.

  • EHS

    Actually, Japan decided to decrease the amount of vaccines after they incorrectly assumed 2 cases of encephalitis was due to the MMR vaccine, but now have begun to recommend it again in the past few years. In fact, rubella is on the rise over there and is a concern among health care providers for anyone born in the 1970s to the 1990s.

    And a double-blind study where you give certain babies vaccines and others not would be considered unethical as no investigator wants to be responsible for giving a baby rubella since we know MMR vaccines work, but there have been observational studies (the only ones ethical in this case) done in Gambia on hepatitis B vaccine if you are so interested

  • Thomas H. Imhoof

    What none of you pro-vaxers seem to realize is that Mother Nature provides the best defenses against viruses. Olive leaf, for example, is known to kill over 1000 different viruses. Iodine is one of the most anti-viral substances on the planet. There are literally dozens of natural anti-viral compounds that are FAR more effective than any vaccine, but none of these are “approved” by the FDA. Why? Because you cannot patent a natural substance. Pharmaceutical companies are not interested in curing disease; they are only interested in developing PATENTABLE

  • jessica

    Renex your a b!@#h why are you even on this site??? F off

  • jessica

    Vaccines didnt save lives. Sanitation and better living did. Why the hell do you think people in 3rd world countries are still dying from these diseases and we arent??? Why arr all you dickheads on this page anyway!? Go get a vaccine into ya.

  • jessica

    Wow you need to get some research done. Do you even know the ingredients in vaccines?? Those illnesses are only life threatening if the child has a autoimmune disorder or a shit parent who feeds their kids maccas and provides a dirty unsanitary home. And it is no longer 1 in 100. Get your facts before you argue or you just look like an airhead.

  • Jackie

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has conducted sweeping reviews of thousands of vaccination studies. You found 17 links on the Internet and tell your followers that there are “lots more.” You’ve cherrypicked links and used them to develop a story that supports your assumptions that vaccines are harmful. If there was a great conspiracy to harm people through vaccination, no sensible government would share the information that you’ve cited. That information would be locked far away from everyday viewing.

    I’m not questioning your intelligence at all, nor am I questioning your sincere wish to help people. But ask yourself–are you qualified to assess vaccination? Can you explain in detail how vaccination works to build immunity in the human body? Can you demonstrate that the miniscule amount of chemical preservatives found in vaccines have harmed people? Can you explain exactly how a vaccine might cause autism? What proof do you have that the medical community, including your own doctor or pediatrician, has turned a blind eye to a program that would seriously harm children? Ending vaccination could cause irreparable harm to the human race. Is it okay to state your suspicions as though they were facts?

    A lot of what is said here seems based on sweeping generalizations. There’s some truth to a lot of the assumptions, such as “natural immunity is the best defense against disease.” Unfortunately, the cost of developing natural immunity to measles could be death. Also, waiting for natural immunity to Hib could mean lifelong impaired brain function. What would the consequences to the human race be if we stopped vaccinating and waited for natural immunity? That approach didn’t seem to work so well for our predecessors. In 1900, the top three causes of death in America were infectious diseases. Now, illnesses like polio, pertussis and measles are virtually nonexistent. Or they were, until pockets of people stopped vaccinating, largely thanks to the now debunked Andrew Wakefield.

    If you’re going to publish about issues involving human life and death, then you owe it to your readers to ask yourself whether you’re picking “facts” to support your existing assumptions or whether you’ve examined all available information and then drawn your conclusion. To publish about something like this, taking a posture of expertise when you have none, is both dangerous and unethical. Autism affects about 250,000 children–it’s scary, and we need to find out why it’s happening. However, about 300 million people died from smallpox in the 20th century alone, and thanks to vaccines, smallpox is now virtually nonexistent. Remind me never to go gambling with you; even though the odds are staggeringly not in your favor, you don’t hesitate to put human health and human lives on the table.

  • Mayowa

    Because vaccines are not 100% effective, just like almost every other thing in the world.

  • Pete

    Here’s a fun one for you Jeffry. You’d think after receiving enough measles vaccine for 10,000,000 people she’d suddenly be as autistic as a MF. But I guess it actually cured her Myeloma. http://www.kare11.com/story/news/health/2014/05/14/mayo-clinic-trial-measles-vaccine-multiple-myeloma/9101893/

  • Jennifer S.

    This woman, Dr. Suzanne Humphries, is “qualified to assess vaccination” and “can . . . explain in detail how vaccination works to build immunity in the human body”, if you don’t trust the author. If you’re willing to take the 11 minutes she can explain to you why bypassing the immune system by injection is horrible for your body. She is one of the people charged with creating the HPV vaccine, who now will never ask anyone to vaccinate. Watch here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efto1LpWkKw

  • InTheLight717

    Too bad I have to connect my twitter account in order to share. Won’t do it.

  • Glenn Festog

    Yeah, right. Statistics say that if I place one foot in a bucket of ice and the other in boiling water, STATISTICALLY I’m at a comfortable temperature. “there are lies, damned lies, and statistics.” Mark Twain

  • Glenn Festog

    Hep B; the STD you can catch from shared needles too? The now MANDATORY VACCINE for infants? Proof positive that health must take a back seat to profits. Why pre-test the mother for the disease when we can make everyone pay? Every baby damaged is a sure money-maker. If they miss their opportunity then, they can “pick up the spare” with Gardisil.

    I noted that you avoided the issue of the reduction in SIDS deaths by 50%. More than 2000 babies died of SIDS in the US in 2010 (last year stats were gathered), want to bet that there’s a 1000 parents out there who wish differently?

  • AutismDad

    Failed vaccines show its experimentation. Shows they use consumers to test them. They will tweek them and try again. Why did autism skyrocket? Changing ingredients and more vaccines. Outcomes are merely factoids to them, something to study further. But when independant people study it and attempt to report it, they circle the wagons are go on the offensive. And there’s nothing more offensive than these pathological vaccine proponents.

  • AutismDad

    You should visit the real world sometime.

  • AutismDad

    Get real. a study of vaccinated vs unvaccinated is needed. Its not unethical any more than causing death and brain damage through vaccination. There is a highly important precedent that needs to be set and it must be independant, not done by the usual suspects.

  • AutismDad

    Yea…say hi to Larry and Moe for me…nyuck nuck

  • AutismDad

    Change your name.

  • AutismDad

    Clear as mud

  • AutismDad

    Oh thanks Einstein.

  • AutismDad

    inject some antacids and see how it goes.

  • AutismDad

    One of the other strategies is to use fear. Calling everything a disease and implying that without vaccines we are all as good as dead. Its been 45 years since i had a vaccine and I’m no where near death.

  • AutismDad

    one thing they fear and respect is lawsuit.

  • eggman2

    My statistics professor used to say, ” You can not have good statistics in you don’t include all the facts. So you might have to throw away the whole trash if you don’t.” The junk medicine robber barons , that produce vaccines, omit too many facts. So all that they have is trash instead of statistics.

  • eggman2

    Also, midwives carry out a more gentle way of childbirth, and that cuts down the mortality rate.

  • AutismDad

    But a pediatrician doesn’t have to explain vaccines at all OR report adverse effects. Unethical? You’ve been watching too much CNN

  • AutismDad

    So? Have you noticed the vaccinated get the illnesses miracle vaccines were supposed to stop? What say about that???

  • AutismDad

    I’ll put your name down under my DUH MOMENT list

  • AutismDad

    We aren’t chemically the same either. If we view our body as a test tube, everything placed in it is relevant.

  • AutismDad

    I guess they call that all coincidence and part of the ANTI-VACCINE CULT led by our fearless MESSIAH Dr Andrew Wakefield. Yes Wakefield started VAERS and the NVICP as a plot against vaccination. OOH he’s so evil!!!

  • AutismDad

    Well their exhaustive research has produced VAERS and NVICP and thousands of deaths and injuries that they refuse to take credit for.

  • AutismDad

    Aren’t you the moderator?

  • AutismDad

    Japan suspended MMR and went with single vaccines. But they would still inject then in one visit……whoops!

  • AutismDad

    This is your logical argument?

  • AutismDad

    So have some for breakfast instead of coffee.

  • Alison

    Thank you Lionheart

  • Alison

    Zero likes…hmmm

  • Alison


  • Alison


  • Alison


  • Sigmund Berg

    How do you know? Are you a scientist or a doctor? How come anti-vaxers are so critical to everyone that deals with and researches on vaccines daily and has done so their entire life, but once something is on naturalnews or any other site you just swallow it uncritically.
    Btw, vaccines are natural. They consist of mainly the virus they are meant to fight, only the virus in vaccines have been “deactivated” so that it does little or no harm.

  • Sigmund Berg

    I say that they got a milder illness compared to the unvaccinated.

  • Sigmund Berg

    You need to do some researc . Start here: http://www.vaccines.gov/more_info/work/index.html
    Secondly, showing your fear of the ingredients in vaccines demonstrates your lack of knowledge in chemistry and biology. If you tell which ingredients you are afraid of, I can explain their function and why they are not dangerous.

  • Sigmund Berg

    Vaccines do not give autism.
    For example the sales of organic foods have increased so that it correlates with autism. Why dont you question that?

  • AutismDad

    Another challenger. How many parents have said “after a series of organic dishes my child regressed into autism”? Pay attention dumbo and stop the ridiculous alternative suggestions. Find me a study showing organic food causes brain damage. Then look for a study showing vaccines cause brain damage.

  • AutismDad

    Sigmund DUH

  • AutismDad


  • AutismDad

    That link is trash. A bunch of blah blah for sheeple. Shows your gullible.

  • Thomas H. Imhoof

    Mr. Berg, I am a Holistic Health Coach with many years experience and I have seen with my own eyes repeatedly the effectiveness of the natural anti-viral agents I referred to. For you to say that vaccines are natural shows your ignorance of the subject. BTW, what are your qualifications for commenting?

  • AutismDad

    He’s a GOOFologist

  • AutismDad

    And I say that’s a brainfart.

  • sabelmouse

    and with pertussis they’re not diagnosed and go merrily on their way visiting that newborn.

  • Rusti1

    Did all those autistic cases eat organic? or were they vaccinated prior to diagnosis? See, easy consideration isn’t it? Organic has nothing to do with autistic rate.

  • Sigmund Berg

    Exactly!! And autism can be shown even before the baby is born! Do we give any vaccines to children before they are born? No!

  • Sigmund Berg

    Haha, yeah, if that is your stand on science, then I am done. If you won’t accept that some people know more about something than you do, and if you won’t listen to the people that have studied these things their whole life, I don’t know what will do.

  • Sigmund Berg

    No, YOU look for a study showing vaccines cause brain damage. You claim it, therefore is it your burden to prove it.
    What you hear parents say was nothing to do with this. also, when do you hear parents telling you that vaccines saved the lives of their children? Never! Because they don’t get sick, they don’t notice.

  • Sigmund Berg

    Yes, and she is the only one (except that woman with Russian name, can’t remember her name right now). The supreme majority of researchers and doctors advocate for vaccines. We have research showing how good they are, and how little risk it is to take one.

  • AutismDad

    Buh Wah Ha Ha….say hi to Larry and Curly for me

  • AutismDad

    Trash doesn’t interest me. Its fine for those who are discerning such as yourself, but I require truth not bogus science.

  • AutismDad

    There will be as Pharma keeps pushing to vaccinate pregnant women.

  • AutismDad

    Because it would make me look like an imbecile.

  • AutismDad

    You must be bordering on insanity.

  • Rusti1

    Yes but, the children developed autism after having vaccines, not before birth. Normal healthy behavior until vaccines taken. Just like children are diagnosed as “healthy” before a vaccine, but sickly after. What happened? The vaccine happened.

  • Rusti1


  • Rusti1

    I haven’t had the flu in 10 years, not since 2 weeks after getting the flu vaccine 10 years ago! Haven’t had the vaccine since, and haven’t had the flu either. What would I credit for not getting the flu then? You really wouldn’t know if the flu vaccine saved anyone from anything. Maybe it was their own healthy lifestyle? I know I take vitamins, especially C. That’s what I would credit

  • Rusti1

    Re: Unfortunately, the cost of developing natural immunity to measles could be death.

    As well as vaccines (could cause death). People should be informed, have choices, and also understand, measles is a mild childhood disease except to one who may be malnourished. In which case, children need healthy foods and vitamins to strengthen their immune system. There are always natural ways of dealing with things.

  • Sigmund Berg

    Symptoms of autism is visible after some months after birth. This corresponds with the time the MMR vaccine is taken, so it appears that there is a connection, although it isn’t…

  • Sigmund Berg

    Haha! “Truth not science”. Hahahha
    Do you know what science really is? It doesn’t appear so, so I will give you a short introduction.
    It is about being thorough and examining things. It is about a skepticism that you need to have towards everything, even things that support your bias. Science is a method for finding the truth, the answer to a problem.

  • Sigmund Berg

    So you can say out of the blue, without evidence, that organic food doesn’t play a role… You are obviously only skeptic to the things that corresponds with you bias. Well, if skepticism is do be done right, it has to be applied to everything.

  • Rusti1

    So there’s no way to tell if a child is “healthy” enough to get a vaccine either, yet they’re given. The whole thing is a shoddy claim of “science”, but there is none.

  • Rusti1

    No, the fact is, the majority do not eat organic, so it’s totally irrelevant. It’s not “bias”, it’s fact.

  • Zjivila Whyte

    YES of course we do, are you unaware that pregnant women are given vaccines? Might pay to read up a little more about it.

  • Emily Campbell

    I agree that vaccines can be dangerous, but insults just undermine your position. Be polite and use facts.

    Also, use the correct form of your/you’re, please.

  • AutismDadd


  • Shiann

    This is not a complete analysis. Like most people pro or anti-vaccine you choose to represent only some of the facts. I would really like to see an analysis that includes all the factors for and against vaccination. How can you possibly make an informed decision about anything when people are always presenting their own biased, limited facts?!! This is really frustrating!! I’m not against, actually I’m really really for informed consent, but I just don’t understand why people all over the internet keep posting super-biased information and then expect others to base their judgment on that information. I mean this is a serious matter and potential health concern but I have not found one article listing the pros and cons of vaccination truthfully and letting the reader decide for themselves.

  • Patricio Da Silva

    Kids today are sicker than ever (google it), and there are a number of studies which reveal this. The pro-vaxx people argue that it is not because of vaccines.

    Okay, fine, but if kids today are sicker than they were when i was a child in the 50s, we can safely conclude that vaccines are NOT MAKING KIDS HEALTHIER, are they?

    If not, then why get them?

    A Generation Rescue study suggests that vaccinated kids are far less healthy than non vaccinated kids, especially in boys. The site says they are not the definitive study, that the only purpose was to prod CDC to do an official study, but the CDC refuses to do the study, and the reason they give on their site is that it would be “unethical” to do such a study. This doesn’t make sense, because without the data such a study would yield, how can
    the ethics be established? The other reason they give is that it is “impractical”. Excuse me?
    Discovering whether or not vaccines are doing more good than harm is impractical? They do 15 year studies of probes ot mars, and they cant do 15 year studies on the overall health of children comparing vaccinated to non vaccinated children?

    I’m sorry, I do not trust the CDC, nor nor the vaccine makers ( who paid over 19 billion in criminal fraud fines in the last 5 years ). Besides, history is replete with outbreaks in vaccinated populations:


  • Patricio Da Silva

    To everything that is logical. If you are looking for a serial killer where kids died over a 10 year period in San Francisco, you don’t first look in Hong Kong. There is no substitute for using your frickin’ brain.

  • Patricio Da Silva

    Women who gave birth to deformed children after taking thalidomide accepted the advice of doctors who knew a lot more than they did.

    Sorry, history is replete with authoritative disasters, and, if the argument is based on that alone, it is wholly without merit.

  • Patricio Da Silva

    I haven’t had the flu in 30 years, so if I got vaccinated, and still did not get the flu, did the vaccine work?

    There is no way to tell.

  • Patricio Da Silva

    History is replete with authoritative disasters ( Thalidomide, and there are a number of others ). Therefore “Majority”, if that is the basis of your argument, is not a merit worthy argument. I would be very careful assuming anything about “research”. Watch this 10 minute video: https://youtu.be/-bYAQ-ZZtEU

  • Patricio Da Silva

    Even if measles vaccine shows a decline in measles, there is a broader issue. How do we know that vaccines are not are not donig more harm, overall, than good, from childhood throughout early adulthood?

    I ask because Kids today are sicker than ever (google it), and there are a number of studies which reveal this. The pro-vaxx people argue that it is not because of vaccines.

    Okay, fine, but if kids today are sicker than they were when i was a child in the 50s, we can safely conclude that vaccines are NOT MAKING KIDS HEALTHIER, are they?

    If not, then why get them?

    A Generation Rescue study suggests that vaccinated kids are far less healthy than non vaccinated kids, especially in boys. The site says they are not the definitive study, that the only purpose was to prod CDC to do an official study, but the CDC refuses to do the study, and the reason they give on their site is that it would be “unethical” to do such a study. This doesn’t make sense, because without the data such a study would yield, how can
    the ethics be established? The other reason they give is that it is “impractical”. Excuse me?
    Discovering whether or not vaccines are doing more good than harm is impractical? They do 15 year studies of probes ot mars, and they cant do 15 year studies on the overall health of children comparing vaccinated to non vaccinated children?

    I’m sorry, I do not trust the CDC, nor nor the vaccine makers ( who paid over 19 billion in criminal fraud fines in the last 5 years ). Besides, history is replete with outbreaks in vaccinated populations:


  • artbyjcm

    “Kids today are sicker than ever (google it)” the issue is that you found your results from a website just as biased as this. While there have been a few outbreaks, the number of people that died of these things prior to vaccines being invented was incredibly high. The same could be said of penicillin, widely considered one of the best discoveries in human history.

    If you want to reject the effectiveness of vaccines because there have been a FEW failures, then you must rejects all forms of medicine, because nothing is 100% effective.

    Please don’t take us to the middle ages because you don’t understand how medicine works.

  • artbyjcm

    You can’t diagnose it until they are mentally developed. That doesn’t mean they got it later in life. Many mental quirks/disorders can’t be evaluated until later in life. Do you think all of them are “gained” later in life? You think mental handicaps are all 100% manmade?

  • artbyjcm

    Wait… so prior to vaccines you’re telling me people didn’t get sick from the things we vaccinate for? The numbers of deaths didn’t go down at all?

  • artbyjcm

    After being civil for so long, it’s kind of hard to keep being civil after so many people like you are trying to take us back to the dark ages, and will not listen to reason.

  • artbyjcm

    95% of kids with autism had breast milk. Breast milk now causes autism. That is your logic.

  • artbyjcm

    That no medicine is 100% successful. Literally none. Using your criteria, you need to never take advantage of any modern developments in medicine.

    Please, never go to a doctor again. Clearly you don’t believe in them, so stop wasting your, and their time. If you ever get sick, stay at home. Ok? Do you promise? You better not turn your back on your beliefs. If the doctor tells you the medicine will keep your heart pumping after a problem is discovered, don’t take it. It’s not literally 100% successful. That means it’s a fraud, the doctor is trying to kill you, right? Or maybe he’s trying to give you alzheimers.

  • Rusti1

    Vaccines are not the only way to prevent illness and death. Most illness is prevented with healthy diet, and today there is supplementation of vitamins. I know personally how amazing Vit C alone helps prevent all kinds of viral and respiratory infections. Klenner used it in the 40’s to cure polio. It’s just that the conventional medical field has dismissed it for decades and bought/paid into a vaccine or pharmaceutical alone means “health”. That’s fine if that’s your thinking and choosing, but, coercing or by “law” force others to take something against their will is the issue today.

  • AutismDadd

    So what are you taking? Maybe its a high I might like.

  • AutismDadd

    I guess you’re real stupid.

  • sabelmouse

    good advice! just last year i was prescribed 2 meds that taken together can lead to fatal stroke.

  • Proponent

    sabelmouse: “good advice! just last year i was prescribed 2 meds that taken together can lead to fatal stroke.”

    List or name them.

  • Proponent

    You seem to be evading the question posed, Sabelmouse..

    List.. or name the two (2) ‘meds’ that you were (allegedly) prescribed.

    … …

    And careful now..

    ‘Cause I suspect that you might simply turn to google and try to find two drugs that might fit this twisted prescriptive bill and narrative of yours.

    But.. you would also have to take into consideration why they (the ‘meds’) were prescribed (if this is actually true, and not just some fabrication on your part) in the first place.

    Shall I wait for an answer.. or was that the sound of you tucking tail and scampering away that I heard … as per your usual?

  • Rachel Ramey

    This doesn’t claim to be a complete analysis. It claims to be “examples of vaccine failures,” which it is. I wouldn’t go to McDonald’s and order french fries, then complain that they aren’t a whole Happy Meal. It isn’t “biased” to post about one element of an issue when you’ve made clear that one element is all you’re posting about, and I don’t think anyone expected any parent to make an entire decision on this single page.

  • Rachel Ramey

    “the reason they give on their site is that it would be “unethical” to do
    such a study. This doesn’t make sense, because without the data such a
    study would yield, how can
    the ethics be established?”

    This drives me nuts.

  • Rikki Hopkins

    I can’t say which ingredient effected me personally, but I know that ingredients in many vaccines are neurotoxins and dangerous. I was recommended to get the HPV virus when I was 16 years old. Within a month, I contracted Bell’s Palsy very badly (neurological disorder) that they couldn’t pinpoint what caused it at the time. I also got a Grand Mal seizure and end up convulsing on concrete and waking up bloody. Also, at the time, they couldn’t state why. I also STILL (7 years after the vaccine) get simple partial seizures. Not 1 of these things run in my family and not 1 of them could be correlated to anything except the vaccine. So I can’t comment on the “effectiveness” of this vaccine given that currently, no I have not gotten cervical cancer, but I did have terrible life-changing side effects from the ingredients you claim aren’t dangerous. Also, if you research the HPV vaccine… you’ll find that I am FAR from the only one who got seizures, Bell’s Palsy, along with other neurological disorders much worse shortly after getting the vaccine.

    No this comment is not meant to say that I’m against all vaccines. No it’s not meant to say they’re all bad nor is it saying that ALL of the ingredients in them are bad. It’s simply a response to your comment that their ingredients aren’t dangerous, because that’s very inaccurate.